Dear Phoenix,
Your advice has been very helpful and I would appreciate help locating a good outlet/factory direct manufacturer in the Westchester area of New York (I am 10522).
With thanks.
These seem to fit your advice, I would greatly appreciate your views on the Ecotouch Latex, the 13" Memory Foam and Cool Contour.
http://www.goldbondmattress.com/specialty/index.php?category_id=4663
With thanks,
Hi Soreback,
Gold Bond is a partner with Vymac (which owns Ecosleep and Verlo Mattress). Both Gold Bond and Ecosleep produce “Cool Contour” memory foam mattresses. Some of the models are identical and some are slightly different. They all use Acella-Flex 2.0 lb base foam (made by Sleep Innovations).
The Gold Bond ecotouch mattresses also have their equivalents in the Ecosleep latex. In many cases Gold Bond seems to have higher pricing than the equivalent Ecosleep however and the Ecosleep are more widely available both online and through retail outlets. Some of the Ecosleep latex models (in some sizes) are available at Walmart and a latex and many of the cool contour are at US Mattress (for pricing reference) as well as many other places in both retail outlets and online. The cool contour is 4lb memory foam (mid grade foam suitable for a lower budget mattress)
Some of these may be good value at the right price (and with a good return policy if you are buying them online and can’t test them personally) particularly the latex over the Acella-Flex Which can be a good budget alternative to an all latex mattress. There are so many variables with buying memory foam online though that the return policy becomes very important. This thread may also help to give you an idea of what I look for with online memory foam choices if you are looking in that direction.
The ecotouch all latex (and the equivalent ecosleep models) have 2" 19 ILD, 2" 24 ILD, and 5" 36 ILD. These tend to be more expensive (from what I have seen) than similar factory direct all latex mattresses from a good independent manufacturers and have no choices in the ILD layering. Value here would depend on the price you find and on how suitable that construction was for your circumstances (weight, body shape, sleeping positions, preferences etc).
If you are looking for a high quality all latex mattress that uses a very effective and unique zoning system that can be customized to perfectly fit any individual … then I would highly recommend one of our manufacturing members that is near you http://www.customsleepdesign.com/. Bob the owner there is a former VP of Latex International and knows his latex. The standard model is 11" of latex but it is also available in a 9" version. NOTE: Their business is currently on hold.
There is a wide variety of other independent factory direct manufacturers within 60 miles of you. In quickly looking through their websites … there is also a wide array of different types of mattresses … some of which are quite unique and are not commonly found (such as horsehair constructions). Your area has a lot of mattress choices of many different types.
http://www.shovlinmattress.com/ NJ Independent factory direct manufacturer that is a member of this site.
http://www.chbeckley.com/ Independent factory direct manufacturer
http://www.longsbedding.com/index.html Carries an array of mattress brands … a few of which are retail direct.
http://www.mycustombedding.com/index.php Independent factory direct manufacturer
http://www.roomandboard.com/rnb/subcategory/list.do?catalog=room&category=rm_bedrooms&subcategory=mattress Retail direct outlet for Restwell
http://www.bondbedding.com/index.html NJ Independent factory direct manufacturer
http://www.norwalkmattress.com/ CT Independent factory direct manufacturer
Not all of these may offer what you are looking for and some would likely have better value than others but I thought I would list them all so you could scan their websites and with a few phone calls and questions decide which ones were worth a visit.
Hope this helps
Phoenix
Thank you again for being so thorough. However, I’m still not seemingly getting there. I contacted a few places and I have 2 problems:
- the price isn’t going down. For instance:
“If you are looking for a high quality all latex mattress … then I would highly recommend www.customsleepdesign.com/. Bob the owner there is a former VP of Latex International and knows his latex.”
Bob was great and helpful, but it will still cost me $3,400 for a king. Similarly, the other places are also much more expensive than I was expecting having read the threads.
- I can’t try out the beds at each of the various sites for purely logistical reasons, so it is reasonable to define what you want and then just order that or is that too risky? From your site and trying out a few examples, I think we want a latex or latex/memory foam combo with 2-3" medium-firmness top layer, 3" of firm latex and 5-6" high density base.
If this sounds right, I would be deeply grateful for which bed to get.
With thanks.
On another thread you mention My Luxury Mattress who are selling what appears to be a very good 14" latex and memory foam mattress for $1,300. The link is below. They do not, however, provide the detailed numbers as you suggest.
http://www.myluxurymattress.com/latex-mattress.html#learnmore
I would be interested to see what you think of this,
Thanks.
Hi soreback,
When looking at price … and especially value in a mattress … it is important to look at the type of materials in the mattress, how much of the more expensive materials (like talalay latex) it contains, and the “other layers” of the mattress (like any polyfoam and memory foam which usually cost less than latex), the contruction methods used, and the ticking/quilting (which can add a significant amount to the price). It is also important to compare the same sizes.
