Hi Anton Chigurh,
I also think highly of the knowledge and service at urban mattress and I have had nothing but good experiences with them when I have talked with them. As you mention though … no matter how much they may want to disclose the details of the contents of their mattresses … they are only able to provide what the manufacturer provides to them. This means that what they are able to tell you may be more complete for some of their mattresses than for others.
The “branded” Dr Breus mattresses are now being made by Comfort Solutions who bought the license for the name but other manufacturers including Sherwood may be making mattresses that have similar layering. There is nothing special about the Dr Breus mattresses (except that they don’t tell you the details of the layers inside them) and they use materials that are available to any manufacturer including Celsion latex (which is now called Talalay GL fast response). The “significant sagging” issues like other major brands is because of the use of lower quality polyfoam or other materials such as synthetic fiber in the upper layers of the mattress. They typically range from under 20% latex to about 50% latex and the rest is lower quality materials and like any mattress where these layers are “hidden” or not disclosed … they can be a recipe for foam softening and sagging.
The problem is that the sags or softening may only be noticeable with weight on the mattress and without any weight they may (and probably are) less than the warranty exclusion. As you mentioned … knowing the details and quality of all the layers is the only way to make meaningful comparisons with other mattresses and to have a reasonable idea of what the “weak link” in the mattress may be and its relative durability. If there is only an inch or so of “unknown material” (such as in a quilting layer) where its softening won’t have a significant effect on the mattress then knowing the density of this layer may not be so important but if the total of unknown layers is @ 2" or more then foam softening may have a more significant effect and I would want to know the details and quality of the layers before considering any mattress.
There are too many mattresses that provide this information to seriously consider mattresses that don’t IMO.
VI Spring is in a completely different realm and can only be compared to other types of similar “super premium” brands that have a similar type of coil and fiber construction (Such as Hastens, Relyon, Savoir, Hypnos). They make their own pocket coils in a variety of different tensions and layering, use some of the best natural fibers available in the world, tease and layer the fibers to create specific performance, feel, and price points, and use “old style” hand building construction methods such as side stitching and hand tufting to keep the shape of the mattress and provide durability. They were among the very first to use pocket springs or “marshall coils” (invented by Marshall Mattress in Toronto which is still in business) and like every super premium brand … they use the highest quality materials and construction methods.
In terms of matching the needs and preferences of consumers though … they would be most attractive to those that had a very different “value equation” from the “norm”.
In terms of the two basic functions of a mattress (which are pressure relief and alignment) they would be similar to other types of mattresses that used good quality and durable materials that provide good pressure relief and alignment that was perfectly suitable for the person sleeping on the mattress.
Where they would differ would be in the preferences that were most important.
The first of these (and perhaps the most important of the “preferences”) is that innerspring/natural fiber mattresses are the most ventilating, humidity controlling, and temperature regulating mattresses available and they excel in this way. They also have a unique feel because natural fibers feel and perform differently from foam. Perhaps most importantly though … these mattresses have a type of value that is not so much utilitarian but esthetic and would be very attractive to those who appreciate the “value” of hand built products that were a work of art as much as a functional mattress. Some people who can comfortably afford it for example would choose a hand built piece of furniture where dovetail joints are hand made rather than machine made or other types of hand built construction over a similar piece that used the same materials and may even be just as durable because they just feel better about what they have purchased … even if functionally it was similar and wasn’t any more durable than a similar piece that didn’t have the same labor or pride built into it. In the case of mattresses … these are the types of consumers where how they feel “about” a mattress and how it was built may be just as important as how they feel “on” the mattress they bought.
Natural fibers are also very durable but they respond differently over time. They will gradually compress and in the initial stages the compression may be uneven (leading to impressions that in the case of natural fibers are not a sign of wear but part of their natural response to use). This will generally even out over time and with flipping the mattress (if that is a choice because it isn’t “necessary”) but there will always be some remaining impressions along the mattress surface and there will be some firming of the fiber layers as they compress and settle under weight and this is part of the design.
The “lifetime” warranty is also not for your lifetime but for the lifetime of the mattress. It covers defects in materials and construction not the gradual loss of comfort or support that happens over time or the natural and “normal” compression of the fibers in the mattress.
From a functional or utilitarian point of view or from the point of view of it’s “commodity or materials” value … VI Springs would not represent the best value. On the other hand for those that have a different “personal value equation” that goes beyond just the basic needs and preferences and place a high value some of the features, hand built quality, the use of all natural materials, no foam, ventilation, beauty, and just the joy that comes with knowing that they have purchased a mattress that is a hand built work of art as much as it is a mattress … they provide “value” that can’t be matched with other types of materials and construction. This is a mattress where cost is not a major issue and “value” is measured in other terms that are different from most people.
I should also mention that the most knowledgeable people I know and have talked with about “super premium” brands (including some who have worked at some of them or toured their factories) have always spoken highly of VI Spring and tend to rate them either among the best or often the best of the super premium fiber/innerspring brands.
Phoenix