After receiving no reply from Custom Sleep Design by voice or email I decided to go and visit them. On arrival I found no shop signage and a dark locked showroom. From the other side of the street you can still see the showroom bed frames but no sign of activity.
This is probably not a good sign for existing customers. I know there has been reported difficulties and assume their current state is related. I had visited them not do long before the weekend before this post and all was well according to them.
Any further info on what is going on? Is it a bad business or just bad service or communication?
I was going to do business with them but a quick background check put me off. The product was very good and it is a shame if they are gone. I was putting them up against Flo and I guess my choice has been reduced.
Post #7 - 9 here has more about their current circumstances but they are not accepting new orders at the moment.
I’m surprised that you were able to reach them if you have talked with them in the last month or two.
I did talk with Bob on the phone a week ago and he told me that he would write down some information to post on the forum but so far I haven’t received anything.
There is no other manufacturer that I’m aware of that was using their particular zoning design although as you mentioned Flobeds also has a custom zoned layer if you choose their vZone.
I agree with your thoughts about their design although I also have to say that IMO they haven’t handled the situation very well and could have done a lot better job communicating with their current and potential customers.
Current (former?) CSD customer here to pile on: if you’ve done the CSD design program on their website and wanted to know more specifics of the results, the ILDs of their levels, from soft to firmest, go 14, 19, 25, 28, 32, 36, and 40. (This is from memory, but I’m pretty sure that’s right.)
If Westport is convenient, maybe visit the Clean Bedroom showroom there, they have great products (Dunlop and Talalay) and are are very knowledgable.
The Latex Bliss beds that Latex International make are a lot like what Bob was creating, minus the wool enclosure and, of course, the customization. I think CT Mattress in Avon is the closest dealer of those.
Good luck!
Here is CSD’s web widget theory for a progressive 3-layer 2-zone build using LI Talalay blended Latex foam rubber:
Given king/queen size of 80", the 2" comfort layer upper body zone dimension is (height head-to-navel) + 2/3 (80 - height)“. The 3” transition support layer upper body zone is +5". Measure your height head-to-navel while laying down, especially if your belly button sags. The navel is roughly at the top of the pelvis.
90-129 lbs. (upper body zone | lower body zone)
2" 14 ILD super plush | 19 ILD plush Talalay comfort layer
3" 19 ILD plush | 28 ILD medium Talalay transition support layer
6" 32 ILD firm Talalay support layer
130-189 lbs. (upper body zone | lower body zone)
2" 14 ILD super plush | 28 medium Talalay comfort layer
3" 24 ILD soft | 32 firm Talalay transition support layer
6" 36 ILD extra firm Talalay support layer
190-249 lbs. (upper body zone | lower body zone)
2" 19 ILD plush | 28 medium Talalay comfort layer
3" 28 ILD medium | 36 extra firm Talalay transition support layer
6" 40 ILD super firm Talalay support layer
250-400 lbs. (upper body zone | lower body zone)
2" 24 ILD soft | 28 medium Talalay comfort layer
3" 32 ILD firm | 36 extra firm Talalay transition support layer
6" 44 ILD super firm Talalay support layer
Personally, I like the idea of a 2" inch comfort layer. I think the 3x3" and 4x3" builds risk the cradle being too deep and/or not progressively firm enough in the cradle depth.
I appreciate you listing a few of the basic specs of their designs but just for the sake of clarity in case anyone takes these combinations too seriously or as an “optimal” design on an individual level … these are just starting points or initial reference points and are often not the final design for one of their mattresses which are (or were) usually based on more detailed discussions, input, preferences, and measurements. They often provided two options in terms of layering depending on the preferences and specifics of each person that isn’t part of the input into the basic profile. These specs would also be more typical for side sleepers. In some cases with certain people they even use a unizone layer in certain circumstances.
I would keep in mind that the thickness of a comfort layer is not directly connected with the depth of the cradle (or what I call the critical zone) because all the layers interact together and even the firmness of the middle and lower layers contribute to the depth of the cradle to differing degrees depending on the body type and sleeping style of the person. With a thinner 2" comfort layer you can adjust the depth of cradle by varying the firmness of the layer below it and with a thicker comfort layer then you can often use firmer middle and/or lower layers because the greater compression of the thicker top layer creates more firmness in the layer (because of compression modulus) which allows for a smoother transition between the thicker upper layers and firmer deeper layers and reduces the compression and “contribution” of the deeper layers. In other words each design has it’s own advantages and disadvantages and one is not inherently “better” than another.
Generalizations and theory based on averages can be useful as a starting point but they often lead people that don’t fully understand all the many variables involved to believe that a certain “design” inherently works better on an individual level and then come to believe that “theory” is a better way to predict their “perfect” mattress design than their own personal experiences or more detailed conversations with a manufacturer. I don’t think that there is any inherent “risk” in a 3" comfort layer and it has more to do with how any specific top layer interacts with the deeper layers below it in combination with the specifics of the person than it does with the actual thickness of a comfort layer itself. Isolating a single part of a design without taking into account how it affects and interacts with the rest of the design can sometimes be misleading. You could have a 2" comfort layer for example which provided a depth of cradle of 4" under a certain part of the body and a 3" comfort layer that provided the same depth of cradle with a different combination of ILD’s. Theory is great as a starting point and as a step towards an “ideal” design but it’s not so good at including all the individual differences, variables, and preferences that can lead to the “best” design for any individual person and in some cases it can lead to people trying to design their own mattress without understanding all the variables involved which can have some unfortunate and in some cases costly consequences.
Maintaining some degree of uncertainty and having good exchange options after a purchase when you haven’t actually tried a mattress is just as important as having certainty when you are dealing with theory because it can prevent unrealistic expectations and an undue focus on mattress specs vs personal experience or the knowledge and experience of a manufacturer who has the experience and instincts that help them know when to “break the rules” and when to follow them.