We ended up choosing an all latex medium Spindle Mattress. It was comfortable in the store, but had a difficult time adjusting once home. My wife was pregnant at the time, so we didn’t rush to make a decision. Unfortunately almost a year later, our problems seem to be getting worse. Namely, uncomfortable side sleeping (too firm on shoulder, saggy by hips) and both of us are experiencing lower back pain.
I want to clarify that I do not think this is any way the fault of Spindle mattresses. Their service and customer focus is great - I think we must just not be “latex” people. The good news is that they refund a large portion of the purchase within a year if you provide proof of donating the mattress.
That brings me to today. We’re searching for a replacement mattress and I’m strongly leaning to avoiding any sort of specialty foam or “fancy” construction (Our best bed was a $800 innerspring Sealy Posturpedic bought at Jordan’s Furniture (northeast big chain). Given my complaints of the latex, is there anything in particular I should look for with an innerspring? To clarify, I’ve read the articles and know the importance of construction method and avoid low density foam. So I know what’s “best” (aka pocket coils, ~14 gauge coils, etc) but I don’t know what’s “best” for me. For instance, we went to Gardner mattress and didn’t like any of their mattresses (at all - way too firm). I do know I would like the following
1… Innerspring support layer
2. No memory foam or similar in the comfort layer
3. Motion isolation (so I don’t wake up my wife if I come to bed later)
4. Decent durability (thinking about 6 years is a good target)
5. Price - No more than $1200
6. Convenient shopping - we aren’t willing to buy online. Don’t mind haggling at retail stores, but it seems like the thought here is that those stores stock low quality mattresses that feel nice in the store but deteriorate.
So the avoid rambling further, Help! I need you guidance.
[quote]We ended up choosing an all latex medium Spindle Mattress. It was comfortable in the store, but had a difficult time adjusting once home. My wife was pregnant at the time, so we didn’t rush to make a decision. Unfortunately almost a year later, our problems seem to be getting worse. Namely, uncomfortable side sleeping (too firm on shoulder, saggy by hips) and both of us are experiencing lower back pain.
I want to clarify that I do not think this is any way the fault of Spindle mattresses. Their service and customer focus is great - I think we must just not be “latex” people. The good news is that they refund a large portion of the purchase within a year if you provide proof of donating the mattress.[/quote]
I’m sorry to hear that your mattress didn’t work out for you. You certainly made a great quality choice and their mattress has so many different layering configurations that are possible by rearranging the layers or adding or replacing a layer that it’s very unusual that one of their customers doesn’t find a combination that works out well. It also sounds like Spindle really went “above and beyond” in your case because while they do have a 365 day comfort adjustment … they don’t normally refund a mattress so it seems that they made an exception in your case. ADMIN NOTE:Removed 404 page link | Archived Footprint: Spindle Mattress
Assuming that the materials in a mattress you are considering are durable enough for your body type and meet the quality/durability guidelines here relative to your weight range … the choice between different types and combinations of materials and components or different types of mattresses are more of a preference and a budget choice than a “better/worse” choice (see this article). The most reliable way to know which types of materials or mattresses you tend to prefer in general will be based on your own careful testing or your own personal experience.
Based on some of your questions I’m not sure if you’ve read (or perhaps reread since you were last here) the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly help you know how and why to avoid the worst ones.
Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort” and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.
While I can’t speak to how any mattress will “feel” for someone else because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances … outside of PPP the most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label (or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new) so I would always make sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the quality/durability guidelines I linked to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.
While I can certainly help with “how” to choose … I don’t make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort” or PPP or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).
I’m not sure where you read that 14 gauge pocket coils were the “best” because it certainly isn’t the case. The “best” innerspring or pocket coil for you would be the one that is inside a mattress that you have confirmed is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP whatever it may be.
A mattress will tend to soften and break down from the top layers down and the innerspring in a mattress isn’t generally the weakest link in terms of durability and the useful life of the mattress although the type of innerspring can certainly make a difference in how it feels and performs. To the degree than an innerspring makes a difference in terms of durability … the most important factor in the durability of an innerspring would be the total amount of steel that it contains (assuming that it is tempered) which unfortunately isn’t a specification that you would normally be able to find out. There is more information about the different types of innersprings in this article and in post #10 here.
[quote]1… Innerspring support layer
2. No memory foam or similar in the comfort layer
3. Motion isolation (so I don’t wake up my wife if I come to bed later)
4. Decent durability (thinking about 6 years is a good target)
5. Price - No more than $1200
6. Convenient shopping - we aren’t willing to buy online. Don’t mind haggling at retail stores, but it seems like the thought here is that those stores stock low quality mattresses that feel nice in the store but deteriorate.
So the avoid rambling further, Help! I need you guidance. [/quote]
I don’t keep a record of the individual mattresses or their specs that the retailers and manufacturers in the hundreds of forum lists throughout the forum carry on their floor or have available online (it would be a bigger job than anyone could keep up with in a constantly changing market) but checking their websites and making some preliminary phone calls to the retailers/manufacturers that are on the local lists is always a good idea before you decide on which retailers or manufacturers you wish to deal with anyway. This will tell you which of them carry mattresses that would meet your specific criteria, are transparent about the materials in their mattresses, and that carry the type of mattresses that you are interested in that are also in the budget range you are comfortable with. Once you have checked their websites and/or talked with the ones that interest you then you will be in a much better position to decide on the ones that you are most interested in considering or visiting based on the results of your preliminary research and conversations.
I think you’ve read this already but the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in and around the Boston arrea (subject to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines I linked earlier in this reply) are listed in post #2 here.
