Hi fridadc,
Thanks for the clarification from Urban Mattress on those specs versus their web site - I appreciate it. While the 2" of 3 lb of memory foam is lower density than what I would normally advise, I hope that this is the one that provides the relief you’re seeking!
Phoenix
Hi Phoenix:
Happy New Year!
Unfortunately, I think I might not have resolved my issues finding a new mattress. While the mattress I got from Urban Mattress is much comfortable for my lower back and hips, I am experiencing other issues. I have been sleeping on the new mattress consistently for 2 weeks (long story short, I didn’t get the new mattress until much recently and with the holidays I didn’t get to sleep on it until I came back from vacation), and I have been experiencing shoulder, neck and arm pain on my right side (I am a side sleeper and I tend to sleep on that side). I am using the same pillow I had in the past, which caused me no pain at all. I am at a bit of a loss now because I am not sure what to do. Even when I sleep on my left side, the pain on the right is awful. I was barely able to sleep last night. I ended up taking my pillow and sleeping more comfortably in the couch.
Urban Mattress won’t exchange a mattress until you have been sleeping on it for 30 days. So I will continue to sleep on it until that time period is up to make sure this is not an adjustment to the mattress issue. But if I cannot get the pain to go away, I will likely exchange it, which will leave me looking for another mattress with them (they won’t issue refunds, just exchanges).
I have one the Uptown mattress from them and it’s probably the softest they have. I don’t like the feel of latex and I am quite sensitive to the fumes of the memory foam (the Uptown has a layer of memory foam but it’s located at the bottom between the coils and the polyfoam layers so it doesn’t bother me). I tried one of their memory foam mattresses while I was there (https://urbanmattress.com/product/taos-plush-memory-foam-mattress/) and my alignment was off.
My alignment with the new mattress is great so I am not sure what else I would need in order for me to get rid of this awful pain on my right shoulder and arm. Any suggestions?
Thank you in advance for your help.
FridaDC
Hi fridadc.
I‘m sorry you’re having some trouble with your shoulder/neck adjusting to your new mattress but I am glad that as far as your alignment the mattress it is working well. Unfortunately I can’t pinpoint or diagnose via an online forum the reasons that you might be experiencing this pain, but I can make some general comments about things to look into or adjustments may be helpful to ease shoulder pressure for side sleepers in the hope that they are useful to you.
First off, I’d make sure that you reevaluate your pillow in combination with your new mattress to make sure that it is providing a decent alignment to keep your cervical/upper thoracic region in a relatively neutral arrangement. Especially with the body adjustments that come with a new mattress the old pillow might have an improper thickness which is a common cause for shoulder issues. Using a body pillow can be a good thing and resting your free arm upon that can be helpful. Placing a pillow behind you to slightly lean against can also take a bit of stress off of your shoulder joint area.
Next, you may wish to reevaluate how you are sleeping upon your side and the location of your arms, as this can also make a large difference in shoulder pain, regardless of mattress types. While on your side, fold your arms across your chest (like what is commonly depicted on an Egyptian sarcophagus). So if sleeping upon your right side, your right arm would be crossed over your chest, with the elbow pointing down toward your waist area and your hand closer to your left shoulder. Doing so adbucts your shoulder girdle and takes some of the pressure off of your shoulder joint. Also, consider placing a thicker pillow in front of you and place your free arm (in his case, the left arm) a top this pillow to help support it in a more neutral position and take pressure off of both shoulders.
Some extra surface plushness by adding a topper can be an option. Since you don’t like the feel of either latex or Memory Foam that leaves you with just the option of a upper layer of polyfoam or natural or synthetic fibers or materials like down.
There is more information about choosing a topper and a link to the better online sources I’m aware of in post #2 hereand the topper guidelines it links to which along with a conversation with a reliable and knowledgeable supplier (that can provide you with good information about how their toppers compare to each other or to other toppers they are familiar with that are available on the market) can help you use your sleeping experience as a reference point and guideline to help you choose the type, thickness, and firmness for a topper that has the least possible risk and the best chance for success. A good exchange/return policy can also reduce the risk of an online topper purchase so I would make sure you are comfortable with the options you have available after a purchase just in case the topper you choose doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for.
The links contained in post #11 here provide quite a bit of good information about looking into possible reasons for should joint pain.
There is also more information in post #2 here that talks about the various symptoms that people may experience on a mattress and some of the reasons that can cause them that can help with the detective work or trial and error that may be necessary to identify the types of changes that may be helpful.
