How to look for and find the best mattress ... for YOU! ***READ FIRST***

Thanks so much Phoenix for the detailed response, it was very helpful. I really appreciate how much time and attention you give to everyone on this site!! Iā€™ll be reaching out to APM next as you suggested. Who knew mattress research could be so exciting =D

Hi ilovesearch,

You are most welcome and thank you again for your post. I look forward to hearing how the search progresses. I am glad you are contacting APM and/or others. Good luck!

Phoenix

Greetings! Iā€™m a new member with a several-part fairly general question.

tl:dr We tried some mattresses, but are having problems translating what we tried into useful information to guide our next tests and our choice.

Background:
My boyfriend and I just moved in together, and agreed that itā€™s time to upgrade from his ancient queen mattress that doesnā€™t really work well for either of us to a king that we both like. Iā€™ve been reading through this site (thank you thank you thank you for this resource!), but we havenā€™t been able to try very many out yet, for various reasons. Weā€™re hoping to go back and finish up the trying-out part this weekend, as efficiently as possible.

Recently, we wound up at a random mattress store near a different errand (so not where we plan to buy), and were able to try three mattresses. I took pictures of the information cards, and notes on our responses, thinking that I could take that information and align it with the info on this site to figure out what our preferences meant, and then go buy a good mattress from an independent manufacturer. Unfortunately, that was easier thought than done. One of the three mattresses had useful Google-able information (#3), but the other two remain fairly mysterious. Can yā€™all help us decipher what it was we tried out and/or help us translate our preferences into more technical terms that can guide what we try next?

(descriptions and numbers taken from the cards attached to the mattresses, followed by our reactions to the mattress)

  1. [li]American Bedding by Coriscana. Firm A10213, Cotton fabric cover, foam encased edge support, ABC OmniSense and SupportSense Comfort Foams, SpringEase Support System. (Queen: 044901754989 460, King: 059902256989 575)
    [ul]
  2. My lower back started hurting a few minutes into lying on my back, perhaps my pelvis was too low
  3. On my side, the support was pretty good (though maybe my pelvis was sinking a bit much), but the comfort wasnā€™t great for my shoulder
  4. ā€œAā€ thought it was pretty good
  5. When ā€œAā€ was lying on his side, he was kind of U-shaped (shoulder and pelvis higher than his midsection)
    [/ul]
    [/li]

    [li]Royal Dreams Collection. Plush PT Royal Dreams, Soft Cotton Cover, Foam Encased Edge Support, Gel-Infused Visco Memory Foam, Super Soft Foam, Individual Pocket Coil (Queen: 079903031228, King: 094903621498)
    [ul]
  6. ā€œAā€'s first impression was that it was nice, but that it might lead to back pain, then a few minutes later he did feel a twinge in his lower back while lying on his back. His verdict was that there was too little back support
  7. While I was lying on my side, it felt like I was folding in the middle a bit. While I was lying on my back, I definitely felt like an upside down U, with my stomach higher than the rest of me. It looked like that was the case for ā€œAā€ as well.
  8. When I stood up after having lain on my back for a bit, I felt a little bit of lower back pain too.
  9. Both of us liked the comfort layer.
    [/ul]
    [/li]
    [li] BeautyRest Silver by Serta Simmons ā€“ Extra Firm ā€“ Open Seas, Cotton Fabric, Dual Cool Fiber, Energy & AirCool Foams, AirCool, ViscoGel, GelTouch Foams, AirCool FEES, Individual Pocketed Firm Coils. (Queen: 099904921298, King 139907071850)
    [ul]
  10. ā€œAā€ said this one gave a good first impression and is his overall favorite. When he was lying on his back, it looked like his spine was pretty straight. He felt a little bit of back pain but not a lot.
  11. When I was lying on my side, the support felt good, but it wasnā€™t squishy enough to be comfortable for very long.
  12. When I was lying on my back, the support also felt good, but there was a bit of a gap between my lower back and the mattress.
    [/ul]
    [/li]

Now a bit of background on us.

  • Iā€™m typically a side sleeper, but I do sleep on my back sometimes too. Iā€™m overweight (~250 lbs) so need more support than the average woman.
  • He primarily sleeps on his back, but sometimes rolls onto his side when his back is hurting.
  • He has cerebral palsy, which among other complications means that he sleeps in the middle of the bed (to avoid falling off), his limbs move a lot except when heā€™s in a deep sleep, and he is prone to neck and back pain. Because he sleeps in the middle of the bed, those fancy ā€œdifferent firmness for each half of the bedā€ mattresses arenā€™t an option, so we need to find something that works for both of us.
  • Weā€™d both like to minimize motion transfer. Durability is also very important to us, and if the cooling features actually work, weā€™d really like that too.

