Tired of dreaming about mattresses

[phoenix]

Hi Fluffhead,

To me I felt as though it was not adequate in pressure relieving. I still felt a hollow feeling in my lower back or a slight aching there after a while. I don’t know if my mid section sunk in to much, I don’t think it did. I think it felt as though nothing was touching my lower back and I believe it was the same for my wife. I think you just wanted to know to have more information, but I do know I still preferred the F/M/n4 over it.

This highlights the difference between Talalay and Dunlop. The Dunlop would be in the range of mid 20’s ILD (possibly higher depending on which side was up and how firm that particular layer was) while the N4 would be in the range of 30-34 ILD. Even though the Dunlop has a lower ILD which would normally be more pressure relieving … because it has a higher sag factor … it didn’t seem to form as deep a cradle for you (less pressure relieving and didn’t fill in the gaps as well). The fact that the n4 and the soft Dunlop are both a little on the firm side seems to indicate that n3 would be closer to your range in a 3" comfort layer. Of course F/M/M would be even worse.

On the n5/n5/n4 the position I was speaking about was actually on my back. I couldn’t get over how it felt. It was almost like the back of my legs were slightly numb, not asleep though, and my muscles couldn’t relax. It did not contour for me and i felt as though my midsection was being lifted up or higher than my shoulders. I do need to be careful in my description of my feelings because I am use to a bed where my mid section sinks in more.

OK … that makes more sense. I just read my last comments as well where I said “on the previous day on your back this layering seemed too soft” but you hadn’t tried this layering or even the same top 2 layers the previous day (it was the F/n4/n4 and the F/M/n4) … so my comments relating to this part weren’t valid. To correct …

On Day 1 you tried the F/n4/n4 which was “nice” for side sleeping but seemed too soft for alignment on your back. The F/M/n4 was too firm on your side but good for the back. This would indicate that the n4 needed “help” because it is on the firm side for side sleeping and that the 30-34 talalay helped it more on your side for pressure relief but was too soft for your back alignment while the M Dunlop helped it less on your side for pressure relief but was good for back sleeping alignment. This is the classic conflict between combination sleeping. What works for one position is either too soft or firm in one layer or another for a different position.

On the next day you tried the n5/n5/n4 which was fine at first but I don’t know which position it was initially fine for (side or back) and you quickly switched mattresses so I’ll pass this by because you were “immediately relaxed” when you went to the F/M/n4.

When you went back to the all talalay n5/n5/n4 the lack of moving around compared to the F/n4/n4 from the previous day would be for the reasons I mentioned before (top 2 layers were firmer overall). Because the top 2 layers were firmer overall … this would also have stopped you from sinking in as much and filling in the gaps as well as the softer n4 middle layer. Because the n4 on the top is already on the edge of too firm … making the layer underneath it firmer as well would likely account for the numbing effect because what was already on the edge would be over the edge with a firmer n5 middle layer. The feeling that your midsection was higher than your shoulders would be unlikely but it probably was much higher than you were used to with the firmer n5 underneath. All in all … it seems that the n5 middle in combination with a the n4 top (which is on the edge of being too firm anyway) is just too much “firmness” both for pressure relief and for filling in the gaps in your profile. It doesn’t form a deep enough cradle.

So up to this point the preference is the F/M/n4 even though the pressure relief on the shoulders isn’t as good as it should be.

I told my wife before we went to bed that I think the reason she liked it so much was because her body is not heavy enough to go through the n4 layer where as the n5 either stiffened up the n4 under my weight or I went through it and the n5 was too stiff underneath

This is likely very accurate. For her weight … the n4 would be an unusually firm preference for a comfort layer and it’s doubtful that she would even “go through” 3" of softer latex much less the n4. You on the other hand being larger and heavier could go through it and feel the underlying firmer layer more than her.

but I already know the two layers of n4 is not firm enough from when we tried the F/n4/n4. I really wish they carried an n3 layer. That would really narrow things down.

It was better on your side but not firm enough on your back which refers back to my previous comment. The F/M was firm enough on your back though. In theory … you would do better with a softer top 3" for better pressure relief and then firmer underneath either n5 or the same M Dunlop for better alignment. With the softer on top you could probably get away with firmer under or at least the same. This would depend a lot on the depth of what I call your “critical zone” which is the effective thickness of the comfort/pressure relieving zone you need to fill in the gaps and relieve pressure. I suspect that even with the firmer n4 comfort layer it is still over 3". How deeply you sink in to the layer below would determine which of the middle layers (n5 or M) would be best for you with an n3 layer (or equivalent).

I think I would be okay with the springiness of all talalay if I could find a layering that felt right. I have trouble imagining the effect an n3 layer would have over the n5/n5 or if n3 would be firm enough for my wife in a 3" layer.

I think the n3 (or the equivalent in blended) would work better for both of you. I also think it would allow for either the same firmness or possibly even more firmness underneath. This could give both better pressure relief on your side and better support on your back.

M/M/S would have been another good combo for us to have tried out. Maybe that would have given the top soft just a little more contouring ability and that would have been enough.

The top 2 layers are where most of the cradling comes from so changing the bottom layer wouldn’t change the cradle and the pressure relief much from the F/M/S. The support would be less though. Pressure relief comes from sinking “in” to the top layers of the mattress. Alignment and support is determined by how far your heavier parts sink “down” into the mattress. Changing the bottom layer would change support more than changing the cradle and pressure relief.

Post #3 in this thread has some options in Charlottesville and Layers would be a very good place to visit and can customize each mattress. They are a factory direct outlet that is knowledgeable and helpful and have choices that are different from what you’ve tried. It may also be worth trying the OMI Lago which is I believe 3.5" of n3 over 6" of n5.

Phoenix