Seeking DIY advice — what to try next?

Mattress Talk
1

Hi all,

I’m trying to figure out what to try next in my attempt to DIY a mattress that works for me from both an alignment and surface comfort perspective.

About me: 160 lbs, 5’8”, back and side sleeper.

A few years ago I bought a Charles P Rogers Estate SE, which combines a firm coil unit with a very soft and relatively thin latex topper. This worked for alignment: I usually woke up with my back feeling good. But I found it to have very poor pressure point relief and for that reason I found it generally quite uncomfortable. Rather than futz with toppers I decided to return it and go down a route that would allow me to adjust and tweak.

So, I bought a Flobeds V-Zone mattress in firm, which is made up of 3 3-inch layers of tallalay latex and a 2-inch convoluted extra-soft tallalay top layer. Immediately I found it to be extremely comfortable from a pressure points perspective, but several years and many tweaks and a couple of additional components later, I’m effectively in DIY land and still struggling to get what feels like good alignment.

I’ve tried rearranging the V zone layer. I’ve tried removing the convoluted layer. I’ve tried moving the firm layers up. No configuration felt sufficiently supportive for my hips, lumbar, and thoracic spine — even when putting the firmer layers at the top — so I swapped in a superfirm Flobeds base layer and then, to be sure, incorporated an extremely firm 3-inch dunlop layer from Sleep on Latex.

When that still didn’t feel supportive enough, and considering my experience with the Charles P Rogers bed, I decided to replace the bottom two layers with a 6” L&P Caliber Edge innerspring layer.

Putting the innerspring at the bottom of the stack (under 3 inches of medium or firm latex, with or without the 2-inch convoluted top layer) didn’t seem to change much. It still felt like my hips were sinking, I wasn’t getting enough support for my lumbar and thoracic sprine, and I’d wake up with hip and lower back pain.

Removing the 3-inch latex layer and just using the innerspring + 2 inches of extra-soft talalay, however, feels like progress. My spine feels better supported and I’m not getting hip pain, but I’m still waking up feeling like my lower back (and core muscles, actually) have been “working” to hold alignment.

I’m trying to figure out what to try next. I’m considering:

-Getting a one-inch medium dunlop topper to add between the innerspring unit and the extra-soft tallalay layer, on the theory that perhaps support is good now but my lumbar region needs more “fill” to be properly supported and 3 inches of latex is too much to do that effectively without otherwise messing up my alignment.

-Trying plywood or OSB under the mattress. I have a king Thuma bed frame with what seem to be strong slats, but there is definitely a difference between how it feels on the sides and how it feels along its center rail. It feels much more supportive right on top of the center rail (where I can’t sleep because I’m not the only person on the bed).

-Trying a different innerspring unit, perhaps one from Texas Pocket Coil. The Caliber Edge feels firm, but I have to say that it still doesn’t feel nearly as firm as the Charles P Rogers bed.

Any thoughts would be greatly welcomed. Thank you!

2

Wow, it seems you have been on quite a mattress ride. Looking at the series trials you have been though, I probably would have futz’d with the toppers on the Rogers bed. I am not one of those who believe, if the bed isnt immediately 100% as is, than it is not good for you.

There are many extremely high end mattresses that build their mattresses around their toppers. Certainly, they plan this as they design and engineer their mattresses, but I believe the topper is an important component to a mattress. It can add contouring and pressure relief, You can achieve a particular height you may desire in you bedding system and of course it can add longevity to a mattress, allowing the primary mattress build to remain stable and in tact, while only needing to replace the topper down the road if it begins to fail.

Look, most pillow manufacturers recommend you replace your pillow after 3 years. How many people actually follow that schedule and how would a topper be much different than a pillow in that respect. If you maintain your mattress, and you should, you will likely have a better experience with it overall. Most folks expand or have their mattress placed on their foundation, and 5-7 years later start to observe changes. These changes can be the mattress or change in preferences, but either way, had they properly rotated their mattress, rotated and flipped their topper, the likelihood of that mattress feeling better for a longer period of time increases quite a bit. My wife comments every time I fluff up, shake, rotate and flip our 3" hand tufted organic wool topper. It makes a difference.

DIY can be a very satisfying experience when constructed, designed and completely thoughtfully laid out. It can also be a trip into the unknown if done without the help of an experienced mattress professional. Companies like @FloBeds, @Arizona_Premium, @CST and @Sleep_EZ to name just a select few, encounter all these issues that you have described on an every day basis. To you, these folks are just one or two encounters. To them, you are one of hundreds of encounters, so they have seen it all.

We could go through some ideas to solve this, but I would strongly advise you discuss with with @flobeds to see if they can make recommendations to get you the support you are searching for, and let their experience and wisdom take the lead. Naturally, flobeds is going to do it with all latex as would CST. Whereas APM and Sleepez can incorporate spring support that may be more satisfying to your comfort.

If you want to try and tackle this yourself, you can try some of the following.

The idea of adding a one-inch medium Dunlop topper between the innerspring unit and the extra-soft Talalay layer is worth exploring, it is often reported that one inch may not offer enough of a change to be as noticeable. Once you start to hit the 1.5 -2" thickness, the change will become more noticeable. In any case, it could help provide additional lumbar support without compromising the overall feel. The medium firmness may help fill in the gaps and keep your spine aligned better while still allowing for some comfort on your pressure points.

Placing plywood or OSB under your mattress might help create a more uniform support surface. This could enhance the overall firmness and prevent the mattress from sagging, especially in the middle where you mentioned you feel more support. This might help improve alignment as well.

If you’re considering a new innerspring unit, look for one that emphasizes lumbar support, possibly with zoned support systems designed for different body areas. A firmer coil unit could also give you the support you’re seeking while still allowing for a comfortable surface layer. Personally, I am cautious regarding zoned mattresses, as folks don’t always understand the consequences of zoning. I am comfortable with a uniform structure that has enough support for my lumbar region, and it doesn’t affect my other regions. If softening /pressure relief or contouring would be needed, the topper is a perfect solution for that circumstance.

Since you’ve already experimented with layer configurations, consider going back to a simpler setup with just the innerspring and one or two layers of latex. Sometimes, a less complex configuration can provide a clearer sense of how each layer is affecting your comfort and support. I subscribe to the less is more ideology as it remains easier to modify and quantify the results of the modifications.

This doesn’t exactly solve the problem, but hopefully, it will give you some ideas on how to approach a solution.

All the best,

Maverick