Well, I’m almost there. Done buying mattresses and did the best I could. Got close, I think.
Have a pocket coil with 1" of 28
ILD latex on top to firm up coils. They’re still sagging a bit in pelvic area when stomach sleeping.
Q: if I put 1 or 2 towels on top of mattress and under a topper I’m using it feels better. But will this ruin the coils? Push them down over timeKing it worse? They’re “firm” but probably not high quality and feel like about a 14 gauge.
Innersprings are designed to compress different amounts under different areas of the body that have either more or less weight or surface area so using a towel as a “belly band” or as an insulator pad either directly on top of the springs or in between foam layers to create a zoning effect and firm up the area under the pelvis and/or lower back certainly wouldn’t ruin the coils.
I should also mention that the gauge of the coils in an innerspring isn’t necessarily a measure of its quality or even its firmness. The amount of steel in a coil would probably be the most reasonable measure of its overall “quality” but you can’t tell the amount of steel in an innerspring based on just the gauge of the coil because the number of coils (or the coil density), the height of the coil, the diameter of the coil, the shape of the coil, and the number of turns in each coil, and some of the other coil specs that can differentiate one coil from another can also make a significant difference in the amount of steel in an innerspring and along with the type of coil and how the individual coils are connected together can also make a significant difference in the firmness and response of the innerspring as well.
Thanks Phoenix. This is great news. I will use a towel.
I get what you’re saying about the gauge of coils.
One other question: will a platform bed stiffen up the coils at all? I read somewhere that a platform bed or a board should be out under a one-sided pocket coil unit with foam encasement which is what I have.
It would depend on what you were comparing it to. A support system that flexes under a mattress will generally feel softer than a support system that doesn’t flex at all (such as a slatted platform bed or foundation with rigid slats or a piece of plywood).
In general a support system that has little to no flex would be suitable under a one sided pocket coil mattress although a solid surface can reduce the airflow under the mattress which in combination with other risk factors can increase the chances of mold or mildew under the mattress (see post #10 here).
I was about to respond to this last night but FELL ASLEEP because my BED IS SO COMFORTABLE NOW
I put another 1/2" of latex on it, got a new body pillow and was in heaven all night. The new body pillow stopped me from feeling the springs were too soft.
I happened upon your comment on the above link about being over- exposed to trying too many different beds and psychologically that helped too. I just stopped expecting the worst and the bed was just fine.
Life sure looks different when ya get a little rest!
Can’t thank you enough for your YEARS of service in my dilemma.
I’ll be back if I need a tweak or something
And try to send your site a donation as soon as I can
Thanks for everything Phoenix
Well, I spoke too soon. Last night I was up at 3am again with my back and sciatica in pain while stomach sleeping. The coils are just too soft. I folded a towel and put it under my topper which just caused a lump-no relief. I took it back out and tried to side sleep which I can make myself do if necessary - but no go. My sciatica was in extreme pain all the way down to my toes. The whole outside of my legs felt “stretched”.
This morning my back and legs are screaming like they’ve never felt before in my life. I have a healthy body and don’t have back or sciatica problems.
What I’m experiencing is that the last two manufacturers I went to only have bonnel and pocket coils - and neither coils are firm enough. They are however, when wrapped with high density PU foam. But since I can’t use that and need latex, which works differently than PU foam, I’m out of luck.
As you’ve said on this forum, there are dozens, if not hundreds, of types of pocket coils. I believe I’ve just happened upon manufacturers who don’t have quality or firmer ones. Probably the ones that cost $20-$30 a piece when bought in bulk. Which makes sense, given the beds we buy at Sleepy’s are made at manufacturers.
I’m beginning to feel that given how bankrupt I am from all these bedding purchases, “cutting out the middle man” in many cases is not the way to go. If I had gone to even a very high-cost bedding store and purchased a quality pocket coil with latex hybrid, I would’ve been better off financially and would’ve also ended up with something that works instead of something that has to be sold or discarded.
I will try obvious “fixes” like different combinations of toppers etc that I haven’t already tried, and even a board under coils, but I don’t think there’s any getting around a too-soft set of coils.
