I would like to first thank you Phoenix, this website is amazing. I have been lurking around for the past 18-24 months or so, but finally registered when the mattress search took on a renewed effort (i.e. my wife finally agreed the mattress was failing). Ill start out with a little about us, current mattress and where we are at currently.
Me: 5’8", 175 lb and average build, side sleeper predominantly (75%) with back being the rest.
Her: 5’6", 140 lb average build. Sleeps 60/40 on her side and back.
Current mattress: Sealy Bay island: comfort layer 2" of 2.0 lb density memory foam and 1.5 lb polyurethane support layer (took a bit of searching and some math to figure this out).
Our current mattress has been giving me issues for the past few years and started with a different mattress frame Amazon.com
That helped for a little while, but my hip/lower back pain started to get worse for me after about 6 months. I stumbled on this site and pretty quickly learned what mistakes I made but it took another 18 months and an extended trip to a relatives house on a newer mattress before my wife finally agreed. After searching the forum, I found a few good options in my area (https://forum.mattressunderground.com/t/looking-for-direct-outlet) and took a drive to see Jeff at mattress to go. We managed to narrow down a good match for her in terms of her posture and alignment, pressure relief and her personal preferences; I have been looking on and off for the past year so I had a pretty good idea what I was looking for in the way of PPP. We managed to narrow it down to two mattresses that she liked:
1.) https://www.matt-to-go.com/HB_Silver_Falls_PT.html
2.) https://www.matt-to-go.com/HB_Vista_Pointe.html
The links have the basic information about the construction of each mattress. The first mattress, the silver falls pillowtop, has two 1" poly foam layers in the quilted layer; Jeff said HD 1.5 lb/ft3 I believe but I intend to confirm all densities via email. EDIT: all of the polyurethane foams in the remaining layers are 1.8 lb/ft3, the memory foam is 4.0 lb/ft3 and the latex is mid 20s ILD.
The comfort layer starts with a1" Dunlop latex layer, a 1" high performance plush poly foam layer and a 1.5" 5-zone plush contour poly layer followed by a versare liner. A .5" piece of gel visco-elastic memory foam in the lumbar region is next, and a 1" layer of high performance support polyurethane foam rounds out the upholstery layers. The springs are a marshal/pocket coil with a1.5"HD base foam on the bottom of the spring unit. The second mattress has the same quilting layer but with a 1" gel latex layer, followed by a 0.5" gel visco-elastic memory foam layer, nanocoil layer, 1" high performance support polyurethane. The springs are also a marshal/pocket coil with a1.5"HD base foam on the bottom of the spring unit. The second mattress also has inner tufting through the mattress itself. To soften up/aid in pressure relief for the second mattress, we added a 2" 11-15ILD talalay latex topper from pure bliss latex and the latex topper makes the two mattresses have a similar feel to each other in pressure point relief and comfort.
Now (finally) to what I would like help with; pending the ILD/density information of each of the foam layers in both of the mattresses, what do you think of the overall design/construction of the mattresses? Any obvious weaknesses (pending the density information)? Anything obvious that I’m missing?
I’m more inclined to the firmer mattress with the latex foam topper since the first mattress is on the edge of what I would consider too soft as well as possibly reducing motion transfer across the mattress and overall durability of the quilting/comfort layers. My wife leans towards the first mattress due to adding the topper; shes afraid of the topper sliding and would rather have all the layers contained within the mattress (i.e. no topper). Also learned that all latex mattresses were a no-go for my wife and her PPP.
I will clarify that it was entirely my mistake for not getting the ILD/density information for the two mattresses. Jeff offered the information and to go into further detail but my wife was ready to go and only a husband that wants to sleep on the couch ignores his wife getting cranky about leaving when you have a 90 minute drive back home. Furthermore, I visited just about every store that carried mattresses within a 30 mile radius and no one came close to being as knowledgeable as Jeff from mattress to go; I was a bit skeptical about the drive (didn’t tell my wife) and trying to convince my wife to go on the drive was a feat in itself, but I’m glad we did. Jeff was the first person that didn’t try to steer me to what he wanted to sell us; I’m still not sure how to handle that, but it’s a very large positive.
Hi Seraph,
As you know I think highly of Jeff and he is certainly a great resource that will be able to give you good information and guidance. He is also one of the most knowledgeable people I know in the industry.
