I recently moved and need a bed so started doing research a couple weeks ago. This site is awesome!
I tried out a bunch of mattresses today and liked the Jamison CloudWing best. According to the rep the “soft talalay” is 19 ILD and the “medium talalay” is 44 ILD (44 being medium seemed a bit odd to me).
EDIT: I got these corrected specs on the CoudWing
Top layer: 2" Soft Talalay Latex 19 ILD / 4.3lb density
2nd layer: 1" Medium Talaly Latex 21 ILD / 4.5lb density
Support Layer: 7" Marriott Core 32 ILD / 1.8lb density
Does anyone have any idea how the feel might compare to the Brooklyn Bedding Cotton Camilla mattress? This would be a bit of a nicer option on my grad school budget.
Also, the price for the Jamison Cloudwing Queen was $1699 for the mattress and foundation. They said they would reduce it by about 15% for just the mattress, and currently it is on a $400 sale. That would make just the mattress $1044. Would it be reasonable for me to try for $1000 with some pillows thrown in?
He is correct that most would find 19 ILD Talalay very soft; however, he must be on drugs to call 44 ILD anything other than concrete!
I’m thinking 36+ range is Firm.
I would agree with jefmoody and 44 ILD is usually considered to be ultra firm … or what the latex manufacturer calls super firm (see their firmness ratings here). I believe you may be getting incorrect information about the firmness of the “medium” 1" layer (you can see the Jamison description here).
“Feel” is subjective and the comparison between the two would also depend on the how the firmness of the base layers compared (which would contribute to how the mattress “feels”) and the firmness of the latex comfort layer you chose in the Cotton Camilla. A single layer of latex in the comfort layer will feel different from the same thickness of latex in a single layer with a single ILD. The Cotton Camilla also has a 1" quilting layer which would also affect how it “feels” vs sleeping directly on the latex in the Jamison. Every difference between two mattress will change how they feel and perform and body type and sleeping positions will also affect how two mattresses compare to each other in terms of “feel”. The only reliable way to know how two different mattress may compare in terms of feel is with side by side testing unless a manufacturer has experience with comparing their mattress to a local mattress you are considering and has tested them in a side by side comparison. Other than that it would be a “best guess” situation.
In terms of the quality of the materials the latex comfort layer is the same material in both (blended talalay latex) but the density of the polyfoam base layer in the Cotton Camilla is slightly lower (1.5 lbs) and I believe the Cloudwing is in the 2 lb range although you would need to confirm this with them).
You can also read some comments about a comparison between the Brooklyn Bedding Bamboo Bliss and the Jamison Skipper (which is the same construction as the Cloudwing) which may be a closer comparison because the Bamboo Bliss uses a higher density polyfoam base layer similar to the Jamison although it also has a more costly cover quilted with wool and a thin layer of polyfoam and has the option of changing your comfort choice after a purchase so it’s not exactly the same construction either.
I would keep in mind alsco that density/quality of a foam doesn’t affect the “feel” of a mattress because any density polyfoam can be made in any firmness level. If you were heavy enough to “go through” a 3" comfort layer more than lighter body weights then a higher density base foam that is a little more durable could be a good idea even though for most people the density of the base layer wouldn’t have a significant effect on the durability of the mattress for more normal body weights (a mattress will tend to soften and break down from the top down).
I think this is a reasonable “mattress only” price already and they may not be willing to go any lower but it certainly doesn’t hurt to ask. The most effective “negotiation tool” is to show them a similar mattress you are considering that has a similar design and materials so they can see that you are making an “apples to apples” comparison between similar mattresses. There is more about negotiating in post #6 here.
Neither mattress has an obvious weak link and you are making comparisons between “good and good” in your final choices.
Thanks for the update. That makes more sense but may still not be quite correct (21 ILD Talalay is not generally considered to be medium). If they are correct they are probably close enough for you to call BB so they can tell you which of their comfort choices they think may be the closest approximation if you decide to go in that direction. None of them would be exactly the same because they have a single layer and use a different type of cover that is quilted with wool and polyfoam.
The Jamison has the advantage that you have tested it in person so you know exactly what it feels like.
The BB is a little more uncertain what it will feel like to you but has the advantage that you have the option to change the comfort layer at a minimal cost if your sleeping experience shows that you need a softer or firmer comfort layer after you sleep on it. It also has some wool in the quilting which can help with temperature regulation.