We also need a new bed frame and, if necessary, a box spring, so suggestions here are very welcome too. It has to have good clearance off the ground (> 8" even when someoneā€™s on the bed), and be very durable as well. We donā€™t want or need a headboard, and canā€™t use a footboard or side posts. Basically, we just need something that holds the mattress off the ground. If possible, weā€™d rather not use a box spring, since weā€™d prefer the overall bed height to be as low as possible, even with the clearance needs.

Iā€™ll say that the mattress budget is under $2000, but thatā€™s not set in stone.

Weā€™re based in Orange County, California, so have many options for places to shop.

Weā€™d really appreciate any insights yā€™all can provide. Iā€™m really excited to have found this good source of information to guide our decision, but am also a bit overwhelmed by the number of different things to consider.

Thank you, and happy sleeping!

Hi cosmos,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :).

Thanks for your very kind words and post. We hope we can help a little on your mattress buying journey. As you mentioned it may be overwhelming, to begin with, but it helps to know you are not the only ones and that with a bit of determination to get things right, like everyone else youā€™ll get there.

Thank you for noting your sleep styles and sleep patterns, well organized, which means as you learn the materials / different constructions, you will know what to look for when you go shopping again.
While you focused a great deal of understanding how a mattress could be a good match for you and your ā€œAā€ and tested your choices for PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) ā€¦ you are correct that it would be difficult if not impossible to ā€œdecipher what it was we tried out and/or help us translate our preferences into more technical termsā€ Perhaps the most important aspect Iā€™d keep in mind is that a mattress is as good as the materials inside of it. It may feel good in the showroom but if it starts sagging in a few months or years all the good testing for the perfect match is wasted and youā€™d need to start your mattress journey once again. Also, someone elseā€™s experience cannot ā€œtranslateā€ into what you will experience with the same bed because only you can feel what you feel on a particular mattress and we are all very unique in what we each need and prefer.
Iā€™d press the reset button and now that youā€™ve gained some valuable experience through your very careful testing (which will greatly simplify your search and help you make the best possible choices) Iā€™d make sure to find out exactly what is in the mattress, layering and densities once you learn to avoid the worst ones (like the major manufacturers or any manufacturer or brand that doesnā€™t disclose the quality of the materials in their mattresses and most mass-market stores that have little knowledge about the mattresses they sell).

Of all of these ā€œspecsā€ ā€¦ the specs that affect the quality/durability of all the foam layers in the upper layers are the most important. In many cases and with many manufacturers they are also the most difficult to find out. Most people that sell mattresses have very little knowledge about even basic foam quality specs. This is usually enough to make meaningful assessments and comparisons or identify any potential weak links in a mattress. For those who want more detailed information about the durability and useful life of a mattress relative to each person then post #4 here and the posts it links to has much more information about all the variables that can affect durability.

Throughout this website, it is often mentioned to avoid ā€œmajorā€ mattress manufacturers. This is primarily due to a clear lack of transparency about the quality and specifications of the materials used in their mattresses vs. smaller independent manufacturers that make similar mattresses with the same or better quality, are transparent about their materials and designs and often times sell for better prices.

In general, for a 2000+ budget innerspring king mattress If you do not know the complete specs and if the mattress does not meet durability guidelines here, I would not waste much time with it. In general, 2nd tier companies like Spring Air, Restonic, Southerland, etc. with independent owners, as well as the remaining plethora of mattress manufacturers, as a group, do not have the QC systems to provide consistency and they were cost driven. This means that shop floor management would make decisions of putting cost ahead of quality (for example substituting components). I would tend to avoid the 2nd tier players in way more than I would avoid the majors when it comes to quality and consistency. Independents like Corsicana, Southerland, are even more likely to be inconsistent and have poor QC practices You may wish to peruse through this Article here.

Comfort/pressure relief and support/alignment are the two most important functions of a mattress for everyone so you certainly arenā€™t alone in this but the only way to know for certain whether any specific mattress will be a suitable choice that provides you with both will be based on your own careful testing or your own personal experience when you sleep on it because different people can have very different needs and preferences in a mattress in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences)

Iā€™m not sure what youā€™ve read since you found the site but just in case you havenā€™t read it yet ā€¦ the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice ā€¦ and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure youā€™ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best ā€œmatchā€ for you in terms of ā€œcomfortā€, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesnā€™t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the ā€œvalueā€ of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists.

