Hate my Tempur Rhapsody, replacing with Aireloom or Prana

All three layers are Talalay. When I spoke to Sleep EZ before ordering it, I was told they recommend the talalay since it is more uniform ILD than the dunlop, as its ILD is only tested in a few places.

So it’s on the soft side overall. When I talked to SleepEZ yesterday, they recommended SOFT-MEDIUM-FIRM in Talalay for my wife based on her weight of 130 and her sleep style of being a side sleeper. You weigh more and have a softer mattress than that. Based on our in-store trials thus far and what I know about the ILD of SleepEZ Talalay - I tend to think this was the right recommendation for my wife.

So my guess, and it’s just a guess, that your mattress isn’t providing enough support and you are sleeping with improper alignment. So I tend to think you need more support, not less. What you should do next, is call SleepEZ. But my first idea would be to upgrade your bottom layer from medium to firm. Can you have someone take a picture of you laying on the current mattress on your side? It might help you determine if your spine is aligned properly if you can visualize your body position.

Sorry I didn’t give enough detail. Its a Cal King, one side has a firm on the bottom, the other side is medium on the bottom, both sides have medium in the center, and soft on the top, which gives it SMF and SMM on each side. The top soft layer is glued together so there wouldn’t be the split seem in the middle. I’ve gone between both sides (SMF and SMM) and the only side I can bare to lay on is the SMM. My only option for a layer exchange would be to have a soft sent out to try SSM.

So after the swap you could also try SMS in addition to SSM. I’m not sure what to say. How long have you had this mattress? Is it beyond the recommended break-in period?

6 days. With the extra soft layers I could go from SMM to SSM, SMS or SSS.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say you haven’t given it enough time.

Hi LJGMDAD,

I think that your limb would be quite “safe” :slight_smile:

Phoenix

How much sinkage should I have on the SMM side (6’3" 160lbs) ?
My friend came over and we tried to measure it and I’m only getting about 1/2" down in the top soft layer when laying on my back.
But I’m so “straight” on it that I feel like I’m laying on the floor…by upper back/shoulder get a lot of pressure, as well as my hips and legs.
When on my side, I’m going down about 1", but again even more pressure on my shoulder/arm, hip and legs.

How much sinkage should I have on the SMM side (6’3" 160lbs) ?
My friend came over and we tried to measure it and I’m only getting about 1/2" down in the top soft layer when laying on my back.
But I’m so “straight” on it that I feel like I’m laying on the floor…by upper back/shoulder get a lot of pressure, as well as my hips and legs.
When on my side, I’m going down about 1", but again even more pressure on my shoulder/arm, hip and legs.[/quote]

I do find it interesting that SMM feels too firm at your weight. And I wonder if the mattress cover needs to be stretched out more so than the latex needing to soften. Either way, you need to give it time. And I doubt there’s an answer that can be given to the question “how much should I sink?”. I’d think it depends on your anatomy. In other words you should have proper spinal alignment on your mattress, and how much you should sink to achieve that will most likely vary from person to person.

For a side sleeper:

Again, all orientations:

People are reporting noticeable softening of SleepEZ mattresses after 30-40 days too. So, 6 days just can’t possibly be enough time.

Hi FAUguy,

You would need some very sophisticated measuring and testing equipment to be able to calculate that. It would depend on the shape and weight distribution of your body and once you had measured that accurately then it would take some very high level math to figure out an algorithm that took into account the response curve of the different layers of latex and the changing surface area of your body as you sink in deeper.

Just for reference the ILD of latex is measured on a 6" core with a 50 sq in compressor head and the ILD is the amount of force it takes to compress the 6" core by 25% (1.5"). There is a video here for Latex International which shows their ILD testing (at 3:00) and one for Radium here (click step 9) which shows their ILD testing.

50 square inches is a diameter of just under 16" so the compressor head would be “about” the size of a bum. If you had a 24 ILD 6" core then it would only take 24 lbs to compress the latex 1.5", if the core was 32 ILD it would take 32 lbs, and if the core was 40 ILD it would take 40 lbs. I would guess that there is probably more than 40 lbs of pressure under your bum. I just weighed myself lying on the floor with a flat scale under my bum and it was putting 79 lbs of force on the scale (I weigh about 200 lbs) so if you weight 160 and your weight was distributed roughly the same as me you would be putting about 63 lbs of force on the same scale so your bum would sink into a 6" core of 40 ILD latex more than 2" if you do the “rough math”. Using the same math your bum would sink into a 6" core of 24 ILD latex more than 3" and probably closer to 3.5". Of course this is very “rough math” because I don’t know your exact measurements or your weight distribution and that would take much more sophisticated equipment.

