Inquiry Latex pure bliss

Hi mike7,

I would be careful passing this kind of advice on to others because while I understand that for some reason this is what you believe … it’s also not accurate as our previous conversation has already indicated.

It’s true though that it may not be something that someone wants to do or would even be worthwhile for some people but it is certainly possible …especially with Talalay latex.

Phoenix

There isnt one post claiming the PLB can be duplicated (now you claim its possible?). In fact it uses a gel type top layer, next based on the actual information given at the store the talalay is blended with a certain percentage of other natural items that other stores online dont use. And as per your posts thickness as well as IDL matter. Not once have you detailed any other store that uses the exact numbers nor materials. As my post above indicates the difference between the numbers in The PLB models is very small. Most posts in here trying to duplicate dont even come close to the PLB. I wouldn’t want anyone paying money for something without understanding the truth. Again you want to protect your members that pay that is very clear. I would never want anyone to make a purchase based on false information as the example Ive used where the person was told a mattress could be duplicated and it wasnt by the same company that told me the same thing.
The feel of a mattress may be subjective I agree, and it could be that coming close to another mattress is possible and acceptable and some may be okay with that but some wont be and you should understand that this is a lot of money to pay. This is why trying the mattress is important. Its the price that makes everyone seek online buying. Again most non paying members here are seeking advice and it should be non biased and honest. My response was exactly that.
thank you )

Mike7,

Your frustrations are very understandable to me. I have been researching and trying to make a decision on a latex mattress for months now. The mattress business is the worst, right? I do understand how brick and mortar stores with showrooms do not want to divulge their specific ILD’s, but they also can mislead customers about their latex information. I’m also trying to duplicate the feel of a mattress that I liked at a showroom but it is so difficult to interpret ILD’s of various companies. I have placed an order with Foam Sweet Foam,(Labor Day Sale) but have it on hold until I figure out the firmness that I want. They are trying to help me decide, but it is crazy with all these ILD’s for Talalay and Dunlop and blended Talalay and foreign and American latex manufactures, covers, protectors, etc… so many variables. I guess this forum has helped educate me, but it hasn’t helped me decide on my layers! I dread getting my mattress, not liking the feel, and repacking and sending a layer back for an exchange. It’s such a crap shoot. I realize that I’m trying to save money by purchasing online, but why aren’t there any mid-range priced latex mattresses in brick and mortar stores, all high end. Just venting, sorry about you experiences here.

Diane

Diane,
The Foam Sweet Foam website looks good…Which mattress did you select?
Jeff

Hi Jeff,

The mattress I bought is a 9" queen 100% Talalay, 3 layers of 3". I think Scott from F.S.F. has been very helpful and accommodating.
Like I said, I’m still unsure of what layers to choose. Right now, I’m leaning towards 22ILD top, 28ILD middle, and 36ILD bottom.(SOFT< MED> FIRM) Scott says that each piece is labeled specifically as to what the ILD is in 5 or 6 different spots. He will try to find the layers I request or at least very close to it. (On sale this mattress was $1699)

Diane

Hi Diane37,

Post #2 here has more about how to decide on layers but in essence it comes down to your own personal experience based on either testing a mattress in person or on buying a mattress that uses the knowledge and experience of an online source and fits the “averages” for your body type and sleeping positions and has the ability to make adjustments if you are outside the “averages” of other people.

It takes many years of experience to be able to predict what someone else will “feel” on a mattress based on specs and even then there is no certainty … only “best efforts” … until someone has actually slept on it so you will always be dependent on either your own testing or on your experience sleeping on a mattress you’ve purchased online in which case the ability to make adjustments or exchange the layers if you haven’t tested it in person would be an important part of your personal value equation and “risk assessment”. There is no way to avoid this reality.

Trying to predict how a mattress “feels” based on specs alone is an exercise in frustration and will generally end up leading to “information overload” or “paralysis by analysis” with no meaningful frame of reference.

Latex is a more costly material than other types of foam and there is no getting around this but there are also many smaller manufacturers across the country that sell latex mattresses locally that are good quality and good value and if one of these is local to you then you can have the best of both worlds and test the specific latex designs they have available for PPP and have better value as well. For those that don’t have better value latex mattresses available locally then more costly options such as the PLB or a choice that has more risk such an online retailer or manufacturer that still allows for fine tuning or layer exchanges after a purchase (and which will end up working well for the large majority of people) may be the “best” value option available for that person.

I know from your previous posts that you’ve had the chance to test Savvy Rest in Dunlop so you would have a good sense of what that type of mattress “feels” like. I scanned your past posts but I’m not sure where you are (unless I missed it) so if you let me know the city or zip where you are I’d be happy to let you know of any other sources of latex mattresses (possibly including Talalay) that may be within reasonable driving distance so you can have a better frame of reference for your choice.

