this is my first post in the forum. I’d like to ask for some advice regarding two of the Tempurpedic mattresses that we have in Australia.
I have read a number of posts on this forum, including replies made by the forum moderator Phoenix, who I believe to be a very resourceful.
In Australia, we don’t get the whole Tempurpedic range. The two that I am choosing between currently are:
The Tempurpedic Original Supreme 31 and the Original deluxe 27
From what I have heard, the Tempur layers for both are the same. Being 12 in total.
From what I have been told by the Tempur rep, the Supreme 31 has more foam at the base, and the support layer is made of 5cm of Tempur Soft touch material (85 density).
The Deluxe however has a different support layer, being 2cm of HD material (110 density) and 3cm of soft touch and has less in the normal foam near the base of the mattress.
The RRP of the Supreme is more, but after discounting, both beds equate to roughly the same price. Does anyone know whether having HD memory foam in the top layer as opposed to soft touch material makes the Deluxe better? Or whether the extra non memory foam near the base make the Supreme better?
Any advice would be great as I will buy one of these beds tomorrow.
Both of these mattresses use high quality memory foam (5 lb or higher) but they don’t provide any details about the density of the base foam layers. More than anything though … both of them have a different design that will feel and perform differently so the choice would be more about which one is better for your specific needs and preferences in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, Personal preferences) than it would be about which one is “better or worse”.
The Tempur 8 lb memory foam is a little softer and more conforming than the Tempur 5.3 lb memory foam once it has softened with heat and would also be a little more durable. Quilting a foam layer and adding a layer as a pillow top are both methods that will change the surface feel of a mattress so the differences between them here would once again be a matter of preference.
In terms of durability … the quality and durability of the upper layers are more important than the base layers because a mattress will soften and break down from the top down. A difference of a few cm in the base foam is not as significant as any differences in their quality, firmness, and performance or differences in the memory foam layers.
Overall … both of these use good quality materials (for the memory foam layers at least because the base layers aren’t specified in terms of quality/density) and I would base your decision differences in how they feel and perform for your body type and sleeping positions in careful and objective testing.
I should also mention though that I personally wouldn’t consider either of these mattresses and there is likely to be much better quality/value available to you than any of the tempurpedic models (which along with most of the major brands are included in the mattresses I would tend to avoid). Post #1 here may also be helpful and the information, steps, and guidelines would apply to Australia as much as North America.
There are several “Australia” threads on the forum listed in post #2 here that also includes a link to many Australian manufacturers and some comments and feedback about some of them that may be helpful unless you really do have your heart set on a Tempurpedic regardless of their quality/value compared to other mattresses that use similar or better quality materials and sell for significantly less.
thank you for taking your time to respond to this post. It is much appreciated.
I regret that I did not read the entirety of the post titled “how to find your perfect mattress” before making my purchase of the Deluxe 27 today. I had briefly only read the “How to look for and find the best mattress … for YOU!” and I missed the part that deals with having a straight spine amongst a few other important articles.
I have a few things to add in this post, some of which are observations and others which are questions which I hope you may be able to answer.
I recall you saying that memory foam is never meant to be supportive but the Tempur rep here mentioned that the 7cm support layer was made of Tempur material. How does this work if memory foam is not meant to be supportive?
Given that in post 2, I mentioned that the support layer is memory foam, what part does the base layer have to play in the core of the bed? Does it have a supporting role or some other role? Also, would I still be looking for HR Poly for the base of 2.5/cubic foot and a compression modulas of 2.4 or higher or is that only a requirement if it is used as a support layer?
I recall that you said that the Tempurpedic line do not represent good value. However, that if money was not an issue, then the quality of their mattresses are good, and they remain "one of the better choices out there, despite not being the quality or feel leader.
In other words I couldn’t have made too bad of a decision right? (other than paying too much).
My main concern now is my spinal position when laying in the bed and in particular my shoulders v hips, as I didn’t get a chance to see my posture as I was lying on the mattress today. In the current mattress I own (which is not good at all), my shoulders do not sink in at all, while my hips go into my mattress.