Regarding the mattresses, you mentioned all of them, as far as I can tell from researching, all of the ones you tried, are innerspring mattresses see the description in this article. When you are trying the mattresses, itā€™s important to note the mattress specifications you need to know.

Maybe most importantly please look at our list of trusted members, which Flo Beds is actually in the Fullerton area. TMU thinks highly of our members and we believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency. All members use high-quality materials at fair prices so they would certainly make a great quality/value choice.

Phoenix

Okay, Iā€™m starting to narrow things down. I wish more stores had latex mattresses. I have had a hard time finding an actual latex mattress I can try out. It seems like most latex mattresses are sold online now. I went into Original Mattress and they only carry one latex mattress, the Serenity. At least I was able to compare it to memory foam and innerspring mattresses at the store. I think I prefer the latex, but Original Mattress only has one and there are no choices for firmness. (I was told that they used to have 5 but now itā€™s down to 1.) Original Mattress also does not take returns at all. I am considering Sleep on Latex and PlushBeds. Both of them offer latex mattresses with several choices for firmness, they take returns up to 90 days, and they arrange pickup of returns, unlike some companies where you have to arrange it with UPS yourself. My question is, how can I decide which level of firmness will be right for me? I am replacing a 10 year old Englander Versailles which has started giving me shoulder pain. I usually sleep on my back and I weight 177 pounds, so Iā€™m guessing that Medium might work for me. I also noticed that PlushBeds has some mattresses that allow you to move around the layers, but how hard is it to do that? Isnā€™t it difficult to get the latex back inside the cover?

Hi doctorx0079,

Welcome back and thanks for the post.

We are very understanding of the difficulty of selecting something appropriate when there are not enough ā€œgoodā€ latex mattresses to try out and compare at traditional retail. It is really hard to gauge what would be best, but at least you were able to try the Serenity latex at Original Mattress and compare its feel to different mattresses and materials.

I did take a look at the Original Mattress serenity link, and this is one of there two-sided latex mattress, made with 4.5" poly foam core and 3" of Talalay on top and bottom. They donā€™t list the ILD of the Talalay on each side, did you happen to ask the sales associate this question?

As you may or may not know, Sleep on Latex is one of our trusted members that I think very highly of and consider them to compete well with the best in the industry. In this way, we are partial to our members based on their quality, value, service, transparency, and use of high-quality materials. Additionally, you can also check out other many members on our site who have many years of latex experience and some offer topper exchange programs. Here is the list of TMU members that sell latex or all-latex mattresses.

I am not sure what you read since youā€™ve found us but youā€™d need to understand the difference between pressure relief and support, you can read about primary or ā€œdeepā€ support and secondary or ā€œsurfaceā€ support and their relationship to firmness and pressure relief and the ā€œrolesā€ of different layers in a mattress in post #2 here and in post #4 here that may also be helpful in clarifying the difference between ā€œsupportā€ and ā€œpressure reliefā€ and ā€œfeelā€.
Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure youā€™ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best ā€œmatchā€ for you in terms of ā€œcomfortā€, firmness, and PPP that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesnā€™t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the ā€œvalueā€ of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well he will sleep), durability (how long he will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and the options you have available after a purchase if your choice doesnā€™t turn out as well as you hoped for).

When assessing any product, also be sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the quality of the materials and components to the durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

When you canā€™t test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help ā€œtalk you throughā€ the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and ā€œfeelā€ of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness, etc.) and the options they have available that may be the best ā€œmatchā€ for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the ā€œaveragesā€ of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about ā€œmatchingā€ their specific mattress designs and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

I hope this gives you a good start in selecting an appropriate firmness choice for a new latex mattress. I look forward to learning about your decision and any other questions you may have.

Phoenix
Note: I have moved both your posts in this thread to better keep track of your progress.

Thanks for your quick and thorough response Phoenix!

I got some additional info about the Serenity by Original Mattress. They have an info card in the store which has information that is not on the website.

Comfort layer: Talalay 16-22 ILD, 3.0 lb with tolerance of Ā±0.25 lb/ft^3
AND 21-27 ILD 3.25 lb/ft^3 with tolerance of Ā± 0.25 lb/ft^3

Core: Polyfoam 26-34 ILD 2.5 lb/ft^3 with tolerance of Ā± 0.1 lb/ft^3

Austin was very helpful as usual and didnā€™t try to pressure me. He did mention that they are testing new natural latex mattresses but no idea whether they will be selling them or when.

