Hello, and thanks in advance for your assistance! I’ve spent many hours reviewing the tutorial and have searched through tons of posts. The wealth of information has just left me more confused.
A bit about us. My wife and I are both side sleepers and prefer a more plush mattress. We live in Cincinnati. We like to sink in a bit, but not feel so overwhelmed we can’t toss and turn. I also tend to sleep hot on our current bed, a really inexpensive Serta innerspring. I am about twice the weight of my wife (about 270 vs 140) and that has been some concern to us in mattress shopping.
Originally we were set on trying out the Lessa or Saatva but after reviewing this site I have some concerns. On the guidance of using a site member retailer, I went to Denver Mattress and left with the Madison Plush being my bed of choice. I also enjoyed laying down on a S+F Emily bed and a Tempur-Pedic but I can’t remember the exact model. Given the cost, the Madison is right about where I want to be at $1,000. My concern is that after going home and reviewing the specs, I have a lot of concerns about durability.
So, all of this has left me thinking that perhaps the only two appropriate mattress choices we have in the online-only mattress segment are the Kiss and Brooklyn Bedding BME. Is that right? I’m also starting to think that we won’t find a mattress in our price range at Denver Mattress. Are there other mattresses I should be considering? Thanks.
In its simplest form … choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers (either locally or online) that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in that are in a budget range you are comfortable with and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …
Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.
Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.
Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.
As you probably know from the tutorial I can certainly help with “how” to choose but it’s not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).
While it’s not possible to quantify the sleeping temperature of a mattress for any particular person with any real accuracy because there are so many variables involved including the type of mattress protector and the sheets and bedding that you use (which in many cases can have just as significant an effect on sleeping temperature as the type of foam in a mattress) and on where you are in the “oven to iceberg” range (some people can sleep warmer on mattresses that most people are generally fine with) and because there is no standardized testing for temperature regulation with different combinations of materials … there is more about the many variables that can affect the sleeping temperature of a mattress or sleeping system in post #2 here that can help you choose the types of materials and components that are most likely to keep you in a comfortable temperature range.
Subject to confirming that any retailer or manufacturer on the list you wish to deal with is completely transparent about the materials and components in their mattresses (see this article) and to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines here … the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in and around the Cincinnati area are listed in post #212 here.
There is also more information in post #3 here and the posts it links to that would be helpful for those that are in higher weight ranges (or are part of a couple that have very different weight ranges and different needs and preferences).
While the process of how to choose a mattress would involve the same steps that are listed in the mattress shopping tutorial … most people in higher weight ranges will generally need or prefer firmer mattresses (firmer materials will feel softer because you will sink into them more) and materials and components that are higher quality and more durable than those that are in lower weight ranges (the materials and components in a mattress will soften and break down faster for those in higher weight ranges than they will for someone that is in a lower weight range that doesn’t compress the mattress as much). I would be particularly cautious about mattresses that use more than “about an inch or so” of memory foam that is less than about 5 lb density or polyfoam that is less than about 2 lb density … particularly in the upper layers of the mattress.
I would have some concerns with 1.8 lb polyfoam in the comfort layers in your weight range as well.
Outside of any local options that may be available to you that are on the Cincinnati list … the mattress shopping tutorial includes several links to lists of many of the better online options I’m aware of (in the optional online step) outside of the simplified choice list that you have probably been reading that include many different types and categories of mattresses that use different materials and components in a wide range of designs, budgets, firmness levels, and with different return/exchange policies that would be worth considering and some of them would also meet the quality/durability guidelines for your weight range.
Off the top of my head I think that most of the Denver mattress models that are in your budget range use 1.8 lb polyfoam and some of it is also convoluted (see post #2 here) … so I would be cautious as well but I don’t know the specs of all their mattresses off the top of my head so you would need to check the specs on each of them to make sure.
We went back to Denver Mattress today with a larger budget in mind and we discovered their Richmond line. Do you have any thoughts on this bed in terms of supporting our weight differences and just construction in general?
Further, do any other specific mattresses (online or in major retailer) with a similar construction come to mind? Spending under $1,400 would be nice.
