Saatva mattress

I read your review regarding Saatva mattresses. What did you mean when you stated they used low to medium quality foam?
Thank you.

Hi Sunny1,

I’m not sure which comments you read but there is more information about Saatva and many of the other simplified choice mattresses in post #2 here and there is also more information about them in post #1 here and the rest of the topic as well. A forum search on Saatva (you can just click the link) will also bring up more comments and feedback about them. The first post in the simplified choice topic would also be well worth reading as well.

“Lower quality” means that a foam material is in a lower density range than I would normally suggest in the durability guidelines listed here and there would be a higher risk of premature softening and breakdown than higher density and more durable materials. Foam softening and the loss of comfort and support that goes with it is the biggest reason that you would need to replace a mattress and isn’t covered by mattress warranties.

While Saatva would be a “better than average” quality/value choice compared to many of the mainstream mattresses made by the major manufacturers (which I would avoid completely) … some of the materials they are using are less durable than I would be comfortable with and for most people they wouldn’t be in the same “quality/value” range as many of the other options that use higher quality and more durable materials and foam layers that most of the members here would know about as a result of the information on this site. I would also be cautious about making a purchase based on some of “marketing exaggerations” on their site.

I’m also not sure what you’ve read since you found the site but just in case you haven’t read it yet … the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

While nobody can speak to how any specific mattress will “feel” for someone else because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances and you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress … outside of PPP which is the most important part of “value”, the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label (or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new) so I would always make sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the durability guidelines I linked to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

Phoenix

Hi Phoenix,
Wow I almost thought for a few short seconds , I posted in my sleep on this same issue I heard about Saatva Mattresses last night being maybe a lower grade foam?
Always look here first I trust your opinion.

We are looking for a good Mattress, and Box Springs. Do we need to Order Box Springs separate?
I read much about many Mattresses over the last 2 years.

Finally bought a great piece of 3" Latex Foam from Sleep EZ , great Company. Had to exchange for the Firmer Foam. Not the Firmest Jeremy had as he said but Firm enough to be good!
Now I have come to the realization we need a New Mattress !!!
I thought my Latex Foam was failing , do not believe it is the Foam Latex Topper at all
But sure we need a new Mattress by now.

I have heard and read many talking about Brooklyn Bedding BME… Very interesting, some happy buyers.

My husband thinks the Coil Mattresses are the only way to go, not me! We do have one personalized Mattress maker here. Slagles he orders the Latex himself if he sells it, and charges so much more. Yikes!!! And his Mattresses sell for a high price.
We have Mattress stores but none I trust at all.

I think a Brooklyn Bedding BME in Medium might be good, but so may others. We do need A California King.

And by the way I do trust Jeff at Mattresss to Go! Lives right by my Brother.
Although we are miles apart. I watched many of his Video’s I was extremely impressed by
his through honesty in what goes into a Mattress.

Phoenix any good Suggestions for a good Quality made Mattress , thought of Jeremy at Sleep EZ, Looked over at Brooklyn Bedding BME. …the Mattresses are not Build as high as ours right now and that is surely a good idea.
I am short 5’2" need a step stool right now the Old Mattress is so high.

Any and all Suggestions appreciated. Thanks!
Bunny

Hi Bunny1999,

I switched your post into a new topic of its own since your comments and questions were outside the scope of the topic you posted in.

I’m not sure you are clear between the difference between a box spring and a foundation. A box spring has springs inside it that flex under the mattress and there are very few one sided mattresses today that use them as a support system and in many cases they will invalidate a mattress warranty. Most mattresses in the industry today need a steel or wooden bedframe with a foundation that has minimal to no flex (vs a box spring that flexes) or a platform bed which also has little to no flex under the mattress. There are many in the industry that mix up the terminology between box springs and foundations even though they are very different products.

Most online or local stores sell foundations that are suitable for the mattresses they sell but there is more information about the different support systems (bedframes and foundations or platform beds) that are generally suitable for different types of mattresses and some examples of each of them in post #1 here.

That makes sense because a topper won’t help much if there are any soft spots or sagging in the mattress underneath it and based on your previous posts your mattress is probably overdue for replacement.

While I can certainly help with “how” to choose … It’s not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress. There are just too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, or PPP or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).