I found the mattress pretty comfortable in the store but I was only lying on it for 10 minutes or so. That doesnā€™t give me much of an idea of how well I would really sleep on it. But maybe it is something to go by when I call the other mattress companies.

I think some experimenting will help me get a better idea of what I need. Last night I tried sleeping on my side with different pillows and I noticed that my shoulder doesnā€™t ache as much. Iā€™m going to try different configurations and see how I feel.

Hi doctorx0079,

Thanks for posting the new info. Original Mattress is a very good factory direct retailer and I am glad that they provided the complete specifications set for the Serenity Latex mattress which is a good product with no weak links. This info can certainly help with finding something comparable that meets your budget. The old latex version that Original sold about 7 or 8 years ago was very similar except that they used 32/36 ILD Talalay latex as their ā€œcoreā€ and it was a great seller, hopefully, they bring back a similar version.

You make a very good point about ā€œthe pillowā€ and experimenting with the mattress pillow combination. Finding a suitable pillow can be as hard as finding the best match mattress. The key, of course, is to maintain a more neutral cervical/upper thoracic alignment in all sleeping positions, but not many of us have what many physicians might describe as ā€œnormalā€ curvature in this region.

For sleeping on your side, it is imperative to maintain a pillow of sufficient enough thickness and substantial enough in filling to not collapse and have your head sink too much laterally. When you sleep on your back, one generally wants the pillow to be a bit thinner so that youā€™re not sleeping with too much forward flexion. That is why ā€œshapeableā€ pillows (ones with filling that can be moved into different levels of thickness) are popular for people who sleep both on their side and back. Down, shredded foams (latex, polyfoam and memory foam), buckwheat hulls, kapok, wool, silk, synthetic fibers, and flaxseed are just a few of the offerings in this category. Additionally, many of these styles of pillows are available with an inner casing that allows accessibility to the fill to allow removal of the fill material in order to customize thickness. You may wish to check out our newest member DIY Natural Bedding that has more than a dozen DIY pillow and kit offerings and also CozyPure with their newest LaNoodle Latex Pillow custom-fill with zipper. and youā€™d have the advantage of being able to interface with both of them as both are extremely knowledgeable and experienced with pillow materials and configuration.

One tip for side sleepers is to place a large pillow or body pillow in front of you and rest your free arm on this pillow. This takes some of the stress off of the neck/shoulder complex. Additionally, you may wish to experiment with placing a pillow behind your shoulders when sleeping upon your side. This allows you to lean back slightly against the pillow, effectively abducting your scapula and rolling your shoulder joint forward a bit, and this can also help relieve some stress for you.

In the end, just like you mentioned, it does come down to quite a bit of experimentation, but youā€™ll want to be sure that youā€™re considering a product using more durable materials. Pillows are a very personal choice and different people will have very different pillow preferences or different opinions about what they perceive as firm and soft or the general type of pillow that ā€œfeelsā€ good to them but some of the information in the pillow topic here and the posts it links to can help you choose a pillow that is the best ā€œmatchā€ for you and the mattress you are sleeping on.

Thanks for the post and I look forward to hearing about your progress.

Phoenix

We spend about one-third of our lives in bed, but we usually donā€™t put a lot of thought into how healthy of an environment it is. Avocado Green Mattress set out to change all that when they designed an affordable mattress made from non-toxic, natural, and organic materials.

Is going natural at bedtime that important? Yes! Unlike the delightful ā€œnew car smell,ā€ ā€œnew mattress smellā€ ā€“ aka ā€œoff-gassingā€ ā€“ can keep you up at night. Despite the convenience and affordability of polyurethane or memory foam mattresses, most are made with synthetic foams and are often manufactured with chemical adhesives and chemical flame retardants. All of which arenā€™t so great for you or the environment (hence the, um, aroma).

Avocado Green mattresses are different. Theyā€™re made to order in California using natural, organic materials. Materials like:

  1. One hundredā€“percent natural Dunlop latex from tree-tapped and sustainable sources in Asia. (Rubber trees donā€™t really grow in the US.) Dunlop latex is made from tree sap and natural ash that get whipped into a foam, which is then steam-baked and washed. Thatā€™s it! No synthetic rubbers or polyurethane foams. Plus, itā€™s naturally antimicrobial and cooler than memory foam.
  2. Avocadoā€™s natural wool is grown by JomaĀ® New Zealand Wool. Itā€™s breathable, odor- and fire-resistant, and great at regulating temperature. All of which means: the wool helps you stay warm when the weather is cold, and cool when the weather is hot. Itā€™s also OEKO-TEX Standard 100 certified.
  3. Finally, every mattress is made using organic cotton that has been grown without the use of toxic and persistent pesticides and synthetic fertilizers. It offers a luxurious, breathable finish that absorbs and wicks away moisture. Of course, their manufacturer ensures all of Avocadoā€™s organic cotton is certified by the Global Organic Textile Standard.