Shoulder and arm issues can come from many sources, such as a mattress that is too firm and puts direct pressure on the shoulders, the shoulder blades, or on the back muscles and can also cause soreness or numbness and tingling in the arms. It can often come from postural issues. If the mattress is too firm, then if you sleep on your side your shoulders may not sink in enough to relieve pressure and your upper body can “twist” away from the pressure so your upper body is “twisted” more forward while the lower body is still on its side. This spinal twisting or torsion can twist the spine in the upper body and lead to soreness in the area of the twist. There is some much more detailed information, including some sleeping postural tips, on shoulder and arm issues in posts #2 and #3 here .
Shoulder issues can also come from sleeping in the same position for a longer period of time than normal. If you are sleeping deeper/longer on your new mattress, you may be repositioning less often, and this could be causing your shoulder issues, as you may be staying in the same position longer than your body is used to. I can’t speak to why you’re suddenly experiencing a different sensation. Usually when that happens it points to something changing in your flexibility, strength or fatigue. A new mattress will soften slightly as it breaks in, but there wouldn’t be as much of this with latex as there would be with polyfoam, and you’ve stated that your alignment is still good (which sleep ergonomic research would prioritize over surface plushness).
Phoenix
This was a very helpful thread. Phoenix, I have no idea how you keep up!
I am hoping it is ok to post here since my situation is similar.
I am in the same boat as the OP and having very bad lower back pain after purchasing a new mattress. I have been to my Chiropractor a couple times just to make sure I am in good alignment before I send the mattress back. Unfortunately, I am still having lower back pain and am hardly getting any sleep because I toss and turn all night. I think at this point it must be the mattress.
A little background:
Me: 5’6", 128 lbs, broad shoulders with smaller waist and hips, side sleeper only
My mattress: Nolah Full size mattress. 1st layer: 2″ Nolah Air Foam
2nd layer: 1″ Aveena Foam
3rd layer: 7″ Foundational Support Core Foam
Time I have been sleeping on mattress: 6 weeks
I spent a lot of time researching mattresses (and reading the articles on this board), and thought this mattress would be a good fit. I had a Costco Novaform memory foam mattress with a gel topper prior, and wanted to get something that still had a memory foam feel, but slept cooler, and didn’t have as much of a quick sand feel. The Nolah mattress fit the bill, and is also supposed to offer great pressure relief from side sleeping (I always have problems with shoulder pain because of my wide shoulders if a mattress is too firm). After speaking with the company, I went ahead and pulled the trigger because of the good return policy.
I never really slept that well on this mattress from the get go, and was constantly waking up, tossing and turning. I didn’t feel any pressure points at first, but now I am starting to notice a little shoulder pain. I am wondering if it could be the top foam layer softening that is changing the feel?
The new problem I am having is a dull, lower back pain that doesn’t go away by changing positions. As soon as I get out of bed the pain starts going away, so I am thinking this mattress just isn’t right for me and must be causing some kind of alignment issue. I tried sleeping with several different height pillows, as well as a full length body pillow, and am finding that nothing helps.
I am kind of unsure about which mattress to try next. From what I have read, lower back pain can be related to a mattress that is too soft? The fact that I am starting to feel some pressure on my shoulder makes me think that this may not be the case though…so confusing!
In a perfect world, I would be able to purchase a mattress that would have adjustable layers so that I could customize it for perfect feel and support. I don’t have a very large budget and could only spend up to $750 for a Full size mattress.
I am looking at the Layla mattress (I think I would like to stick with memory foam) and like the fact that it has a soft side and a firm side. So if one doesn’t work, you can flip it over and try the other side. It is also budget friendly. I am also looking at the DreamFoam Ultimate Dreams Supreme 12" Gel Memory Foam Mattress. Nectar mattress have a great price point and return policy, but I am worried that the materials may not hold up as well as some of the more expensive mattresses.
I know you can’t recommend a perfect mattress from just talking with someone online, but any direction regarding firmness you could give based on my symptoms and size would be appreciated. It is very overwhelming with all the mattress choices available. Also, if you know of any memory foam mattresses within my budget that have interchangeable layers, please do tell. Thanks for taking the time to answer my long post.
Hi AnnaP,
Just wanted to ask: how long have you been sleeping on the mattress? Oftentimes people can underestimate the impact of switching from one mattress to another: it’s a big deal. Your body needs time to adjust - at least a few weeks. If you’ve given it enough time, then it could definitely be your mattress.