I’ll probably either end up sleeping on my box spring, which is at least firm, with latex on top (can this be done?) or on the carpeted floor with cotton mattress pads and latex. Might sound crazy but I don’t care. If I can get enough rest perhaps I could at least work - and eventually buy a high-quality bed B)
Unfortunately I guess I’ll need to retract my “that’s great news” comments from my last reply :unsure: .
You have certainly had more your share of challenges with finding a mattress that is a good “match” for you and your unusual sensitivities to certain materials or to the different mattress designs you’ve tried in terms of PPP certainly don’t make it any easier.
I don’t think that whether you cut out the middle man or not would have any bearing on whether a mattress is a good match for you in terms of PPP although I do agree that there is much more to the “value” of a mattress purchase than just the price (see post #13 here about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase).
You could be just as likely to purchase a mattress from a “high end” bedding store that isn’t a good match for you in terms of PPP (and possibly pay too much for it as well) as you would if you were dealing with a factory direct manufacturer or a retailer that carries high quality mattresses that operates on lower margins and makes or sells a similar mattress that uses similar materials. Don’t forget that you can’t “feel” the quality or durability of the materials in a mattress and the price of a mattress has little to nothing to do with whether it will be suitable for you in terms of PPP. The only way to know for certain whether any mattress is a good match for you (regardless of the price) will be based on your own personal experience when you sleep on it.
If your coils are too soft … particularly under the heavier parts of your body … there are some suggestions in post #11 here and the posts it links to about zoning to that may be helpful … particularly for combination stomach/side sleepers or others that find it more challenging to find a suitable mattress.
Thanks. I’ve been up for two hours trying different things and what I’m realizing is that the reason for this new type of pain (sciatica) plus lower back pain is that the mattress is actually firm (which is good) but the 28 ILD latex
Is too hard. I’m getting pushback, and then I try to soften it up with the soft and medium latex toppers I’ve got here but have to use 2.25" to achieve enough softness without bottoming out.
In hindsight when I drove 2 hrs out there and saw he really didn’t have any low-20s or mid-20s Ild latex I shouldn’t have proceeded. These are the blindspots I have when mattress shopping. I figure, "Well, I’m here. I might as well just take the closest thing. But latex preference can be so specific.
But also in hindsight I’m totally fine with the foam encasement that surrounds this pocket coil set and I believe I could’ve had him use PU foam instead of latex. I had a bad scare (reaction) a few years ago with a memory foam topper so was scared off from anything that wasn’t natural latex. That is probably the real crux of the problem.
In fact I was thinking today that I am no longer surprised that many people here choose what I’ve heard described I think as “high density polyfoam” as a comfort layer when making their beds.
I don’t want to try another mattress surgery because it ruined my last bed. These aren’t pillowtops or even plush models so it’s difficult if not impossible to pull the bed together tightly again and sew it.
I could purchase a good, dense but not “hard” piece of certified PU foam and use it as a topper if PU foam works differently than latex in the sense you can sleep more “in it” than “on it”. I believe about 1.25" of somewhat/fairly dense but not necessarily superdense memory foam would feel nice on this bed so would an ILD of PU foam be perhaps around a 25 or so? I will peruse the board for info on PU foam toppers.
It just occurred to me that the 28 ILD latex inside this bed on top of the coils might be keeping the coils too so I definitely don’t want to do surgery.
And if all else fails, I’ll sell it to a back sleeper and go to Sleepy’s
Unless you have a great deal of knowledge and experience with different types of mattress materials and specs and different layering combinations and how they combine together and can translate them into your own “real life” experience that can be unique to you … I would tend to avoid using ILD numbers or other complex specs to try and predict how a mattress will feel or perform for you and focus more on your own actual testing and/or personal experience. When you try and choose a mattress based on complex combinations of specs that you may not fully understand then the most common outcome is information overload and “paralysis by analysis”.
I would always keep in mind that the only way to know whether a mattress will be a good “match” for you with any certainty (especially when you are as sensitive as you are to some very small differences in layering that wouldn’t make much difference to most people) … will be based on your own personal experience when you sleep on the mattress.
If I was in your shoes and had tried as many different mattresses or combinations of materials as you have that didn’t work out as well as you hoped they would (or only worked for a short time) then the exchange or return options after a purchase would be a much more important part of the “value” of a mattress purchase.