Hello Phoenix & Sensei,

Thanks for providing such an informative and helpful resource. Being near the end of my research, Iā€™m ready to purchase a latex mattress, but I need to ask questions to help narrow down the pros & cons of each approach Iā€™m considering.

Me:

  • BMI 19.5 (tall and thin), with shoulders about 1/2" broader than hips.
  • Shoulders have been a pressure point problem.
  • Side and occasional back sleeper.
  • Will use a 5 panel, adjustable, queen-sized bed, as the foundation.

Here are the 3 choices Iā€™m considering in a queen size:

Mattress #1 (all Talalay)

  • 3" split F layer + 3" split M layer + zippered cover (quilted wool)
  • 3" S topper (w/stretch case)

Mattress #2 (all Talalay)

  • 3" split F layer + 3" split M layer + zippered cover (Stretch)
  • 3" S topper (w/stretch case)

Mattress #3 (all Talalay)

  • 3" split F layer + 3" split M layer + 3" single S layer + zippered stretch cover

The difference between 1 & 2 is just the case around the 6" mattress. The difference with #3 is all layers would be inside a case.

With a latex mattress, Iā€™m trying to come close to, (or BETTER!), than the plush/firm, Sealy Crown Jewel, double-sided, pillowtop mattress I purchased around 2001, and loved for many years. I never felt the rock hard springs, until the quilted 2" poly(?) foam + 1/2" (?) memory foam, started to go south, (not sure exactly what was in there, do you know?). However, I intend to steer clear of the toxic crap that was used in its construction. Also, Iā€™m going to use an adjustable bed to maximize comfort, so, an all latex mattress seems the way to go.

What iā€™ve tried:

  • Tempurpedic Deluxe -After many nights the verdict is: I cant stand the wet sand feel. Itā€™s waaaaaay too hard, if I dont have the foot and head adjusted properly, it causes pain/numbness in my shoulders with side sleeping and pain in my calves and heels with back sleeping.

  • Savvy Rest or was it Nest? - tried in the showroom, but the cover was soooo stiff, (did they use the sails from a boat???), I couldnt feel my body contouring into the latex, so I basically just floated on top of the soft topper+mattress.

  • Iā€™ve used latex pillows, off and on, so Iā€™m familiar with the feel of Talalay latex, as far as pillows are concerned. I prefer the thin stretch cover that JCPenny & Tempurpedic have used on their products. This allows for maximal contouring, which I believe I will prefer for pressure point relief. Iā€™m considering the separate topper in the #1 & #2 mattress configurationā€™s above, to create more freedom for the latex to conform around me (similar to the construction of the pillow top on my Sealy Crown Jewel, that had a 2" indention all the way around the edge, before it was attached to the cover).

Questions:

  1. Which of the 3 configurations would work best to give me contouring, but little to no wrinkles & shifting in the layers/case/protector, given that Iā€™m going to use an adjustable bed?

  2. Are they all going to breathe about the same, when used with an adjustable base? Or will one be less hot than the others? (Iā€™m in an area with long, hot, summers, but i do run an AC when itā€™s 85+ degrees).

  3. Any potential cons to any of the 3 configurations Iā€™ve listed? Such as, durability? Lousy edge support due to smaller topper size? etc.

  4. Lastly, Iā€™m trying to understand the ā€œTalalay is more lively than Dunlopā€ statement. Is it the same annoyance that I experience with a solid latex pillow when laying on my back? I end up with my head flopping to one side, or the other, as thereā€™s no grip to the pillow, to keep my head facing forward. I cant tolerate this, and have to use a shredded latex, or down pillow, to stabilize my head, so my muscles can relax when facing forward. If this same problem is what people are complaining about, when they say Talalay is too lively, then maybe I need something else at the surface of the mattress to create this ā€œgripā€? A shredded latex topper, perhaps?

Thanks for any help you can offer! The ball needs to get rolling :slight_smile:

~Janeway

Hi Janeway,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :), and thank you for the compliments. Let me see if I can offer any help, but just as an overall impression all of the choices listed are very good mattresses with no weak links.

Regarding the Sealy Crown Jewel, I donā€™t have access to this information at this time, and I think it may not be that relevant, but I will do a quick search just to double check anyways. It sounds like it worked out quite well.