Given that you said in another post, that Tempurpedic do usually use high quality material and because you said higher density Tempur is more conforming and pressure relieving, would it be correct that the Deluxe 27 would be a better choice than the 31 and at least give a better chance for my shoulders to sink more into the mattress and therefore give me a more erect spinal position? Or do the base layers have a role to play as well?
Further, will high quality Tempur memory foam give me the BEST chance of conforming. In other words, if 8lb Tempur foam didn’t cause my shoulders to sink down, then nothing else like coils, latex, etc would?
Since I assume there is no zoning on the mattress, and that different parts of the body have different weights, how would memory foam know how far to let one part of the body go down as opposed to the next? Could either mattress still give me imperfect body alignment?
If you look at the Tempur Deluxe 27, you will notice that the top layer is 2cm of HD and 3cm of soft tempur. Does the different densities in the comfort layer make the design kind of progressive as opposed to differential (at least in comparison) with the Supreme 31?
This post if for my interest only I remember reading from some other posts that you spoke about not recommending the Tempur Cloud series due to the density level. Is it merely because it does not have the right pressure relieving qualities due to not conforming as much, its durability or was it some other reason?
If the foam used in the beds are the same for both the Deluxe and Supreme, with the only difference being the HD layer being used for the top of the Deluxe, which bed would you choose if they cost exactly the same? What would be better for my height? I am 6 foot 2 and 74kg. Which bed represents better value in terms of the cost of the materials?
Concluding remarks
In the end, I made my decision to go for the Tempur because I didn’t have much time to really go to each manufacturer and test local brands or to really invest into researching mattresses in more detail. It’s been a busy period for me (just moving into new house) and I felt like I couldn’t spare more than two weekends looking for the right one. As long as the only mistake I made was “paying too much” and I wasn’t ending up with a bad product, I don’t think I will feel too much buyers remorse.
I ended up going for the Deluxe 27 because it felt softer than the Supreme 31. I tried both in store and the Supreme felt harder to move on, my body didn’t sink in as much, and it felt firmer for some reason. I also found out that the Supreme 31 was previously called the Tempur Celebrity (which may have been released in the US) and had bad reviews on our Australian Product review site and was much older than the Deluxe.
I feel that this site is full of valuable information and I am very appreciative that someone like yourself is able to put so much knowledge in the public space for everyone to learn. If I had more time, and I will for the next time I am in need of a mattress, I will follow everything on this forum step by step. The difficulty of course, If I was selecting memory foam again would be to make sure the formula and chemicals inside the foam, which from what I gather has an effect on the foam just as much as density has. Since this would be hard to gauge, I am curious as to how you would manage that into going for a local memory foam brand. I suppose it would be just to look at that page you of the cmpany that does independent testing on memory foam manufacturers.
Thank you for all your help Phoneix and I hope to hear from you again.
There are several meanings of “support” depending on whether you are talking about primary support or secondary support. You can read more about this in post #4 here.
Memory foam can be used as a comfort layer and as a transition or “secondary” support layer but all memory foam is too soft to be used as a primary support layer to “stop” the heavier parts of the body from sinking down too far. Memory foam also gets softer with heat, humidity, and with the length of time it is compressed so even if a deep support layer made from memory foam “stopped” your pelvis from sinking down too far initially it would become softer over the course of the night and you could end up out of alignment in the morning. This is also the reason that layers of memory foam in a mattress that are too thick for the individual person can be a “risky” construction.
The base layer is for “primary support” and its role (along with the thickness/softness of the upper layers) is to “stop” the pelvis from sinking down too far. Polyfoam which is typically used in the primary support layers of a memory foam mattress isn’t heat sensitive so if it is firm enough to keep you in good alignment when you go to bed then you will still have good alignment in the morning. Memory foam always need a base layer for primary support that is firmer and where the softness/firmness doesn’t change over the course of the night. Polyfoam is usually used for this but an innerspring and latex can also be used for primary support layers.
