LookingNow, I noticed in another thread where we discussed the firmness level of your new mattress, you described the feeling of wanting to crawl to the side of the bed? What did you mean by this?
Thanks Again Bud!!!
I had a rough night with my neck again because of this. I think my body alignment is so good that I now need to fill the gap under my neck when I sleep on my side, and I need something I can scrunch lower for my head. I will go try one of Neal’s pillows this week but call first to see if I can get one with all natural latex, yes. Thanks.
Also, I bought a pillow for about $60 once at either Sleepy’s or perhaps a smaller store in Chelsea I visited once; I can’t quite remember where I got it. It was awesome. I wore it out after a few years. It was filled with some sort of material that felt like soft beads of some sort that move beautifully as needed, confirming to my needs in this way, for both under the neck and for the head. I wanted to buy another one when I threw it out but I had ripped off the tag. The cover itself was incredibly soft too. I might look around the web for it.
[quote=“brc722” post=33622]Did you know Spindle offers adjustable shredded latex pillows as well? Neal explained to me that they come overfilled and then you can remove the fill to your comfort level. The thing is, i recall you saying you were chemically-sensitive, so you should know that they use a combo of their natural and synthetic latex inside the pillow. Perhaps one could be customized for you…i dont know.
Ive had this problem with my neck too and i have found it always to be a pillow issue. Like you, i fall asleep in one position(my side), then end up on my back. So, in trying many different type of pillows, i discovered some side pillows have so much loft, that my head is too high when im on my back. If the pillow is too low or mushy when on my side, then my neck will definitely start hurting. It can be a real nuisance! I have found using a medium loft pillow thats firm is working for me right now bc it isnt too huge for when im on my back and it being firm, it keeps my head up to be in alignment when on my side. I know stomache sleepers require flatter pillows so thats tough to combine with side sleeping! I myself am considering ordering a pillow with my order from Spindle bc i used one at there and i found it relatively easy to reshape and use as i needed, although it was limited use of course.
Good luck![/quote]
Brc,
My first night on the latex with (from the bottom up) firm, firm, medium the bed felt softer than I have been used to lately for my stomach sleeping. (I’d been sleeping on hard beds prior to that.) So I thought it was too soft. But after giving it another try it is not too soft for stomach sleeping. Because of the way Spindle’s latex holes are, the smaller holed area that creates more firmness for the stomach/lower back area holds up my stomach nicely. It also fills in the gap at my waist for side sleeping really well. I don’t know if because the holes are smaller again up at the head, my head is higher and not sinking in as much as my shoulders., this my need for a pillow that will suit these needs. Could be the case, maybe not.
Just a quick update and question here…
Sleeping on the F, F, M is killing my back now, could it be my needing to get used to it?
I sleep on my stomach - and also on my right side.
My left lower back hurts and is shooting mild pain down my leg right now. I also have middle back pain on the other (right) side.
Not sure if this is from stomach sleeping or side sleeping - but the F,F,M feels too soft. The F,M,F combination felt too hard.
Seller recommended giving the current (F,F,M) a week’s try possible. It’s been about 4 nights; pain is increasing.
Phoenix, I found a post where you talk about it being uncommon to put F under M but do you or anyone else here suggest I try it again and see if it softens up? Maybe I can achieve something more supportive with that if I give it time.
Or, could this be just my body getting used to latex? I’m fairly young and healthy but I do have some slight misalignment with my back and legs, I was told once by a chiropractor.
I know you can’t feel the mattress for me but any ideas based on experience or what others have said?
Thanks
Hi LookingNow,
It certainly could be … or it could also be because the current layering isn’t the best match for you. There is more in post #2 here about some of the more common “symptoms” on a mattress and some of the possible reasons behind them. The first thing I would always do though is to talk with the manufacturer because they will be more familiar with their mattresses and how different types of people do with different combinations than anyone and you can go into much more detail with them about the specifics of your “symptoms” than is possible on a forum.
I’m not sure where you read this but a softer layer over a firmer layer would be much more common than the other way around … especially in the top two layers (although the other way around or what I call dominant layers can also be a useful option in some cases). Most layering combinations have the firmer layers closer to the bottom. Like Neal suggested I would also tend to stay with the initial FFM for a while before switching things around but if this is impossible then I would definitely talk with Neal about your options. Two of the options you have to rearrange your layers would be what you have tried (FMF) which would give you a firmer sleeping surface and a little less deeper support or FM (two layers) which would give you a support layer that became firmer faster than having two layers and a little firmer sleeping surface. Additional options would also be possible with a layer exchange depending on the outcome of your conversations with him.
Phoenix
I would like to try the FMF again before I ask him about it. (Yes - I had my question about that backwards.)
When you mention “2 layers” do you mean simply taking out one of the F layers and having my mattress consist of 2 layers (F,M) only? And if so, how could that be different than it is now with the F,F,M?
Hi LookingNow,
When I got my latex mattress (from a different company) my original combination of X-firm dunlop, firm dunlop, medium talalay, and medium talalay topper felt to firm for me after only sleeping a few nights on it. My shoulder started to hurt. So I switched up the layers, I stole one of my wife’s layers and adjusted it slightly to find out a combination that worked for me. One thing I did eventually was I had my wife check my posture and alignment after laying in the bed for 15 minutes or so like I was testing the mattress at the store. If she said it looked like it was out of alignment I immediately went to the next combination. Only making small incremental changes. I found that if I tried going to bed when my alignment and posture was poor to start with, it did not improve at all during the night.