With some latex mattresses, this can be common for beds that use a ā€œtape edgeā€ sewn cover, creating a feeling that you floated on topā€¦I used to use the analogy to a ā€œparachuteā€ as this cover is pulled tight to sew all four sidesā€¦but I also love the ā€œsails from a boatā€ā€¦very funny. Itā€™s really good you noticed this as it happens with a lot of latex mattresses.

All three will be very similar regarding the layers shifting, the one with the ā€œquiltedā€ cover may show fewer wrinkles. The ones with the ā€œtopperā€ that is added onto the 6" base mattress, could potentially shift a bit more given the topper is free standing. If you add a mattress protector, this, of course, will give you more ā€œholdā€ and help keep the layers feeling more snug.

I think given that all of the covers are stretch knit, and use Talalay latex the will all breath about the same. Technically the wool in the quilted cover could theoretically wick away more moisture, but I canā€™t say it would be incrementally noticeable to an individual. That said, every personā€™s sensitivities to these questions are different, so only you will be able to tell the difference.

No issues with durability, especially given your low BMI. Regarding edge support, if you are using the firm 36 ILD? and then Medium 28ild you will have pretty good edge support, but again, this is something that is personal to people. I can say ā€œno issueā€ and you can say itā€™s an unbelievable problemā€¦do you find when you tried other mattresses, latex or not, that this issue is noticeable, and is it a high priority for you?

Mattress number 3 will have better edge support as all three layers are in one cover unit, thus this mattress will feel a bit firmer, compared to same ILDā€™s but using a free-standing topper.

I sleep on Talalay pillow and talalay latex, and I do not think this is the same issue. Oneā€™s head and neck are very sensitive to having your head pushed forwardā€¦this is a very particular feeling. The part of the talalay being more lively is important to many people.

Latex has an unusual combination of surface softness and deeper firmness/support that comes from itā€™s elasticity, itā€™s point elasticity (ability to conform to the shape of a body) and itā€™s compression modulus (the ability to get firmer faster with deeper compression than other types of foam). This means that it can enhance the pressure relieving layers above it because of its surface softness and point elasticity but it is also very supportive and can ā€œstopā€ the heavier parts of the body from sinking in too deeply. It is also very resilient (it returns a high percentage of the energy of compression instead of absorbing it like memory foam which has very low resilience) so it can enhance the ā€œfeelā€ of the mattress by making it more responsive and more adaptable to different body profiles and sleeping positions rather than the less responsive feeling of memory foam or the stiffer and less adaptable characteristics of, for example, polyfoam.

I see you are asking other questions from our trusted members, they can help also.

Please message any other questions you may have, and let me know if you need any clarification. Thank you so much for your post.

Sensei

I hope this is the right place for this question. Iā€™ve been trying to follow the recommended procedure for narrowing choices down, but am running into the problem that because my current mattress became so painful so fast, I am pretty much always in a bit of hip/back pain and so thereā€™s no mattress that feels 100% right. However my sleep on my current mattress is getting worse by the day so I want to make a decision as soon as possible. I am hoping that someone on the forum can give some advice as I feel a bit anxious about proceeding!

About me ā€“ Iā€™m 5ā€™4, 135 pounds, and a side sleeper. In following the initial steps, I found I didnā€™t like the all latex mattresses as I tend to switch sides a few times before falling asleep and some of them felt too bouncy. I gravitate towards mattresses that arenā€™t very plush, but kept my mind open since I didnā€™t make a good choice on my mattress last time, and of course now I know the difference between sinking in and sinking down thanks to this site. :slight_smile: Iā€™ve narrowed down my choices to some found at Urban Mattress in Vienna, VA, which is one of the few non-chain mattress stores thatā€™s reasonably close to me. The sales clerk there was very helpful and I think Iā€™ve found a few mattresses that are good at least in terms of alignment and construction. Iā€™ll be going back hopefully this weekend with a friend to double check my choices (particularly the alignment part ā€“ the sales clerk took photos for me but itā€™s hard to see subtle differences in them), but meanwhile I wanted to see if anybody on the forum can give some advice.

