Some people sink into memory foam and have trouble moving out of the impression. Is that what you are describing? If so, latex would be a very different experience, as it is resilient. Lew[/quote]
no. i’m unable to move them with the actual parts themslves, lol, i think the circulation is being cut off or soemthing, so i have to pick them up with my hands. or i have to move the upper body to drag the lower limbs. how &^%-ed up is that. lol.
Hi paisley,
Body parts falling asleep are usually an indication of too much pressure and poor circulation and nerve function in that area as well as “downstream” from the area.
It certainly seems to me that some additional pressure relief is a necessity for you and perhaps in the range of “a fair bit to a lot” may be most appropriate given your “symptoms”.
Phoenix
yeah. Could 3" latex do that for me? i’m just thinking if my 3" foam plus 1" latex can’t keep me from having to manually move my limbs out of place i’m a little nervous that 3" of latex would be much better. wondering if i won’t just end up where i am right now with my 3" foam. I know my foam is medium firm, but my more like 3/4" latex doubled over to 1.5", no matter what the ild, is a joke. it’s squishes down to a half an inch with very little pressure. i know it’s only half of three but if the 3 foam just barely gets me to sleep and keep my circulation from being cut off…ya know?
And either way, with my needing more pressure relief, would i be looking at more soft of a latex, or a firmer latex? If i go soft i can’t imagine i won’t be feeling the build of this mattress underneath me…and if i go firm latex, well. then i’m firm on extra firm, but i don’t know how it works anyway as far as pressure relief.
i know you can’t tell for sure, but i just have no idea which direction i’m supposed to go in in terms of soft latex and how much of it could alleviate the problem.
Hi paisley,
Based on “averages” certainly yes but each person may have a very different experience on the same material based on their body type, sleeping style, preferences, sensitivities, physiology, age, health conditions etc and on the type of mattress it is used on so there is no way to know for sure outside of “averages” unless you have tested a particular combination for yourself.
In your case you are also quite light so I would tend towards the softer ILD’s that are mentioned in the topper guidelines (19 ILD may be more suitable for you “on average” for example than it would for someone that was heavier).
Again … your conversations with each manufacturer you are considering that can take into account as much information as possible about you, your experiences, and about your mattress as possible and their experience with the materials they sell will also be very helpful.
There is no way to be certain how any topper will feel in combination with your mattress for you specifically until you have tried it in person so you are really going by averages and trying to choose the topper with the best odds of success. The return policy of the source you buy from may also be important if being able to change your choice after your purchase is also important to you so I would ask about that as well when you are talking to them although it’s less common for a merchant to offer returns on toppers which like pillows are usually (but not always) considered to be personal items and non returnable.
Phoenix
Thanks again. Just to put my mind at ease, or a little more understanding, why would (or how could i guess) a 3" latex do for me what a 3" foam could come nowhere near close to easing the pressure needed for me?
(for the record, i am a very healthy person in her 30’s, my only physical ailment was a disk jutting out in my neck years ago, went to phys therapy, etc, so i just use flat pillows so as not to mess with my neck, i don’t have circulatory probs, don’t smoke, all that. i am an active strong healthy adult, flexible, nothing wrong with my bones, hips, back, etc, etc. I swear the mattress is very very hard. of course, i have no personal padding.
Hi paisley,
Health factors are just one of many variables between people that can play a role in how a topper feels. There are many others and each person has a different physiology and body type, body shape, weight distribution, percentage of fat and muscle, and different sensitivities even if all are healthy. What is too much pressure for one person in a certain sleeping position may be fine for another. This is why personal experience is the ultimate test because it “cuts through” all the variables and it either works reasonably well or very well or it doesn’t.