I will continue to browse your links and see if I can come upon anything else. Unfortunately, due to our schedule, I’m not sure if in the near future we would be able to get to any retailers outside of our local area, and some that I have found don’t allow returns, and that concerns me. I guess that’s one of the reasons I’m feeling a bit stumped by the single choice online retailers vs Denver Mattress.
I can’t speak to whether it would be suitable “match” for either or both of you and you would need to do some careful testing on the mattress to assess whether it would be a suitable choice for both of you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP .
I can certainly make some comments though about the quality and durability of the materials in the mattress.
3" ACR Cushion Layer 2.5lb Foam: You would need to check and see if this layer is memory foam or polyfoam. If it’s memory foam then it will leave a handprint for a short time when you press down on the mattress with your hands and then remove your hands and if it’s memory foam then it would be a very low density and I would avoid it. It’s more likely though that it’s a high performance polyfoam which has a more “instant” response and won’t leave a handprint in which case it would be a durable material that would be suitable for your weight range.
1 Flex Net Insulator: This is an insulating layer that helps prevent the foam comfort layer from compressing into the pocket coils and wouldn’t be an issue in terms of durability.
Coil Density: 744 Foam Encased Coils: They don’t mention the thickness of this component or the gauge of the coils but I’m guessing that it’s a 4" low profile comfort core. Regardless of the thickness though … assuming that the mattress is a good match for you in terms of firmness and PPP and isn’t too soft or “on the edge” of being too soft for you then steel innersprings are a durable component and wouldn’t be a weak link in a mattress in terms of durability. ADMIN NOTE:Removed 404 page link | Archived Footprint: Error 404: Not Found - L&P Bedding Group
If you tend to sleep on the outside edge of the mattress or sit on the edge of your mattress on a regular basis then I would also want to know the density of the foam encasement around the pocket coils to make sure that they are a suitable density for your weight range.
4’ 1.8lb Foam Base with Engineered Articulating Cuts: This is a little lower density than I would normally suggest for someone in your weight range (where I would generally look for minimum 2 lb polyfoam) but it’s also deeper inside the mattress and the layers and components above it would absorb most of the compression forces that come from sleeping on the mattress so it would have a smaller effect on durability than if the same layer was closer to the sleeping surface so I would add a “slight caution” because the risk of premature foam softening would be slightly higher than if the foam density was higher.
Overall … and assuming that the foam surround is a suitable density polyfoam … it would make a “reasonable” choice but it probably wouldn’t be the “best” choice available to you in terms of durability because of the additional risk involved in the bottom layer.
There is more information in post #9 here about the different ways that one mattress can “match” or “approximate” another one. Every layer and component in a mattress (including the cover and any quilting materials) will affect the feel and performance of every other layer and component and the mattress “as a whole” so unless you are able to find another mattress that uses exactly the same type of materials, components, cover and quilting, layer thicknesses, layer firmnesses, and overall design (which would be fairly unlikely) then there really isn’t a reliable way to match one mattress to another one in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP based on the specifications of the mattresses (even assuming that you can find out all the specifications you would need for both mattresses you are comparing in the first place).
Mattress manufacturers generally try to differentiate their mattress from the mattresses made by other manufacturers and don’t normally try to “match” another mattress that is made by a different manufacturer so unless a manufacturer specifically says in their description of a mattress that one of their mattresses in the same general category is specifically designed to “match” or “approximate” another one in terms of firmness or “feel” and PPP and/or they are very familiar with both mattresses and can provide reliable guidance about how they compare based on the “averages” of a larger group of people that have compared them (different people may have very different opinions about how two mattresses compare) … the only reliable way to know for certain how two mattresses would compare for you in terms of how they “feel” or in terms of firmness or PPP would be based on your own careful testing or actual sleeping experience on both of them (regardless of anyone else’s opinions of how they compare which may be different from your own).
In other words it would be very unlikely that you would be able to find another mattress that uses all the same materials and components and I certainly don’t know of one.
I certainly understand. With a local purchase and for the majority of people … careful testing (using the guidelines in the tutorial) and some good guidance will usually result in a mattress choice that is well inside a suitable comfort/support range and will generally be “close enough” so that if any fine tuning is necessary it would be relatively minor and involve different mattress pads, sheets, mattress protectors, or perhaps even a topper if a mattress is too firm (see post #4 here and post #10 here).