For example … the mattress at http://www.customsleepdesign.com/ has 11" of latex and is custom zoned for each individual. He also has a wider choice of ILD’s available in his mattresses than some others. It is also a King size which is a fair bit more than a queen. He can make these in a 9" version as well for those who are looking to reduce the cost however an “all latex” mattress is more than a mattress with latex in the comfort layers and other support core materials (such as an innerspring or polyfoam).
The mattress you linked at myluxurymattress is $1899 in a King size and only has 2" of latex in it so it cannot be meaningfully compared with a mattress that has 11" of latex. I do know however that they are usually more than happy to let you know the specs of the materials they use on a phone call if they are not listed on the site. This mattress has 5" of softer foam as a comfort layer over 3" plus 6" of polyfoam so could be on the thick side for most people. It is similar to the NXG 600 in the comfort layers (but with an innerspring support layer) which retails here for $3779 in King.
I would suggest that any mattress that has more than 12" of foam inside it is probably more than you or most people would need. 8" - 9" … especially if all of it is latex is usually enough for almost anyone even though a little thicker in some cases may be desirable for specific reasons or circumstances or contructions. Even a hybrid latex comfort layer over polyfoam (which certainly lowers the cost of sleeping on a latex comfort layer) would not normally need to be thicker than about 9".
The 2" - 3" comfort layer that you mentioned would be in the range of most people but this would normally be over a latex core or a polyfoam core and you would not normally find a 3" “transition” latex layer in a lower cost mattress as this extra 3" would put the cost out of the budget range. In a King Size all latex mattress with about a 6" core and a 2" comfort layer you would be looking at about $1500 as a bare minimum (not including a foundation) and as the thickness of the comfort layer goes up or other options are added it would go up from there. These types of mattress would cost significantly more … if you could find them at all … in most retail outlets. The pure latex bliss Nature for example with 9" of Talalay latex in a king size with just the mattress and no foundation is $3100. Even this is much better value than other national brands which have an equivalent amount of latex and are significantly more.
Actual field testing of mattresses with different layering is a very important part IMO of defining what you want. No theory can replace actual experience. Since you are looking for lower cost options though … a good starting point (depending on your height/weight/body shape/sleeping positions) would be 2-3" of latex over a polyfoam core of about 5-7" of a good quality polyfoam similar to the ecosleep. If you add memory foam to the comfort layer mix (bearing in mind that your cost will also go up with more complex layerings) then it may add an inch or two at most to the comfort layer.
While I am happy to provide guidance in terms of layering and ideas, various outlets and mattresses which may help in testing (even if they don’t have good value for an actual purchase), and specific manufacturers that are nearby (which usually but not always have better value and knowledge) … I never recommend a specific mattress or outlet over others because of the many subjective factors involved in a mattress choice and the wide differences in how each person defines value. My role is to provide people with the tools they need to avoid most of the pitfalls and “stories” they will encounter and to make better choices in their final buying decisions.
While the theory is interesting and invaluable (at least to me :)), nothing can really replace actual experience of mattress testing and there is always a danger of the theory becoming so complex that paralysis sets in with information overload. Shooting for 90% instead of 100% and knowing how to compare value will almost always lead to much better decisions than the vast majority of the public that buys a mattress and learns to “overlook” the parts that weren’t “right” … even though even they are usually much happier with any new mattress than they were with the mattress they were replacing. Most people will truly never realize what they “could have purchased” in terms of quality, value, and suitability and learn to like what they did purchase … or end up replacing it much too early. The major manufacturers and mass market outlets depend on this for their business.
The goal at the beginning is to ignore prices and test for the layering that works. The very last step in the process is to choose where to actually buy and where your best value is and if it is online you will have a much better idea of the layering and type of mattress that works best for you.
A few phone calls with specific questions like “I am looking for a mattress with about 3” of latex (or a rough idea of what you want to test) and no polyfoam in the comfort layer over polyfoam or latex in the support core … do you have anything like that" and other similar specific questions about materials will go a long ways towards helping you decide which places to actually visit. Those that just go “huh” are usually not worth the time to visit 
So hopefully this will help a bit in making meaningful comparisons and help you decide where to do some testing. It appears to me that you are most likely looking for a lower budget latex mattress with a latex and/or memory foam comfort layer over a “non latex” support core but certainly correct me if I’m wrong here. A combination comfort layer will also add a great deal of complexity to your choices and especially in the absence of field testing similar layers it may be wise to choose one or the other unless you know for certain that you want the combination.
Don’t forget that at the end of the day, the mattress you are looking for relieves pressure points … keeps you aligned … and “feels good” overall. This is possible inside any budget using suitable materials and the durability of the materials you choose (how long it will keep doing what it is supposed to do), the “preference options” you choose (like the ticking and quilting), and of course where you decide to make your purchase (factory direct rather than a mass market outlet) is the last part of the journey and will be a big part of the final cost and value.
Phoenix