Pros And Cons of My 3 Favorite Tested Mattresses?

I’ve finally been able to try some really quality mattresses at a nearby store, PJs Sleep Company, and while I was impressed with their “home made” latex mattresses, the only one that felt like “this is an expensive mattress” from the moment I sat down was the Natura Eco Radiance they had. I’ve browsed these forums enough to know that the initial feel isn’t the best to judge a mattress by, but I can’t get that sensation out of my head! However, it was about 3 times the cost of the (already pricey) Ivy Organic mattresses. If I want to consider spending that much, I definitely want to make sure I’m spending my money wisely.

I’m 6’3, ~160 lbs, and mainly a side/stomach sleeper. My priorities are (probably like most people) (1) Comfort/ability to get uninterrupted sleep on a nightly basis, (2) Mattress retaining its quality throughout its lifetime (or at least for as long as possible), (3) Not overspending

Here are the breakdowns of the three mattresses I liked best (in order):

Natura Eco Radiance
Quilt
Certified 100% organic cotton stretch-knit ticking
4.2 lbs Certified organic Natura Grow WoolTM
1" Convoluted all-natural Talalay latex
Zippered Topper
1" All-natural Talalay latex
2" All-natural Talalay latex – soft
2" All-natural Talalay latex – medium
Core
6" All-natural Dunlop latex
Mattress Height
12.5"

Ivy Organics Latex Cushion Firm (this one doesn’t seem to be listed on their website, and all I have are the notes the salesmen read me)

  • 11", 1 sided
  • 120 oz wool + organic cotton deck + 3" organic latex with ILD 21-22
  • 15 gauge 800 count pocket system
  • Needle punched wool

Ivy Organics Latex Medium

  • 7" thick, 2 sided
  • 6" “organic latex” with ILD 30-35
    120 oz wool + organic cotton band incasement

(I should mention that I’m not especially concerned with getting an Organic mattress, this was just the nearest high end store)

I’ve been targeting latex because my research made it sound like the best overall quality for a mattress, so I’d imagine any of these cover my 2nd priority quite well. However, comparing the instant-comfort of the Eco radiance with the lack of it in the Ivy Organics makes me wonder if those mattresses actually cost me some comfort/good-nights-sleepability for the durability I’m getting? Also, this is probably not a worthy consideration, but the descriptions of the Ivy Organic components reads a lot like ‘fluff’ to cover the fact that’s it’s pretty much just latex and wool (although I’m guessing it is still very high quality material given that they’re one of the recommendations in the LA Manufacturers post?).

So I guess my main questions are,

  1. Does anyone have experience or insights to share about any of these mattresses?
  2. Is there a way to get the luxury-level comfort of the Eco Radiance on a cheaper mattress that still has high durability?
  3. Or alternatively, a way to get something with the support of one of the Ivy Organics but more of whatever made the Eco Radiance so comfortable?
  4. Are the materials in the Eco Radiance as durable/long-lasting as those in the Ivy Organics? If it turns out to be the highest quality option, I don’t mind the price
    4b) But does anyone know anywhere/anyway else that may be cheaper to get the Natura Eco Radiance? I could be wrong, but I would guess that since it’s not one of PJs Sleep Company’s own mattresses there is a little markup
  5. Is there any downside of an all or nearly all latex mattress that I’m missing?
  6. Is it “settling” to get a mattress that doesn’t have the lovely comfort of the Eco Radiance? I’ve tried probably 40+ mattresses over the last few months, and that is the only one that really felt instantly, incredibly, comfortable.

And I just want to say again, thank you so much to this awesome community! It’s incredibly refreshing to find a haven for purely helpful, factual information about a world so otherwise hard to decipher.

Hi willwantstosleep,

I’m glad you recognized that the “feel” of a mattress has nothing to do with its price or quality or for that matter how suitable a mattress may be in terms of PPP. Some of the most costly mattresses available may be completely unsuitable for some people to sleep on and some very low budget mattresses may be a great match for the needs and preferences of some people even if the materials are lower quality and not particularly durable. In other words … what you are feeling is the design of the mattress not the quality of the materials.

The reason that the Natura feels good to you is likely because it has 100% natural Talalay comfort layers that appear to be significantly thicker and softer than the comfort layers of the Ivy Organics mattresses you tried.

All of these mattresses use high quality materials and have no weak links in their design or construction although 100% natural Talalay may be a little less durable in the softer ILD’s than blended Talalay or 100% natural Dunlop. You can read a little more about the different types of latex in post #6 here

Natura is generally in a more costly price range compared to other manufacturers that make latex mattresses and certified organic Dunlop also tends to be quite costly even though it is basically the same material as the less costly 100% natural Dunlop so you would probably be able to find a similar comfort level in a lower cost latex mattress that used comfort layers that had a similar thickness and softness if you used less costly versions of latex or was made by different manufacturers. It may be worth talking to some of the other manufacturers or stores on the Los Angeles list and it may also be worthwhile testing some of the PLB mattresses which use blended Talalay which would be less than the Natura (although they are also not generally in the lowest budget range for latex mattresses either). The PLB store finder is here. With PLB make sure that the retailer you are looking at knows the difference between the blended Talalay and the 100% natural Talalay. If the warranty is 20 years then it’s blended Talalay because the all natural Talalay has a 10 year warranty. They also have a stretch knit cover instead of a cover quilted with wool so you can test the difference between covers as well.

