Soo, lets say you had slept on a soft sided semi-waveless water mattress fro the last few decades and due to spousal required request for increased support due to hip and joint issues were mandated to make a change.
I have looked around until I am dizzy, and although I am sure some love their air mattresses and memory foam jobbies, I am not sold on the stuff myself. Seems overpriced.
Some hybrids are pretty good it seems, yet again a lot of mumbo-jumbo about exactly what is in there for twice the price!
So, what would be the closest thing to my beloved WATER without the MUD of mem foam and affords a good support? Side and back!
Unfortunately, there is no one answer of what best approximates a waterbed, as this is subjective. Additionally, you’re not looking to have an exact feel like a waterbed, but instead something different that is more supportive, which will by definition be a different product. But I get the gist of your query.
The first thing I would have you read would be this article I wrote about waterbeds and how they work, which will be useful for context of my comments. It’s a quick read.
Getting to the basics, the two main functions of a mattress are pressure relief and spinal alignment. The waterbed does a good job at pressure relief, but in many instances the spinal alignment (as in your case) can be insufficient.
I find it can be much more accurate to test and “evaluate” a mattress in terms of a comfort layer (pressure relief) and a support core (spinal alignment and support). This way the words “soft” and “firm” can take on more specific meanings depending on whether you are talking about the pressure relieving qualities (top layers), the supportive qualities (lower layers), or the overall feel of a mattress (much more subjective). This can lead to more accurate feedback in terms of where a mattress may be too firm or soft rather than a more subjective description of the mattress as a whole.
It may be worth considering something using latex in the comfort layers because it’s much more resilient (springy or bouncy) than memory foam, and very point elastic. There is more about some of the differences between latex and memory foam in post #2 here, but like anything the most reliable way to know which type of materials or mattresses you tend to prefer in general will be based on your own careful testing and personal experience. Some of the newer ultra high density high performance polyfoams are also quite point elastic and they provide a gently contouring feel that many people enjoy coming from a waterbed mattress. There is more information about these foams and their characteristics in post #2 here.
Then you need to address the type of support core to be used, as this was your main concern, as to improve support and spinal alignment. A product using a pocketed coil spring unit (what some refer to as a “hybrid” mattress) certainly can be a good choice, as it can provide good support while allowing a bit more “independence” and travel in the deeper support layer. A product using a latex support core can also provide excellent support characteristics while being very conforming (although most conformation is felt as a result of the uppermost layers of your mattress). Even something using a polyfoam core can work well. All could be good options.
I think that since you are considering moving from a waterbed to a more “conventional” style of mattress, some local testing maybe beneficial. If you’d like, you can provide your zip code and I can see if I am aware of any better options in your area where you may go test some alternatives to your current waterbed.
Also, just in case you haven’t read it yet … be sure to read through the mattress shopping tutorial here which has all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you find a mattress that is a suitable match for your body type, sleeping positions, and preferences … and know how and why to avoid the worst ones.
For now, that’s the best advice I can offer, as nothing will be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).
I must admit that my research has already taken me away from the name brand retailers and their deceptive practices and high prices/ low value/ replace every 8 BS!
Although they may offer some good products, the ones I was attracted to were out of my price range and I started looking elsewhere.
This trek took me to the LATEX world already, although it seems many of these are a bit “overmarketed”, not to mention finding a local that even sells latex!
Upon the recco of the rep at SleepEZ, I did find a local outlet of the similar product from Savvy Rest for a first hand comparison of construction using the same components. The store also carries brands such as Posh and Lavish, others, and their own cheap stuff both MUD(mem) and LATEX.
They did have the Savvy Rest in the S,M,F configuration and I was impressed, however I am not yet ready to just order online without firming up my thoughts and initial impressions of the Latex, although I have found nothing through research that suggests better longevity, quality, value, and although NOT CHEAP, as everything else there is a balance it seems. \
I am in Dallas area if 75240 is an area where you know of other things local to compare.
Honestly, I could probably deal with a high value hybrid, but I have not found it, or at least what I would expect in one. Do Tell!
I’m glad that you’ve become educated so as to be able to discern between different marketing ploys. Regarding mattress durability, while there is no way to know for certain how long any mattress will last or maintain it’s comfort and/or support for any particular person or how long it will take before they cross the thresholds between sleeping well on a mattress to sleeping “OK” to tolerating a mattress to finally deciding to replace it because there are too many variables involved that are unique to each person … if a mattress is well inside a suitable comfort/support range and isn’t close to the edge of being too soft when it is new and meets the minimum quality/durability specs that are suggested in the guidelines here then it would be reasonable to expect a useful lifetime in the range of 7 - 10 years and with higher quality and more durable materials like latex or higher density memory foam or polyfoam (in the comfort layers especially) it would likely be in the higher end of the range or even longer.