I’m assuming you’ve read the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

If you are considering online options then the mattress shopping tutorial includes several links to lists of many of the better online options I’m aware of (in the optional online step) that include many different types and categories of mattresses in a wide range of designs, budgets, firmness levels, and with different return/exchange policies that would be worth considering.

If you are primarily interested in latex then I would start with this link to a list of the members here that sell mattresses online and many of them also sell latex and latex hybrid mattresses (including component mattresses) that use different types and blends of latex that also have a wide range of different designs, options, features, return and exchange policies, and prices. Post #3 here also includes a list of manufacturers that sell component latex mattresses online as well.

As you probably know both SleepEZ and Brooklyn Bedding are members of the site which means that I think highly of both of them and that I believe they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency. SleepEZ primarily sells component latex mattresses with individual latex layers that can be customized for firmness and rearranged or exchanged to fine tune the comfort or support of the mattress after a purchase while the BME is a latex/polyfoam hybrid that is available in 3 different firmness levels. There is more about the pros and cons of an all latex mattress vs a latex/polyfoam hybrid in post #2 here.

When you can’t test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart (which would certainly include SleepEZ and Brooklyn Bedding) and who can help “talk you through” the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and “feel” of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc) and the options they have available that may be the best “match” for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the “averages” of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about “matching” their specific mattress designs and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

If you are also considering local options then you appear to be close to Slagles which is in Bakersfield, CA so the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in the area … subject to making sure that they are transparent about the materials and components in their mattresses (see this article) and that they meet the quality/value guidelines I linked earlier in this reply include …

http://www.slaglesmattress.com/ Bakersfield, CA. They are a factory direct manufacturer. They don’t have any specific information on their site about the mattresses they make but they appear to make a range of innerspring, latex, and memory foam mattresses. They certainly fit the profile of a local manufacturer that would generally make higher quality and better value mattresses and would be well worth a phone call or a visit.

bakersfieldmattressstore.com/ Bakersfield, CA. They are also a factory direct manufacturer that makes their own latex and some memory foam mattresses. They also carry some Golden mattresses and some Spring Comfort mattresses which may be worth considering as well.
ADMIN NOTE:Retired Website | Archived Footprint: bakersfieldmattressstore.com/

https://www.jordanhomefurniture.com/ Retailer in Bakersfield. They carry a range of Diamond mattresses which may include some better quality/value options but make sure you can find out the density of any foam layers in their mattresses.

https://www.morfurniture.com/ Retailer in Bakersfield. They carry Sherwood and Lumina mattresses (both made by Sherwood) which may also include some better quality/value options but once again make sure you can find out the density of any foam layers in their mattresses.

Phoenix

Thanks so much Phoenix,

I see you understand me better then I do myself. :silly:

I meant foundations. If you were to buy a complete Latex Mattress do you buy a good foundation elsewhere ? As I see none offered that saw did. I did not look at each one that throughly either to see if they did offer Foundations. Surely would buy one local I would think.

I see your perferance is a Wood Foundation. With Slats spaced apart for air. Am I reading that correctly?
This is what we have now, wood slats under our Foundation of the Mattress on top. We have a Complete Wood Bed that holds even our Complete Mattress set now!

Phoenix your opinion please:
Would a tight cover over the 3" Latex Topper effect it in anyway? Seems our other Topper was perfectly good without it as we always cover the Latex Topper with a Very Well made Mattress Cover always have. Even this one is covered, does that keep the Topper from getting proper Air circulation?

We will be checking all you listed, your simply amazing and so knowledgeable

Hi Bunny1999,

Most retailers or manufacturers that sell latex mattresses would also sell a suitable foundation but if for some reason they don’t then you would need to buy it separately.

Yes … An all latex mattress will generally do best with a firm, flat, and evenly supportive support surface underneath it that has minimal to no flex under the mattress and for larger sizes with at least one center support beam that has good support to the floor to prevent any sagging in the middle of the mattress. The components need to be strong and durable and stable enough to support the weight of the mattress and the people sleeping on it without some of the parts bending, sagging, or breaking over time. The support surface under the mattress should have enough surface area to prevent the mattress from sagging through any gaps or spaces in the support surface over time but still allow some airflow under the mattress. I would suggest that in a slatted support system (either a foundation on a steel or wooden bedframe or a platform bed with a slatted support surface) that any gaps between the slats are no more than 3" (with 1 x 3 slats) although less than that would be better yet.

