Could someone recomend a Talalay mattress configuration for me (220 lbs) and my wife (190 lbs). I have tried the Pure Bliss Beautiful and it was comfortable, but I am afraid of the top layer becomming indented with an ILD of 19. Any advice would be appreciated.
Sam
Hi Samoman,
Unfortunately there is no formula and there are far too many variables and differences between people to use height and weight information to build a mattress based on specs alone out of the thousands of different combinations that are available. Outside of your own personal testing, it’s always best to speak directly with each manufacturer or retailer you are considering because they have much more detailed knowledge about the mattresses and designs they make or sell and which ones are the best “fit” on average for each type of person based on their own customer base and feedback. In other words different manufacturers or retailers may have different designs and components that can change the ILD recommendations and layering from one to another.
While the most “accurate” way to choose a mattress is with local testing, particularly if you are working with an “expert” than can help and guide you, there are also some generic guidelines for body type here and for sleeping positions here and how different types of layering can effect both of these here that can give you some ideas and insights into the different influences and factors involved in a mattress design. These are only meant as general information though and not as anything that would be specific to any particular person because of the different needs and preferences and variables between people.
Latex is more durable than other types of foam even in softer ILD’s but of course the softness of a material contributes to its durability as well (softer compresses more and is subject to more mechanical stresses). The Nutrition has a top layer of 27 ILD (19 ILD underneath) if you wanted to test a PLB mattress with a firmer layer on top.
Even in 19 ILD latex though … my bigger concern would be PPP (Pressure relief, Posture and alignment, and Personal preferences) and concerns about the comfort layer being too soft and/or thick would override my concerns about durability even though it’s true that firmer would tend to be more durable than softer.
In other words … If I had tested a mattress that used 19 ILD Talalay in the comfort layer and it was perfect for my needs and preferences (and I had tested more objectively and specifically for PPP rather than just “comfort”) then I wouldn’t hesitate to use it although if I had another choice that was just as suitable that used slightly firmer layers I would choose the one that was slightly firmer.
Phoenix
Phoenix:
Thank you for such a quick response. You provide such a valuable service to all of us looking to be more knowledgeable about such an important purchase. In the Sacramento area we have a couple of “latex matress” stores, but it seems like 20 or 30 minutes trying out a mattress doesn’t give the whole story. I talked with Sleep EZ and he recommended a mattress made up of Talalay using a 44 ILD bottom, a 40 ILD next layer, then a 30 ILD, and another 30 ILD. The Beautiful Pure Latex Bliss is made up of a 50 ILD bottom, 6 inches of 36 ILD, 2 inches of 24 ILD and 3 inches of 19 ILD. The contact at Sleep EZ felt with our weight the 19 ILD and 24 ILD would start to sag and indent after a couple of years. While we both tried the Pure Bliss line, and we both seemed to like the Beautiful, but that was for the very short trial period. Any thoughts to help with the decision?
Hi Samoman,
I agree with this but this is partly because of the thickness of the comfort layers combined with the softness. The odds are that with 5" of soft latex and with your weight that you would have a significant risk of alignment issues and any durability issues would be secondary although of course still important. An inch or two of 19 ILD latex would be one thing but 5" of 19 and 24 is another thing completely both in terms of durability and alignment.
You can actually use local testing as a good indicator if it is done more objectively. The Beautiful has probably been one of the most commonly mentioned mattresses here where people (particularly heavier) tested it in the store for a more subjective sense of “comfort” rather than more objectively and chose the softest cushiest mattress that was the most “aha” experience in the showroom. When they slept on it at home though … it ended up creating back issues because the comfort layers are so thick and soft so long before durability would even be an issue they were already feeling pain or discomfort.
While pressure relief wouldn’t be an issue with a mattress that had comfort layers this thick and soft … there are some guidelines for testing pressure relief here. More importantly, there are some guidelines for testing for alignment here and in post #11 here (which is more difficult because you typically feel the effects of poor alignment when you wake up in the morning and not when you go to bed at night).
If you are working with an online manufacturer … I would take their suggestions very seriously because they have years of experience with customers with every body type and sleeping position. Their suggestions and the results of your local testing can usually get to a very good design for you and you still have flexibility to make adjustments with re-arranging or exchanging layers.if that is an option It would be beneficial though if you could test some firmer latex locally to see how it feels to you.
Phoenix
Thank you Phoenix. I will continue the search…
I’m at 220-ish and 6’1". We went with SleepEZ and did the medium over soft config. based on our liking of the PLB Nutrition. Soft is just too sinky. i mean think about it how many mattresses used to be super soft? Not many. The trend in this country is to bigger, heavier people and softer matresses. Both are going the wrong way.
Try a Nutrition or a savvy rest and try a med-soft-firm config or even med-med firm or med-soft-med.
I’m on med-soft-ex firm-firm and am planning to swap the firm and ex firm layers around to soften just a bit.
Now I am more confused. I did a profile at Custom Sleep Design, and talked with Bob, and the design of his bed for me is very different from the design at SleepEz. The only part of the bed that is the same is the bottom 6 inch layer of both beds with an ILD of 40. Custom Sleep Design has the head of the mattress at 2" of 14 ILD over 3" of 19 ILD and Sleep EZ has the two top 3" layers at a 30 ILD. How can two experts be so far apart?
Hi Samoan,
These are two very different types of mattresses and I would not try to “translate” one into the other. If you order one I would go by the suggestions of that manufacturer and if you order the other I wold go by their suggestion as well. Both offer layer exchanges except the Custom Sleep Design has exchanges for the zones as well.
Trying to become a “mattress designer” and figure out the theory behind both based on specs without a personal reference point based on testing (and this would be difficult with the zoning of the CSD mattress) is not a good idea and as you are finding out will do more to confuse than anything else.
This really is an apples to oranges comparison with two completely different designs and two different design goals and philosophies behind them. If anything I would compare the lower section ILD’s not the upper section ILD’s but this would also be fairly misleading. One is more standardized with single ILD layers and one is customized and zoned to your weight and individual measurements.
Both would make great choices but they would also be very different.
Phoenix
Thank you Phoenix.
Great info, I’m 6’3’’ 235ish and this helps my research!