Need Mattress Topper Advice - For Phoenix

Phoenix,

I ended up returning my memory foam mattress topper and exchanged it for a 3" latex Medium-Soft 4.7lb 16-18 ILD. It has only been two nights but I think this one is better for me.

Now I want to finally order the mattress protector. As we previously discussed I will purchase a protector to go around my Tempurpedic mattress and the new latex topper. When I had the memory foam topper I planned to get the St Dormier protector. I am wondering with a latex topper if that would still be the best protector for me? Or would a stretch cotton be better such as the Suite Sleep or Cozy Pure? Previously you mentioned that the wool can provide better temperature regulation but may have more a little more effect on your mattress. Is that the same for a latex topper as well?

Since the latex is a bit firmer than the memory foam I think the most important factor now would be a proctor that has the least effect on the feel of the topper, than temperature regulation would come second. Can you please let me know if wool or cotton would be better for this?

Thank you

I

Hi udoknowjac,

There is more in post #89 here about the pros and cons and the tradeoffs involved in different types of mattress covers which would apply to any mattress. The Dormeir is thinner relative to other types of wool/cotton protectors (it has 4.5 oz/yd of wool) and would have less effect than a protector that was less stretchy or used thicker layers of wool (see this post for some recent feedback from one of the members here) but a knit cotton protector will be more stretchy yet and would have even less effect than the Dormeir (although of course it wouldn’t be water resistant).

Phoenix

Hi Phoenix,

I am looking for your advice once again.

I had a 3 inch 4 pound Aerus Memory Foam Topper from Sleep Warehouse which I placed on top of my Tempur-Pedic mattress. I found this to be too firm so in June I returned the Aerus Memory Foam Topper and replaced it 3" latex Medium-Soft 4.7lb 16-18 ILD topper. I have not truly enjoyed it much since ordering it, it has not been very comfortable or pain relieving. More importantly recently as my pain has increased the bed seems to be very uncomfortable. Since my chemotherapy ended my body pain has increased and I am trying to find a solution to make my bed more comfortable. Right now it seems very firm and I am not experiencing any relief from pressure point pain. I am going to look into a complete new bed but in the interim I want to buy a new topper.

The cause of my pain is unknown at this point but it might be fibromyalgia or inflammation from the chemo. Basically it is all over pain and my bed at the moment is the least comfortable place for me. I have been doing some research and I am wondering if a wool topper might be helpful? I could use it right on top of the temperpedic or on top of the latex topper I would appreciate any thoughts you might have.

I also still sleep VERY warm and would I hear the wool can help with this?

I am also looking for something as chemical free/organic as possible. If you do think wool would be a good choice can let me know some trusted companies and what size/type might be best considering the layers of my bed?

Thank you,
Jacalyn

Hi Phoenix,

I am looking for your advice once again. As mentioned in this post previously I purchased a 3" latex Medium-Soft 4.7lb 16-18 ILD. in June whjch sits on top of my temperpedic bed. I am finding lately I am experiencing alot of pain and not very comfortable in my bed. My body pain has increased since my chemotherapy and I am trying to find a solution to make my bed more comfortable. I am going to look into a complete new bed but in the interim I want to buy a new topper.

The cause of my pain is unknown at this point but it might be fibromaygia or

Hi udoknowjac,

If the 100% natural Dunlop latex topper you purchased is 4.7 lb density then it would almost certainly be firmer than 16 - 18 ILD (it would more likely be in the mid/high 20’s) and given that Dunlop latex also feels firmer than Talalay in the same ILD range it’s not all that surprising that your topper is too firm for you. You can see some examples of approximate firmness levels and ILD’s for different densities of 100% natural Dunlop latex in post #2 here.

Unfortunately I can’t make any specific suggestions because you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress/topper combination and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion about which topper would be the best “match” for both you and the mattress you are using it on in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) based on specs (either yours or a mattress) or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more accurate than your own personal testing or sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here). This would be particularly true when there are also more complex health issues involved. The specifics of the mattress under the topper can also make a significant difference in which topper will work best for any specific person since every layer and component in a mattress/topper combination will affect the feel and performance of every other layer and the “sleeping system” as a whole.

Having said that … wool has an amazing ability to help maintain a more neutral sleeping temperature (it can regulate temperature in both directions) and the humidity and the overall microclimate of a sleeping surface. Wool is also often a favorite material for many people that are more sensitive to pain (such as many people with fibromyalgia) because it can provide a more “relaxed” sleeping surface and can help with surface tension or shear forces on the sleeping surface (see post #18 here). There is also some evidence that it can help people reach the deeper and more restorative levels of sleep.

A topper can also reduce the amount of heat that reaches any memory foam underneath it or at least slow down the time it takes to become softer with your body heat which may lead to a combination of some additional surface softness and a different “feel” from the wool topper combined with firmer feeling memory foam layers underneath it. If you do go in this direction and you haven’t tried a wool topper then any return/exchange policy may become a more important part of your purchase just in case it doesn’t work out as well as you hoped for. While it may end up working well for you as it has for others (the only way to know this would be based on your actual experience) … you could also end up with a more temperature regulating sleeping surface that was still less pressure relieving than you hoped for.