Phoenix

Diane thanks for the response. My local PLB dealer will match the mattressexpert price including no tax. I originally thought the Beautiful model was best until I went back and noticed my spine felt a little strange. They had a testing mattress with a computer that is able to check pressure points and determined that I needed the more firmer model the nutrition. That one has a softer layer in the middle and firmer on top. My point regarding this forum was that sometimes the responses contradict each other.
The PLB uses a 6" core and other sizes for the top 4" 3" and 2". It also has the active fusion gel layer for temperature relief. And it uses a thin stretch knit cover. This is blended talalay and the blend from my understanding is PLBs own with natural products. I think these all go into determining the feel of a mattress which is why I think it will be hard to duplicate exactly and why it made me more wary of companies like the one I mentioned above that said it could duplicate it.
I dont understand why anyone would try so hard to get the right feel with layers of latex and then use a wool cover and mattress pad that takes away from the feel of latex. That was another confusing point. I understand that changing layers may seem like a great idea and that pricing is also an incentive but after researching I feel more comfortable with a thicker core layer and not moving layers around. One dealer told me moving layers can eventually cause tearing of some of the latex where little pieces come off. I was happy with being able to try the mattress at the showroom and the one I chose seemed like it was right for me. Im going back to the store again to make sure.
The other confusing issue was this notion of ILD —who labels them as such the dealer? If most get their latex from one source how do they order it? It seems simple but the posts seems to indicatt each brand has a different definition for soft firm and med. The more confused I got the more I thought something isnt making sense logically. Ordering online sounds great until I thought bout having to exchange a bed or return one and how to repackage something or figure what to do without a bed after I returned it. I most likely will go with my local store PLB as they will deliver set it up and take the old mattress. PLB has a great warranty as well I guess Im paying a little more than trying to duplicate it online but in the end I know what Im getting. All the best to you

I do stand by post that I dont believe the PLB can be duplicated exactly unless the exact materials were used and so far not one company has made that claim.
But maybe there will be a company that can get the exact materials

I also wamted to say that the store I went to had every PLB model and at the foot of each one was the materials used and the ILDs of each.
thank you)

I want to point out that I called every PLB internet dealer on this site. I priced the Worlds Best Bed. Shipped directly from factory.

www.cgmattress.com/mattress/pure-latexbliss/world-s-best-bed/

This above site is BY FAR the least expensive place. BY far. I got the “World’s Best Bed” for what I felt was an awesome price.

I am so excited to get this mattress.

I becomes tired of looking to duplicate the PLB mattresses. I thought it was going to be price prohibitive, but it was not. This site helped me realize that Latex was the answer for us and I am grateful. Its why I made a donation to the site. This is a great resource.

Honestly, if you find the precise duplicated mattress how much are you expecting to save? Isnt the PLB company owned by the largest latest companies in the US? I understand you will pay a premium for the name, but I cannot see there is enough savings to find a local manufacturer who can get close. I think I am going to prefer the real thing :slight_smile:

Hi Mike7,

Exactly … now you are “getting it”.

All the materials in the PLB can be ordered separately in the same thickness and in the same ILD as is used in the PLB mattresses. PLB doesn’t use anything in their mattresses that can’t be purchased separately. If you add a cover that is functionally the same you will have a duplicate mattress.

Other than that … each difference in layering or design can either add to the differences between two mattresses or offset each other so you could have a mattress that was a good approximation in terms of PPP for many or even most people (but not all people) that used a similar or sometimes quite different combination of layers.

The reason is that some people much prefer a mattress that has a quilting layer of wool or other materials in the mattress vs a mattress where you sleep directly on the latex. They just don’t like the “feel” or resilience of bare latex as much as the “feel” of latex that has some kind of quilting material above it. In addition to this the wool can replace the fire barrier that would otherwise need to be used. You can see an example in this thread from earlier today of someone who likes the OMI Lago Nouveau which uses a cover that is quilted with thicker layers of wool and is incredibly “comfortable” for them and they didn’t like the springiness of some of the other latex mattresses they tried. One of my favorite latex mattresses was the OMI Terra which also has thicker layers of wool in the quilting.

These are also listed on the forum here (at least for “version 3” of the PLB mattresses.

If you go to the Latex International site here you can see all the different types of latex they have available and post #4 here has sources for all of these in any thickness that someone may wish.

Phoenix

Hi odrunr,

Thanks for the tip. I’ve added them to the previous list of retailers here that can ship the PLB mattresses across the country.

As you know … the PLB mattresses can be very good value depending on where you buy them. As you also mentioned … PLB is owned by Latex International which makes much of the Talalay latex used in mattresses sold in North America (the other major Talalay latex manufacturer is Radium).

