Simplified Choice Mattresses aka Disruptors, Bed In A Box, One Choice Fits All, Universal Comfort, Millennial Mattresses

Discussions General Mattresses Questions
126

drm870,

Yeah, that’s an interesting article, isn’t it? I read it yesterday. Information some of us involved in doing mattress research were aware of, but nice for someone to connect the dots. The cases with Casper and Purple are very different. The involvement of JAKK in the review site purchase and changes made soon thereafter are interesting, and I’ll be looking to see what happens eventually with the ownership of that site long-term. You should go to HMR and read the disclaimer that they have to place at the top of their web pages, and then click on the link that redirects to the most recent court ruling on that case and you can see the tangled web between that review site and a mattress company and even some of the false reviews a family member of that mattress company posted online. A lot of this is disgusting, but there’s so much money in affiliate advertising that things like this were bound to happen and eventually be exposed. But I know this isn’t the place for such discussions, and Phoenix keeps above such fray (probably for good reason), but as someone who has been following this, I thought I’d throw in my 2 cents.

The new Casper stuff has been discussed earlier on the forum, starting with this post. The Wave was discussed briefly here. And apparently Serta is suing them regarding the Wave for what they say is copying a patented design held by Serta.

Jeff Scheuer
Mattress To Go

127

Yeah, that’s the other reason I didn’t make a topic over it – on top of not really being the purpose of the forum, the subject matter itself is kind of “loaded,” so to speak. I thought the article was fascinating (and informative!) enough, however, that I’d at least take a chance at a more obscure/subtle post. I do personally think it was worth a read.

128

drm870,

Yup - I agree.

129

Phoeniz,

Where did you get the specs for Zotto?

I contacted them through their contact page after hours and asked what the densities of their layers were and this is what I was told.

We can’t give out the specs of our foam layers because its part of our patent-pending formula but we have a description of each layer and the benefits of our formulas here.

I did not include the link it just describes what each layer is without specifics.

130

Phoenix has her ways… Seriously though as administrator of this forum I would expect her to have access to some information that companies may not so willingly share with the general public. Different companies choose how they want to operate and not all are very open about technical details of their products. It goes back to what Phoenix describes as transparency and the importance of getting the applicable details regarding the construction of products you’re considering. Just one of the many things that makes this forum such a valuable resource!

131

Hi Napper,

They contacted me in Dec. 2015 with their specifications (see this post).

Phoenix

132

[quote=“Phoenix” post=74266]Hi sretodd,

Thanks for providing the updates on the Dromma mattress. It seems that they have kept the memory foam layer and the polyfoam core the same (eliminating the “softer” polyfoam core), and the upper latex layer has been replaced with the same 1.5" thickness of one of these newer generation of “high performance” polyfoams that are softer but buoyant and more durable than lower-density polyfoams without the viscous properties of memory foam. The “adapt” polyfoam is 3.2 lb in density, which would be a good quality material.

Phoenix[/quote]

Hi Phoenix
what do you think of the dromma for a higher bmi? they think it would be great but I am wondering what you think?

133

Hi Ari:

You can see some of my comments about the Dromma where they are listed in the Simplified Choice Thread. There would be no obvious weak links in the mattress, but I would issue a slight caution for those in a higher BMI with the 2.5" of 4 lb memory foam and the 1.8 lb 33 ILD polyfoam core.

Phoenix

134

Thanks Phoenix!

135

Hi Ari,

You’re welcome.

Phoeinx

136

Hi Phoenix,

Thank you very much for sharing your time and knowledge and for guiding us through mattress buying process. Really appreciate it!

I am looking to purchase a king size mattress, medium firm, perfect for all kind of sleeping postures, suitable for 150 lb average weight per person. I live in DC area. I reviewed the list given in this post which was super-informative. I am overwhelmed though.

What would be your top 3 picks?

Which mattress do you own? Curious to know.

Regards

137

Hi VJ123,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :slight_smile:

You’re welcome.

[quote]I reviewed the list given in this post which was super-informative. I am overwhelmed though.
What would be your top 3 picks?[/quote]

I don’t provide “Top Picks”, as what I focus on is assisting people with “how” to choose, not “what” to choose, as it’s not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).

I’m not sure what you’ve read since you found the site but just in case you haven’t read it yet … the first place to start your research (and to assist with being “overwhelmed”) is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and the options you have available after a purchase if your choice doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for).

Outside of PPP (which is the most important part of “value”), the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new so I would always make sure that you find out the information listed here so you can compare the quality of the materials and components to the durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

In its simplest form … choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers (either locally or online) that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in that are in a budget range you are comfortable with and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …

  1. Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.