I or some of the more knowledgeable members of the site can help you to narrow down your options, help you focus on better quality/value choices that are available to you either locally or online, help you identify any lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress, act as a fact check, answer many of the specific questions you may have along the way that don’t involve what you will “feel” on a mattress, and help with “how” to choose but only you can decide which specific mattress, manufacturer, or combination of materials is “best for you” regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or whether anyone else (including me) would have the same criteria or circumstances or would make the same choice.
In its simplest form choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …
Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.
Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.
Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.
Today we went to two stores to test mattresses. The larger retailer with $1500-3000 name-brand mattresses convinced me to stay away. 1.0-1.2lb density foam…
We went to a smaller direct store in the area (Boston Bed Company) and found one we liked (Error). Here’s the specs provided
Quilting: 2" Super Soft Tac and Jump Quilt
Build Up (comfort layer I assume): Convoluted Comfort Layer, Lofted Ther-a-pad
Unit (Support Layer?) : 660 14 Gauge High Profile Foam Encased Individually Encased Coil
Base: High Loft TheraPad
Border: Multi-Quilt border
I asked about the “Convoluted Comfort Layer” and was told it was equivelent to a 3lb density foam. Online I see this is “egg crate” material…which I only associate to what I put on my old college bed to make it halfway usable. Is this low quality material and/or a concern I should have. The mattress is only $700 (king) so I’m not looking for a 10+ year lifespan.
That’s good advice because 1 - 1.2 lb polyfoam is a low quality material and I would stay away from any mattress that includes more than “about an inch or so” of lower quality and less durable materials in the upper layers of the mattress.
Unfortunately the specs you listed don’t include the information I would need to make any meaningful comments about the quality or durability of the materials inside it.
If you can find out all the information listed in this article (including the type and thickness and density of all the foam layers) and post them on the forum listed in order from top to bottom or from bottom to top I’d be happy to make some comments about the quality and durability of the materials and let you know if there are any lower quality materials or weak links that would be a reason for concern in terns of the durability and useful life of the mattress.
You can read more about convoluted foam in post #2 here. Whether it is a low quality or higher quality material would depend on which type of foam it was but if it’s memory foam then it would be a lower quality material than I would be comfortable with and depending on its thickness and on whether there are any other lower quality materials it could certainly be a weak link in the mattress.
Although this can be a good strategy if you can test the mattress/topper combination in person before a purchase … you can see my comments about choosing a firmer mattress first with the intention of adding a topper later in post #2 here.
In most cases I would avoid this approach because of the uncertainty involved with two purchase choices instead of only one and choosing a topper that would be suitable in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your Personal preferences) for a specific person on a specific mattress can sometimes be almost as difficult as choosing a mattress that doesn’t need a topper in the first place. I would generally focus on choosing a mattress that is likely to be a suitable match without a topper (again unless you can test the combination in person or you are purchasing both online as a set and they both have a good return/exchange policy) and then use the option to add a topper as a “backup” strategy in case your choice doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for rather than a “primary” strategy.
It can also be more costly than just buying a mattress which includes the same materials as the topper as a layer inside the mattress itself and you would be avoiding the risk of having additional materials in your base mattress that you may not need or that may be lower quality foam (that can soften or break down more quickly) or that may be softer than what would be ideal for a transition layer under a softer topper. At the very least I would make sure that the topper has a good exchange or return policy so there would be less risk of buying a topper that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for in combination with your mattress. I would also make sure that you can find out all the specifics of the materials inside the base mattress so you can make sure it meets the quality/durability guidelines here and that there are no weak links in the mattress.
Having said that … if you do choose a suitable mattress/topper combination which turns out to be a good “match” for you in terms of PPP (and there are no lower quality materials or “weak links” in the mattress/topper combination then it would have the advantage of being able to replace just the topper without replacing the entire mattress if it softens or breaks down before the upper foam layers in the mattress (which is likely because a sleeping system will tend to soften or break down from the top layers down) or if your needs or preferences change over time and a topper can also help extend the useful life of a mattress underneath it as well.
Thanks so much for your quick and thorough reply! We found another mattress we liked at the same retailer (we have an infant and it’s difficult to drive to far to explore other options.
I was able to obtain some construction details and while I know there are a few areas of concern (lower density foams), I’m wondering if the fact that it’s a 2-sided mattress and the support layer seems relatively thin makes a difference. Keep in mind this is a $700 mattress and we’d be happy with a 5-year lifespan.
In order (and this is a 2-sided mattress)
Quilting: Tac and Jump’ blended quilt. 1" @ 1.2lbs density
Build up: Poly-Foam Comfort Topper. 1/2" @ 1.2lbs density
Insulator: Lofted Ther-a-pad support. 3/4" @ (density unavailable - claimed they don’t measure this because it’s a fiber pad and not foam)
Support: Pocketed 858 tri-zone coil unit (14 gauge, a bit firmer zone in the middle 3rd of the mattress
Insulator
Build=up
Quilting (all same as other side)
I saw in a few threads you recommend 1.5lb minimum density in 2-sided mattresses, but given we have fairly low lifespan expectations and that it’s only 1.5 inches of material (“about an inch or so”), I’m wondering if this is a reasonably exception. I’m 6’3 195 and my wife is 5’8 150. I’m also surpised that the comfort layer is only 2 1/4 inches…seems very thin. Not sure how best to confirm unless I call back and end up speaking with someone else.
The Therapad is most likely a polyester fiber layer that would also be subject to packing down and visible impressions more quickly than higher quality foam materials.
The quality/density guidelines are minimums and the layers in your mattress are lower quality/density materials that would be a more risky choice than I would be comfortable with and I would suggest avoiding it even if your durability expectations are only 5 years.