Woman on the verge of latex bed overwhelm!

[phoenix]

Hi feeblewitz,

Some browsers seem to have some issues with attaching photos (see here) so I downloaded them and attached them to your post … I hope that’s OK (and I’ll switch it back to the links if you prefer them).

Both my husband and I tested out the bed without the cases and thought it seemed more comfortable than in the casing. Could the cases be constraining it, making it more like a trampoline than something to sink in to?

Yes … the type of cover on a mattress can have a significant effect on a mattress (for better or for worse). Yours has wool in the quilting which can help with temperature regulation and the surface “feel” of the mattress but it can also have an effect on the contouring of soft latex.

We have the 9.5 inch 930 Ecotouch which has the latex base. And It does look like a real latex base. The top layer also looks like real latex. The middle layer seems different. The bed description says that the bottom layer is firm talalay (36ILD), then soft talalay (24ILD), then super soft talalay (19ILD). I got the ILDs from an ebay description so take with a grain of salt.

I believe your specs are probably accurate and the middle layer would also be blended Talalay latex (not all latex layers look the same but you can see the pincores).

In the spirit of scientific inquiry, we are putting our big butts on the line and took pics of us laying on the mattress. If an expert eye might be able to tell what’s going wrong for us, we’d appreciate it. Maybe we can add another level on top of the whole thing for pressure point relief? Maybe it needs some zone treatment, putting a different ILD in the pelvis/hip area and shoulders?

I certainly don’t have an “expert eye” and there are many people who sell mattresses every day (which I don’t) that have much more experience and are much better than I am at assessing alignment. It’s also difficult at best to assess alignment just from a single picture without being there in person (you can only see one “snapshot” and one angle and rotational alignment is also difficult to assess) and having more reference points (such as something that can help show the line of the spine to see how it’s bending or feeling under the lumbar curve) is also helpful. Assessing alignment is also partly based on visual cues and partly from “feel” and the ability of your muscles to “let go” and completely relax (which usually takes some time).

Your specific “symptoms” are also an important part of assessing alignment (see post #2 here). Not everyone sleeps free of pain or discomfort if they are in a “theoretical” best alignment because their body may not be used to it.

Having said that … from the point of view of a “non expert” … it looks to me like there is some sagging happening for both of you. In his case it looks like his pelvis is tilted and in your case it looks like your hips/pelvis is being held up too high although I can’t really tell for sure from just one picture. There may also be other members who have more day to day experience than I do that see this and will hopefully share their thoughts as well.

In looking back at your posts you mentioned …

We’re average weight - 150 and 180, both seemed to have developed hip bursitis from our current bed. I have ongoing lower back issues that are usually kept at bay with stretching, good rest, and not sitting too much but with this bed I wake up with back pain.

Lower back issues are most commonly from comfort layers that are too thick/soft or from support layers that are too soft. If your hips/pelvis is out of alignment either from sinking in too far or not enough then this can also cause “hip symptoms” or aggravate issues that already exist.

my spouse developed shoulder pain.

This is usually from comfort layers that are too thin/firm or from sleeping with a pillow that isn’t suitable in combination with the mattress. It’s more common with men who have wider shoulders that need to sink in more or that need a thicker pillow (on their side) to maintain support under their head and neck.

Currently the floor with padding is more comfortable! A firmer surface seems to be what we need.

This seems to “point to” comfort layers that are a little thinner and that bring you closer to the support layers (although this can also cause pressure points … especially with a pillow that is too thin for side sleeping.

So we left the cases off, put sheets on, and slept on it that way last night. It was more comfortable, though I still woke with back pain and my hips and shoulders hurt through the night. He said it was ok - much less hip pain but still not super comfy.

I would give any change you make at least a few nights (more than 2) so you can see if things are an improvement or worse than the previous version. One nights experience is really not enough to make a good assessment of whether a different combination is better or worse.

I would first sleep on the mattress without the cover for a few days and assess the “direction” of any changes you experience (how and where are they better or worse than before). Depending on the outcome I think that the next thing I would probably try is to “carefully” remove the top latex layer (and this can be difficult and will take time and involve carefully lifting up and pulling back on the top layer as you cut in small strokes in between them with a sharp blade). Depending on whether it is only partly glued or glued all across the surface some areas may be more difficult than others and you will have some tearing in the latex and lots of “crumbles” but this won’t make much difference to performance if you are careful and avoid pulling on the latex too firmly which can tear it…

If you are OK with removing a layer then I would test sleeping on just a single comfort layer to see how your experience changes as the difference between this and your double comfort layer will provide some useful feedback and “pointers” about whether thinner/firmer comfort layers will help.

Phoenix