I might get some heat for this but my absolute favorite mattress/topper combination at IKEA yesterday was the SULTAN HOLMSTA + TROMSDALEN.
I’m fully aware of the lower quality materials in the top layers on the SULTAN HOLMSTA and this is the reason why I would be purchasing it with the TROMSDALEN topper basically to slow down the process of the top layers of the SULTAN HOLMSTA from sagging too soon.
To me the SULTAN HOLMSTA on it’s own felt already so good in store and this is on a IKEA foundation that has about 5"-6" spacing between the slats found the foundation (can be fixed).
In combination with the TROMSDALEN topper the SULTAN HOLMSTA did not feel any softer or firmer with the topper on significantly cooler in temperature with a slight bit more bounce.
I will be going to Quality Mattress Factory Inc. today to check out their two sided coil mattress and back to Dreamstar Bedding tomorrow to check out their Natural Escape (Hybrid Latex) and some non fancy pocketed coil mattresses with the IKEA TROMSDALEN topper in mind, that’s it; no more mattress shopping, it’s becoming a chore.
Can you give a synopsis how the differences in feeling between the Holmsta and Heggedal? I didn’t try the Holmsta? I can read about the construction but it seems like words can never describe the feeling.
As long as you are aware that you would be buying a lower quality and less durable mattress then you would be making an informed choice and you certainly wouldn’t be getting any “heat” from me :).
I’m looking forward to your feedback after your visits.
I’m 5’7" and 130 lbs, medium build single male…LOL
The Sultan Holmsta feels soft, I’d say one spectrum below medium firm from other mattress brands. You don’t sink in due to the synthetic Latex layer in top comfort layer (about 1 inch Latex followed by 2 inches of Poly).
The Sultan Heggedal on the other hand still feels good and just that; it’s more bouncy, has a thicker and better layer of Latex in top comfort layer.
The TROMSDALEN topper combined with the Sultan Heggedal softens it down a bit but no enough for my liking, furthermore I feel the Sultan Heggedal is the least value mattress from IKEA considering the materials, price and design.
I also feel if the Sultan Heggedal has Poly foam under the top blended Latex layer it would be much more soft, this would allow the Latex to compress and conform better to the body but because the Latex top sits right on top of the pocketed coils every time compression happens the bottom coils push up more from the bottom onto the Latex layer making feel firmer while also making the feeling of the coils underneath more apparent to the user.
@ Phoenix,
I visited Quality Mattress Factory in the GTA today, while I didn’t find any mattress to my liking (due to firmness) but I do feel the business they are operating is honest with high value in quality and price.
The use mostly a Continuous coil system is their mattresses which is slightly less durable than Pocketed coils (only if both are single sided) however since most of their mattresses are double sided if properly maintained by the user a double sided Continuous coil mattress will certainly outlast a single sided Pocketed coil one.
Thanks for your insights. I wonder if I was more ok with the Heggedal simply because I’m 70lbs heavier (200lbs). Maybe I’m heavy enough to actually compress the inner pocket coils instead of just sitting on top of them on the thinner compressed latex comfort layer.
I certainly wouldn’t agree with your assessment of the “value” of the Heggedal based on the quality of the materials but of course there are also many other parts to the value of a mattress purchase than just the quality and durability of the materials and each person’s criteria and the parts of their personal value equation that are most important to them may be very different from someone else. A forum search on Heggedal will also bring up more comments and feedback about it.
I’m also not so sure I would agree with your “theories” here and it would also depend on the specifics of the polyfoam and how firm it was (polyfoam can range from ultra soft to ultra firm). Polyfoam is also not as “point elastic” (the ability to contour to the shape of the body) as latex. Of course each person can have a very different experience on the same mattress so how a mattress “feels” will depend on the person and their body type, sleeping style, and their sensitivity to the different layers and components in a mattress.
A mattress will tend to soften and break down from the top layers down and the innerspring in a mattress isn’t generally the weakest link in terms of durability and the useful life of the mattress although the type of innerspring can certainly make a difference in how it feels and performs. To the degree than an innerspring makes a difference in terms of durability … the most important factor in the durability of an innerspring would be the total amount of steel that it contains (assuming that it is tempered) which unfortunately isn’t a specification that you would normally be able to find out. There is more information about the different types of innersprings in this article and in post #10 here.
Thanks for the insight Phoenix, your knowledge and opinion is always welcome and appreciated.
I didn’t end up going to Dreamstar Bedding this weekend simply because a few things came up for me thus I was busy.
I do plan on going to their showroom sometime this week without Andy since I like it better to take my time laying on mattresses to pick out the best one that suits my body.