Latex can oxidize faster with exposure to air and ozone and ultraviolet light along with other substances that can damage it see here and it’s generally a good idea for latex to have a suitable dedicated cover to give it the best possible protection and to help maximize it’s useful lifetime. It can also help protect it with handling. There is more in post #3 here and post #3 here that will give you some sense of the effect of different types of covers on latex. A cover would have “some” effect on the feel of the topper but a relatively thin stretchy knit cover would have the least possible effect.
ADMIN NOTE:Removed 404 page link | Archived Footprint: primelineindustries.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Chemical-Compatibility-Chart.pdf

Phoenix

Thanks Phoenix for some reason it cut out much of what I told you.
I wonder why?
Will post later.

By the way the Newer 3" Latex Topper is Covered with a good covered provided by SleepEZ.
And it is Covered with a Heavy Mattress Cover also? Myself I think it needs more air. Or on Top of Mattress Cover. We have well made Sheets , and Blankets , and Comforter and Bed is not exposed to Sunlight at all. We keep Sunlight out of our bedroom completely. Although I air out in late evening during nice weather, which is a fairly long season here as we have nice weather much of the year, we also do have screens on French Door. We have one set of French Doors with Windows, but they have Tight Levelors on them and are always closed. Except when cleaning every 2 weeks. And Room is never exposed to any Direct Sunlight ever.

Ok I am late.
Thanks
Bunny

Phoenix spoke to a person at Brooklyn Bedding giving specifics about each of us, even our Son.
They recommended the Soft for all of us! soft level comfort
That confuses me a tad when our weights are all different. I thought they might of suggested a Medium for my husband and me, but seems they know best.
Although they surely know what they are taking about.
I will still use my Topper I bought.

Roger over at SleepEZ is a great Guy. We are trying to figure out if the Reverie will work without removing our Headboard and Foot Board. He thinks it will fit inside our bed frame , Let me explain why I think it might not.
The Side Boards are Connected and shaped like a L which holds the Foundation and Mattress of course we reinforce with extra slats. That lip that holds is all is 2" on each side.
I do not think sadly the Reverie will fit unless we remove the Complete Side Board and Hook the Headboard and Footboard separately onto the Reverie.
I guess we could get a Queen but it would be a huge loss with Sheets and Blankets, ect!

I like both from BB and from SleepEZ . Still need to visit stores.
I think I know no one will carry a better Bed although you did mention many, I need to keep a open mind. Although the Reverie works with Foam Mattresses much better.
Thanks
Bunny.

Hi Bunny1999,

Thanks for the update.

It may be possible to remove the lip.

I’;m looking forward to finding out what you end up deciding.

Phoenix

Phoenix the Regerie 5D will fit. Inside the Wood Bed Frame.

We did buy our Son the Brookland Bedding Mattress. My Son said it sounded good to him. He told them to give you credit. He wrote and said do not forget Phoenix sent us here. :slight_smile:
The Prices are really great!
I might go with this also or I might not be able to get a Latex 10" Mattress and the Reverie 5D both?
It cost a lot of money for both at SleepEZ. Although that is truly my pick.

Bunny

Hi Bunny1999,

Congratulations on your son’s new mattress :slight_smile:

I’m looking forward to finding out how he likes it once he receives it and has had the chance to try it out.

Phoenix

Amazing effort put into this site! Thanks.

“Lower quality” means that a foam material is in a lower density range than I would normally suggest in the durability guidelines listed here and there would be a higher risk of premature foam softening and breakdown than higher density and more durable materials.

In the case of Saatva you said:

If anything I would consider the lower density polyfoam used in the quilting materials to be a little on the thick side (a little over 2") and I normally like to see quilting layers a little thinner (under 2")

You also voice a similar concern of the Wink bed.

Which innersprings mattresses/beds actually pass your discerning scrutiny when it comes to under 2" of lower density foam?

More importantly, when it comes to the “others” among intersprings mattresses in the same price range, which would be rated/recommended over than Saatva and Wink?

I too was ready to go with Saatva until I came to this site.

My last bed of 23 years was a low end box store purchased.

I am currently sleeping on a memory foam bed (belonging to a roommate) which has caused me considerable back and shoulder issues. She does not know the brand, as it was a gift and too heavy for me to get the cover off.

But other than the squishy sinking where the hips are it is like sleeping on a table.