When you are testing a mattress locally then the ILD of the individual layers isn’t important to know because with careful testing your body will tell you much more about whether a mattress “as a whole” is a suitable “match” for you in terms of PPP than knowing the ILD of the individual layers. ILD is also only one of several factors or “specs” that will determine how soft or firm a layer or a mattress will feel to different people and can often be more misleading than helpful (see post #4 here).
If a quilting layer (or any layer) is lower density or “unknown density” and is only “about an inch or so” or less then it doesn’t really have a meaningful effect on the durability of a mattress and just affects the “surface feel” of the mattress. If the layer is quilted to the cover then the quilting pre compresses the foam and makes it a little more durable so in practical terms I normally use about 1.5" as a maximum thickness guideline. The 2" in the Silver Falls is just on the other side of the line I normally look for so there would be some slight additional risk in terms of durability but since 1.5 lb polyfoam is only a little lower than the minimum density that I normally look for and is a higher density than is usually used in quilting layers and because all the other layers and components are good quality materials … it should be fine in terms of the durability and useful life of the mattress
The Vista Pointe is inner tufted which can significantly increase the durability and useful life of the materials and components in a mattress so with the inner tufting the top 2" of 1.5 lb polyfoam wouldn’t be an issue at all so there are no lower quality materials or weak links in this mattress that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress. IMO it would be a more durable choice than the Silver Falls.
While not everyone likes the feel and performance of latex … latex is very heavy and “sticky” and it’s very unlikely that there would be any issue with the topper sliding or moving especially underneath a fitted sheet and mattress protector which would also help to secure it in place.
If a mattress/topper combination is a good “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP then having a separate topper has the advantage of being able to replace just the topper without replacing the entire mattress if it softens or breaks down before the upper foam layers in the mattress (which is very likely because the upper layers of a sleeping system tend to soften or break down before the deeper layers) or if your needs or preferences change over time. A suitable topper can also help extend the useful life of the mattress underneath it because it will absorb some of the compression forces that can soften or break down the top layers of the mattress underneath it over time.
Once you have narrowed down your options to a list of finalists that are all choices between “good and good” and you have confirmed that none of them have any lower quality materials or “weak links” in their design relative to your weight range and if at this point there are no clear winners between them (which is usually a good indication that you have done some good research) then you are in the fortunate position that any of them would likely be a suitable choice and post #2 here can help you make a final choice based on your local testing or mattresses you have slept well on, your more detailed conversations about each of them, your confidence about PPP and the suitability of each one, their prices, your preferences for different types of materials or mattresses, the options you have after a purchase to fine tune the mattress or exchange or return the mattress or individual layers, any additional extras that are part of each purchase, and on “informed best judgement” based on all the other objective, subjective, and intangible parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.
Phoenix
I wanted to leave an update for anyone who was/is interested; my wife and I ended up getting the Vista Pointe with a 2in ultra plush pure latex bliss latex topper. I also ordered a new frame for the mattress and a split mattress frame/box spring (why that’s important comes in later). Jeff was VERY knowledgeable about the entire process, saving me from a few potential headaches before I even thought of them, namely transport and setup of the mattress.
We picked up the mattress and set it up a week ago and I’m SO glad I paid extra for split foundations; Jeff warned me about the weight and increased lumber used in the construction, the new frame made my old one look like a bunch of twigs stapled together. The frame was the simplest I’ve ever setup and very sturdy for what I paid for it, truth be told.
After about a week sleeping on the new mattress, I am sleeping longer every night without waking up tossing and turning, while not waking up in pain when I get out of bed. My wife says she has mixed feelings so far; she feels better but was initially claiming she was tossing and turning more, which had me concerned. Turns out it was me and not the bed; after cooling down our down our bedroom and looking at her sleeping tracker, we realized she was staying up later than usual and waking up with me in the morning (3 hours earlier than her usual time). I’ll ATTEMPT remember to post updates to this thread how our mattress is working out for us, but so far so good.
Hi Seraph,
Thanks for the update with your comments and feedback and for letting us know what you ended up deciding.
Most importantly … congratulations on your new mattress and topper 
It sounds like you made a great choice and hopefully as your wife gets to sleep a little longer her experience will get better as well although it’s normal that there will be a break in and adjustment period with any new mattress or sleeping system that is different from what you were used to sleeping on (see post #3 here).
I’m looking forward to any additional updates you have the chance to share.
Phoenix