Hi there - Long time reader, first time poster. For months now I’ve done my due diligence (mostly by reading Phoenix’s posts) in finding a replacement for my 9 year old Beautyrest innerspring. My wife and I are back/side sleepers and have slept on firmer mattresses for over 15 years now. Normal BMIs without any major back or joint pain.
I live in Los Angeles so am fortunate enough to be near showrooms for some of the online-direct mattress makers. The Nest Bedding store is about a mile away from me. I test-slept all their mattresses and really liked their Smart House (formerly Honest) Cool Sleeper firm model. It’s foam but doesn’t have the sinking feeling as much. Sensation is somewhere between traditional foam and bouncy latex IMO.
But being on this site so much, I"m starting to give serious consideration on taking a flyer on Brooklyn Bedding’s BME. It’s half the cost of the Cool Sleeper and I really like the bounciness of latex. I’ve seen the BME compared to the Love Bed because of similar price, but no comparisons to the Cool Sleeper. Is anyone familiar with both? I know they are different materials, but interested in how it compares in terms of firmness. I contacted Brooklyn Bedding on chat and they said the Cool Sleeper firm corresponds to BME’s medium… Sounds iffy to me because from what I’ve gathered BME medium firmness is roughly that of Casper’s, which I didn’t like when I tried in Venice. I get the same canned responses whenever I’m on chat, and it seems like nobody can give me an accurate response except Mario, whom I haven’t gotten a hold of.
The other mattress I like is Brentwood Home’s Solano, which is latex too, but I have questions about their build quality. The fabric doesn’t seem that durable. I visited their Showroom, which is by appt only, and the product specialist/tour guide wasn’t all that knowledgeable. If BME firm can give me a similar feel I may opt for that.
The Smart House line are all-foam mattresses, featuring a 7” 2 lb. polyfoam base, followed by 2.5” of 3 lb. polyfoam, above which is 2.5” of 4 lb. convoluted memory foam, and quilted to the top is a 2” wool layer. There would be no obvious weak links for someone in a normal BMI range, but I would be cautious of the upper 4 lb. layer of convoluted memory foam layer for those of a higher BMI.
The Brooklyn Bedding Best Mattress Ever (BME) uses 2" of blended Talalay latex over a 2" synthetic Dunlop latex transition layer for a total of 4" of premium foam materials in the comfort and transition layers. These are on top of a 6" 2.0 lb density polyfoam support core. The cotton cover is quilted with a thin (less than an inch) layer of polyfoam to provide a softer “surface” feel so the mattress finishes at about 11". With the quality of the comfort materials and the support core this mattress would be suitable for any weight range.
Trying to compare the BME with the Cool Sleeper is a bit of a difficult exercise, as you’re comparing two very different products – in essence a memory foam mattress to a latex mattress, both using a polyfoam cores. You’d certainly have a bit more of a buoyant comfort on the BME, but with the “secondary” layer of Dunlop latex it won’t be as “bouncy” as a total of 4” of Talalay latex. The Cool Sleeper certainly will have a less resilient (bouncy) surface comfort as compared to the BME and would be “firmed up” a bit with the wool on top.
The only way for you to tell how they compare in “firmness” would be through your own personal testing. But in general you’ll feel a bit more “on” a latex product and you’ll feel a bit more “in” when trying out a memory foam product.
Again, trying to compare different mattresses with different componentry with different characteristics is a difficult thing to do at a distance. At least you’ve had a chance to try a few of these products. Comparing the Casper to the BME and trying to relate firmnesses is again problematic, not only because this is a subjective comparison, but also because these products are very different in design, with the Casper using a synthetic Dunlop latex on top with memory foam and polyfoam beneath. I wouldn’t call the BME responses “canned”, as they are very familiar with other models like the Cool Sleeper and they’ll honestly try to give you a best approximation, but with different componentry in the upper layers (the layers that make the most difference in surface comfort) this is difficult to do. It’s not exactly an apples and oranges type of comparison – maybe apples and pears? :lol:
There is more information in post #9 here about the different ways that one mattress can “match” or “approximate” another one. Every layer and component in a mattress (including the cover and any quilting materials) will affect the feel and performance of every other layer and component and the mattress “as a whole” so unless you are able to find another mattress that uses exactly the same type of materials, components, cover and quilting, layer thicknesses, layer firmnesses, and overall design (which would be very unlikely) then there really isn’t a reliable way to match one mattress to another one in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP based on the specifications of the mattresses (even assuming that you can find out all the specifications you would need for both mattresses you are comparing in the first place).
