stuck in mattress shopping hell and need help

A few months ago my husband and I upgraded from a queen to a king bed and needed a new mattress. My last three mattresses have been Tempurpedics and I’d always loved them until the past year or so when I started to sleep hotter and experience the mattress as much too firm (maybe a result of being in my 40s). Also, I wanted to find something a bit more natural and environmentally friendly. After a bunch of research we decided on a Loom and Leaf memory foam. My husband loved it but I started having back pain and I’d never had back pain before. I also didn’t like how lumpy it felt. So after a few weeks we exchanged it for a Zenhaven. Again, my husband is happy and I am getting a lot of back pain (although I like the feel better). I sleep on my back and stomach and my husband sleeps on his side so he seems to do better with softer mattresses (he’s only ow telling me now much he hated our very firm termpurpedic). I like a firmer feel I think–just not as firm as the firm side of the Zenhaven. We tried flipping the Zenhaven to the firmer side and that did feel better on my back when laying on my back but we both woke up feeling really stiff and sore all over and I slept terribly (moving around a lot). I do like the feel of the latex (I like the slight bounce and not getting sucked into the bed so much) but I’m not sure why I’m getting back pain for the first time in my life. Is it coming from a lack of support (I’m 5’6" and 123lbs and my husband is 6’1", 170lbs so it would seem weird that it would be enough support for him and not me)? Or if it’s just a comfort preference and maybe I need something somewhere in the middle of the two Zenhaven sides–there feels like a significant discrepancy between them? I’m wondering if I should try another latex mattress (I’m looking at the Nest Q3 and Avocado) or if I would do better with a hybrid latex/memory foam. I’ve spent hours and hours at this point researching mattresses not wanting to make yet another mistake but I’ve been overwhelmed an paralyzed by choice. I desperately need some suggestions. Thank you.

Hi cassandram,

The Loom and Leaf is a memory foam mattress, as is the Tempurpedic, so the issues with memory foam tending to be less breathable would still be an issue, and the “eco-friendliness” of the polyfoam and memory foams used point mostly to being CertiPUR-US certified and having part of the polyol of the foams replaced with a plant-based polyol, which would generally describe most of the polyfoam produced domestically. In the end, it’s still isocyanate and polyol and water mixed together.

I’m sorry your Loom and Leaf didn’t work out as well as you had hoped. The ZenHaven is an all-latex natural Talalay mattress with different comforts on the top and bottom. This would have a more supportive and buoyant feel than the memory foam. If you’re having back pain (you weren’t specific about where it is along your spine), but assuming it is in your low back, it would make sense that something slightly firmer could allow you to sleep better.

I can’t predict why you might behaving the pain that you are. There is some information about the many different symptoms that people may experience on a mattress and some of the most common causes behind them in post #2 here that may be helpful, but the most common reason for lower back pain is a mattress that has comfort layers that are too thick/soft or a support core that is too soft. It could be that you desire a bit more deeper support, but slightly softer surface comfort, as you stated you had pressure point issues on the firm side of the ZenHaven. I don’t know how long you tested out these different sides of the ZenHaven, as there is usually a period of adjustment when you try out any new mattress or configuration.

Again, I can’t predict what type of mattress you might do best with via an online forum, as there are entirely too many personal variables involved. The Nest Bedding Q3 is offered in three different comfort levels, and the base version is configurable in either a “medium” or “firm” comfort by rearranging the layers. The Avocado is a pocketed coil product and the base mattress is more of a gentle firm, with 3" of latex on top of the springs. There is an optional pillowtop for a softer feel. Memory foam will tend to give you more of the “sinking in” feeling (and potential for sleeping warmer) which you stated that you might want to avoid.