For those that are making an online choice where they can’t test a mattress before a purchase, have a history of choosing mattresses that are unsuitable for them even if they have tested them locally, have body types or health considerations that are more challenging and make choosing the most suitable mattress more difficult, or that for whatever reason are more uncertain about whether their choice is “right” for them … then the options you have available after a purchase to fine tune the comfort or support of the mattress or to exchange or return the mattress or individual layers can become a much more important part of each person’s personal value equation.
Of course the other side of this is that exchange or return options are built in to the cost of a mattress so they can add to the cost of a mattress and the majority of people who don’t return or exchange a mattress are the ones who pay for the minority of people who do (see post #3 here and the posts it links to).
This is wonderfully helpful! Thank you for taking the time to help unpack these materials. It seems this is a reasonably new line and I’ve had trouble finding any useful information.
I have posed a question about the ACR foam, but it felt like polyfoam when I laid on it. My wife did not like the feel of memory foam beds and this bed had a nice bounce to it without sinking in. I did press my hands down several times when examining the bed and my handprint never stayed in the bed. We spent a lot of time on the mattress with a good pillow and it felt right for “comfort”, firmness, and PPP. That said, it’s still more than I want to spend, especially if I can get something of a higher quality for the same cost or less.
Do you have any thoughts on the weak links of this bed versus the Alexander Hybrid or Saatva? I know you can’t comment on comfort and so on, but just based on durability. My impression from other threads is mixed Finally, are there any coils+foam beds available online that you do approve of given our weight differences?
Based on your comments it seems clear that the top layer in the Richmond mattress is a high performance polyfoam which means it would be suitable for your weight range.
The Alexander Signature Hybrid uses 3.5 lb memory foam and 1.8 lb polyfoam in the comfort layers which are both lower density than I would suggest in your weight range.
The Saatva mattress also uses some lower quality/density and less durable materials in the upper layers than I would suggest in your weight range or even lower weight ranges as well.
In other words … I would consider the Richmond to be a more durable choice than either of them for someone in your weight range.
Again I can’t speak to whether any mattress would be suitable for you relative to your weight differences but since you are in the higher weight range if it was durable enough for you then it would certainly be durable enough for your wife as well.
In terms of durability … I would consider any mattress that doesn’t have more than “about an inch or so” of lower quality and less durable materials (in the upper 6" or so of the mattress especially) than the guidelines here to be a suitable choice. Suitable materials for your weight range would include 5 lb or higher memory foam, 2.0 lb or higher polyfoam, any type or blend of latex, or any steel springs.
I don’t make specific recommendations and I don’t keep a record of the individual mattresses or their specs that the retailers and manufacturers in the hundreds of forum lists throughout the forum carry on their floor or have available online (it would be a bigger job than anyone could keep up with in a constantly changing market) but checking their websites and making some preliminary phone calls to the retailers/manufacturers that are on the local or online lists is always a good idea before you decide on which retailers or manufacturers you wish to deal with anyway. This will tell you which of them carry mattresses that would meet your specific criteria, are transparent about the materials in their mattresses, and carry the type of mattresses that you are interested in that are also in the budget range you are comfortable with. Once you have checked their websites and/or talked with the ones that interest you then you will be in a much better position to decide on the ones that you are most interested in considering or visiting based on the results of your preliminary research and conversations.
In other words I can help you evaluate a specific mattress that you are looking at once I know the information in this article but you would need to “find” them by looking through websites or by talking to different retailers or manufacturers that are listed in the local or online lists.
If you are looking for an innerspring mattress instead or an all foam mattress then there are some latex/innerspring hybrids that are listed in post #2 here that would be very suitable choices in terms of durability (latex in general is the most durable of all the foam materials) and I believe if you check their websites or call them for prices that you will find that a few of them may be in your budget range as well.
There may also be some suitable options in your local area as well.
I or some of the more knowledgeable members of the site can help you to narrow down your options, help you focus on better quality/value choices that are available to you either locally or online, help you identify any lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress, act as a fact check, answer many of the specific questions you may have along the way that don’t involve what you will “feel” on a mattress, and help with “how” to choose but only you can decide which specific mattress, manufacturer, or combination of materials is “best for you” regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or whether anyone else would have the same criteria or circumstances or would make the same choice.