As you can see in post #9 here and in post #8 here, memory foam responds to many different variables including temperature (body temperature as well as room temperature), humidity, pressure, and time of compression and there are also dozens if not hundreds of different types of memory foam that can feel and respond differently even if the density is the same. Because of all of this … memory foam can be a more tricky choice and this is also why the knowledge of the person you buy from can play a role in your success because the ones that are more knowledgeable about the type of memory foam they sell and how it may compare to others and their overall level of knowledge and experience can help you make better choices with higher odds of success. In other words … while the 4 lb memory foam you tried didn’t work as well as you hoped … another type of 4 lb memory foam may work well for you even though in durability terms they would be similar. There are also other factors that can make a difference (such as the layers that are either over or under the memory foam) which you can see in post #2 here.
Latex on the other hand is a more resilient material that responds primarily to pressure and has less variables that change how it feels and responds and has a more consistent response between different manufacturers if you are comparing the same type of latex with the same ILD to another. This makes it a little easier to predict.and compare when you are dealing with latex compared to memory foam.
Phoenix
k. thanks. off to do more research.
Also, any opinion on wool toppers? i remember really liking the denseness of my futon, but my limbs and hips didn’t go numb against it. i wonder if that wouldn’t be an option.
Hi paisley,
I personally like wool toppers and they can offer more point specific pressure point relief and great ventilation and temperature control as well along with good moisture resistance but they will tend to be firmer than a softer foam topper and they will get a little firmer yet as the wool compresses over time.
You can read more about wool toppers and some of the better options I’m aware of in post #3 here.
Phoenix
ooh, will do. thanks
Wow. that was really something.
I went to ABC home goods yesterday and they had a lot of beds from the OrganicPedic line. and they had some coil + latex from NaturePedic.
Very interesting experience. There was no 1 bed that was perfect for me in coil, coil + latex or all latex, but that’s to be expected, they didn’t have the entire range of the universe. I will go again though. I full fell asleep on the all latex Lago but in the end i just felt that tiny bit of pressure on my hip. But overall i think i could really like latex. The bed i liked the most was the Verde, which was already supposedly soft, but i only loved it when i put an extra latex topper on it. lol. That config became too tall so i did that again with another bed (a 7" medium/firm, then added a 2" medium topper, then the 3" wave soft topper, so in the end both set up i liked were a firmer base, medium next level then soft topper. (ah heck, something like that, i can’t even remember). Very surprising to me. But i still have body trauma from my current mattress, so who knows.
I was too late to get to TheCleanBedroom before they closed but on my way home i passed by a sleepys, might as well go in and look at my readily available coil options. So i did. I did the’ sleep to live’ diagnosis machine thing, they pegged me at SOFT! (just up to the border before it crosses over into medium or whatever the next section was). Maybe i’ve always hated soft beds because they weren’t pillow top and sink in? or maybe they’ve been cheap, no idea, doesn’t matter. I am wary though, and will be very wary of my alignment. I very much enjoyed my time on the Kingsdown Sleeping Beauty Gabrielle (plush eurotop type bed, tall, lots of stufff), but i believe they break down pretty quickly and i’m not paying $2K for a matty that is going to be dipping in 3 years. Just no way. Also enjoyed one of the lovely pillowtop S BR Recharge, and i would absolutely be quite happy falling asleep in it, although more so the BB Gabby, but again, it’s a lot money to see a dip in a few years.
And very importantly, i wanted to see would a 3" latex topper relieve me of my current situation (and if so what kind). I put ABC’s 3 inch ‘Wave’ topper over a semi firm mattress and it was very good, a big difference from being on just that mattress. Granted, the mattress was nowhere near as hard as mine, but it helped me get the gist. (later at sleepy’s i took sleepy’s 3" latex topper (Miracle Sleep) sample (they’re small, like crib sized) and 2" latex topper sample and put them over each other on the floor. yeah, no good. But since my mattress is somewhere btwn the firm mattress in ABC, and the floor, i feel like i might get relief from a 3" latex. I think it’s not gonna be easy though. Clearly even 2" + 3" of not even sure whether it was “soft” or “medium” on a floor was uncomfortable, but if i go to firm, then i’m right back where i started, so … dunno.