With respect to the mattress being too soft and causing back pain: there is a delicate balance to be achieved here: If it’s too firm then you’ll have soreness at pressure points on your shoulders and/or hips; If it’s too soft then spinal alignment will suffer. We’ve found that a soft top on a medium firm core is best for sleepers with lots of contour (usually side sleepers with wide shoulders and/or hips): it gives you that nice 1-2" padding, but doesn’t let your spine “hammock” in the bed. You could try a medium-firm memory foam mattress with a soft non-memory-foam topper, or consider the Novosbed Medium with Comfort+.
Hope this is helpful for you.
Novosbed
Sam,
I have been sleeping on the mattress for almost 7 weeks now.
Last night I woke up with again from low back pain and couldn’t fall back asleep. I put a very thin pillow under my hips and it allowed me to fall asleep again. From this experiment, I am guessing that the mattress is too soft and my spine is falling out of alignment?
I have decided that I want to go back to a memory foam mattress at this point. Your mattress looks very nice. The only thing I am worried about is that a 5 lb memory foam may feel too firm. You do say that I could use a topper to help though. Can I ask what type of topper you recommend? It says non foam in your post. Why not use a thinner memory foam topper?
Also, sorry if I missed this on your website, but what is comfort+, and how does that work? Thank you so much for your help.
Hi Annap!
Happy to answer that. The 5lb memory foam is certainly high-density but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s extra firm. Most mattresses use cheap memory foam that doesn’t contour to your body properly (and like you mentioned, you’ll just sink into your mattress). The Novosbed medium firmness with a soft Comfort+ kit seems like the perfect option for you. The Comfort+ topper I recommended is a 2 inch polyfoam layer that integrates right under the top cover of the mattress. I’m biased, but it’s a heavenly feel when it contours to your body.
Any other questions, just let me know!
Sam
Hi Sam,
I am really considering one of your mattresses after looking at them more. Seems like they are made from high quality materials. I am wondering though, if the soft version might be a better fit for me because of my weight? I am a little nervous the medium might be too firm. Can I ask why you think the medium would be a better fit?
If it has to do with my guess that my mattress is too soft, I think that may not be the case after all. After really thinking about the symptoms I am having with my current mattress, I am leaning towards the mattress being too firm for me. I think maybe I am just not getting enough cushion and am going through the “comfort layers”, which are only 3" in total. I assume this can cause lower back issues as well. I have been experiencing pain between my shoulder blades too, and I think that may have to do more with a bed too firm, rather than too soft? I pretty much wake up in pain everyday, so obviously, something isn’t right.
Sorry about all the questions, I am definitely a princess and the pea type, so I really want to make sure I am buying the best possible bed for my body type and sleeping position.
Also, would it be better to speak with you directly on this topic? Thanks!
Ok, a little more info…While I was out today I happened to drive by a bed store that sold Tempurpedics. I went in and tried several different models. The one I felt most comfortable laying on was the Cloud Elite. I also liked the Cloud Supreme Breeze (they didn’t have the regular model), but felt slightly more pressure on my shoulder, which could be a problem. I thought the Supreme Breeze has more of that squishy memory foam feel (that I like) than the Elite did.
I do see that your Soft mattress does somewhat compare to the Cloud Elite. The only thing I question is that I would receive enough support from this mattress. From the info I have gathered on this site, I was under the impression that it is best to get a mattress with 4, or better yet 5 pound memory foam. The first layer of the Soft mattress appears to be 3.7 pounds. If I were to choose the Soft, do you feel it would offer enough support long term, based on my weight?
If I went with your original recommendation of the Medium, and most likely added the Comfort + topper, do you think that would approximate a similar feel to the Cloud Elite too?
Thanks again for your help, and I look forward to your reply.
Hi AnnaP,
Glad you had a chance to test out some mattresses. To address your questions:
“Squishiness”: This will vary from one mattress to another based on formulation (i.e. the proportion of chemicals used to make the foam), and is generally a result of the “viscosity” response from the foam. Softer “visco-elastic” foams (memory foams) can be squishier because the “elastic” component of the foam (the component that determines “static” firmness) does not resist motion as much as in firmer foams, and you are therefore feeling more of the “viscosity” component of the response when you first lie down on a softer “visco-elastic” foam - this is “Squishiness”. The Novosbed Soft is more “Squishy” than the Novosbed Medium, but I would err on starting firmer and going softer (with Comfort+) if you need to.
