Latex: Does thickness matter?

Discussions General Mattresses Questions
1

Hi,

I am in the market for a new mattress and I was about to purchase a Simmons Legend from sleepys… when the bells went off in my head "come back down to earth… the salesman has you in a trance and just because you spent 15 minutes of his time it does not mean you owe him his commission!

My wife was proud of me and said if only you were so strong with the 3 gym memberships you signed up to in the past year…

Back to the topic at hand… I decided to go Latex and after doing research I think I have narrowed it down to 3 companies.

Sleep ez, Arizona Premium, and Flo beds.

With sleep easy I thought I would go with a Talalai 13000 although I not sure is that to thick or if thicker is more comfortable…?

Arizona Premium is the best price… although the salesman (not ken) was a bit pushy…

Flo beds is pretty much out of the equation unless someone makes a case for their product to be superior…

Here are a few questions:

  1. I am getting a full mattress… I’m 5’10 290 pounds (I’m heavy’ish :slight_smile: ) I dont want to feel like I am bottoming out so I figure thicker is better… or is "13 overkill?

  2. Arizona Premium say they work with 6" thick layer because the "3 inch layers shift… is that an issue?

  3. Arizona is 15% cheaper than sleep ez so are they the way to go?

  4. a person of my size would be better off with Talalai or dunlop?

Thank you very much for your help!

All the best,

Aron

2

Hi aron82e,

I think you are choosing between some great choices that use similar materials although there are certainly differences in the designs. Both SleepEz and mattresses.net are members of this site which means that I believe they are among the best quality/value in the country … and the extra 5% discount for your membership here doesn’t hurt either :slight_smile:

When you are choosing between good and good … then personal preferences and which one best matches your personal “value equation” both for the mattress itself and the options or benefits available from each merchant both before and after the sale. There is no “better or worse” in other words … only differences and preferences that may be more or less important to different people.

SleepEz has more options in terms of layering and ability to customize.

Mattresses.net is less expensive.

Other differences may include differences between their exchange or return options. In essence it will boil down to tradeoffs between all the objective, subjective, and intangible tradeoffs that are involved in any mattress purchase.

Flobeds is also great quality but for some people may not be in quite in the same value range as either of the other two for their single zoned mattresses so they may need need to be a compelling or specific reason that wasn’t offered by the other two in order to go in that direction (which could include their convoluted comfort layer or the differences in their exchange policy). Of course their zoning options for their vZone may be a compelling reason and if there was a difference that I considered important and justified the higher price or gave you more confidence that the mattress would be a better “fir” then I wouldn’t hesitate to go in this direction either in spite of the higher prices and they would also make a very good quality/value choice.

On to your specific questions …

You can read a bit more about the differences between thicker and thinner mattresses in post #14 here. If you also go here you will see someone that was heavier than you (and also preferred firmer mattresses) where SleepEz suggested a thinner model because in their case it would be fine (although others of a similar weight may choose or strongly prefer the thicker 13000). This is just to say that the overall thickness can depend on many things and there is no “rule” that would apply to all people so I would go with the recommendation of the manufacturers you are working with for their specific mattresses (which may be different from each other because of the differences in their design).

I haven’t seen this become an issue because latex is quite “sticky” and the layers tend not to shift over each other but if this were to happen over time it would be easy to open the cover and “wave” the layers back into place. Everything comes with pros and cons and the single core layer is a less complex design and the odds of shifting “in theory” would be lower but it also has fewer options to adjust the feel of the mattress and either exchange or re-arrange layers.

Again … when you are choosing among the best values in the country … the objective, subjective, and intangible differences differences between each that are most important to you and your own personal preferences would be the way to choose and I would avoid thinking in terms of “better/worse”) because both are great choices and it would be difficult to make a “mistake” with either.

This is also a matter of preference and each of them have their own different “feel” and compression curve. This article may be worth reading as well as post #7 here which may help you imagine how each may feel. Having said that …many heavier people may prefer Dunlop in the support layers because it has a higher compression modulus (which means it gets firmer faster with deeper compression and is more “supportive” in the same ILD as Talalay). You could also compensate for this by choosing firmer Talalay however. In the comfort layers … Talalay usually comes in softer versions and feels softer and more 'springy" than Dunlop (again assuming the same ILD) so this would depend on the surface feel you would prefer. The most reliable way to choose would be to personally test both of them and choose your favorite but in the absence of personal testing then the differences between them that you know about and your discussions with each manufacturer would be the best way to choose between them.

Phoenix

3

Phoenix

Thank you for the detailed response.

I read the links you provided and found them very helpful. I am leaning towards sleep ez and although arizona premium offered to make a thicker mattress I think I’m better off going with the company that makes thick standard as they have the track record on them.

I was wondering though what a company like sleep ez does with a return of a latex mat or exchange which from reading the forums seams quite normal… does that mean I could be getting a layer of latex that someone else used for a few weeks before deciding to go with a different feel?