Mattress manufacturers generally try to differentiate their mattress from the mattresses made by other manufacturers and don’t normally try to “match” another mattress that is made by a different manufacturer so unless a manufacturer specifically says in their description of a mattress that one of their mattresses in the same general category is specifically designed to “match” or “approximate” another one in terms of firmness or “feel” and PPP and/or they are very familiar with both mattresses and can provide reliable guidance about how they compare based on the “averages” of a larger group of people that have compared them (different people may have very different opinions about how two mattresses compare) … the only reliable way to know for certain how two mattresses would compare for you in terms of how they “feel” or in terms of firmness or PPP (regardless of anyone else’s opinions of how they compare which may be different from your own) would be based on your own careful testing or actual sleeping experience on both of them.
As you stated you’ve been reading through the advice presented on the site so you may have already read this, but just for the benefit of others who will peruse through this thread…nobody can speak to how any specific mattress will “feel” for someone else or whether it will be a good “match” in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances and you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress but outside of PPP (which is the most important part of “value”), the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or how a mattress feels in a showroom (or in a hotel) or when it is relatively new so again I would always make sure that you find out theinformation listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the quality/durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.
With that being said, maybe there have been members on the site who have owned both of these mattresses in the firmnesses you describe and they might be able to help you narrow down your options.
My suggestion to you would be a phone call (not a chat) to BME and discuss with them what you’ve tried and also the style of feel that you prefer/are looking for. A phone call will result in a much better transfer of information than the chat function. A good online manufacturer/retailer will have your best interests at heart, and will be the most knowledgeable about their products (matching sleeping styles, body types and preferences) and how they compare to any others that you’ve been sampling, and they also have the benefit of the “averages” of other customers they’ve assisted who are similar to you. Additionally, you can also check at that time for any return/exchange policies should your purchase potentially not turn out as you’d expected.
If you decide to make a purchase from one of them, both Brooklyn Bedding and Nest Bedding are members of this site which means that I think very highly of both of them and that I believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency. I certainly wouldn’t hesitate to purchase a mattress from either of them.
I’m interested to learn about your progress and what information you find as you go through your decision making process.
Thanks, Phoenix, for the detailed response. I will try to call in and talk to a live person. I said that the responses I got were canned because I chatted with two different people on different days to ask them to compare the firmness of the Casper to their medium. I did this to see if the were any inconsistencies with their responses. There were not because I got the same answer verbatim both times with boilerplate about how they compare with Casper and T&N. Seems like I really need to talk to Mario.
I’ve also read some Yelp reviews and saw a YouTube video complaining about their return process. Hoping these are outliers. If I decide on BME I would sincerely try to make it work. Any quirks I should be aware about their return process?
A phone call is always your best choice for details and more specific answers. You are correct that with the online chat people answering thousands of questions a day, they will have prepared responses to certain questions (I even have a few of those! :whistle: ) but it doesn’t mean that the information is any less accurate. Even with that being said, following up with a phone call is always your best option and I think you’re on the right track with that thought.
The Brooklyn Bedding return process is very simple. You must have it for at least two weeks and you have up to 120-night to request a return. They send a truck to pick it up if you don’t like it – you don’t even have to pre-compress it. If you’re concerned about returning the item, I’d keep the plastic that it comes in to help cover the item once it is picked up for a return. I would agree that the “reviews” you’ve run across are “outliers” and certainly not indicative of the reputation of Brooklyn Bedding, their customer service or the experience of the vast majority of members here on the site.