I’m currently fixated on the IKEA Holmsta + Tromsdalen but if I find a pocketed coil mattress from Dreamstar Bedding with the same amount of firmness/comfort, in the same price range and with better quality materials I very likely go with Dreamstar Bedding model in combination with a Tromsdalen topper from IKEA.
I will be going into the showroom with the IKEA Tromsdalen in mind when choosing from their less priced pocketed coil mattresses with the exception of their Natural Escape model in which already has 4" of Talalay Latex on top if I decide to go the all Foam/Latex route.
Seems to be the same as the Special Edition above both on Ton Furniture and Dreamstar Bedding’s website, only Euro top (cosmetic difference) with a slightly lower price.
Did not get to try this model in the showroom last week, I still seem to like pocketed coil mattresses plus Latex topper combination better; will not need a topper with this one.
While the coil count and gauge will have little practical use in terms of choosing which mattress is the best “match” for you in terms of PPP or in terms of the durability of the mattress … I would definitely make sure that you know the specifics of all the foam layers and components in the mattress before making your purchase because this will have a much more significant effect on the durability and useful life of the mattress than the innerspring.
I’m looking forward to finding out what you end up deciding.
Just an update. I swapped the Matrand for the inner spring Heggedal.
In the store I felt less pressure on my hips and shoulders on the Heggedal. I felt comfortable with the materials used in the mattress as well. It was on a fairly soft boxspring foundation in the store. Ours at home has almost no compliance in comparison. My thoughts were that the Heggedal is thick and firm enough the the springs in the foundation probably don’t contribute much to the feel.
Now that it’s home it feels even firmer than the Matrand. :ohmy:
I hope it breaks in quickly. I’m concerned that my brief experience with even a cheap latex mattress has made me notice the short comings of springs even more though.
Another point that i overlooked. The Latex Matrand had very good support all the way out to the edge of the mattress. My bed actually flet substantially wider with the latex Matrand than it did with our previous Serta or with the new Heggedal. The spring mattresses seem to kinda want to dump you off the edge if you get to close. This is relevant to my wife and I since we have 3 young daughters (2,4, and 6) who are constantly trying to sunggle into our bed at 5am. Every bit of width gets utilized. We try and sleep for another hour or two but the bed is so crowded that I usually just get up and start my day.
I suspect my ultimate mattress would be a latex mattress with a softer upper comfort layer than what Ikea offers. and probably slightly thicker (in the 7-9" range). The Ikea latex mattresses all only have a single layer up to about 7inches thick, it seems like other manufactures often incorporate up to 3 layers of varying thickness and densities of latex to create a more refined support system.
We might just add a soft latex topper (not from Ikea) if the Heggedal doesn’t break in enough, but I don’t really like the way the mattress slopes towards the edge if you get too close, and fear a topper would exaggerate that feeling.
BTW, the Heggedal was only $650cdn, it’s on clearance in store at Ikea. Regular price is $900.
[quote]Now that it’s home it feels even firmer than the Matrand. :ohmy:
I hope it breaks in quickly. I’m concerned that my brief experience with even a cheap latex mattress has made me notice the short comings of springs even more though.[/quote]
This could be the result of testing the mattress on a box spring that is softer than the support system you are using at home.
It’s unfortunate that you didn’t test for this in the store because “roll off” can certainly be an issue with some innerspring mattresses (pocket coils in particular) that don’t have firmer edge support for those that tend to sleep closer to the edge of their mattress (see post #2 here). Unfortunately it’s unlikely that a topper will correct this.
Hopefully the lack of edge support is something that you can get used to and I’m looking forward to any additional updates you have the chance to share once you’ve had the chance to sleep on it for a bit.
I think I’ve finally found my mattress after a 2nd visit to Dreamstar Bedding through Andy from Ton Furniture.
I’m about 95% sure I’m gonna go with the Natural Escape but still unsure on firm or plush.
I’m also going to get a custom made foundation from Dreamstar Bedding which consists of Birch wood (might be Pine however i was told it was Birch), 1’ by 3’ slats about 2" apart (originally 4.5" apart but I asked for smaller gaps) and possibly in low profile.
Just some questions on foundation directed at Phoenix:
a) For foam core mattresses what is the idea space between the slats (I’ve read it’s 2-3 inches but I cannot find a definite answer)?
b) Is there such thing as too little space between the slats, if so what is it and why?
The reason for the slats is to provide some airflow under the mattress which can help reduce the risk of moisture and humidity getting trapped in the mattress and adding to the risk of developing mold, mildew, or dust mites in the mattress.
