Looking for mattresses with HR Foam

Hi Phoenix, I have a few questions for you.

  1. Based on MU’s article on polyfoam support cores, you mention that HR Foam is the highest grade polyfoam. Can you link me to some mattresses with HR foam as their support core? I haven’t seen it anywhere. How long do you think an HR foam will last you in keeping it’s firmness/resiliency before breaking down?

  2. Am I correct when I say that HD polyfoam is estimated to last around 7-10 years (mileage may vary of course)?

  3. On another note, I am also looking for latex mattresses in the same price point as DreamFoam. Off the top of your head, which other companies should I consider that are similiar? I have poked around your membership list but I haven’t come across any in the same price point for latex upper layer yet. I know I won’t find an HR foam support core in this price point.

  4. You often recommend when buying online to have an honest thorough conversation with the company so they can best help you figure out what you need. How can one compare these mattresses if say Company A says that their mattress X would be the best mattress for you and Company B says that their mattress Y would be the best mattress for you? (I’m one of the ones that suffer from analysis paralysis as you can see :stuck_out_tongue: )

Thank you for your time and attention.

I’m reading more about progressive construction and came across this:

“This would allow the use of HD foam for example which has lower progressive resistance to be used in a budget mattress if it was used over a lower cost innerspring that was soft on top and also had higher progressive resistance (such as a softer bonnell innerspring) and still be comfortable … at least until one of them wore out.”

…and later this: " Because they have high degrees of many qualities, Latex, Pocket coils, Offset coils, and HR polyfoam are usually the best choices here and other types of support layers that are often used (Bonnell and continuous coils and HD polyfoam) are far less advisable."

Am I understanding correctly that HD foam alone would not be a good choice for a support core?

Hi seraphicsiren,

You may be making your search much too complex and technical than it needs to be.

I’m not sure what you’ve read since you found the site but just in case you haven’t read it yet … the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Assuming that the materials in a mattress you are considering are durable enough for your body type and meet the quality/durability guidelines here relative to your weight range … the choice between different types and combinations of materials and components or different types of mattresses are more of a preference and a budget choice than a “better/worse” choice (see this article). The best way to know which type of materials or which type of mattresses you tend to prefer in general terms will be based on your own testing and personal experience because different people can have very different preferences.

While knowing the specs that can affect the quality and durability of the layers and components in a mattress is always important … unless you have a great deal of knowledge and experience with different types of mattress materials and components and their specs and different layering combinations and mattress designs and how they combine together and can translate them into your own “real life” experience that can be unique to you (which would generally be a very small percentage of people) … I would tend to avoid using complex specifications to try and predict how a mattress will feel or perform for you. When you try and choose a mattress based on complex combinations of specs that you may not fully understand or only based on specs for single layers or components that may not be as relevant or meaningful as you believe it is then the most common outcome is “information overload” and “paralysis by analysis”. Even the best mattress designers in the industry are often surprised at what a mattress they design “should have felt like” based on the specs when they design it and what it “actually feels like” when they test out their new design.

I don’t keep a record of the individual mattresses or their specs and prices that the retailers and manufacturers in the hundreds of forum lists throughout the forum carry on their floor or have available online (it would be a bigger job than anyone could keep up with in a constantly changing market) but checking their websites (which often don’t include every mattress they carry) and making some preliminary phone calls to the retailers/manufacturers that are on the local lists is always a good idea before you decide on which retailers or manufacturers you wish to deal with anyway.

[quote]How long do you think an HR foam will last you in keeping it’s firmness/resiliency before breaking down?

  1. Am I correct when I say that HD polyfoam is estimated to last around 7-10 years (mileage may vary of course)?[/quote]

While there is no way to quantify how long any mattress will last for a specific person or predict exactly when you will decide to replace it because it is no longer suitable or comfortable for you (because this is the only real measure of durability or the useful life of a mattress that really matters) because there are too many unknowns and variables involved that are unique to each person … if a mattress is well inside a suitable comfort/support range and isn’t close to the edge of being too soft when it is new (see post #2 here) and you have confirmed that it meets the minimum quality/durability specs that are suggested in the guidelines here (which they all do) then it would be reasonable to expect a useful lifetime in the range of 7 - 10 years and with higher quality and more durable materials like latex or higher density memory foam or polyfoam (in the comfort layers especially) it would likely be in the higher end of the range or even longer and the chances that you would have additional “bonus time” would be higher as well.

Again, I don’t keep a list or record of the specs of individual mattresses or their prices but outside of any local options that may be available to you … posts #3 and #4 here include some of the better latex and latex hybrid mattresses I’m aware of that are in a lower budget range (although of course it’s not a complete list of everything that may fit your criteria in the industry).

The only way to know for certain whether any mattress will be a good “match” for you in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP will be based on your own personal experience so if you aren’t confident that an online mattress will be a good match for you then the return/refund policy would become a much more important part of the “value” of a mattress purchase so you can try out the mattress in your bedroom with little or no risk.

[quote]“This would allow the use of HD foam for example which has lower progressive resistance to be used in a budget mattress if it was used over a lower cost innerspring that was soft on top and also had higher progressive resistance (such as a softer bonnell innerspring) and still be comfortable … at least until one of them wore out.”

…and later this: " Because they have high degrees of many qualities, Latex, Pocket coils, Offset coils, and HR polyfoam are usually the best choices here and other types of support layers that are often used (Bonnell and continuous coils and HD polyfoam) are far less advisable."

Am I understanding correctly that HD foam alone would not be a good choice for a support core? [/quote]

HD polyfoam in a suitable density and in a mattress that has an overall design that is suitable for you can certainly make a suitable and durable support core and it’s used in many good quality/value mattresses in the industry.