I was over at Sleepy’s to see what was available for the Memorial Day weekend sale and the bed that I found most comfortable was a Simmons Beautyrest with cooling gel and a Euro pillow top, Sleepy’s calls Shakespeare. It is the in-between one called plush firm or something like that.

So the Saatva sounded similar.

Hi tspnyc,

[quote]Which innersprings mattresses/beds actually pass your discerning scrutiny when it comes to under 2" of lower density foam?

More importantly, when it comes to the “others” among intersprings mattresses in the same price range, which would be rated recommended over than Saatva and Wink?[/quote]

While I can certainly help with “how” to choose … It’s not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress. There are just too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).

I’m not sure what you’ve read since you found the site but just in case you haven’t read it yet … the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

While again nobody can speak to how any specific mattress will “feel” for someone else or whether it will be a good “match” in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances and you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress … outside of PPP (which is the most important part of “value”), the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label (or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new) so I would always make sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the quality/durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

I don’t keep a record of the individual mattresses or their specs that the retailers and manufacturers in the hundreds of forum lists throughout the forum carry on their floor or have available online (it would be a bigger job than anyone could keep up with in a constantly changing market) but checking their websites and making some preliminary phone calls to the retailers/manufacturers that are on the local or online lists is always a good idea before you decide on which retailers or manufacturers you wish to deal with anyway. This will tell you which of them carry mattresses that would meet your specific criteria, are transparent about the materials in their mattresses, and that carry the type of mattresses that you are interested in that are also in the budget range you are comfortable with. Once you have checked their websites and/or talked with the ones that interest you then you will be in a much better position to decide on the ones that you are most interested in considering or visiting based on the results of your preliminary research and conversations.

If you are only considering online options then the mattress shopping tutorial includes several links to lists of many of the better online options I’m aware of (in the optional online step) that include many different types and categories of mattresses in a wide range of designs, budgets, firmness levels, and with different return/exchange policies that would be worth considering.

Latex in general is the most durable of all the foam materials and this is one of the reasons that there are many people who prefer latex/innerspring hybrids (see post #13 here) over other types of mattresses or combinations of materials and outside of any local options that may be available in your area … some of the better innerspring/latex options I’m aware of are listed in post #2 here and the post it links to but if you wish to test any of them in person rather than ordering online you would need to check their websites or call them to see if any of them have a dealer close to you.

If you are also interested in local options then if you let me know your city or zip code I’d be happy to let you know about the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in your area.

The major brands such as Sealy/Stearns & Foster, Simmons, and Serta all tend to use lower quality materials in their mattresses than most of their smaller competitors that will tend to soften or break down prematurely relative to the price you pay which is why I would generally suggest avoiding all of them completely (and the major retailers that focus on them as well) regardless of how they may feel in a showroom along with any mattress where you aren’t able to find out the type and quality/durability of the materials inside it (see the guidelines here along with post #3 here and post #12 here and post #404 here).

One of the most frustrating parts of mattress shopping can be spending time testing a mattress and finding out that you like it and that it’s a good match for you in terms of firmness, “feel” and PPP only to find out that the mattress contains low quality materials and/or that information you need to identify any lower quality materials or weak links in the mattress or make meaningful comparisons to other mattresses isn’t available and you’ve wasted the time you spent testing the mattress.

In its simplest form … choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to first finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …

  1. Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.

  2. Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in the mattress relative to your weight range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.

  3. Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Phoenix

I posted only after reading the various posts you keep recommending to various readers, which is a bit of a loop. Since it seems some of them also read these posts before posting to ask you to clarify your statements.

You do not want to recommend any mattress? That is OK.

People write me all the time about buying acoustic guitars. I take the same stance that it is a very personal choice, but I also give them some options based on my personal preference and years of experience around people who explain what they want and like and what the do not like and that often translates to others who are trying to figure out what they want.

But within themattressunderground.com you are giving specific reasons why someone would or should have second thoughts about buying particular brands, based on specific criteria used to find fault with a mattress, implying other brands of mattresses do not have the same faults, without providing actual alternatives,

In the Saatva assessment you say:

“If anything I would consider the lower density polyfoam used in the quilting materials to be a little on the thick side (a little over 2”) and I normally like to see quilting layers a little thinner (under 2") to reduce the risk of soft spots or virtual (or actual) impressions that can affect some people more than others but this is offset by the quilting and zoning of the mattress and therer is certainly less lower density polyfoam than most mainstream mattresses."

