Advice on new mattress that I'm considering, please.

Mattress Talk General Mattresses Questions
61

Hi scubamom,

I don’t think there is any doubt that the reasons for the issues you have been having are in the foundation.

As you mentioned they are made from fiberboard and they are certainly strong and solid with no flex. The only down side is that they have a solid surface which limits airflow under the mattress (see post #10 here).

There is no doubt that the Tempurpedic foundation will change the feel of your mattress compared even to your defective foundation when it was new (your mattress would have been sagging into the gaps from the beginning even if there were no visible sags).

The latex itself shouldn’t be damaged but the layers may have shifted or bunched because of the defective foundation underneath it. I would give things a week or two to see if it “recovers” and evens out again. I would also make sure you sleep on the parts with the ridges as much as possible.

I would also email PLB with your pictures and a description of the issues you have been having (and I would also include that your retailer has been having trouble getting them to return calls) and ask them about the options you have available if your mattress doesn’t recover in a week or two.

Phoenix

62

Well, the good news is that we figured it out! Thanks to you and all the help on this forum! Thanks to BobP too.

The bad news is that the bed still feels like it did on the PLB foundations, other than my back isn’t out quite as much as it has been. That said, the pressure on my hips and legs is the same - rendering muscle spasms during the night and all the next day! I’ve been the masseuse and chiropractor more times in the last 6 weeks than in 2 years combined!

When I get back in the slightly lumpy Simmons, I’m much better. May have to stay in that bed until we see if the PLB settles down.

Meanwhile, I’ll call my dealer and send photos… if they don’t get a response, I’ll contact PLB. Probably do well to give the bed a few days to see what it does.

63

Hi scubamom,

You may need to go through a new “adjustment” period now that you have a solid foundation.

I’m looking forward to finding out whether your mattress is “recovering” over the next week or so and how things work out for you.

Phoenix

64

Scubamom,
Great pics. Add another center head to toe beam to your full foundation and you have my PLB queen foundation with a piece of cardboard on top. My foundation lasted about 10 months before it started to make loud creaking noises. From your pics I can see why, it’s nailed not screwed together. PLB replaced it with the SAME foundation. We will see how long this one lasts.

You would think that a company that makes a great latex mattress would pair it with a strong adequate foundation. I assumed that who would know better what foundation would be suitable for their mattress than the mattress manufacturer. In this case a bad assumption.

Don’t forget to save the law tags on the PLB foundations and mattress. If you do decide to file a warranty claim with them a picture of them is required.

Hopefully your PLB mattress will recover.

65

Thanks for the heads up on the law tags! I took pictures of both of them. Both made in numerical sequence 3/17/14 in NC… wonder how many others on that day had the tops left off!

Actually, with a bit of cross bracing here and there plus a 1/2" plywood top, they might turn into really great foundations. If we were going to keep them, I’d probably have a carpenter do that. Be easy to strip the cover off and beef it up, then put the cover back on (with a heavy duty bottom fabric sealing it up).

While we are working with this problem, the other problem is our second PLB Beautiful at our 2nd home does not feel like this one at all! When we LIKED this one the first 6 weeks (support and pressure relief), the other seemed a LOT softer. If this one is rated an 8, we’d rate the 2nd one close to a 10. The one here feels like the floor model at the store - an 8.

The mattress company knows this but we haven’t been back up to the other house to meet with them on it.

So, as you can imagine, we are a bit skiddish of whether we want to keep either one! Could the quality control make two mattresses vary that much? With all the problems we are having, honestly, I’m not sure what we should do.

But we’ll see what this mattress does in the next week or so. We are so tired of moving back and forth between the PLB and our Simmons, it’s enough to make us bonkers! :frowning:

66

Hi scubamom,

It would be hard to know how much difference the foundation made in how the two mattresses compare because it would certainly make some difference so it may be worth waiting a week or so to see how they compare then now that you have the foundation issue solved. I’m also assuming that they are the same mattress and that you didn’t get the wrong mattress with one of them by mistake which would also be a possibility.

If there is a significant difference between them it may be worthwhile comparing both mattresses by themselves and then both mattresses with the topper to see if you can isolate which one is contributing to any difference between them.

Other possible causes that could contribute to a different “feel” could be your mattress protector or your sheets.

If there are no other obvious causes either above or below the mattress then it’s certainly possible that one of them was somehow made with the wrong layers although this wouldn’t be common.

If that turns out to be the case I think it would qualify as one of those “when it rains it pours” set of circumstances :frowning: .

Phoenix

67

The 2nd home bed is on a solid top (custom made like a tank) platform - I saw this being built, so know it will never sag, creak or whatever. Same protector, same sheets, same pillows, same 2" PLB fast release topper.

We originally bought two Simmons - one for here and one for there… it was odd, sometimes we’d wake up and not know which house we were at because the beds were so much alike (until they started getting a few depressions on my pillowtop plush comfort level 8 side - hubby’s firm side comfort level about 3-4 really never changed in three years).

