Need help making a final decision on mattress...


I’ve been looking for a mattress for quite some time, and this forum has been invaluable in helping to get me to this point. Some context and background…I live in Louisville, KY and I’m replacing a 15 pocketed coil mattress from a “Brand Name”. To be honest, it probably should have been retired 8 years ago, but, oh well. I’m in my 40s, 6ft and about 225 lbs. with broad shoulders. I’m primarily a side and stomach sleeper. and after months of research and try out, I think I’ve narrowed down my choices and looking for a final opinions before I lay down a credit card number and buy a bed.

There aren’t many options in town. but I narrowed it down to a local manufacturer, Bowles Mattress, and Denver Mattress in Ind.

I’ve tested these as best I could, keeping in mind the three “Ps,” but need some final opinions.

Bowles Mattress:


[li]Euro Style Pillowtop; No Flip Construction[/li]
[li]13 1/2" Mattress profile[/li]
[li]Your choice of 9" or 4" Premium Foundation[/li]
[li]Cool Max® Fabric quilted to 1 1/2" Foam;[/li]
[li]VLS Visco Lumbar Support[/li]
[li]3" Super Soft high-density foam pad[/li]
[li]704 Marshall “Zoned” “Pocketed” Foam Encased Coil w/ 3" x 6" High Density Firm Encasement Rails[/li][/ul]
Link to the Heiress page:


[li]No Flip Mattress[/li]
[li]12" Mattress profile[/li]
[li]Your choice of 9" or 4" Premium Foundation[/li]
[li]Euro-style Pillowtop construction with fabric quilted to 1 1/2" foam[/li]
[li]3" Super Soft high-density foam pad[/li]
[li]704 Marshall “Zoned” “Pocketed” Foam Encased Coil w/ 3" x 6" High Density Firm Encasement Rails[/li][/ul]

Cutaway of Lafayette:

Denver Mattress

Madison Plush–$749

15 Year Non-Prorated Warranty
Mattress Height:12"


  • Quilt Layers:
  • Double Knit Ticking
  • 1 1/2" 1.8lb Density Convoluted Foam
  • 1" BioFlex™ Soy Based Foam
  • Natural Rayon Fire Barrier
  • Comfort Layers:
  • 2 3/8" of 1.8lb Density Foam
  • 1 Flex-Net Insulator
  • Support System:
  • Coil Density: 567* Individually Wrapped, Foam Encased Coils(Queen Size)
  • 15 Gauge Tempered Steel

Link to Madison Plush:HERE

Any comments or feedback would be greatly appreciated.


Hi worldhaven,

I would need to have more information about both of the Bowles mattresses to make any meaningful comments about them or help you identify any potential weak links in the mattress. In particular I would need to know the thickness of any foam layers and the density of any memory foam or polyfoam and the type and blend of any latex in a mattress. Without this information there is really no way to make any meaningful comments or comparisons between mattresses.

The Madison Plush uses 1.8 lb polyfoam except for 1" of foam that doesn’t include the density but this is within the guidelines I normally use of "around an inch or so or less of unidentified foam) and would not have a significant effect on the durability or useful life of the mattress. The pocket coil or any innerspring or support layer is also a lower coil count and uses a higher gauge (thinner) wire and while an innerspring or any support system is not normally the “weak link” of a mattress (which is usually in the foam used in the comfort layers) because it’s a relatively low coil count and also a thinner wire (higher gauge) this could also have some effect on durability with your higher weight and I would also make sure you test this mattress very carefully and objectively because it could also be somewhat “risky” for you in terms of alignment.

Higher weights tend to need firmer support systems and firmer (and good quality) comfort materials as well.


Hi Phoenix,

Thanks for your reply… The only information I was able to dig up was the information listed in the attachments. I took a screen shot of the PDF of the cut aways and included them here.

Let me know if you can discern the information you need from the attachments. If not, I’m not sure where else I can get that info for you.

Many thanks!

Hi worldaven,

Both of these mattresses use 1.5" of soft quilting foam and then an additional 3" of 1.5 lb polyfoam (low/mid quality) for a total of 4.5" of lower density foam which would be a weak link in this mattress. Over a 15.5/15 gauge pocket coil this would be a “risky” choice in terms of durability in a one sided mattress for your weight IMO.


Hi Phoenix,

Thanks for the feedback…given what you said about “Higher weights tend to need firmer support systems and firmer (and good quality) comfort materials as well”. It looks like a may need to go firmer…

What do you think about the three options listed below? Their HD Series has a pretty good gauge coil.

The “Euro Style” comes with 2’ Talalay Latex, It feels firm and very close to what I’m used to, but it’s also $1088.

The X Firm II is very firm, I would need to get a mattress topper. The 3" latex topper at Brooklyn Bedding is $347, pushing the cost to over $1200.

The Sapphire is part of their “Bronze” series and feels ok. Clearly not the best of materials…Would need to get a mattress topper, but the total would come out to be between $1000-$1100.

Any additional thoughts or advice would be much appreciated!

My challenge is I have a restrictive budget. Ideally, I would like it to keep it below $1000, but I don’t want to pay $749 for a Denver Mattress and not be able to sleep properly…Ugh. This is tough.


Hi worldaven,

The options you linked in your last post would be more suitable and more durable IMO than the options you listed previously.