You also basically say the Saatva is overall a good mattress for a decent price despite:

“slightly higher amount of lower and medium quality foams in the upper layers of the mattress than I would normally suggest (2” or more is where I would become a little cautious)"

And when it comes to Winkbeds you say:

“My only caution here is that they use 2” of 1.5 lb polyfoam in the top layers of the mattress… (which is) “on the edge” of the guidelines that I would normally suggest which is “no more than about an inch or so of lower quality and less durable materials in the upper layers of the mattress” so I would add a “slight” caution here relative to durability."

So, what mattresses do NOT go over the amount of lower density polyfoam, which I and others can investigate further?

You also say of the Saatva:

“There are also many innerspring/microcoil (pocket coil) mattresses that are significantly under the $2500 that they claim would be a comparable mattress including some that are made by the same manufacturer that makes Saatva. Some of these use more costly offset coils or pocket coils or other materials in their mattresses along with microcoils with higher coil counts and/or specialty foams (such as latex or memory foam) in their comfort layers or wool in the quilting and sell for well under $1500 .”

What are these “many other” mattresses? Can you name one or three as examples that people can go checkout for themselves?

Your comments stopped me from buying from these companies. What companies actually meet these standards you have decided upon?

I also understand when you say that Saatva is not comparing apples to apples because they are comparing to much higher priced mattresses.

They of course are trying to say they are an ultra-premium mattress or almost, but are much less expensive for providing similar comfort and quality. You have called them on this.

We have all heard “just like a Rolex!” before. So it is good to point out their optimistic marketing may be going a bit far.

But the mattresses they put on their chart are exactly the mattresses the retail stores guide people to. They are Saatva and Winkbeds’ direct competition, other than the other on-line-only sellers, few of which are coil mattress sellers.

Again, you point out that these $3,000 mattresses are actually different than the Saatva offerings and imply Saatva would be more accurately compared to some other list of mattresses.

But WHICH ones?

Hi tspnyc,

There really isn’t too much I can add to the comments in my previous reply which already answered most of your questions. These comments In particular …

I wouldn’t consider them to be “good” quality/value mattresses because both of them have lower quality materials or “weak links” that don’t meet the minimum quality/durability guidelines that I would normally suggest. While they do use better quality and more durable materials than most of the major brand mattresses which is why I often mention they are “better than average” … the major brands are a very low bar to use as a comparison or reference point and neither one of them are mattresses that I would normally suggest considering.

Most of these would be local mattresses that are sold by local retailers or manufacturers that you would need to identify in your own specific area based on your own local research. They would be sold primarily by local factory direct manufacturers or some of the better retailers in different areas of the country that are transparent about the materials and components in their mattresses so you could make meaningful quality/value comparisons between the mattresses they sell and the Saatva and Winkbed mattresses. Finding them in your own specific area based on the criteria I’ve suggested would be your part of the research you would need to do for yourself.

As an example … if you were in the Beloit, WI area there are some innerspring mattresses here that use microcoils in the comfort layers that don’t use any lower quality materials or have any weak links that are made by one of the members of this site.

I don’t consider the mattresses on their chart to be their direct competition (outside of marketing narratives). Their direct competition would be good quality/value mattresses in a similar or even slightly higher budget range that don’t have the same “weak links” not major brand mattresses that are in much higher budget ranges. They are comparing themselves to mattresses that I would also consider to be significantly overpriced (and they have also overstated the prices) and that I also wouldn’t consider even at much lower prices because of the quality of the materials and components they use. I don’t consider major brand mattresses (or any mattress that has a weak link) to be real competition for any “good” quality/value mattress.

The optional online step includes links to 4 different lists of online options and the list of the members here that sell mattresses online include several that sell innerspring mattresses that would be worth considering. While I normally don’t look through the lists for specific mattresses for the members here since they can easily do so themselves (I would have no time remaining to answer posts and do the other ongoing research and activities that are involved in running the site if I did all the work for all the members here) I will make an exception in this reply. They include …

[url=https://my-green-mattress.pxf.io/natural-escape[/url]
https://www.flexuscomfort.com/
https://www.nestbedding.com/

The link to the list of latex/innerspring mattresses that I included in my last reply would also include mattresses that would be worth considering.