There is more information about wool toppers and how they compare to various foam toppers (at least in very general terms) in post #8 here and in posts #3 and #6 here and there are some additional comments about wool toppers and a list of some of the better sources I’m aware of in post #3 here.

Phoenix

Thank you for the quick reply. I am sad to hear the topper I have is so firm. I speak a lot of time talking with the salesman on the exchange and feel I was mis-informed since I was exchanging an item for being too firm. There is nothing I can do about it now except try to find something to bring me relief. The worst for me is the pressure points in my shoulders when sleeping on my side.

I understand you cannot make any specific suggestions but I hope you do not mind further questions. The more I read the more confused I become with all the options and great information! My desire is to find a combination which is soft/somewhat “sinkable” while comfortable to sleep but bringing the needed pressure relief. The firmness I have now does not do it at all and either did the 3 inch 4 pound Aerus Memory Foam Topper.

In one of the posts you mention “Wool is a great material that is a strong preference for some people and there are certainly some good benefits to sleeping on wool but I will echo diynaturalbedding’s comments that it will be different and firmer than sleeping on a soft foam material (and it will also get a little firmer as it compresses over time).”

I had decided against memory foam because of the chemicals involved, this is one of the reasons I switched to latex. In addition, the memory foam I had was not working for me . I realize Is there a “soft” talay latex which might bring pressure relief and be better than the wool? Do you have any information from your research/experience on which one might be better for people with Fibro? The information below makes it seem the wool might be perfect for me but I am just wondering how it might compare to a softer latex? Or even a latex on top of the firmer latex I currently have?

In another of the posts you mention a wool topper "would “soften” firm latex below it and it would “firm up” soft latex below it. In your case does this mean the wool topper would soften the firmer latex?

I really appreciate your help and I am sorry I keep asking so many questions. I am just hoping I might be able to make a better choice this time. I did a lot of research last time and now see I made a mistake

Thank you

Hi udoknowjac,

I’m always happy to answer any questions that I can but I can’t speak to how any combination of materials will “feel” for any specific person because there are too many variables in both people and combinations of materials to be able to predict this with any certainty.

I or some of the more knowledgeable members of the site can certainly help you to narrow down your options, help you focus on better quality/value choices that are available to you either locally or online, help you identify any lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress relative to your weight that you may be considering, act as a fact check, talk about the pros and cons of different materials, or answer many of the specific questions you may have along the way that don’t involve what you will “feel” on a mattress, and help with “how” to choose but only you can decide which specific mattress, topper, manufacturer, or combination of materials is “best for you” regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or whether anyone else (including me) would have the same criteria or circumstances or would make the same choice.

Unfortunately there is no “better choice” for someone with fibromyalgia because they aren’t a homogenous group of people with the same needs and preferences so a topper that would work best for one person with fibromyalgia may not work nearly as well at all for someone else with fibromyalgia or on top of a different mattress.

In very general terms … softer and more pressure relieving materials that provide a more “relaxed” sleeping surface will tend to work better than firmer materials because for most people with fibromyalgia a softer more pressure relieving sleeping surface is a more important priority.

Materials such as wool or other types of natural or synthetic fibers or fiberbeds, shredded latex, very soft latex, or softer memory foam are all materials that have worked well for some people with fibromyalgia but no specific material will work well for all people with fibromyalgia (and once again the specifics of the mattress under the topper will also make a significant difference in which topper will work best for you). When you have more complex medical conditions such as fibromyalgia that can be cyclical I would also keep in mind that there may be no “perfect choice” when it comes to a mattress.topper combination and a topper that works well for you some of the time may not work as well at other times or all of the time (this is true for everyone to some extent but would be a bigger issue for those that are more sensitive because of specific health challenges) so the most realistic goal is making the “best possible” choice that works “most of the time” rather than a “perfect” choice that works all of the time.

A forum search on fibromyalgia (you can just click the link) will also bring up more comments and feedback from others that are in similar circumstances that may be helpful (but it will also confirm that there isn’t a single “best” combination of materials that will work for everyone with fibromyalgia).

This would depend on the specifics of the wool topper and how thick and firm it was relative to your latex topper (your latex topper may be in a softer range if the density information was listed incorrectly) and it can also depend on the person because different people can also have very different perceptions of firmness and softness compared to others as well. A mattress or topper that feels firm for one person can feel like “medium” for someone else or even “soft” for someone else (or vice versa) depending on their body type, sleeping style, physiology, their frame of reference based on what they are used to, and their individual sensitivity and perceptions. There are also different types of firmness and softness that different people may be sensitive to that can affect how they “rate” a mattress or a topper as well (see post #15 here) so different people can have very different opinions on how two sleeping systems (mattress/topper combinations) compare in terms of firmness and some people may rate one as being firmer than another and someone else may rate them the other way around. This is all relative and very subjective and is as much an art as a science.