All latex is a durable material but 100% natural Talalay made by Latex International is a little less durable than blended Talalay in the lower ILD’s.

Latex is a very high quality material so the only potential down side would be if you didn’t like the “feel” of any version of latex (and there are many) and of course it’s a higher cost material than other types of foam (polyfoam and memory foam).

There are many lower cost latex mattresses that may be just as comfortable to you and just as suitable a match in terms of PPP but if for some reason your testing indicates that it’s the only latex mattress that works well for you then I don’t think it would be settling and would just be part of your personal value equation although I would definitely check other latex mattresses with comfort layers that were similarly thick and soft and were in lower budget ranges to confirm that it really was the best choice for you. Once you are over about $3000 or so (queen size mattress only) then I would always make some very careful value comparisons to satisfy yourself that there is enough of a difference in how a higher budget mattress feels and performs compared to other lower cost but equally durable alternatives to justify the higher cost.

When you look back on a mattress purchase a decade or more down the road you will remember more about how well you slept and how long the mattress lasted than you will about the initial purchase price but price is also a significant part of the “value” of a mattress purchase and I would make sure you have done some careful testing and made some good value comparisons so you are convinced that a mattress in that price range really is the best “value” for you.

Phoenix

Thank you for another quick and unbearably helpful reply, Phoenix! I’ll check out that post on different kinds of latex today, and there’s actually a store with PLB mattresses pretty close to me so I’ll go try those out tomorrow.

I definitely don’t mind paying more (or a lot) if it’s the only way to get my ideal mattress, and I am looking at Queen beds so I understand it’ll be a bit of an investment regardless. I just wanted to make sure I wasn’t overpaying for that quality, and it sounds like I’ll be able to find out now that I know exactly what made the Natura feel so nice (the thick Talalay comfort layer).

So maybe I can find something a little less expensive, but your post at least gave me the confidence to go with the Eco Radiance if after further testing it still seems to have been the best. Thanks again, and I’m sure I’ll have more findings to report back tomorrow :slight_smile:

Oh and one quick story from the first place I tried mattresses (a big chain store that was clearly not the highest quality mattresses or salesmen) that illustrates how disingenuous the feel in-store is:

I had clearly made the salesmen from uncomfortable the moment he started talking to me when I asked what anything he was saying had to do with comfort and support layers. Although I’d read about it here, I really didn’t expect those two simple words to have such a noticeable impact on his confidence! But it did get him to leave me alone and try a variety of mattresses in peace for solid 30+ minute blocks… until I moved on to one particular mattress, and he just HAD to come over and let me know all the features of this one that made it an especially cool (temperature wise) choice. Once again, it all sounded like total BS, but the mattress did certainly feel colder… and I found out why a few moments later. I adjusted the paper lay-down cover they had given me for the pillows (since I had, like a total rookie, forgotten my own!), and noticed that the corners were kind of ruffling even when I wasn’t touching it. I looked up, and sure enough, there was a vent directly above the mattress blowing in cold air! Not hard enough for me to feel, but too much for that papery cover, and certainly enough to make this mattress noticeably colder than the others. I had to chuckle and give the store credit-- that little trick would surely fool a lot of customers! And it provided the perfect reinforcement of what this whole website tried to tell me: you cannot judge by how it feels at first!

Sorry for the off-topic tangent, but I thought it was a funny story that taught a lot of the principles I’ve learned here :slight_smile:

Hi willwantstosleep,

Thanks for sharing the story and for the laugh … that’s one of the more unusual “techniques” out of the many I’ve heard :slight_smile:

Just as a further point of reference as well … the online manufacturers that are members here and are listed in post #21 here can also be a very useful “value reference” point for many types of latex mattresses.

Phoenix

So I didn’t get a chance to try a PLB mattress today (hopefully tomorrow!), but I did take the time to reread a lot of the info linked here and across the site, and I have a couple more questions about the nature of the Eco Radiance:

  1. When you referred to the thicker and nicer (for me) comfort layer, does that mean just the quilt part, just the zippered topper, or both?