So far all of these felt pretty good (or aggravated my existing issues as little as possible):

Harmony firm: https://vienna.urbanmattress.com/shop/product-collection/virtues/
Outer layer: Stretch-knit fiber
Comfort layer: 3" layer of HR Cold Foam
Support layer: One 6ā€³ layer of 2.5 lb. 28 ILD HR base foam, one 2ā€³ layer of 28 ILD latex, and 1" layer of 19 ILD latex

Gratitude: https://vienna.urbanmattress.com/shop/product-collection/virtues/
Outer layer: Polyester Blend over two 1.5 inch layers of 2.1 LB High Density Certipur Foam
Comfort layer: 2 inch 28 ILD Talalay Latex and 2 inch of 19 ILD Talalay Latex
Support layer: 6 inches of 2.5lb 28 ILD (Firm: 35 ILD) HR Cold Foam

Silver Lake firm: https://vienna.urbanmattress.com/shop/product-collection/essentials/
Outer layer: Stretch-knit fiber over 2 layers of 1.5 inch Certi-pur 3 lb HR Cold Foam
Comfort layer: 2 inches of Certi-pur 3 lb HR Cold Foam
Support layer: Firm: 884 6 inch 14.5 gauge pocketed coil with firm edge/ Plush: 884 6 inch 15.5 gauge pocketed coil with firm edge

Dahlia plush: https://vienna.urbanmattress.com/shop/product-collection/bloom/
Outer layer: Natural Bamboo cover; .4 inches of natural Talalay latex; wool filling; 1.5 inches of 3 lb HR Cold Foam
Comfort layer: 2 inches of 28 ILD Talalay Latex
Support layer: Firm: 884 6 inch pocketed coil 14.5 gauge / Plush: 884 6 inch pocketed coil 15.5 gauge

Part of the reason I am struggling is that these all feel about the same even though they have different materials. I spent a good deal of time at my last visit testing all of them and didnā€™t detect a whole lot of difference. Iā€™ve of course done some reading on the site but still do not feel very confident in assessing the relative merits of materials of these. I lean towards the Gratitude, Silver Lake, and Dahlia because I think their materials overall seem better, but I could be wrong.

Itā€™s very important to me to buy something that lasts (in addition to giving me a pain-free nightā€™s sleep!) and I donā€™t mind paying more for more durable materials.

This is a very long post, so if you read it and are able to provide any advice, please know it will be most gratefully received!

Thanks,
Claire

Well, this site provides a wealth of information in the sea of confusion that mattress buying can be. Thank you.

Hereā€™s our situation, 5 years ago, my wife and I bought a Serta iComfort Prodigy to replace an EZ Sleep all latex bed that we had for @ 6 years. That bed sagged and no longer supported us (it was a 3 layer, soft/medium and firm) and left us with backaches even after flipping the top layer, which was a pain in the neck. That bed always felt like sinking in concrete. Prior to that, we slept on softside waveless waterbeds, which were wonderful except that if it was adjusted right for one person, it was uncomfortable for two and vice versa. Prior to that, I sold and slept on original style hardside waterbeds since the late 70ā€™s.

Now in our late 60ā€™s, the iComfort has been much more comfortable than the latex, but it seems like now, the top comfort layers are collapsing and no longer doing their job, leading to backaches for both of us.Iā€™m also starting to sleep very hot on it. Iā€™m 5ā€™ 10" and 196 lds, down from 216 a year ago and my wife is 5ā€™7" and in the mid-200ā€™s. We both switch back and forth from side to back sleeping.

My research has led me towards a foam/coil spring hybrid. Specifically, Iā€™m considering either the Ghostbed Flex or the Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid. I have not ruled out a Dreamcloud, Brooklyn Bedding or Helix either. Any input or shared experience would be welcome.

Thanks in advance.

Hey David,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :).

Thank you for the post, and thanks for the nice words about TMU.

Noted on the Icomfort Prodigy, that was a good mattress that Serta made in 2014. I am not surprised some of the comfort layers are breaking down, but you actually did pretty well for these layers to last 5 years. Some people are seeing a breakdown in materials after 1 or 1.5 years.

Just as an aside, thatā€™s so cool you ā€œbought and soldā€ hardside waterbeds. Growing up one of my best friends parents had three different ā€œoriginal style hardside waterbedsā€, which for a teenager was awesome when we had sleepovers. That is my experience in total of these beds. Your post brought back memoriesā€¦ok I digress.

I think your choice of the GB flex and the Nest Signature is a good direction at this point. Both of these coil units are of high quality and very supportive. As you well know, there is no way for us to give you any direction of which one will be better for you and your spouse.

I know you may have read some or most of the information, but this post - How toā€¦best mattress for you is a great post organizing many critical points about buying a new mattress. Also, both Nest and GB have many years of experience in the mattress industry and they most likely will have knowledge of the Serta Prodigy from 2014/15 models.

Good luck and let us know if you have any other questions.