There are many local manufacturers around the country who sell latex mattresses that have some great value but in most cases they will be a different design from PLB. Whether their designs are “better or worse” for each person is up to each person to decide … but the actual materials are the same. Latex International is also well aware that it’s not a good idea to compete too strongly with their main source of income which is the manufacturers (large and small) that use their latex in their own mattresses or they would just replace LI with other suppliers and they would lose much more business than they gained from their PLB sales so the mattresses sold by local manufacturers across the country are often less than PLB even though the designs may be different. Some good research such as you did can also uncover some very good sources for PLB as well in spite of their MAP pricing (minimum advertised pricing).

Most importantly though … congratulations on your new mattress … I think you made a great choice :slight_smile:

Thanks too for all your feedback and the donation … I appreciate both of them!

Phoenix

Now Im getting it? Its not my posts that seem to contradict themselves.

Now you are suggesting DIY mattress is possible by ordering the separate layers and only then can you achieve the PLB clone Yet in other posts you dont recommend doing so. But please can you list the places where one can purchase the exact layers as PLB including the active fusion layer and cover.

If Latex International lists its ILD and most companies use thier Latex why are their ILD’s different

Is Radium in another country? If so does their latex get sprayed with pesticides when entering America?

If one uses a wool or quilted cover wouldnt that negate the active fusion cover and layers effects?

What is the best Mattress cover that wouldnt create a tightening of the latex

Hi mike7,

Post #4 here has a list of sources where you can purchase any of the latex materials in the PLB mattresses. for the cover you would need to buy a similar stretch knit cover because PLB doesn’t sell their cover separately as far as I know (although you could call and ask them).

I don’t usually recommend a DIY mattress where you buy all the layers separately for the reasons that are mentioned in the posts you are referring to. You seen to like “fault finding” and argumentative posts but it would be very helpful if you read the posts you refer to a little more carefully before you keep making comments that need to be corrected.

I’m not sure what you’re referring to here … what is different from the LI site. There are many companies that use Radium as well.

Radium is in Holland. No … their latex doesn’t get sprayed (see post #2 here). That’s only necessary when wooden pallets are used and it wouldn’t make sense for a supplier to use them.

Affect yes … negate no. Just like a mattress protector or sheets won’t negate it. Wool also has a cooling effect on its own but if you wanted to come closer to the “feel” of a PLB with a DIY construction I wouldn’t use a wool quilted cover.

A stretch knit cover that is the right thickness for the layers you are using.

Phoenix

I just spoke with Ronnie at CGmattress. Great guy gave a great price and great service. They allow for a comfort exchange at least in California. May be worth talking to him about your site Phoenix
thanks

Also those sites you list do not have the exact PLB layers in fact I cant even find individual layers for sale on some. The amazon link claims the ild is 22-24 which most claim for plush----
PLB layers are 19 21 24 etc
I’m sorry you think Im being argumentative rather than looking at your posts as many do seeming to contradict yourself. I think things could be simplified but you dont see your posts confusing people. Just in these last few posts you do it again. But I’m not going to argue. I hope this exchange has helped people. You cant oppose DIY mattresses and then suggest you can only duplicate a mattress if you buy the individual layers offering links as you have.
Again if you have a site that sells the exact thickness and blended talalay with exact ILD let me know
Lastly the international latex site suggests side sleepers would do best with a hybrid why is that?

Hi mike7,

Thanks for the suggestion and I’ll definitely talk with him about the PLB mattresses he sells as soon as I have the chance. There is already a number of manufacturers who design and build their own mattresses that are still waiting to be listed as members here until some other background projects are closer to completion. CGmattress also sells mainly major brands and only the PLB is a line that I would consider there so they don’t really fit the profile of the members here because they wouldn’t be able to provide the quality specs of most of the mattresses they sell.

I’m certainly happy to include them in a forum list or point people in their direction for those who are looking for the PLB specifically (which is why I added them to the PLB list earlier) … but it’s not likely that they could become a member because most of the specs of the main lines they sell aren’t available and they only have the PLB line besides these.

Phoenix

mike7,
Glad to hear you used the mattressexpert’s PLB prices as a bargaining tool and was successful.

This has been posted on the forum before but I thought it was worth mentioning again. PLB’s mattresses also have a fire retardant layer on top of the latex layers. It’s Milliken’s Paladin FR barrier which is made from rayon and silica. I could not find any reference as to how thick this barrier is or if it would add or subtract to the feel of the mattress. You can find more info on it here on the forum using the Search function.

We use an inexpensive thin terry surface/polyurethane mattress protector for our PLB mattress. We have found that it does not affect the original feel of the mattress. More info on mattress protectors can be found on the forum using the Search function.

BobP

odrunr,
Would you post the price you paid for your PLB World’s Best Bed mattress, including shipping and tax (if any)? Did you also purchase the PLB matching foundation?
I was not aware that PLB will ship directly from their factory to a consumer. My PLB mattress was shipped from their factory/warehouse to the PLB retailer and then to me.

Thanks,
BobP