There is also a more complicated (and probably not very accurate) example of some “rough math” with multiple layers in post #26 here and you can see a similar “rough math” example that applies to pressure relief (rather than how much you sink in) in post #2 here.

Having said that … regardless of how much you are sinking in or how much pressure you would have if it was measured … all that really matters is that you sleep well and as LJGMDAD said I would give it a few weeks at the very least (and hopefully you’ve checked the other suggestions I made previously as well).

Phoenix

The math of bums! So would a 6" core have any more resistance than a 3" core at the same pressure and same ILD? I’m just curious. I had looked at the Botanical Bliss which is a 6" core and 3" comfort layer, and I had previously thought it’d provide a more solid foundation somehow. But I do think I favor the combination of 3 3" cores instead - just to have more options.

Oh and speaking of the Botanical Bliss - there’s one retailer that does make a big to-do about their certifications! But, again, how to put a price tag on that is questionable at best. I.e. if the latex is all natural, then what does an additional certificate on top of that do for me? But I digress…

Hi LJGMDAD,

If they were both on a solid surface then a single 3" core would be firmer than a 6" core because it would be compressed to a greater percentage of it’s total thickness (see post #14 here about the effect of thickness).

If you have two 3" layers that are both the same ILD as a single 6" layer they would be very similar. There is more about two 3" layers vs a single 6" layer in post #2 here.

Phoenix

I was going to try and contact SF and Aireloom next week to see what type of foam is used on their upper layers.
What classification questions should I ask…such as what type of foam, ILD, weight?

It was mentioned that maybe the cover was still to firm, so today I unzipped it and had the sheets right on top of the latex, but still felt the same type of “up pressure” that is making me soar.

I did that the two Magniflex dealers in my are actually home decor type of stores and only have one of those models on display.
So they recommend going down to the Miami Magniflex Gallery (an hour south of me) to try all of them out. But if I were to order one, there is no exchange or return since Magniflex cannot resell or recycle used mattresses. So that right there would probably prevent me from every buying one.

Hi FAUguy,

The information you would need is in this article.

Phoenix

So after 2 1/2 week, I sent it back to SleepEZ today.
It never got any break in where there was less pushup pressure on me. What’s interesting is that I had a few friend stop over in the past few days and just try it out for an honest opinion. They said things like too firm, too much pressure, air mattress, trampoline. Out of the 5 people, none of them liked how it felt…not that it really mattered, but was just interesting if any of them liked it.

Boxing it up today was a pain. It took 3 of us almost 90 minutes to get it done, and we were hurting afterwards.

I do wish it would have worked out…and at this price…but I guess it just wasnt for me.

I’ll be heading out next week to narrow down what I want to end up getting…will keep you updated. The bad thing is that it takes 7 days for this to get back to AZ, then 7-10 days for the refund to process. Once the credit is posted to my card, only then can I order another mattress. So I’ll be mattress-less for about 3 weeks.

Hi FAUguy,

I’m sorry to hear that your mattress didn’t work out for you but the good news is that you had the foresight to order a mattress with a good refund policy.

As you mentioned … at least you can do some research and testing to help you decide which type of mattress you are most interested in while you are waiting for the refund.

I’m looking forward to finding out what you end up deciding on to replace it.

Phoenix

I made it back up to City Mattress this week and tried them out again.
I liked both the Aireloom Maribel and Silverton models. The Maribel is “softer” while the Silverton is a bit more “supportive cushion”… it’s hard to describe in words the difference in how they felt. Pricing was $3600 and $4100, taking $900 off retail price.
Not really sure yet which one I may go with. But the SF MacClesfield I’ve filled out because it is too much like a marshmallow and have no idea how the two 3" memory foam layers would hold up.

Hi FAUguy,

[quote]I made it back up to City Mattress this week and tried them out again.
I liked both the Aireloom Maribel and Silverton models. The Maribel is “softer” while the Silverton is a bit more “supportive cushion”… it’s hard to describe in words the difference in how they felt. Pricing was $3600 and $4100, taking $900 off retail price.
Not really sure yet which one I may go with. But the SF MacClesfield I’ve filled out because it is too much like a marshmallow and have no idea how the two 3" memory foam layers would hold up. [/quote]

I would be very cautious here and make sure that you know the type and quality of all the layers in any mattress you purchase so that you can confirm there are no weak links in the mattress…

While there is always some risk in buying a mattress that uses durable materials but doesn’t have the comfort and support that you need and isn’t a good match for you in terms of PPP … if you have a good return/exchange policy the risks are minimal.