When you can’t test a topper in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help “talk you through” the specifics of their toppers and their properties, firmness, and "feel"and the options they have available that may be the best “match” for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses or toppers you have slept on and liked or other toppers you are considering that they are familiar with, and the “averages” of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about “matching” their specific toppers to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other toppers or materials that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

Once again though … I would always keep in mind that even the best of other people’s suggestions will always be based on their “best efforts” and on what their experience indicates has worked well based on the “averages” of other people that are in similar circumstances but the “averages” of other people may not always apply to you.

I wish there was a way to predict how well a specific combination of materials would work for any specific person or set of circumstances or that there was some algorithm that could predict this but unfortunately nobody has a crystal ball that can predict which specific combination of materials you will like best or that you will sleep best on with any certainty based on specs or “theory at a distance” and I would be very skeptical of anyone who claims that they do. It just doesn’t exist.

Phoenix

Good Morning,

Thank you again for all of your help, I am very grateful. Instead of asking more questions I am hoping to be able to find someone close I can go and try some things out in person. If possible this would be better I think than online. I live in Orlando and I am trying to find a local retailer where I can go since I have had so many issues. I have seen the retailers listed on your site and I think the closest is in Holly Hill, unless you have any new ones?

In a google search I came across “Relax The Back” they claim to use organic materials and appear to have wool toppers as well as Dunlay/Talay Latex. Here is a link: https://www.relaxincomfort.com/products/certified-organic/savvy-rest.aspx

I would love any thoughts/information you might have on this retailer because they are very close to my home and as I begin to explore toppers and a new bed it would be great to use someone close.

I also found this place in Ocala FL: The Sleep Center:
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Thank you!

Hi udoknowjac,

You’ve probably seen this already but the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in the Orlando area are listed in post #2 here and the Ocala list is in post #2 here. I don’t know which of them carry toppers or the types of toppers they would carry so you would need to call and find out before visiting them.

[quote]In a google search I came across “Relax The Back” they claim to use organic materials and appear to have wool toppers as well as Dunlay/Talay Latex. Here is a link: https://www.relaxincomfort.com/products/certified-organic/savvy-rest.aspx

I would love any thoughts/information you might have on this retailer because they are very close to my home and as I begin to explore toppers and a new bed it would be great to use someone close.

I also found this place in Ocala FL: The Sleep Center: [/quote]

I added Relax in Comfort to both lists (thanks for the heads up). They carry Savvy Rest component latex mattresses and also seem to carry their Woolsey topper as well although they may also carry or have access to the other Savvy Rest toppers as well. They certainly use good quality materials and Savvy Rest dealers tend to be quite knowledgeable but they are also in higher budget ranges than other similar mattresses and toppers.

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They carry Pure Latex Bliss mattresses so it’s quite possible that they would also carry the PLB toppers as well which use very soft Talalay latex.

Phoenix

Thank you! I think I want to go ahead and look for a new bed (the topper is just an interim solution) and it seems from your post Relax in Comfort may be a great place to look. On your link the only other location close to me would be IKEA. The other retailers would be a bit of a drive which might be worth it but I am glad to know Relax in Comfort is a good place to start.

They seem to offer three types of beds: Unity, Serenity and Savvy Rest. I think the Serenity is Savvy Rest as well from what I am reading. Do you have links or any input on the Savvy Rest beds? I will go and meet with them but any knowledge before would be helpful.

Also, any thoughts or information on the Pure Latex Bliss?

Thank you!

Hi udoknowjac,

All three of the mattresses you mentioned are Savvy Rest component latex mattresses.

A forum search on Savvy Rest (you can just click the link) will bring up much more information and feedback about them but the “short version” is that they use very high quality materials and there are no lower quality materials or weak links in any of their mattresses but they are also in a higher budget range than other similar mattresses so I would make sure that you make some careful value comparisons.

Pure Latex Bliss is owned by Talalay Global (previously Latex International) which manufactures Talalay latex and they also make some high quality toppers that use different types and blends of Talalay latex that are typically in very soft ILD ranges (as low as 14 - 15 ILD). A forum search on Pure Latex Bliss (you can also just click the link) will also bring up many more comments and feedback about them as well.

Phoenix

Thanks once again for all the information. I have been reading a lot of posts and there are many comparing Savvy Rest to Sleep EZ. It appears many people test out the Savvy Rest in the store and then purchase (for much cheaper) from Sleep Ez. Is Sleep Ez still a vendor you would recommend? Any advice for when I go to the Savvy Rest Store if I want to purchase from Sleep EZ instead?

Thank you!
Jacalyn

Hi udoknowjac,

Yes … SleepEZ is one of the members of this site which means that I think very highly of them and that I believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency.

There is more about the different ways to choose the most suitable mattress (locally and online) that can help you assess and minimize the risks involved of making a choice that isn’t as suitable for you as you hoped for in post #2 here.

When you can’t test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart (which would certainly include SleepEZ) and who can help “talk you through” the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and “feel” of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc) and the options they have available that may be the best “match” for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the “averages” of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about “matching” their specific mattress designs and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with or layer combinations that you tried at Savvy Rest) than anyone else.

Phoenix