Odd request

[phoenix]

Hi Hobotrader,

I see what you mean now when you talk about Foamite value. The polyurethane foam is the same price as the pure latex from Dreamtime. Though you can tell there’s a lot more aesthetics/decoration/setup at Foamite vs. Dreamtime which is basically a factory with a barebones display in the front. I’m guessing they don’t have to go hardcore on presentation because only people that know what they’re doing will go there and hit the bid on the materials - it seems like they are more on the wholesale side. Chris mentioned that they are a wholesale factory that is willing/able to sell retail at wholesale prices. They did have a hybrid latex and memory foam that was decent. I really have to check tomorrow though, the potential is all in that backroom rather than the showroom. Their samples also had zippered quilts to show the underlying layers.

Bingo

Foamite does seem to be the most convenient option so far just because of their store setup and the amount of beds you could try out. I did test the 6" latex at Dreamtime and it was much too soft but again I’ll have to ask Chris if he can access the 40+ ILD 5.3 pounders.

All the value of a mattress purchase is not necessarily in the mattress itself but also in the service and selection of the retailer or manufacturer and in your confidence that the mattress you buy will provide you with the quality of sleep that you are looking for. In other words … there is a difference IMO between “commodity value” and the value of the entire mattress purchase which includes the benefits of the retailer or manufacturer you are working with. This is part of the reason why each person’s “value equation” can be so different because there can be so many objective, subjective, and intangible factors involved that each person may assign a different value to.

10 years from now you will remember much more about how well you slept on a new mattress than you will about just the price you paid.

Should I be worried about a 2.3 pounder polyurethane that Foamite is carrying? It’s within my price range but again as you said, value. I wonder why they don’t carry heavier latex than the 26’ers at foamite? She did confirm that’s all they had. I can see how they need thicker margins though, the store is gorgeous. I’m just concerned that I can’t test a pure 41 ILD latex’er. Factory and Dreamtime only told me density but not ILD =/. I think the ILD is key for me. That Foamite trip was definitely worth it to get a feel for what the values mean.

I wouldn’t be “worried” no because even 2.3 lb is much higher quality than you would usually find in the upper layers (or support layers for that matter) of a mattress but I would take it into account in my “value comparisons”. I also find it strange that they only carry 26 ILD because the manufacturer they use makes latex in a much wider range of ILD’s. It may just be a matter of economics and simplicity in terms of ordering materials. They are the only manufacturer that i know that only carries a single ILD of latex but they work around this with variations in their polyfoam.

Factory and Dreamtime only told me density but not ILD =/. I think the ILD is key for me. That Foamite trip was definitely worth it to get a feel for what the values mean.

I would keep in mind that with local testing knowing the ILD is not nearly as important as knowing what your body feels in terms of pressure relief, alignment, and overall feel. ILD is more important if you are ordering online and are trying to “match” a mattress you have tested. Keep in mind too that different materials with the same ILD can feel very different so you aren’t mislead by the apparent softness of more elastic materials like latex which can be more supportive in spite of their softer feel. ILD is also only one of the “comfort specs” of diffferent foams that can make a real difference. Another spec that is just as important if not more so than ILD but is rarely disclosed or even talked about is compression modulus (the ratio between firmness at 25% compression and 65% copmpression) which can have more to do with comfort than ILD alone. The compression modulus of conventional foam is in the range of 2 … or less … HR foam is in the mid to upper 2’s, Talalay is in the range of upper 2’s to around 3, and Dunlop is in the range of 4. this is just as important as ILD. It’s also important to know that ILD is never exact and is within a range of tolerance and ILD is also tested differently with latex (tested on a 6" layer) compared to polyfoam (tested with a 4’ layer) so they are not apples to apples comparisons between the two materials.

Yes! Tencel cotton. I remember reading on this site that ILDs are understated with latex just because of that compression modulus. So that 41 ILD could act like a 50+ if you were to compare it with polyfoam or other materials?

Tencel is another viscose fiber similar to Bamboo but is made from Eucalyptus.

Actually latex ILD would be slightly overstated in terms of its 25% ILD (ILD is usually measured at 25% compression of a layer) because of the way it is tested compared to polyfoam (a 6" layer has to be compressed by 25% or 1.5" to get the standard 25% ILD rating while with polyfoam the 4" layer only has to be compressed by 1" to get the 25% ILD rating). The different compression moduli of each though will also make a significant difference so the actual “real life” difference may not be as much as you would otherwise think. It’s usually best to compare latex ILD’s to latex ILD’s and polyfoam ILD’s to other polyfoam ILD’s and to use “rough translations” between the two of them. ILD in memory foam can be even more confusing (and even meaningless) but that’s outside of the topic this post.

In the end … your body will probably tell you more than “specs” although specs can be useful for comparison purposes and making sense of why two mattresses may feel different.

Phoenix