On the other hand the risk involved in buying a mattress that is comfortable and supportive or has a great “showroom feel” when it is new but uses lower quality materials that will only hold up for a few years are much higher (especially in the price ranges you are looking at) because if you lose the comfort and support that was the reason you purchased it and you end up needing to buy a new mattress after only a few years then what you paid for the mattress will have been lost completely. I would also keep in mind that the loss of comfort and support that comes from foam softening isn’t considered to be a defect and isn’t covered by a warranty unless you are one of the minority where the visible impressions in a mattress (without anyone on it) are deeper than the warranty exclusion (see post #174 here).

Phoenix

[quote=“Phoenix” post=50751]Hi FAUguy,

[quote]I made it back up to City Mattress this week and tried them out again.
I liked both the Aireloom Maribel and Silverton models. The Maribel is “softer” while the Silverton is a bit more “supportive cushion”… it’s hard to describe in words the difference in how they felt. Pricing was $3600 and $4100, taking $900 off retail price.
Not really sure yet which one I may go with. But the SF MacClesfield I’ve filled out because it is too much like a marshmallow and have no idea how the two 3" memory foam layers would hold up. [/quote]

I would be very cautious here and make sure that you know the type and quality of all the layers in any mattress you purchase so that you can confirm there are no weak links in the mattress…

While there is always some risk in buying a mattress that uses durable materials but doesn’t have the comfort and support that you need and isn’t a good match for you in terms of PPP … if you have a good return/exchange policy the risks are minimal.

On the other hand the risk involved in buying a mattress that is comfortable and supportive or has a great “showroom feel” when it is new but uses lower quality materials that will only hold up for a few years are much higher (especially in the price ranges you are looking at) because if you lose the comfort and support that was the reason you purchased it and you end up needing to buy a new mattress after only a few years then what you paid for the mattress will have been lost completely. I would also keep in mind that the loss of comfort and support that comes from foam softening isn’t considered to be a defect and isn’t covered by a warranty unless you are one of the minority where the visible impressions in a mattress (without anyone on it) are deeper than the warranty exclusion (see post #174 here).

Phoenix[/quote]
Here’s an update.
The SleepEZ was returned several weeks ago, as it was just not right for me.

I spent time going back to City Mattress several times trying out their selection. I narrowed it down to the Aireloom Meribel or the S&F Macclesfield Hybrid. Both felt comfortable to me in the store and it was a bit of a toss up. I ended up buying the Aireloom Meribel since the brand had better reviews on line and seemed to stand behind their warranty better.

But now that I’ve had it for the past week, I haven’t been real happy with it. Even though I can sleep on it (which I couldn’t even do on the latex) it is still noticeably firmer and with a strong “push back” that I don’t like. Also, the tufting hills and valleys I’m not use to. The first 3 night when I tried to sleep on it, it took 3-4 hours until I did sleep, and kept waking up with a soar back and numb legs. After those few nights, I ended up putting my 3" gel memory foam topper I got two year ago on there, and was we to sleep better, but can still feel the up pressure underneath for the mattress.

Now I’m not sure what the hell to do. Tough it out with the Aireloom and try to break it in (with or without using the foam topper), even though I’m soar and hurting (and out $3600 for the mattress). Or give it at least a month, and if it’s not working out, to change it for the S&F Macclesfield, since it has two 3" from layers on top of the 8" coil, and is flat on top without the hills and valleys.

I hate that its been all these months and still having a bad time finding something that I’m comfortable with.

Hi FAUguy,

As you know I would normally suggest avoiding any of the mattress you mentioned you were considering in your previous post for all the reasons that I’ve outlined in my earlier replies but now that you have made your purchase I would probably sleep on the mattress for a few weeks (preferably 30 days or longer) to see how things work out as the mattress breaks in and you adjust to the feel of a different sleeping surface (see post #3 here).

Unfortunately City Mattress doesn’t allow refunds and only has a 90 day exchange policy so if after you have slept on the mattress for a few weeks it still isn’t working out for you then you would be in a somewhat difficult position where you need to exchange a mattress and are “locked in” to a store where I would normally suggest avoiding most of the mattresses they sell and where there may not be any particularly good quality/value options available to you. Their cost for an exchange is lower after 30 days and lower yet after 60 days so it would make some sense to wait as long as you reasonably can.

When you are in this type of more difficult situation there are some suggestions and ideas in post #2 here about the two main strategies that you can use that can help you make the best of a difficult situation.

If the only issue with your mattress is that it’s too firm and you need some additional softness and pressure relief then a topper can also be an effective solution as well and wouldn’t be much more than their exchange costs and post #2 here and the topper guidelines it links to can help you use your sleeping experience as a reference point and guideline for choosing the type, thickness, and firmness for a topper that has the least possible risk and the best chance for success and also includes a link to a list of some of the better sources for toppers I’m aware of as well.

Phoenix