In general terms most of the online “simplified choice” mattresses or online “bed in a box” mattresses are foam mattresses and you would probably find many more good quality/value innerspring mattresses that are available locally that would be worth considering and that meet the quality/durability guidelines I’ve linked than you would online. Part of the reason for this is that many innerspring mattresses are more difficult to compress and/or ship economically.

There are a few pocket coil mattresses that have been launched more recently that I haven’t included in the simplified choice list yet that may also be worth considering. They include …

https://www.aviyamattress.com/ See my comments in post #25 here.

lumasleep.com Their basic mattress includes 1.5" of blended Talalay latex on top of a pocket coil innerspring with a 1" layer of high density polyfoam as a stabilizing layer under the pocket coils. It’s available in two different firmness levels. They also sell their Latex Hybrid Slumber System which includes the basic Luma mattress with an additional 3" Talalay latex topper in your choice of 3 different firmness levels.
NOTE: these specs are different from their original design which originally included a base mattress with a 1" layer of memory foam on top of the coils with the additional topper and which was only available as a mattress/topper combination.

Hybrid Innerspring Mattress - View Our Ultra Plush Hybrid Innerspring Mattress | CRaVE Mattress – Crave Mattress This includes a 1.5" convoluted latex top layer over a 1.5" memory foam middle layer on top of an 8" pocket coil with a 1" polyfoam bottom layer. I would want to know the density of the 1.5" memory foam layer under the latex. ADDED: I contacted them to find out the specifics of the materials and components in their mattress and they told me that the 1.5" memory foam layer is only 2.5 lb density which is much lower quality/density than the durability guidelines I would normally suggest for memory foam and I would consider it to be a weak link in this mattress in terms of the durability and useful life of the mattress.

https://voilamattress.com/ They don’t list the specifics of the materials and components in their mattresses so I wouldn’t consider this one unless they can provide you with the information here so you can confirm there are no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress. They are also made in China and there is always some additional risk and uncertainty involved in buying a mattress that is made in China or other imported mattresses that may be subject to longer periods of compression during shipping and storage that can sometimes affect the durability and useful life of the mattress (see post #6 here).

https://suissly.com/ 2 of their 4 firmness options include a pocket coil with different types of foam layers on top of the pocket coil. These include what they call California Dream foam (which would be what I call a high performance polyfoam), memory foam, and organic dunlop latex. The orgainc latex is a very high quality and durable material but I would want to know the density of the high performance polyfoam and the memory foam to make sure they meet the minimum durability guidelines before considering them.

I or some of the more knowledgeable members of the site can help you to narrow down your options, help you focus on better quality/value choices that are available to you either locally or online, help you identify any lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress, act as a fact check, answer many of the specific questions you may have along the way that don’t involve what you will “feel” on a mattress, and help with “how” to choose but only you can decide which specific mattress, manufacturer, or combination of materials is “best for you” regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or whether anyone else (including me) would have the same criteria or circumstances or would make the same choice.

Phoenix

Phoenix received it Wednesday, fast shipping!
We let it Air out. Really had little to no smell…
My Son sleep on it 2 Nights, he said he wakes up a lot less sore each morning.
That Speaks Volumes.
He really likes the Brooklyn Bed. Looks great and feels soft.
Pillow is a bit to hard, and I see no place to unzip? To let some stuffing that is in it.
I use to Sew but cannot anymore.

Now for us, we ordered the 10" Natural Latex Bed a Split King at SleepEZ. Roger was great.
Good grief need to go back and tell him about your recommendation. I will!!!
We receive it surely by Today or tomorrow. Will let it air we always do. With 6 Pieces that is not going yo be easy. Yikes : :whistle:

Then we purchased a Split King Serta Adjustable Foundation.
The price was much better then the Reverie, found a sale.
Bought the Warranty also. And Home Delivery.
Still waiting yo hear where it is? I have copies and used a Good Payment method so hopefully no worries.
We are so Happy our Son loves his New Mattress. He has a bad back Scolosis and Mario did help. Just hope it holds up well. And , All goes well for all we bought.
Thank you for all the Great Help.
Sunny

And the Foundation we bought fits inside our Bed Frame. Sure hope they are correct. It does nook like it will. Have 3 Leg Adjustments.
By the Way our Dog , he is washed very often found his way onto Joshua new Mattress much lower jump. :slight_smile: We wash our bedding more often then most do also.
Hope we are all happy.
Sunny

Hi Bunny1999,

Thanks for the update … I appreciate it :slight_smile:

Phoenix