“Support”: This is largely determined by the layers underneath the comfort foam. The Novosbed Soft uses slightly softer foams throughout and is… well… soft 
In your case I would still recommend the medium, and then a Soft Comfort+ if it is not perfect. The Comfort+ will add some non-memory-foam between you and the mattress, which will provide the contouring softening that I believe you are looking for, without removing the visco response beneath. It is a really great feel.
“Density”: This is one of the most common questions we receive. Our observations have shown that foams (from good fabricators) with densities as low as 2.5 lb/cuft can perform very well over time: this is what we use in our Douglas Mattress in Canada. They are less expensive and offer customers still a great product, but at a lower price point. High Density foams (like those used in Novosbed) offer a comfort more akin to the “traditional” memory foam feel, that cannot be achieved using lower density foams. They are super durable, but are more expensive. This really boils down to personal preference.
I cannot comment on mattresses from our competitors but can say, as above, that I believe the Novosbed Medium, potentially with Comfort+ (which you can decide to use at your convenience between days 30 and 120 of your sleep trial), would be a great fit.
Hope this helps,
Sam
Novosbed
Hi Phoenix
Thank you for your suggestions. Sorry, I didn’t give you an update for a while, life happened. But have put together a summary of what I have done so far in terms of all the mattresses and some thoughts. I noticed that you have a new section to ask the experts so I wasn’t sure if I should post there or if I should continue to post here. What would you suggest?
Thanks
Rosa
Hi fridadc.
I am glad to hear that you have updates and perhaps some more insights!
Our new section “Talk to the Experts” is still in development, but the “Ask An Expert” part of it is fully functional. Note that in in the near future, we will be adding more Experts and areas of expertise to cover more topics of interest, but for now can chose to start a new topic and seek a different angle from one of our experts, or you can continue in the old thread, although this would be a little difficult to reference it with the other posters in the thread.
Either way, I or any of our Expert Members will be happy to assist you.
Phoenix
Hi Phoenix:
I went ahead and posted under the Talk to the Experts forum. I figured it would be easier since I have so much information here and it’s hard to keep going back to the info.
Thank you so much for your help.
FridaDC
Hi Phoenix
Question: Could a mattress be too soft and cause pain? I’m still aligned properly in the mattress but sleeping on my back causes pain in my abdomen (my core). I posted on the Talk to the Experts and Jeff commented something I suspected. The more the comfort layers I add, the more issues I have.
Thanks in advance
FridaDC
Hi fridadc.
In a nutshell, anything is possible… there are people with different health conditions such as fibromyalgia that have a high level of sensitivity that can lead to discomfort and pain on just about any surface no matter how soft. In your case, as you mention that your alignment is good, then your pain seems to be more position related and depending on your preferences and sensitiveness, finding the right combination of materials and construction is relative and very subjective and it is as much an art as a science. It also is a bit unusual to experience abdominal pain when lying on your back unless you have some preexisting conditions that would surface when you are in this posture…if anything, normally the plushness and sinking a little deeper when you are on your back, would generally relax the abdominal muscles. As Jeff pointed out you may need to find out if the pain is not radiating or “triggered” from somewhere else within your body and some detective work may be necessary for you to identify the source of any pain or discomfort before you make a purchase.
Generally, there are different types of firmness and softness that different people may be sensitive to that can affect how they experience a mattress which are included in post #15 here.
I know that I pointed to some of these readings but, just in case I’ll list again some of the forum posts that talk about fine-tuning a mattress that may help you recognize or “diagnose” the underlying cause of different types of “symptoms”, pain, or discomfort that may be connected to a mattress.
[indent] Post #2 (this is the primary reference post for different “symptoms” that people may experience when they sleep on a mattress)
Post #45 (this is particularly worth reading as well)
Post #2
Post #6
Post #6
Post #4
Post #7
Post #7
Post #18 [/indent]
If all else is checks out good, then if I had to guess based on your comment that the problem seems to be limited to your back sleeping then I would say that the comfort layer is a little too thick (or too soft for back sleeping)
I am glad that you reached out to Jeff (our expert here) as he knows much more about sleep ergonomics, than most of the people I know (including myself) and I would follow his suggestions and keep away from adding more comfort layers but experiment instead with some combinations of materials in a mattress manufacturing facility and use the advice of the manufacturer themselves. There is not much more that either I or Jeff could add to this unless you gather some more data points to add to the picture.
Phoenix
Hi Phoenix
Thank you for your reply.
I read the suggested posts (some I had read in the past but it was good to read them).