What I ended up with is the following combination. Firm Dunlop, X-Firm Dunlop, Soft talalay, and medium talalay topper. As you can see I used the dominating layer effect to help get my posture and alignment correct. Thanks for the suggestion Phoenix 
Although I am still not 100% about this combination I am still in the testing phase I will say I have had over a week of sleeping on it and my pain has decreased significantly. Although being sick has also not helped with my current testing.
The key to switching the layers around though as I have found out is to only do small incremental changes at a time. IE. Swap only 1 layer at a time and test.
I hope you get a combination that works for you!
Thanks, CentralPA!
I do wish I had someone her to check my alignment.
Are your layers 3" each?
Feel better .
Hi LookingNow,
Yes. Thinner layers or thinner mattresses will have less “range” of compression from soft to firm (see post #14 here) and it may maintain much of the surface softness but feel firmer overall because the layers would compress to a greater percentage of their thickness so I thought it may be worth trying as an option (after your other combinations) to see if it made any difference (although as CentralPA mentioned I would go very slowly with “incremental” changes and not make rapid changes that your body doesn’t have time to keep up with or identify a “pattern” that you can assess).
Phoenix
Thanks.
I have now spent another night on the F,F,M continuous pour.
Last night I struggled against the softness of the bed. My hips especially sank in where the holes in the latex are bigger for extra softness. I finally ended up getting a little sleep by sleeping across the bed where the holes are smaller and bed is firmer.
I need no more experiments with this combination. It isn’t working.
Today I will ask the owner about what he suggests although the options i have now are either F,M,F (which felt too hard the one night I tried it) but I might give that a few nights. I will also ask him about taking out one layer (ending up with either F,M or M, F).
At last resort I could also turn the latex sideways and cut it making my bed shorter which is fine for my 5’3" height so I’m sleeping “down” the smaller holes I need for support.
It seems the problem for me anyway is that the holes they make aren’t really helpful. I’d rather have the whole latex piece be the SE firmness all the way down the mattress. The holes also get bigger again at my shoulders but that’s what’s causing my head to “pop up” too high and neck pain.
After doing more reading this morning it seems to me that like any other foam experience I’ve had, this may be about having that top softer support layer be thinner than the 3" it is now.
I will see what the owner thinks about this and if he has any thinner layers.
[quote=“LookingNow” post=33738]Thanks, CentralPA!
I do wish I had someone her to check my alignment.
Are your layers 3" each?
Feel better .[/quote]
Yes my layers are 3" each.
Also is your mattress talalay or dunlop? I read somewhere and Phoenix can correct me that dunlop can feel slightly firmer when flipped over. So if your medium layer is dunlop and you flip it over, it might firm up enough to fit the difference of the F/M/F and the F/F/M you have been trying out.
Phoenix please correct me if I misinterpreted this from what I had read earlier….
That makes a lot of sense actually.
It’s continuous pour Dunlop.
When you say “flipped over” do you mean “smooth side up”? That side does feel firmer.
Since the softer layer on top was way too soft for me, I already changed it back to F, M, F for tonight. But I think I will do what you suggest (oppositely) and put that top Firm layer “smooth side down” and see if that softens up this configuration.
If that doesn’t work I will try F,M (2 layers only) with the M layer on top - and smooth side up - as you suggest.
Thanks again.
Hi CentralPA and LookingNow,
The continuous pour process has less settling of the latex particles so there may not be as much difference between the top and bottom firmness as molded Dunlop but the “skin” side may be a little firmer and it’s certainly worth a try.
Phoenix
Hola Phoenix
When I turned it just now the “skin” side felt just that - a little firmer.
Thanks
Did you say you want to build an adjustable fill pillow yourself? With natural fills?
We sell all our fills by the pound with pillow cases separate or in a kit with all the supplies together. Our Manufacturer Memberships :: The Mattress Underground See “supplies” for by the lb. loose fills.
Our fills are shredded natural latex, millet hulls, kapok fiber. All of them are mold and mildew resistant, non habitable for dustmites. And each pillow has a very different feel to it.
Deborah
Hi diynaturalbedding,
For some reason I neglected to add you in the DIY pillow supplier links in post #8 here which in turn is linked in the pillow thread.
As you can see the oversight is now corrected … thanks for the reminder 
Phoenix
Thanks Deborah!
Once I get my bed all squared away I’ll look at that again.
I now completely understand what Phoenix means about people having different ideas of what “soft” and “firm” are. Having tried the very same mattress that LookingNow has , i would never think of it as being too soft (it was a comfortable firm for me) . But for her it is too soft of a firm. Its funny because i was happy to have found a latex that had a firmer feel overall than what i was finding elsewhere (albeit not many), so to hear it being described as yet too soft brings home Phoenix’s points on the difficulty of comparing firmness levels based on an individuals perceptions.
Lookingnow, did you try the the Firm, Firm, Firm configuration…was it too firm for you in the showroom? Since you do sleep on your side as well, i can see how maybe that setup couldve been overlooked.