Thanks
Sensei

Hi clairechristina47,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :).

Thanks so much for the post, and the kind words about TMU.

Urban Mattress is a well-known retailer within the mattress community, and they make very good quality mattresses and are quite professional. One of the things I was thinking about, is itā€™s not that surprising after testing out a variety of mattresses, then coming down to some finalistsā€¦that they may feel very similarā€¦this is the feel you are gravitating to.

Although they are different, they are relatively firm mattresses. I think its good you have two with high quality, high-density foam as the base/support layer, and the other two are very good quality pocketed coil hybrid mattresses.

All of the layers and materials are of high quality, with no ā€œweak linksā€ as we say. I do agree with you and wish they could show more differentiation in product feel, especially when marketed within the ā€œVirtuesā€ or ā€œEssentialsā€, etc product group.

For the Harmony, I donā€™t usually agree with putting 1" 19ild below 3" of the ā€œHR Cold Foamā€. 19ILD Talalay is a wonderful layer should be used closer to your body and on top of polyfoam. Just dropping it in the middle of a mattress build is a waste. The real benefit is lost so far below the surface.

Regarding the HR Cold foam, which I am sure is the high resilient polyfoam product. The website is vague about this layerā€¦as as an FYI, for real HR Polyfoam to be considered high resiliency ā€¦ ā€œby Lawā€ requirementsā€¦must have both higher than 2.5 lb./ft3 (Yes they do) in density and have a compression modulus of 2.4 or higher. and are defined in ASTM D3770 on the PFA website. These are important factors for why ā€œHRā€ foam has the qualities it has.

I think the next thing you need to compare is one of the all foam beds - Gratitude, for example, and then choose one of the Silver Lake and Dahliaā€¦then take time to closely compare these final two and see if you see a difference in how the pocket spring works against the all foam bed.

Then you are able to choose between one pocket coil bed and one ā€œall foamā€ bedā€¦both are going to be very durable compared to similar mattresses made by National companies.

All of your choices are made with high durability materials, therefore I am thinking about pressure relief more for youā€¦ and as you say, which I personally can relate to:

I know you read this comfort and pressure relief article, if not itā€™s still good for all of our consumers for testing pressure relief on different mattresses.

Thank you again, and please let us know if you have any other questions, and if you made any decisions. Good luck!

Thanks.
Sensei

Hi Sensei,

Thanks so much for your reply, this information is super useful! I am hopefully going to the store today to make a final decision and will keep all of this in mind. I canā€™t say thanks enough for you and the other experts on this site providing your advice - although itā€™s still a big decision I at least feel like Iā€™m not going in as blind as I did last time.

And, I did read that pressure relief article a while back but that was a useful reminder, so thanks also for that. Even if I cannot expect the mattresses to immediately relieve chronic pain that has been building for a while, I can focus on trying to find pressure points.

Cheers,
Claire

Hey Claire,

You are very welcome, I am looking forward to hearing how it went. I know that area fairly well, some close family live in Falls Church. Talk soon.

Sensei

Hi Sensei,

I ended up purchasing the Gratitude. I liked the idea of the more natural outer materials of the Dahlia, but this time I was feeling a pressure point through the hip so eliminated that. I didnā€™t feel a huge difference between the Silver Lake and the Gratitude, but my friend (and the store manager) said my spinal alignment was slightly better on the Gratitude, so I went with that. I eliminated the Harmony right off the bat as I decided you were right - why bury the best material. Especially after reading so much on this site about the positive aspects of latex!

I really felt a lot more confident having some expert input in the back of my mind, so thanks again to you and everyone on this site who takes the time to help strangers on the internet with their mattress purchases.

To others reading this thread - I can strongly recommend the Urban Mattress store to everyone in the DC, MD, and VA area. They are not very pushy (and know about this site!) and are knowledgeable. I never felt pressured to hurry up and make a decision even after going in there multiple times and testing mattresses out for long periods of time. Also, they are right across the street from a Savvy Rest store - I didnā€™t like their mattresses myself but they might work for others of course.

Thanks,
Claire

Hey clairechirstina,

Very nice! Thank you for those nice comments about TMU. It really is a unique process, and getting some real info can be so helpful at retail. I a not surprised Urban Mattress knew about TMU, they are the type of retailer that can appreciate TMU consumers. I like the Gratitude model a lot, really nice quilt layers, and the talalay layersā€¦itā€™s really a high-quality mattress.

I am glad we could be helpful, and at least just give support with what you had learned, and what the retailers was saying. Glad to hear.

Thanks,
Sensei