I’m going to head over to TCB on Wednesday. And i’ll head back to ABC as well to really get a handle on how i feel about a latex bed.
Course, now i also have to do a fair amount of thinking about the future. If there’s a fair chance i buy a latex bed to replace this one when i can afford it, that means almost figuring out the bed i want now so that i can find the right vendor to buy the topper from so i can deduct it from the final bed. So what i think i’ll do is actively start looking for the bed I want, whether it be latex, coil, or coil + latex (yuck to foam, no likey), and that will also determine what i buy right now for a topper, or maybe i just end up with a new bed, well, except i have no money, but you never know. :D.
Anyway, so that’s my tale for now. I look forward to seeing more beds on Wednesday.
Hi paisley,
It sounds to me like you are doing some good testing and it also appears to me that something in the range of 3" of “soft” latex appears to be close. If you can find out the type (Talalay or Dunlop and natural or a blend) and firmness of the latex toppers you tried it would also be helpful (although I believe the top layer on the Lage is N2 Talalay which is in the range of 20 - 25 ILD and the little bit of extra thickness and the convolution will make it “act” a little softer yet).
I wouldn’t use this as an indication of what you need because a 2" base “mattress” with a topper will be completely different than the same topper on an actual mattress because the thin topper doesn’t have the same thickness or the range of compression of a mattress does and really doesn’t represent how a mattress / topper combination would feel and perform. A thin topper will act completely differently from a mattress and will get firmer much faster.
Phoenix
So how about as it turns out my memory foam topper is just lame. lol. I went into a foam store today and asked about latex, see if they could even do something for me. I told the guy my issue, and that my 3" mrm foam at home wasn’t working, he looked perplexed. then he put a piece of memory foam on the hardest bed surface they had, said it was 4lb density, omg, world of difference (not exactly pleasant for me, but sooooo different than the pos i have at home). I’m back home right now and lying on my foam again it doubled over, and i can easily feel my bed though it, so i stick my hand under the foam while i’'m lying on it, sure enough my butt is 1/4 inch from the bed even with the 3" piece doubled over. lol. My foam is a cheap pos. (Well that AND it being 3 years old. Makes sense now).
Anyway, still figuring through things, but just had to share that, thought it was kinda funny. :P. I guess i’m not the princess and the pea after all.
Hi Paisley,
I think that’s good news and it sounds like the memory foam topper you originally bought probably wasn’t 4 lb memory foam and was likely a lower density. It’s not unusual in my experience for some of the overstock products to be misdescribed.
Now you know that a “real” 4 lb memory foam topper will likely be OK at least you are back to having some better options because both memory foam and latex would probably work for you in the right thickness and it would just be a matter of preference between them (and I’m guessing based on your descriptions that “a fair bit to a lot” is probably in the range which would mean 3").
Phoenix
Totally. And plus it was 3 years ago, so it makes sense it would be totally dead now. I mean, $130, so i guess it was fair enough. :D. i’m sure great foam wouldn’t, but this clearly wasn’t. :D. Got my $130 worth though, that’s for sure.
yeah, i’m gonna go with a 3" latex topper from BB and then get the Aloe Alex later after I know a latex bed is for me, i’ve laid down on several but it’s not easy for me to figure out whether it’s something for me.
ANYWAY…Trying to figure out what topper to get. 4 days ago i did a brief chat with BB online, the guy said get a 6 (which is a 24 i guess), then yesterday we had a brief chat before the chat shut down and and the same guy said get a 19. So i’m a little confused as to which to choose. The main thing is feeling less of the matty, so of course i’m nervous that the 19 will be a problem.
What might be your thoughts? knowing i can do a comfort exchange on my topper is good b/c i can just swap either the 24 for the 19 or the 19 for the 24 but still would love to get it right on try 1.