In its simplest form choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers (either locally or online) that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in that are in a budget range you are comfortable with and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …

  1. Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.

  2. Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.

  3. Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Phoenix

Thank you for your response. After more research I’ve decided to go with DreamFoam. They have the best price for what I’m looking for. Now, I can’t decide between the 3" or the 6" talalay latex comfort layer. What are your thoughts Pheonix?

I already have an Ultimate Dreams mattress for my daughter in a #6 firmness (28 ILD talalay latex comfort layer). After laying on it for awhile, I felt pressure on my hip. I’m a side sleeper. Chuck tells me this means I could either go with a softer comfort layer #7 (24ILD) or perhaps the 6" latex as opposed to the 3" I originally opted for.

I would appreciate any feedback.

Hi seraphicsiren,

I’m assuming that one of the mattresses you are considering is the Dreamfoam Ultimate Dreams Aloe Alexis latex mattress which is the only mattress they carry that includes two 3" layers of latex but they also have two mattresses that contain a single 3" layer of latex which is the Dreamfoam Ultimate Dreams latex mattress (which I’m guessing is what you purchased for your daughter) and the Dreamfoam Ultimate Dreams Eurotop latex mattress so it would be helpful to know which of these two you were also considering.

Phoenix

Right. I’m considering the Eurotop and the Alexis.

I’m also toying with the idea of getting the Eurotop and adding a Sedona Sleep talalay mattress topper. It would be like an Alexis (6" of latex) but a bit cheaper. So to clarify, these are my options:

  1. Get the Eurotop in a 7. My husband is not keen on this option as he prefers firmer, but says it ultimately up to me. He can sleep almost anywhere.
  2. Get the Alexis in a 6.
  3. Get the Eurotop in a 6 and add a Sedona Sleep mattress topper in either the 28 ILD or the 19 ILD.

Okay, those are my options. Pick the winner for me Phoenix, you’re picking the mattress I’m sleeping on for the next 7 years. :wink: Kidding, sort of. Lol.

I’m a side sleeper and my husband is a stomach sleeper, We’re both average to overweight.

Hi seraphicsiren,

While I can certainly help with “how” to choose … It’s not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, or PPP or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).

When you can’t test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help “talk you through” the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and “feel” of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc) and the options they have available that may be the best “match” for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the “averages” of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about “matching” their specific mattress designs and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

If either you or your husband are in a higher weight range and/or are more sensitive to the deeper and firmer layers in a mattress you may “go through” a thinner top layer more than someone that is in a lighter weight range and you could feel more of the firmness of the base layer underneath it. In this scenario if a mattress feels too firm it could be because you are feeling more of the firmness of the base layer “through” the top layer and having an extra layer of latex on top of the firmer base layer would help to isolate you more from the firmness of the base layer.

On the other hand … if you are in a lighter weight range or you are a back or stomach sleeper then more of what you feel would be the top layer of a mattress and you would feel less of the deeper layers underneath it. In this scenario if a mattress is too firm then choosing a softer top layer would probably be a suitable choice although adding a second layer of latex could also be effective in this case as well.

There is also more information about the pros and cons of the Alexis vs the Eurotop in post #2 here as well.

If you were to purchase a latex topper (either from Sedona Sleep or from another source) and use it on top of the Eurotop then your mattress/topper combination would have a different “feel” from the Alexis (even if the latex was the same ILD as the top layer in either mattress) because you would be sleeping more directly on the latex in the topper rather than sleeping on a quilting layer on top of the latex. There is more about some of the pros and cons of a quilted cover vs a more stretchy knit cover (which are the two main types of covers that you will usually encounter) in post #12 here and the posts it links to.

A separate topper can also “act” a little more independently and “feel” a little softer outside a cover than it will by having the same layer inside the cover (see posts #3 and #4 here and the first page of posts in this topic).

Finally if you need to exchange the topper for a different firmness or you need to return the mattress and/or the mattress/topper combination if in spite of the best efforts of everyone involved your choices don’t turn out as well as you hoped for then the topper may have a different exchange or return policy which can also affect the options you have available after a purchase and any costs involved and the overall “value” of a mattress purchase.

All of the options you are considering would certainly be great quality/value choices.

Once you have narrowed down your options to a list of finalists that are all choices between “good and good” (which you have) and none of them have any lower quality materials or “weak links” in their design (which they don’t) and if at this point there are no clear winners between them (which is usually a good indication that you have done some good research) then you are in the fortunate position that any of them would likely be a suitable choice and post #2 here can help you make a final choice based on your own local testing and/or your more detailed phone conversations about each of them, the firmness and suitability of each one, their prices, your preferences for different types of materials and components, designs, or types and blends of latex, the options you have after a purchase to fine tune the mattress or exchange or return the mattress or individual layers and any costs involved, any additional extras that are part of each purchase, and on “informed best judgement” based on all the other objective, subjective, and intangible parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Phoenix

Thank you Phoenix. I know it must be annoying when people ask the same questions over and over again. The MU is always helpful in helping me decide what to buy. I appreciate your feedback and all that you do very much.

We’ve decided to go with the Alexis. This will be my 3rd mattress from DreamFoam, my first Alexis.

I’ve learned a lot about mattresses in this journey. Price doesn’t equal quality. Longevity is a must when it comes to big purchases like these. Name brands don’t necessarily mean anything.

I hope to update in a few months after it’s well broken in. :slight_smile: Rest well my friends!

Hi seraphicsiren,

I’m always happy to answer any questions that I can regardless of whether they may have been asked before … but I appreciate your kind comments.

Congratulations on your new mattress :slight_smile:

As you know I think you made a great quality/value choice with some good options to make some fine tuning adjustments if you need to.

I’m looking forward to your comments and feedback once you’ve received it and have had the chance to sleep on it for a bit.

Phoenix