After they delivered the 2nd home PLB Beautiful and it was so soft, best I could guess it was closer to a world’s best with that top soft layer OR maybe more like the former Beautiful (didn’t it have an ILD of 19 instead of 21?). For the first 3 weeks, we had a Nature with the 2" PLB bliss topper - too hard for both of us… then I added a 19 ILD under the 2" bliss topper and it was too soft - no support. We did a comfort exchange for the Beautiful and liked it so well that the next month, we bought it to replace the Simmons at the 2nd home.

The one up there almost feels like the Nature with the 19 ILD and 2" topper, Or maybe the one down here is firmer than “normal” Beautiful. ACK! Wish there were an ILD (what is it) test we could do on both the beds. :slight_smile:

Both are 12" tall. Both say Beautiful.

We’ll stay on the Simmons a few nights to let the PLB “rest” and then try it again. We’ll get back up to the second home next month and see what that one has done and feels like again.

Yeah, when it rain’s it pours… the mattress gods are truly mad at us! :frowning:

68

Hi scubamom,

That rules out some of the “other” possibilities so the two most likely causes are either the foundation you were having issues with affected your perception of how they compared or they are actually different.

2 ILD is less than most if not all people would be able to feel and is less than the normal ILD variation across the surface of a typical latex layer. The Old Beautiful (see the specs here) also had an inch less latex in the middle 24 ILD layer layer than the current Beautiful (see the specs here) which would have a firming effect.

Phoenix

69

Update: A week later, the mattress is still confused and looks like it did when it was on the defective foundation - middle hill + two valleys + raised ridge around the edge of the bed. If anything, it’s fluffed up a tiny bit (if I use my imagination!) :slight_smile: We slept on it last night and it wasn’t too bad - horrid pressure on shoulders, hips, and legs weren’t like they were on the crazy defective foundation, but it appears to have lost it’s “Beautiful” feel.

I sent all the photos and information to our mattress store and he’s offered to replace it. We think we might have enough to file a warranty claim on the defective foundations and damage they did to the poor mattress. I assume PLB is now getting their act together a bit better than a month or two ago?

If we do this, I’ll be interested to see if it is “soft” like the one at our second home, or feels like this one DID and the one on the mattress company’s floor - lots of support, comfort, and pressure relief. In other words… truly a Beautiful Bed! :slight_smile:

70

Hi scubammom,

That probably depends on who you talk to because the feedback from retailers seems to be somewhat mixed (see here).

Did you happen to contact PLB themselves?

Phoenix

71

Just talked to our mattress company and they planned to replace the PLB Beautiful with a Simmon’s Black Kate Plush which they have in stock - they are still having problems getting PLB to respond to anything - phone or faxes and reluctantly are thinking of dropping the line.

SO… if others are waiting 6 weeks to receive their mattresses we are back to decision time. Guess I’ll go try a Black Kate, but others said they fail within the first year. ACK!

Our daughter just purchased a Simmons Black Hope Firm… here’s what the tag says (so you can check out the foam types)

Quilt:
3/4" Geltouch Foam 1.5LB
1" Luxury Firm foam 1.65LB

Comfort layers:
1/2" Aircool Memory Foam 2.1LB
1/2" Micro Diamond infused aircool memory foam 4.5LB
1 1/2" Micro Pocket Coil 17 gauge
1/2" Dynamic Response Memory Foam 3.2LB
Bottom upholstery (below comfort layers)
1 1/2" 1.2LB energy foam

Support 13.5 gauge

NOTE: The Black Kate is somewhat the same other than coils are 14.75 gauge and it has an additional 2" Aircool Memory Foam in comfort layer over the microcoils

Sounds like a lot of complicated layers to me!!

72

Hi scubamom,

Comparing the specs to the guidelines here indicates that there are certainly enough “questionable” and lower quality/density materials in the comfort layers that would likely be a weak link in this mattress … especially for a mattress in this price range … that it would be a very risky purchase.

With an additional 2" of lower quality/density materials in the comfort layers … the Kate would be even riskier yet.

Phoenix

73

Well, hubby thinks PLB is a lost cause for getting this one replaced and the mattress company WOULD try to order a new one, but who knows when or if we’d ever get one. Such a problem since we really liked the Beautiful.

At this point, since we have a free exchange on both PLB, I don’t think we have a choice. I went and tried a Simmons Black Kate Plush locally… it’s only been on the floor two weeks and felt much firmer (not as soft) as the Beautiful + 2" PLB topper, but the sales person said it had not broken in yet. At least the comfort rating is the same as the PLB and all the other mattresses we’ve tried over the last 4 month! Probably like comparing apples to oranges spring -vs- foams, but it is what it is.