I’m have to phone them anyway and have a talk because i’m gonna ask about an Aloe Alex build for myself as wellwhich i’m guessing will either a HDFoam/28/24, or a HD foam 24/19. But i am going back to one more bed store to see how i feel about the very soft vs. firm beds in latex, that’ll help me get a better sense of what build might be better as far as comfort. I won’t get that until later, until i feel financially it’s easier. a day or 2 ago i was ready to charge a $2k Berkley Ergonomic latex mattress (very similar to BB Total Latex) b/c of the pain i was in. But as long as i can get some relief from my topper i might be able to hold off. Good thing the guy told me that Berkley bed would take 4 weeks to be delivered! lol.
Plus after I get my topper i’ll have a very good idea of what a latex bed would feel like rather than just trying a bunch of beds in the store. Anyway, thoughts on 19 vs. 24 and what i would feel though it? Gonna order tmrw, very excited. Hopeful.
Update: Found a post here on value coils, and value coils + latex brands, cool. So now i’m looking into Restopedic and Parklane as well. ay yi yi. :D. At least Restopedic is in CT. If I can find someone to give me a ride I can check out all the CT places! A Saatva is still on the table, but i’d rather have coil + latex if i’m gonna do any sort of coil. At this point i’m ready to buy a freakin’ plane ticket to AZ, lol.
Hi paisley,
I would normally suggest that if you have two choices that seem roughly equal that you choose the firmer of the two but you are very petite and light and while both 24 and 19 are in the “soft” range … I would probably lean towards the 19 unless you have a preference for something slightly firmer.
It may be on the table or even on your plate but before you “eat it” … I’d make sure you read this thread.
Phoenix
Oh Saatva is so gone. lol.
I was looking to see what people were writing about them online, the only thing you could find was them writing about themselves! lol. Not a good sign at all.
Thanks. 19 looks good. I deserve a 19 after all this dammit!
At least i think i’ve finally narrowed things down
Want to check out Restorpedic’s Nature’s Wonder for before eliminiating coil, if i can get a friend to drive me to CT, and if so i’ll stop by CSD. If I can’t even check it out, then it’s Alex Aloe/Total Latex/Sleep EZ 9000. : ). Something like that. Getting there.
I’d love to see the Petty Grove by Parklane, but alas, too far. Pretty to look at though.
Let me ask you this. And i know they are 2 dif. substances and that it’s not a perfect comparison, but the HD base of an Aloe, do you know if it is very similar to the firmness of an ILD 32 latex base? or softer/harder. I know they function slightly differently and create a different feeling or something, but just want to see if my support would be the same.
also, how fast does that foam wear out vs. a latex core? i know it’s not exact, but does it last more than 10 years?
Hi paisley,
I don’t know the ILD of the base layer in the Aloe but they could probably tell you.
In general though … the IFD of polyfoam will be firmer than the ILD of latex because one is measured on a sample that is only 4" where 25% compression is only 1" while most latex is measured on a 6" core where 25% compression is 1.5". There are many other variables as well as you can see in post #6 here or in post #4 here.
In other words … even if the ILD was measured the same way it would only be a meaningful comparison if you happened to sink into the layer by exactly 25% and there are more factors involved in how firm a foam feels or how it performs so ILD/IFD comparisons can be somewhat misleading.
There are many factors involved in the durability of a foam which you can read in post #4 here but there is no way to attach a number to any specific foam because it depends on so many things (including the person on the mattress). In most cases a foam doesn’t “wear out” or break down completely before the mattress is replaced because the gradual loss of comfort and support will gradually take you over the threshold and outside of the range that is suitable for you even though the foam may not be “worn out” and may be fine for someone else.
Having said all that … the support layers are not usually the weak link of a mattress and they will last much longer than the same materials in the upper layers so a good quality polyfoam base (such as the 2.17 lb polyfoam used in the Aloe Alexis) would normally last 10 years or more yes (again depending to some degree on the specifics and design of the mattress) … even though the layers above are subject to more stress and may soften or break down more quickly (which is why it’s a good idea to have a more durable foam like latex or other higher quality foams in the comfort layers)
Phoenix
K. Ordered my topper in ILD 19 from BB. Here’s hoping. : ).