And it sounds like there would at least be some slight degrading over time, as a few parts of this mattress are softer 100% natural Talalay… I’m just wondering how much of this I can expect:

  1. Will it still hold up better than any non-latex material?

  2. Will the fact that only a few of the layers are less durable make it hard to notice the decline?

Mainly I’m just wondering if the “decreased durability” is just in comparison to the immortality of other kinds of latex, or if having some layers of soft 100% NR Talalay will actually negate some of the durability value I’m aiming for with an all-latex choice

Hi willwantstosleep,

The comfort layers of a mattress are the upper few inches of foam and/or fiber that you sink into and creates the pressure relieving cradle of the mattress (see post #4 here). You will sink into thicker and softer comfort layers more deeply which can redistribute weight more effectively and improve pressure relief and “comfort” but it also increases the risk that your heavier parts (like the pelvis) will sink down too far and create alignment issues. The balance between comfort/pressure relief and support/alignment in all your sleeping positions is the key behind all mattress design and theory and is why different mattresses are suitable or some people and not for others depending on their body type, sleeping style, and individual preferences.

There is no way to quantify this with any precision because of all the variables involved in durability except to say that less durable materials will soften and break down faster than more durable materials. Softness is also a secondary durability factor and softer / thicker layers of the same type will have a bigger effect on durability than firmer / thinner layers. There is always some tradeoff between softness and “comfort” and durability. There is more about the factors that are involved in the durability and useful life of a mattress in post #4 here and the other posts it links to.

All latex is a durable material compared to other types of foam yes so less durable types latex is relative to other types of latex. It will also depend on where you are inside the range of PPP that is most suitable for you. If you are “close to the edge” of a mattress that is too soft then even a small amount of normal foam softening can put you over the edge and even though the materials are still in almost new condition the mattress may no longer be suitable for you in terms of PPP. This is why no matter what the quality of materials in a mattress it’s a good idea to make sure that a mattress isn’t too soft for your specific needs and preferences.

Thinner layers of less durable materials will lessen the impact of foam softening compared to thicker layers of less durable materials yes.

Phoenix

[quote=“Phoenix” post=29076]Hi willwantstosleep,

The comfort layers of a mattress are the upper few inches of foam and/or fiber that you sink into and creates the pressure relieving cradle of the mattress

[/quote]

So in the case of the Eco Radiance…

Quilt
Certified 100% organic cotton stretch-knit ticking
4.2 lbs Certified organic Natura Grow WoolTM
1" Convoluted all-natural Talalay latex
Zippered Topper
1" All-natural Talalay latex
2" All-natural Talalay latex – soft
2" All-natural Talalay latex – medium

The comfort layer/what I feel and enjoy is just the wool and 1" of latex in the quilt, correct? And the Zippered Topper (along with the Core) all contribute to support more than comfort?

Thanks for another quick and helpful reply! Can’t wait to finally pull the trigger on one of these!

Hi willwanttosleep,

There is no exact definition of “comfort layer” but in general it refers to all the layers above the support core that are designed to contribute to the softness that you feel on a mattress and form the pressure relieving cradle (the amount you sink in).

In this mattress it would be all the layers you listed although the medium layer could also be referred to as a transition layer because for most people (depending on weight) it would partly contribute to the softness and pressure relief of the mattress and partly to the support of the mattress.

Overall these would be relatively soft comfort layers that would allow most people to sink in more deeply than if the top layers were firmer or thinner.

Phoenix

I’m back! I went to Beds Etc to try some PLB mattresses, and I loved them! I felt like I could pass out on any of the three types of firmness they had, but eventually decided I liked the Vitality (medium firmness) the best. My spine looked aligned on my side and front positions, so I’m just about ready to pull the trigger on this.

  1. Are there any downsides/complaints about PLB I should know about?

I also am incredibly tempted by the Serta iComfort/Ergomotion foundation (I think it’s the “Serta Motion Perfect” shown here: Adjustable Bed Frames | Cal & Split King, King, Queen, Full & Twin XL). I work from home, so being able to turn my mattress into a hammock-arrangement that lets me use my laptop while being lazy seems like a huge bonus. And the massaging feature just looks like icing on the cake!

  1. Are there any dangers of using an adjustable foundation like this with a PLB/other latex mattress? Will it wear out the mattress faster/“crease” it at all if I regularly adjust the head/foot regions?

  2. The massaging action seems quite gentle, but could that potentially do any harm?

As enticing as this foundation seems, I definitely don’t want to compromise the durability I’m paying for in a PLB/other!

Hi willwantstosleep,

No, The Vitality uses good quality materials and has no obvious weak links in the mattress. It has 2" of Talalay GL fast response over 2" of blended Talalay latex (a total of 4" of Talalay) over a 7" bonded foam latex core (see post #6 here) which are all good quality and durable materials. Their Hybrid line can be a good way to experience many of the benefits of sleeping on latex at a lower cost than their all latex line.

You can read more about adjustable beds in post #3 here and the adjustable bed thread it links to. I would make some careful value comparisons though because the Serta (made by Ergomotion) may not be in the same value range as other adjustable beds that have the same or similar functions that are made by the same manufacturer.

Any ongoing mechanical stress will have some effect on durability with any material but in the case of high quality flexible materials such as latex or the base foam used in the mattress the effect would not be a significant factor in the durability of the mattress.

Assuming you mean harm to the mattress … it would be fine.

Phoenix