  2. Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight/BMI range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.

  3. Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

I sleep upon a latex mattress.

Phoenix

138

Hello,
First time posting. I spent a couple of weeks researching for a mattress. Lots of really good information on this forum so thank you. I am from Canada and there seems to be more of these Bed-in-a-box companies available. One of them is ZZAK Sleep and I can’t seem to find much information about them. I reached out to them today regarding the firmness and density of each layer. Is my understanding correct where Layer 2 might be a concern given that it’s a non-flippable mattress and only 1.5lb’s per cubic foot? I assume the numbers after the lbs is the ILD?

"We would describe the firmness of our mattress a 7/10.

The density of each layer is as follows:
LAYER 1: (the comfort foam closet to you): 2" Gelflex Plus 3 lbs 9-14
LAYER 2: (transition foam): 2" 1.5 lbs 25-30
LAYER 3: (support foam): 6" 1.8 lbs 39-44 "

139

Hi phtpCA,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :slight_smile:

[quote]One of them is ZZAK Sleep and I can’t seem to find much information about them. I reached out to them today regarding the firmness and density of each layer. Is my understanding correct where Layer 2 might be a concern given that it’s a non-flippable mattress and only 1.5lb’s per cubic foot? I assume the numbers after the lbs is the ILD?

The density of each layer is as follows:
LAYER 1: (the comfort foam closet to you): 2" Gelflex Plus 3 lbs 9-14
LAYER 2: (transition foam): 2" 1.5 lbs 25-30
LAYER 3: (support foam): 6" 1.8 lbs 39-44 "[/quote]

The uppermost layer of the ZZAK Mattress uses a 3 lb layer of memory foam called GelFlex Plus. The middle and the base layer are both polyfoam, at 1.5 lb and 1.8 lb, respectively. You are correct that the numbers provided behind the density would be the ILD ranges for those foams. The polyfoam second layer, and especially the memory foam layer, are lower than what I normally advise in the mattress durability guidelines, so I would advise caution with such combination of materials, unless the potential for lower durability and lower pricing were specific tradeoff considerations.

Phoenix

140

So I think I am likely going to go with a bed in a box. However I noticed that a lot of these companies (Casper, Leesa, BB) are going with a much more responsive foam layer to mimic the feel of latex. I honestly am indifferent about a bed with a responsive or memory foam feel. I’m wondering if there are any major pros or cons between the two types.

141

Hi MeDave,

There are more manufacturers looking to replace lower density polyfoams in their quilt panels with some of these newer generation “high performance polyfoams”. Some of these foams are also designed to mimic the feel of memory foam, albeit with faster response rates and less temperature sensitivity. And some of them are made more resilient and have comforts similar to latex. But of course, the overall feel of the mattress is dependent upon all of the materials within that particular mattress. And how “buoyant” or "dead’ of a surface comfort feel you desire would be a matter of personal preference.

While these higher density polyfoams do provide some unique levels of comfort, one of the best benefits is the extra longevity they can provide versus some of the less dense and lower quality polyfoam and memory foam materials that they sometimes replace.

Phoenix

142

If you have upgraded your bedding and have bought a new mattress then in next step you have to buy a protector for your mattress in order to make it safe from bedbugs, water and others. You should buy waterproof mattress protector to protect it from water.

143

Some mattresses have quilting and others do not and they appear to be a flat surface across. Would it be normal on the flat non quilted mattress to sink in a little but remain on top of vs in the mattress and feel like you are going up a slight incline when rolling towards the middle or edge of the bed whereas the quilting would prevent that?

144

question applies to an all foam mattress

145

What you’re describing seems to be like a bit of foam settling/softening in the area where you sleep upon a mattress. It’s normal for the center head to toe area and the side of the mattress to feel a bit firmer and also not be broken-in as much as the areas where the mattress is mostly used. How much of a difference there would be in these areas depends upon use, sleeping patterns, mass applied, as well as the overall layers used within the mattress and quality of those materials. Whether or not the mattress was a smooth top or had a polyurethane foam quilted panel wouldn’t necessarily dictate a difference in these wear patterns, as the phenomenon you describe can be felt in both styles of mattresses. It should be noted that fibers and polyurethane foam are what is commonly found in the quilt panel. There is some quiltable latex, but it is not common, and memory foam is not commonly found in any significant amount in a quilt panel. Quilting these materials can compress them a bit (depending upon the patterns), but how the quilt panel is attached and the cut can also increase loft. So there really are many variables and no one true answer to your question.

Jeff Scheuer, The Beducator
Beducation / Mattress To Go