All of them include .75" of quilting polyfoam which by itself would be within the guidelines I would normally use (around an inch or so or less of unknown quality or lower quality materials). Quilting polyfoam also precompresses the foam which makes it firmer (tighter quilting patterns are firmer and looser quilting patterns are softer) and also increases the durability of the polyfoam.

The first two mattresses you listed (The Bowles HD Euro Style and the Bowles HD X Firm - double sided) use an offset coil that would generally be stronger and better quality than the continuous coil in the Lady Americana Bronze Sapphire - Semi Plush although none of them list the amount of steel in the innerspring which is the most meaningful way to compare different types of innersprings (and this information isn’t provided by manufacturers).

The Bowles HD Euro Style uses an additional inch of 1.5 lb polyfoam under the 2" of latex which increases the amount of lower density polyfoam to about 1.75" which isn’t bad but is also a little more than “around an inch or so” which I would tend to prefer. It is also under the 2" latex layer however so the latex would be absorbing much of the compression forces which would increase the durability of the foam below it so this would be an offsetting factor. They also don’t mention the type or blend of the latex but no matter what type it may be latex is a good quality material compared to other types of foam. Overall this would have minimal weak links because of the materials and the way it is constructed. You may or may not need a topper with this mattress depending on how well it matches your specific needs and preferences in terms of PPP but your own careful testing and/or sleeping experience would be the best way to know and if you did need a thin topper for additional softness and pressure relief it would probably be “close enough” that you could sleep on it for a while and use your actual sleeping experience as a guideline for the thickness and firmness of any topper that you needed.

The Bowles Bowles HD X Firm - double sided doesn’t have the additional inch of polyfoam so this wouldn’t have any weak links in the mattress. It’s also two sided which will increase the durability of any mattress and allows it to wear more evenly. The challenge with this mattress however is that it would almost certainly need a topper to be suitable for you (probably in the range of 2" - 3" or so) and as you mentioned this would increase the cost of your sleeping system. There is also some uncertainty in choosing a topper for a mattress that is the best “match” for your needs and preferences and you may not be able to sleep comfortably on a mattress this firm to use your sleeping experience as a guideline for choosing the topper. It would probably be the most durable of the three choices and you could flip both the mattress and the topper but it would probably be the most “risky” choice because you wouldn’t be able to test the mattress topper combination in person before buying the topper (unless Bowles sells a latex topper that you can test with the mattress).

The Lady Americana Bronze Sapphire - Semi Plush would probably be my least favorite choice of the three because of the lower quality innerspring and because it uses 2" of 1.8 lb convoluted polyfoam instead of the latex. 1.8 lb polyfoam is a good quality material and at the lower end of “good quality” polyfoam but convoluting polyfoam also makes it less durable than a solid layer because there is less material in the layer. Even good quality polyfoam is less durable than latex as well. They also don’t mention the density of the memory foam layer but it’s also very thin so this wouldn’t have a significant effect on durability. The biggest reason to choose this would be budget reasons rather than quality or performance reasons. It appears to be roughly the same firmness level as the Euro so if you could sleep on the Euro without a topper then this one would probably be fine as well. Overall I would say this one also has only minimal weak links in the mattress in terms of durability although I would rate it behind the Euro.

Part of your choice would be the risk involved in buying any topper you need because there is no guarantee that the first topper you choose will be the most suitable in terms of thickness or softness and choosing a topper always has some degree of uncertainty involved … particularly if you can’t sleep on the mattress first to help you make the most suitable choice based on the topper guidelines here.

All three of these are more suitable choices IMO than the ones you listed previously and the choice between them would be much more in line with choices between “good and good” instead of “questionable and questionable” and a final choice between them would be based on the criteria that were the most important parts of your personal value equation.

In terms of general design … the Euro has some similarities to the Telluride Plush at Denver Mattress (a mix of polyfoam and 2" of latex, over an innerspring) except the Telluride uses 1.8 lb polyfoam throughout and has no lower density polyfoam. The Telluride uses a pocket coil which is more conforming and has a higher coil count and has more foam over the coils so it wouldn’t have any obvious weak links in terms of durability but I would want to test it very carefully to make sure that it was suitable for you in terms of PPP because it may or may be on the soft side … especially for stomach sleeping. If a mattress is on the edge of being too soft for you then even a smaller degree of foam softening may put you over the edge in terms of PPP even though the mattress is still in relatively good condition.

Hope this helps :slight_smile:


Hi Phoenix,

The deed is done…

And the winner is…Sapphire! :cheer:

It really came down to a money. Sapphire was $688 for the set. The HD Euro was $1088. You can certainly feel the difference in quality and comfort, but with the holidays coming up and I just found out I need a crown for a tooth that I have to pay for out of pocket, in the end, the choice was obvious. If I didn’t need a bed so soon, and I didn’t need dental work, I might have chose differently. I guess it all factors in in my personal value equation.

I look forward to sleeping on my new bed on Monday!

Thanks for your all your time and helpful advice. Glad this forum is here. I feel comfortable with my choice. Keep up the good work.


Hi worldaven,

Congratulations on your new mattress.

I think you did some good research and asked good questions and made an informed choice that was best for you which is the most important goal of the site.

Perhaps I should add another criteria to the personal value equation post which mentions dental work as one of the “value” criteria :slight_smile:

I hope you have the chance to share your feedback when you’ve had the chance to sleep on it for a bit.