Tempurpedic uses many different types of foam in their mattress and while many of them use good quality materials … some of them don’t. The durability of a mattress (or the materials it uses) will also depend on the body type and sleeping style of the person using it. For example a 4 lb memory foam may be very durable for someone who was lighter but not so durable (especially in thicker layers) for a heavier person. The quality of a mattress and the materials in it is always relative to the person and the specific circumstances … not the name of the manufacturers. Some or even many of the Tempurpedic mattresses use good quality/durable materials relative to the specific needs of most people but some of their mattresses also use low quality materials and some of them use materials that would be good quality/durability for some people but not for others. All of them regardless of the quality of the materials they use have relatively poor value compared to many other mattresses that use the same quality materials in their mattresses.
If I was in a heavier weight range then I would choose a memory foam mattress that used a minimum of 5 lb memory foam and if there were any layers less than this i would make sure they were very thin so that their softening had less effect on the mattress. The mattress you chose uses 5 and 7 lb memory foam so this is in the higher quality/durability range for memory foam.
You can read more about the many “interactive” factors that can affect the durability of a mattress in post #4 here.
Again this would depend on the specific Tempurpedic mattress you were looking at and it’s suitability for your specific needs and preferences (how well it relieves pressure, keeps you in alignment, and how durable the materials are likely to be for your body type and sleeping position). You can only know this if you test the mattress carefully and objectively and also know the specific details of all the layers in the mattress.
If you take price out of the equation then how good or bad your decision was would depend on PPP (Posture and Alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) and on the durability of the materials in the mattress. I don’t know how suitable the mattress is for you (only your own experience or testing can know this) but the mattress you chose uses high quality memory foam in the comfort layers which are usually the “weak link” of a mattress so strictly from a durability criteria it is good quality. How good or bad any mattress purchase decision is depends entirely on the personal value equation of each person because each person may have very different criteria and definitions of good or bad based on their own needs and preferences. Only you can answer this.
All of the layers play a role and every layer affects every other layer of a mattress and contributes to PPP in one way or another. There are too many variables and unknowns for anyone else to know which specific mattress is most suitable for you in terms of PPP but in terms of quality then the 8 lb memory foam used in the top layer is higher quality than the 5.3 lb memory foam although it is only a very thin layer. The 'better" choice would be the one that works best for you based on your actual experience rather than “theory”.
No this is not accurate. Every material has many different versions and levels of softness and firmness and can be used in a mattress with different material combinations so the type of material is only a personal preference (Tempur or otherwise) and is not as important as the design of the mattress that uses the material and it’s suitability for you.
The memory foam doesn’t “know”. If you have upper layers of memory foam that are too thick then you could easily sink down too far with the heavier parts of your body and wake up with discomfort or pain in your back regardless of the quality of the memory foam. the goal of different mattress designs is so that different types of people can sink into a mattress evenly and be in good alignment … it’s not the material that “knows” … it’s the design of the mattress that makes one mattress suitable for one person and not another. only your own personal testing or experience can tell you if a mattress provides you with good alignment in all your sleeping positions.
Differential and progressive are just concepts that can help people understand the different ideas that go into mattress design. Both of these use several layers of material with a softer layer on top, a middle transition layer, and then a firmer support core so they are both closer to a progressive construction. (Differential constructions would usually have only two layers). One isn’t better than another … just two different methods of reaching the same design goals (PPP).
The Tempur cloud uses 4 lb memory foam which wouldn’t be as durable as higher quality/density memory foam for someone that was heavier. The “caution” was for heavier weights.
I would choose the one that was the best “match” for me in terms of PPP. If I really couldn’t decide between them and they had exactly the same feel and performance (which is unlikely) then I would probably give the edge to the one that used the slightly higher quality/density materials. If there was a small difference in how they felt … I would probably choose the one that was a little bit firmer. It’s much easier to “fine tune” a mattress that is too firm with a mattress pad or topper than it is to “fix” a mattress which is too soft which would require the removal and replacement of some of the foam layers instead of adding to them.
Hopefully this helped and you can better evaluate your choice and decide if it really is the best one for you based on your own personal value equation (which in your case would include the value of the “time” it takes to find a mattress).