It is true that finding a local latex retailer can be a bit more difficult, as properly explaining and selling latex generally requires a more knowledgeable sales staff, and unfortunately that can be a bit difficult to find in this industry, especially in many of the larger chains. As far as “overmarketed”, I’m not sure as to what you’re referencing, as latex tends to be one of the “lesser known” types of mattresses here in the States. If you mean “overmarketed” as referring to some of the claims and “greenwashing” that some stores and brands use, that unfortunately can be the case, as it is with many other mattress types in the industry.
Make sure that when comparing you are aware of whether you are testing out Dunlop or Talalay, as they each have different qualities of comfort. I’m assuming SleepEZ already gave you some good guidelines regarding this. I do trust their advice (they are a member here of the site) and knowledge regarding latex and “matching” their items as best they can to models you may test elsewhere. You are correct that latex will generally be one of the most durable products available, and in the long run can represent a very good value as well.
Subject to first confirming that any retailer or manufacturer on the list that you wish to visit is completely transparent (see this article) and to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines here … some of the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in and around the Dallas/Ft Worth area are listed in post #4 here.
Thanks again for your response, and yes by saying “overmarketed” I mean the overpriced GREEN theme or all the NATURAL theme stuff. This does indeed seem to fluff the price at certain outlets, which is irritating to me.
You really have a similar market in tires for your car in a way. You know rubber is rubber, but the quality and design of the tire is a value thing and some work better and last longer than others. Add in the marketing ploys of some major brands and you may not end up with the best bang for the buck, once again a million variations!
As with anything else, to a certain extent you get what you pay for! Yet I see things I just do not like in this industry. Is a base of springs worth as much as a base of Dunlop? I have tried some beds with springs and they are not bad, but it seeme many of the hybrids have mem foam on top. Add they still want stupid money, and I looked at a lot of expensive beds that had springs support and only a thin layer of comfort latex on top as well, yet still want the same money as some pure latex makers. I do not see the value in a spring based system even if they do last a long time it just does not meet the same price point that I can see in my research. Possibly I am wrong.
And thanks for the info to locals in Dallas area. I reviewed many of their websites tonight, feelings mixed with the locals thus far, yet I need to call a couple of them just to see whaTS UP.
When evaluating products and statements about mattresses, it’s important to become familiar with the actual certifications and what they mean, and separate that from the general terminology that is sometimes used.
Most people that are looking for an “organic” mattress or materials are usually concerned more with “safety” than whether the materials have an actual organic certification and they usually aren’t aware that an organic certification isn’t the same thing as a safety certification. There is more information about the three different levels of organic certifications in post #2 here and some of the benefits of an organic certification in post #3 here and there is more about the different types of organic and safety certifications such as Oeko-tex, Eco-Institut, Greenguard Gold, C2C, and CertiPUR-US in post #2 here and more about some of the differences between organic and safety certifications in post #2 here and there are also some comments in post #42 here that can help you decide whether an organic certification is important to you for environmental, social, or personal reasons or whether a “safety” certification is enough.
All the latex you are likely to encounter (either Dunlop or Talalay that is made with either natural or synthetic rubber or a blend of both) will also have a reliable certification such as Oeko-Tex, Eco-Institut, Greenguard Gold or C2C and based on actual testing I would consider any type or blend of latex (regardless of whether it is synthetic, natural, or blended) to be a very “safe” material in terms of harmful substances and VOC’s (offgassing). Any type or blend of latex will also be a very durable material relative to other types of foam such as memory foam or polyfoam as well.
In the end, an organic certification would be a part of your own personal value equation as to its worth, as compared to other similar mattresses that have safety certifications that test for harmful substances and VOCs that would be just as suitable and just as safe but are in much lower budget ranges.
I’m not familiar with tire manufacturing, but there are definitely differences in the rubber used to make latex foam (Natural, Synthetic or a blend of the two), plus different formulations and fillers, and differences in the production processes (Dunlop or Talalay) – see this article. The job of the marketers is of course to sell you their product, but your job as a consumer is to become educated in order to make a choice that meets with your own particular needs, which is the main focus of this site.
With mattresses, I would be cautious about equating price with quality. There are wide fluctuations in price for products using similar materials, which makes it even more important to become educated about mattress componentry.
There would be no way for anyone to determine the “worth” of one product versus another for any individual based upon some sort of formula or algorithm – there are simply too many individual variables involved in that process. Both innersprings and latex would be a good choice for a durable support core of a mattress, but which you would prefer would come down to your own personal testing. Post #28 here speaks a bit more to latex versus springs.
Again, these opinions are based upon your own personal value equation and what you consider “stupid money”, and if you personally find more value in a latex core versus a spring unit, there would be no reason for you to change your mind based upon the quality of material, and you’d be making a good durable choice. There are some excellent choices for latex mattresses, both using springs and using latex for the core, from the members of the site here. I think very highly of the members here and I believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency. They are extremely knowledgeable about latex and different configurations, and I would not hesitate to recommend any of them for your consideration.
You have some excellent choices in your area, including one of the members here of the site, The Mattress Factory.