There isn’t a definitive answer about which specific foundation is “best” for a specific mattress because it depends on the mattress and the materials inside it but there is more information and some general guidelines about support systems (bedframes and foundations or platform beds) that are generally suitable for different types of mattresses and some examples of each of them in post #1 here
A mattress with a polyfoam support core will generally do best with a firm, flat, and evenly supportive support surface underneath it that has minimal to no flex under the mattress and for larger sizes with at least one center support beam that has good support to the floor to prevent any sagging in the middle of the mattress. The components need to be strong and durable enough to support the weight of the mattress and the people sleeping on it without any of the parts or the support system bending, sagging, or breaking over time. The support surface under the mattress should also have enough surface area to prevent the mattress from sagging through any gaps or spaces in the support surface over time but still allow some airflow under the mattress. I would suggest that the gaps between the slats are no more than about 5" (with 1 x 3 slats) although less than 4" would be better yet.
With a mattress that has a latex support core then I would use a maximum guideline of about 3" (and again less would be better) because latex is more flexible and elastic than polyfoam and can sag into any gaps more easily.
As long as the gaps are wide enough to provide some airflow under the mattress (and it’s difficult to prevent any airflow unless the support surface is solid) then it would generally be fine. Even a solid surface would be fine in many cases depending on whether there are any additional risk factors involved. There is more about airflow and solid surface support systems in post #10 here.
While both of these are good quality materials … all else being equal I would give the advantage to the synthetic latex (latex in general is the most durable of all the foam materials).
Comfort and feel are subjective so it would depend on which one your testing indicates you prefer. All the layers and components of a mattress (including the cover) will also affect all the other layers and components in the mattress and the mattress as a whole so which one is a better match for you in terms of PPP will also depend on all the specifics of the mattress.
While it’s not possible to quantify the sleeping temperature of a mattress for any particular person with any real accuracy because there are so many variables involved including the type of mattress protector and the sheets and bedding that you use (which in many cases can have just as significant an effect on temperature as the type of foam in a mattress), the temperature and humidity of your room, the firmness of the mattress, and on where you are in the “oven to iceberg” range … latex in general is more breathable than other types of foam materials but most people wouldn’t have temperature regulation issues on either one.
There is more about the many variables that can affect the sleeping temperature of a mattress or sleeping system in post #2 here.
[quote]Now that it’s home it feels even firmer than the Matrand. :ohmy:
I hope it breaks in quickly. I’m concerned that my brief experience with even a cheap latex mattress has made me notice the short comings of springs even more though.[/quote]
This could be the result of testing the mattress on a box spring that is softer than the support system you are using at home.
It’s unfortunate that you didn’t test for this in the store because “roll off” can certainly be an issue with some innerspring mattresses (pocket coils in particular) that don’t have firmer edge support for those that tend to sleep closer to the edge of their mattress (see post #2 here). Unfortunately it’s unlikely that a topper will correct this.
Hopefully the lack of edge support is something that you can get used to and I’m looking forward to any additional updates you have the chance to share once you’ve had the chance to sleep on it for a bit.
Phoenix[/quote]
Just a one week update. I’m relieved that the mattress and I have gotten a lot more used to each other. It is still on the firm end of the spectrum but is very supportive and comfortable and does a good job avoiding pressure points even for side sleeping. This is somewhat surprising because a quick press with the palm of your hand would lead you to believe it is way too firm.
The roll of issue definitely still there and will likely get worse over the years I suppose. I wouldn’t have noticed it had I not purchased a relatively firm thin latex mattress first. One thought I had was to try the Atloy box spring since it has a rigid outer surround, but (soft for a foundation) bonell springs. It may slightly counteract the rolloff by providing more compliance as you move in from the edge but good support on the edge. It was on this box spring in the store. Or I may just deal with it since I like everything else about it and the price was right.
It’s certainly possible that it would help to some degree with the feeling of “roll off” but a support system that flexes can also change the feel and performance of the mattress as well. This could end up being beneficial, detrimental, or “neutral”. It can also increase the amount of motion transfer in between the sides of the mattress. The only way to know how a different support system will affect you will be based on your own personal experience but careful testing in the store on the same combination can certainly give you a good idea of how it would compare to the support system that you are currently using.
Today I tried the Heggedal in the store with the Bonell Spring foundation (Atloy). It felt twice as soft as mine at home, and the roll off was a little worse. On the plus side the Morgongava had no roll off issues, and felt similar in softness/pressure point elimination, but it was much more seemless refined feeling.
