We recently replaced our 12 year old pillowtop mattress and 4 inch memory foam topper with a latex mattress from Royal Bedding in Pelham, AL. I am 5’ 2, 120# and hubby is 6’ 0, 200#. He is a very hot sleeper so I thought latex would be a great option. He is a back and side sleeper and was having no issues with the exception of sweating while sleeping… I am a back and side sleeper and was having shoulder pain, arm and hand numbness and lower back pain. I researched mattresses online for a good 6 months and decided a latex mattress would be our best bet. I was reluctant to order online as we could not try them out first, and have heard returns can be a pain. I found your recommendation for Royal Bedding in Pelham. I went there and was steered toward their Mountain Top Desire. (A 6 inch core layer of C3 latex foam ILD of 21.5-24.5 with 3 inch comfort layer of C0 latex foam ILD 9.5-12.5 on both sides (mattress can be flipped to extend life). I felt this seemed pretty soft given my online research. However, they were super helpful and seemed to be very knowledgeable. They explained that should I not be happy, they could adjust the foam thickness or swap out the foam, etc. (for the cost of extra foam) but no returns are allowed. The first night on the bed, I felt like I was sinking. Almost like sleeping in a hammock. (We do have a good 9 inch steel foundation that we bought from them specifically for this mattress) I am only 120# so thought surely it was just me adjusting from the previous memory foam topper I had on the old mattress. Husband commented he felt like he was riding a wave every time he moved in the bed overnight. (Again, possibly just because we are used to a memory foam topper on top of a pillowtop mattress). I woke up the first morning with lower back pain and neck pain. I figured we just needed to give it more time. Then this morning after our 2nd night, I woke up feeling achy all over, I slept on my left side most of the night and today my neck hurts, left rib cage and left chest are achy, lower back hurts, etc. I plan on calling them tomorrow. Again, they seem very knowledgeable and hopefully they will have a solution. One example the owner gave (prior to my purchase) to firm up mattress if needed, was to trim the comfort layer down to 2 inches. My concern would be with such a low ILD, we would feel a bottoming out into the core layer so to speak? Another option would be to replace the comfort layers with 2 inches of C2 latex foam with an ILD of 17.5-21.5. But we would have to pay for the foam. Do you think we need to just give it more time? I guess my concern is that giving it more time is not going to make it any firmer. I am frankly concerned that the core layer is even too soft. And I do not believe there is any way to change that. We have already spent $3000 and hate to invest any more. And returning the mattress is not an option due to their no returns policy. My husband is in favor of just writing it off as a bad investment and moving on. He doesn’t want to invest more time and money into fixing it. I am heartbroken. I have spent so much time researching mattresses and was so hopeful that this mattress would work. What are your thoughts?
Hi Bhamgrl,
Welcome to the Mattress Forum! 
You are correct, I do think highly of Tom and Royal Bedding. The Mountain Top Desire you purchased uses continuous pour Dunlop from Mountain Top, and their ratings as they relate to Talalay latex are a little different. Mountain Top uses two different methods to test their ILD ranges. One of them is the amount of force it takes to compress the material by 25% and the other is the amount of force it takes to compress the same material by 40% (which of course would produce higher numbers).
Their 25% ILD ranges are …
C0 9.5 - 12.5 ILD
C1 11.5 - 14.5 ILD
C2 17.5 - 20.5 ILD
C3 21.5 - 24.5 ILD
C4 29.5 - 32.5 ILD
Their 40% ILD ranges are
ILD Range
C0 14 - 20 ILD
C1 18 - 22 ILD
C2 27 - 33 ILD
C3 34 - 42 ILD
C4 44 - 54 ILD
The closest ILD approximations to Talalay for each of their different firmness levels for individual layers would be somewhere in the lower end of their 40% ILD range, so your 6" C3 latex core would be approximately a 34 ILD related to Talalay, and your C0 upper layers would be approximately 14 ILD. ILDs of 32-40 are common for support cores for latex mattresses, and an upper layer of around 14 ILD certainly would be plush.
The softer layers top and bottom can have this sensation, as they are quite plush. Latex is very point elastic.
Yes, latex will have a very buoyant feel, and is quite different form an older innerspring mattress using memory foam on top, which will have a bit more of a “dead” feel. It can take some time to get used to.
Unfortunately, it’s not possible to “diagnose” mattress comfort issues on a forum with any certainty because they can be very complex and there are too many unique unknowns, variables, and complexities involved that can affect how each person sleeps on a mattress in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP or any “symptoms” they experience. However, there is more about the most common symptoms that people may experience when they sleep on a mattress and the most likely (although not the only) reasons for them in post #2 here .
Neck (lower cervical / upper thoracic) issues are commonly related to your pillow, and you may have to adjust the thickness of your pillow with any new mattress to make sure that your alignment is relatively neutral. As post #2 I linked to previously describes, there can be quite a few reasons for low back pain and side pain, some from the mattress being too plush and putting too much pressure on your side as you have too much of a lateral curve, others from a mattress being too firm or the comfort layers not providing enough contouring surface support and you end up “feeling through” the upper comfort layers to the deeper support core (this usually presents more as “pressure points” and also can have accompanying low back pain), and some of it can simply be your body adjusting from having a poor learned alignment from your old mattress and not being used to have a new supportive product, just to name a few possibilities.
While you’ve only had the mattress for a few nights, that’s not enough to go through an adjustment for you or the mattress, I think a conversation with Tom is your best move. Use his advice and experience and describe your situation and see what advice he is able to come up with for you.
The C2 would be closer to a 27 or so ILD, which definitely would be a firmer surface comfort than your current C0. If you’re able to spend more time with your current configuration, I would advise it, as it will give you a bit more time to adjust from your old mattress, and it will also give you a larger “sampling” of data to bring back to Royal Bedding should you need to make an exchange.
You’ve only had the mattress for two nights, so I personally wouldn’t be in such a hurry to “write it off”. I’d recommend that you take longer than 48 hours before making a decision to “move on” to another product. The fact that changes can be made to this product from a knowledgeable vendor is a huge advantage to have, so I personally would take advantage of all of those opportunities before deciding to move in another direction.
I’ll look forward to the next steps that you decide to take.
Phoenix