I’ve gone back to the original configuration of the mattress (no toppers, original cervical pillow I have used in the past in old and new mattresses as well as in the couch). My shoulder and arm hurt, a lot. I tried changing the pillow, and there’s not a lot of relief (don’t judge, I got desperate and picked up the ‘My Pillow’ after I watched the commercial one night I couldn’t sleep; it’s actually felt super comfortable when I used it to sleep on my couch one night I couldn’t take the pain any longer).
I was trying to sleep on my back because I was trying to give my shoulders some relief from sleeping on my side. The thing about sleeping on my back is that is hard for me to determine if I am out of alignment in the morning, the pain doesn’t occur right away, it takes a few hours after I sleep in that same position. I live alone so I can’t have someone check my alignment but I when I wake up, I feel like I’m sinking in too deep in the mattress. So perhaps my alignment is off after a few hours. There’s lower back pain as well, which makes me believe I’m out of alignment. Or maybe I’m just not comfortable with all the plushness of all the layers (the mattress it self has microcoils, memory foam and regular foam on top of the innerspring).
So sleeping on my back or on my side is not working for me on this mattress. I’ve had been trying it for 8 weeks with several additional comfort layers and without, with 5 different pillows (foam, shredded foam, etc) and nothing is working.
So I’m probably going to start from the beginning. I am stuck with Urban Mattress because I can only exchange, and while I have been only been sleeping on the mattress for 8 weeks, I’ve had it for close to 90 days (holidays and traveling prevented me from sleeping on the mattress at the beginning for the first 3-4weeks), so I need to make the exchange soon. I will talk to them and see if they can at least pick up this mattress and then hold off to order a new one until I do more research before I make a decision on what I need to get for the exchange.
I do think I need less comfort layers, like Jeff said, the more layers I add, the worst it is for me.
Thanks again for all your help.
Hi fridadc,
I am sorry to hear about the lack of relief that you seem to be having on the Urban Mattress.
I wasn’t aware that you have lower back pain as well as abdominal pain, but either way I tend to agree with you that lower back pains, especially in the morning (or in your case a few hours later) are an indication of poor alignment and generally come from a mattress that has upper layers that are too thick and soft and/or support layers which are too soft which can allow the pelvis to sink down too far relative to the rest of the body. This tilts the pelvis which changes the natural curve of the Lumbar spine and can lead to lower back issues, however, this would not explain the abdominal pains you are experiencing when lying on your back. A mattress that is too soft can also allow the hips to sink down too far which flexes the hip joints out of their neutral position which can also lead to joint soreness or back soreness if the muscles are working to keep the back and hips in alignment. I am not sure from the site description if the Highland has any latex on top of the microcoils but you won’t “sink in” more as the night goes on as these materials stay the same and don’t have a viscous nature like memory foam where the accumulated body heat would make it softer and would cause you to sink in more. If it the comfort Memory Foam layer is too thick due to its viscous nature would cause you to sink in more over the course of the night and throw you out of alignment.
I would definitely “get in touch” with your body and trust what it’s telling you over other people’s rough assessment of whether you are properly alignment or not, which would not help much in any case as they are not trained orthopedic physicians. You tried all combinations to understand that this is not working for you and I would avoid the tendency to overanalyze this any further and as you are running out of time I would make the call to UD as planned and see if they have other suggestions for you in terms of the next exchange that they offer.
Phoenix
Phoenix
Yeah, I think my alignment is off in the morning with this mattress. I currently have The Uptown which has the microcoils and the memory foam as well as two layers of quilt foam. I think it’s about a 7.5 inches of comfort layers on top of the innerspring support. While I don’t weight much, I agree with Jeff, the softer the mattress, the more discomfort I’m experiencing. The one mattress I tried before deciding on the Uptown, was the Highland, with the innerspring support (I think the coil count was higher than the Uptown), but I liked it and my alignment was good. I agree with you that the memory foam in the Uptown (which is 2 inches and it’s located between the microcoils and the regular foam) might be causing me to sink more as the night progresses. There was another option that UM had available but the store didn’t carry that mattress and I am hesitant to order without trying in person. So I will likely go with the highland which has innerspring and regular foam, this is a combination that worked for me in the past. If additional comfort layers are needed, that would be easier to add. But I want to be conservative with that too, for now.
I’ll update you as soon as I figure things out.
Thank you so much for your help.
FridaDC
Hi fridadc.
Thanks for the update.
I agree that for someone as petite as you are 7.5’ of plushness is not likely to be appropriate for your alignment needs.
I am glad that UM is working to help you and I hope that they have a good option that will work for you.
Keep us posted
Phoenix