If you are going to stay with online shopping and you can’t test a mattress in person, then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help “talk you through” the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and “feel” of the materials they are using and the options they have available that may be the best “match” for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the “averages” of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about “matching” their specific mattress designs, options, and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

When shopping online, the return/refund policy and any costs involved would become a much more important part of the “value” of a mattress purchase so you can try out the mattress in your bedroom instead of a showroom with the only risk being the cost of returning a mattress if in the worst case, and in spite of the “best efforts” of everyone involved (both you and the retailer you are buying from) the mattress doesn’t turn out to be as suitable a choice as you hoped for.

As I mentioned in my previous reply to you, and just in case you haven’t read it yet, the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and the options you have available after a purchase if your choice doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for).

Outside of PPP (which is the most important part of “value”), the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new so I would always make sure that you find out the information listed here so you can compare the quality of the materials and components to the durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase. The two brands you are considering do use good quality and durable materials, and Nest Bedding is a site member here, which means that I think highly of them and their products.

Phoenix

Thanks Phoenix. I did read through the links and appreciate all the info. I didn’t realize that lower back pain could also be caused by comfort layers that are too soft or thick. I think that was the problem with both the Loom and Leaf and Zenhaven. I think both those beds have good support layers but they have a lot more material on top than I’m used to. Last night I slept on my old Tempurpedic and slept so much better. No back pain this morning. I went to sleep on my back and woke up in the same position. What I notice about the tempurpedic is that it’s pretty firm (I don’t sink in much) and there is no pillow top or material on top–it’s just foam and I like that. My complaints with it are that it’s hot and a bit too firm (my muscles are a bit achy in the morning) and now that I’m more educated about mattresses I know there are other healthier, more environmentally friendly, less expensive options out there. So I guess I’m wondering what options would feel most similar to a tempurpedic but be more natural/less toxic?

Hi cassandram,

The definition for “environmentally friendly” is quite nebulous and can apply to multiple stages of foam production that are beyond the scope of this forum, and in general it’s something that tends to be defined by each individual according to their area of focus and own personal definitions.

“Toxic” is a term for poisonous substances produced within living cells or organisms, although the term is often used in the mattress industry (and often part of some “fear-mongering” campaigns). Most people that are looking for “non or less-toxic” (toxicity is dose-dependent) materials are usually concerned most with “safety”.

There is quite a bit of confusing information available online about toxicity, safety and organic, and there is more about the different types of organic and safety certifications such as Oeko-tex, Eco-Institut, Greenguard Gold, C2C, and CertiPUR-US in post #2 here, and more about some of the differences between organic and safety certifications in post #2 here and there are also some comments in post #42 here that can help you decide whether an organic certification is important to you for environmental, social, or personal reasons, or whether a “safety” certification is enough, and what those certifications can mean to determine whether the contents of any particular mattress are “safe enough” for you.

If you desire to stay with a memory foam product, based upon your statements you’d probably want to look at something that would have at least a CertiPUR-US certification (this is for polyfoams and memory foams).

Latex is generally able to meet more stringent standards for VOCs and harmful substances, and if you decide to move in that direction, but still desire the slower recovery feel of memory foam, there is a form of slow recovery latex available called Puralux. You can create a mattress using it in a component-style system such as here at Mattresses.net (they are a site member here and experienced with this particular latex foam).

In general, those would be two directions for you to pursue. Memory foam has a very specific feel and is not very resilient (bouncy), so there are not many types of products similar to it.

If you have more specific questions after looking through this information, I’ll do my best to answer them.

Phoenix

Thanks for all the info. I live in Portland, OR and I actually just saw that you have a local company called Parklane listed as a member. I had never heard of them but I just spoke to them and they have a selection of latex mattresses that sound like the might be a good fit for what I want. Going to drop by there this weekend. I would much rather buy locally and be able to lay on the mattress before buying but previously had some bad experiences with another local company so had started looking online. So glad I found your site!

Hi cassandram,

As you mentioned, Parklane is a site member here, which means that I think highly of them. I have visited their factory outlet in Tualatin and was impressed. I’ll be interested to learn of the results of your visit and if you find anything that suits your needs.

Phoenix