So I’ve narrowed it down to two mattresses in pocket coil that I’m certainly going to get, I’ve ruled out the Natural Escape from Dreamstar because I still prefer the feeling pocket coils to an all foam core and since I’m buying the mattress only for myself as a filler to get ready for and finish my studies; I don’t mind saving a bit more money to spend on other things of slightly higher quality that I need: a mattress protector/pad, a bed frame, pillows, a duvet, etc…
Dreamstar Monaco Limited $430:
3 Zoned Tempered Pocket Coils (682 Count)
Triple Edge Guard
1" Insulator Pad
3/4" Comfort Layer (very likely less than 1.5 lbs)
2" High Density Soy Foam (1.8 lbs)
1/2" Foam + Hollow Fill + Blended Cotton Fabric
IKEA Sultan Holmsta $565:
5 Zone Tempered Pocket Coil (380 Count)
360 Foam Encasement (1.5 lbs)
Insulator Layer
1" High Density Foam (1.5 lbs)
1/2" Comfort Layer (unknown density, likely less than 1.5 lbs)
1" Blended Latex (20% Natural)
1/2" Foam + Polyester Fill + Blended Tencel Fabric
I will be getting a 2" Dunlop topper from Memory Foam Canada or 2" Talalay topper from Dreamstar (depending on price) regardless of which mattress I end up, my first choice being the Monaco Limited from Dreamstar.
The Sultan Holmsta highlights being it has 1" Blended Latex in the top comfort layer, blended Tencel fabric, 360 high density foam encasement (up to 10% more usable sleeping space) and IMO IKEA has more consistent workmanship (especially the coils, I currently laying on a 10+ year old IKEA double sided coil mattress for reference).
The Monaco Limited highlights being it has a thicker 2" layer of higher density foam in the top comfort layer, has 75% more pocket coils, Hollow Fill in the quilt layer, is $135 cheaper (tax included on both) and Andy has been outstanding in customer service.
Other thoughts:
-Both mattresses are very close to within margin of your guideline for having 1" of less of lower density foam is the comfort layers.
-360 high density foam encasement gives more sleeping area but is a pricey premium and not needed since triple edge guard system works just a well with 2" of high density foam followed by 2" of Latex topper layers over the metal edge guards.
-Higher coil counts doesn’t equate to higher quality/comfort, IKEA’s coil quality has been outstanding from my experience however a 75% more coil count cannot be overlooked.
[quote]Dreamstar Monaco Limited $430:
3 Zoned Tempered Pocket Coils (682 Count)
Triple Edge Guard
1" Insulator Pad
3/4" Comfort Layer (very likely less than 1.5 lbs)
2" High Density Soy Foam (1.8 lbs)
1/2" Foam + Hollow Fill + Blended Cotton Fabric
IKEA Sultan Holmsta $565:
5 Zone Tempered Pocket Coil (380 Count)
360 Foam Encasement (1.5 lbs)
Insulator Layer
1" High Density Foam (1.5 lbs)
1/2" Comfort Layer (unknown density, likely less than 1.5 lbs)
1" Blended Latex (20% Natural)
1/2" Foam + Polyester Fill + Blended Tencel Fabric
-Both mattresses are very close to within your guidelines of having 1" of less of lower density foam is the comfort layers.[/quote]
Guidelines such as these have “fuzzy edges” because something doesn’t suddenly go from good to bad as soon as it goes over a certain threshold so the guideline I use is no more than “about an inch or so” of lower density polyfoam in quilting layers. The quilting process (or tufting even more so) pre-compresses the foam which makes it more durable so if a quilting layer has about 1.5" of polyfoam then I would still consider it to be OK. The density will also play a role because much of the quilting foam is in the range of 1.2 lb density or even lower which is less durable than 1.5 lb foam. Firmness will also play a role because firmer materials tend to be more durable than softer materials that compress more easily.
The Dreamstar Monaco has 1 1/4" of lower quality/density materials in the comfort layers so I would certainly consider this to be OK.
The Sultan Holmsta has about 2" of lower quality/density materials in the comfort layers so this would be a more risky choice.
I also tend to prefer steel edge support vs a foam encasement … especially if the encasement is only 1.5 lbs (see post #2 here).
The coil count is only one of many variables that can affect the feel and performance of the mattress (including the gauge of the coils and the number of turns in the coils) and that also affect on the amount of steel in the innerspring unit and coil counts by themselves aren’t particularly meaningful. Again though … the innerspring wouldn’t likely be the weakest link in the mattress and as long as a mattress is a good “match” for you in terms of PPP then the quality/density of the foam layers above the innerspring would be a much more important factor in the durability and useful life of the mattress than the number of coils. Assuming that there weren’t any obvious weak links in the mattress … I would choose a mattress that had a lower coil count but was a better “match” in terms of “comfort” and PPP over a mattress that had a higher coil count but wasn’t as suitable in terms of its overall feel and performance.