Hubby said looks like we should take the Blacks… see how long they last - year or two or so and at that time, maybe there will be more options out there… more latex mattresses to choose from, etc.

Are any of these retailers you have contact with actually receiving mattresses from PLB? If there was any hope we might get a replacement in the next few weeks, I’d hold out for PLB, but otherwise, we can’t go without a decent place to sleep much longer. :frowning:

74

Hi scubamom,

It may be worthwhile talking with some of the online PLB dealers that are listed in post #32 here to see if they are having the same issues with their PLB deliveries.

Phoenix

75

We had the damaged PLB Beautiful mattress and defective foundations picked up by the mattress company yesterday. Their mouths dropped open when they saw the poor saggy mattress, still with a hill in the middle and “hammocks” on each side. We all agreed that somehow the centers (from top to bottom) had compressed into firm “valleys” of latex, whereas the “hill” was the only part that remained springy (I’ve been sleeping in the center for the last two weeks… the only place that felt half comfortable).

They also couldn’t believe there was no solid top on the foundations! The fabric was so saggy between the slats that it’s little wonder the mattress was bent out of shape permanently. Too bad it took us a month to figure it all out but the damage was probably done by the 2nd or 3rd week we had it, even though it felt wonderful for the first 5-6 weeks.

They said that they were selling off all the PLB floor models since they are still having no luck reaching anyone to take orders, discuss business with, or talk to about any problems. The few times they manged to get through, call backs were promised and it never happened. Or “the person they needed to talk to was out of the office”. They have given up and had no interest even trying to reorder the Beautiful or even try to file a claim.

Which left us with the Simmons Black Kate. :frowning: It has so much puff and fluff on the top that it is an unbelievable 16" of hulking monster!! Comfort rating 8+ (the same as the Beautiful with our 2" PLB topper). Alas, we loved our latex while it lasted and now have to get used to a spring bed again.

First off, I woke up at 2 am bathed in memory foam fumes! UGH! I still smell like memory foam 12 hours later. Took everything off the bed, put in an air filter machine and turned the ceiling fan to high all day. Washed all the bedding. It’s not quite as strong tonight, but I know I’m going to be sleeping in fumes again for awhile. (unless I move back upstairs yet again for several nights).

And once again, I’m sleeping HOT! The PLB mattress was not hot and not cold, just perfect. Sigh.

Maybe next week I’ll try to contact all those companies in your post who carry PLB and see what the chances are of getting another Beautiful anytime soon.

We still have one Beautiful at our second home… so will have to decide whether to change it to a off gassing spring Simmons… or search for another Beautiful and this Black can go to the guest room.

Or if all else fails, maybe we can build a Beautiful. Has anyone actually “built” a mattress that feels like one of the PLBs?

76

Hi scubamom,

Hmmm … while I realize that PLB has their issues at the moment … something in this isn’t adding up to me and I suspect that there may be more to what they are telling you than meets the eye.

I think this would be a good idea … and if I was in your shoes I would also email PLB (and hopefully they will reply) to tell them your story and ask them about what you have been told.

Phoenix

77

Hi Scubamom,

I forgot to answer one of your questions … sorry :slight_smile:

Yes … there have been a number of members that have done this. Since the specs of the Beautiful are known … if you buy latex layers that are the same type (blended Talalay from Latex International) and thickness and firmness level (ILD) as the Beautiful and stack them inside a similar stretch knit cover you would have a close equivalent (with the main difference being that the layers wouldn’t be glued and that the cover would be slightly different). The component post here has some of the better sources for layers and components (including covers) that I’m aware of.

Phoenix

78

Ok. I filled out an inquiry form on the PLB website detailing our problems and included the foundation tag info.

Also emailed mattress to go and received a reply and quote back from Jeff with good price on beautiful. 3 to 4 week delivery. White glove service. (Always wondered who locally does that!).

Probably call a few others on your list. What do you recommend?

Meanwhile the second night on Simmons mattress from hell off gassed me again. Knocked out my back and makes me want to sleep on floor! Or even a bed of nails would be better than Simmons. :frowning:

79

Hi scubamom,

Other than Jeff at Matt-To-Go … I don’t have any specific recommendations. The list came from members comments that have had good experiences with each of them.

I’m sure curious about any response you receive from PLB!

Phoenix

80

Late Friday, I received an email from PLB that said:
[i]Dear Lynn,

Thank you for your inquiry. One of our team members will contact you shortly. Below is the details of your inquiry![/i]

It being a holiday, not sure when I might hear from them, but probably need to call the mattress company and tell them to hold on to the Beautiful and foundations just in case we “might” be able to do a warranty.

Meanwhile I was all ready to call Jeff at Mattress to Go and place an order for another Beautiful. Now I don’t know what to do other than I SURE don’t want to sleep on this Simmons any longer than we have to! :slight_smile:

Hey, at least there might be light at the end of tunnel… costly, but this whole thing has been one big ordeal after another!