Also if you could point me to where I could read people long term experience with their latex mattresses… to see how they hold up… sleep ez and the others.

Also is there somewhere to read many reviews on the sleep ez "13 to see what people think of it?

Thank you very much!

Aron

4

Hi aron82e,

They don’t re-use the layers themselves but there are other retailers they can sell them to who sell them as comfort exchanges or seconds.

I don’t keep track of the review sites for specific types or “ages” of reviews and there are unfortunately very few people who post reviews outside of their initial impressions or perhaps in rare cases a year or two later (which still says little about durability) but there should be some results on a google search if you can wade through the 99% that talk about their shorter term experience. The durability of their mattresses would be based on the materials anyway so any long term review or feedback about the same material would give you a good idea of the durability of all the manufacturers with similar mattresses who used it. Durability is always about the material rather than the manufacturer who uses it. There are a few examples of very old latex mattresses in this article. Perhaps the best source of “old” reviews would be the manufacturers’ sites themselves but of course many people would think that they were not “unbiased”.

There are a fair number of posts with feedback and reviews for the SleepEz 13" mattress on this forum and a forum search on “sleepez 13” (you can just click this) will probably bring most of them up along with comments and questions about them as well and a google search should also pull up others at other forums and sites that are older (such as “what’s the best mattress”).

Phoenix

5

Awesome!

I’ve learnt this forum in 2 hours what i’ve been searching for a week!

On the topic of latex and firmness… how do all latex mattress do with mattress “edge” support for sitting on the edge of the bed?

Thank you

6

Hi aron82e,

They will typically be softer and compress more with sitting than a mattress that doesn’t have a reinforced edge both because it is a single ILD layer and also because latex is very point elastic and can compress more without affecting the area around the compression. Sometimes people are surprised that it can compress as much as it does with sitting (depending on the ILD of the layers) but be so supportive with lying down but this is part of the nature of latex. For most people this is not an issue because latex gets firmer when it compresses more deeply (just takes some getting used to) and also because it doesn’t affect sleeping only sitting. In a few cases you may find a core that has firmer polyfoam around the edge but I don’t think this is the best idea because the polyfoam will soften more quickly than the latex and you would lose the benefits and have a less durable mattress in the long term. In some cases there are latex cores which use firmer latex on the outside either fabricated or with smaller pinholes on the edges.

It’s not usually an issue though although you may need to sit a little further back if you use your bed for sitting so that your weight isn’t quite so concentrated on the very edge. It’s probably not the best as a chair … but it’s great for sleeping :slight_smile:

Phoenix

7

Thank you… will be ordering on monday and will write a review when i receive it.

Does the 5% off negate the offer of pilloews that they include?

And does sleepez run sales… I read reviews where people quoted prices that are lower then what i’m seeing online… although those reviews were from 2011 and prices may have increased…

8

Hi aron82e,

No ,… the 5% is additional to the pillows.

I’ve never seen them have one and I doubt they ever would although they do have a “SleepEz special” on the site which is a special price and model (which is the only one that doesn’t have the 5% discount) but this is ongoing not a “sale”.

Latex prices have gone up several times since 2011 and the raw material increases have resulted in an increase in the price of their mattresses (along with other manufacturers as well).

Phoenix

9

As far as discount vs pillows, which company are you refering too? I recently ordered a latex mattress from Ken Hightower at mattress.net and was only given the choice of the two pillows or the 5%, not both. Just FYI, as I am fairly heavy, like the original poster, the recommendation from Ken, which I went with, was a 6" 100% natural dunlop split core (different firmness between my side and my wifes) with a one piece 3" blended talalay top layer, plus cover. Their standard is a 6"+2" but you can upgrade to the 3" top for a bit more. For those that aren’t aware, the Arizona Premium Co will use 100% natural dunlop, 100% natural talalay or blended synthetic talalay or whatever combination of any of these you would need or be willing to pay for. Incidentally, when I first called I couldn’t talk to Ken and ended up speaking with someone in the factory. The advice as to what to get was entirely different than what Ken himself recommended. Ken’s recommendation was a bit cheaper, btw. Bottom line is that even in the same company the advice can be very different, which would likely influence the final product. If the mattress I ordered, which is about 10" with the cover isn’t comfortable enough, I can add another 3" topper and still come out cheaper than 13" at sleepez.

I will make certain I post at least my initial impressions of the mattress when it gets here.

10

Hi kwinky,

I think he was referring to SleepEz … at least my answer was :slight_smile:

The 5% discount or bonus is usually over and above what someone would receive that wasn’t a member of the forum but of course the “package” that is included with any purchase will vary from manufacturer to manufacturer.

I’m looking forward to your feedback once the mattress arrives … and congratulations on your new mattress :slight_smile:

Phoenix