Who ACTUALLY MANUFACTURES the Dunlop Latex Toppers?

Talk To The Experts Sleep EZ
1

I have ordered many 3" Dunlop D95 toppers in previous years from various companies and they worked beautifully for me. They were very dense and super firm to help keep my back straight but still giving me a little cushion for my shoulders and hips. This year, I have ordered 3 Dunlop toppers from 3 different businesses. They are not labeled D95’s and longer, they are calling them 3" X-TRA Firm. They are not as firm as previous years D95’s and cause too much pain because they are not as firm or dense or however you want to call it. All 3 companies I bought from sent too soft toppers. So it must be the Manufacturers.

So my question is, did the product change from last year and is there any way to get what I always received in the past? My back is fused with rods and plates, pins and screws, from my shoulder blades to my tailbone and I have a plate that goes across the tailbone and screws into each pelvic bone. The previous years D95’s worked beautifully for about a year and then I would buy another one as I would get a small dip in them, even though I am rotating it constantly. I have bought a new one every Jan. for the last 4-5 years but this year all that I bought are soft. Since I bought them at different companies that sell Dunlop Latex toppers, I am guessing they are all softer by the manufacturer. If that is so, then I guess people such as myself that are held up with tons of metal rods etc. are just out of luck finding a way to sleep…at least out of luck with Dunlop Latex D-95’s.

The way I use them is with my Sleep Number Bed that sits on hard plastic slats, then the air beds that sit on the slats I keep aired up to 100% of air (I have removed the cover and foam from the sleep number bed as it has dips in them), then I have 2 Dunlop 3" D-95 toppers on top of that. If I put 3 toppers I would need a step ladder to get to the top. So the two 3" D-95 toppers always worked until I received this years toppers. They are all softer than previous purchases. Have other people made this complaint?? Thanks for any insight you can shed on this matter. Not sure what I will be able to sleep on if the old D-95’s are no longer available.

2

Hello tskubala and welcome to the forums! There are a handful of Dunlop manufacturers in the world, including Latex Green, Eco Latex, Coco Latex, Arpico, Latexco, and several others. However, Dunlop is inconsistent because of the manufacturing process, so that if we or any company shipped you 10 extra firm Dunlop layers, all of the layers will be softer or firmer than the others. In fact, the range is so big that the firmest medium can be pretty much just as firm as the softest firm layer. As such, it sounds like you might have initially received D95 layers that were on the firmer end of the extra firm spectrum, and recently received D95 layers on the softer end of the extra firm spectrum. This is natural and really just the nature of Dunlop. For us, the person who pulls our latex of the shelves has been with us for around 25 years, and he can actually hand-pick the firmest extra firm layer, softest medium, etc. out of our stock. Have you tried contacting the company you bought the layers from to see if they’ll offer an exchange for at least one of the layers?

3

No I have not contacted anyone at the two last companies I received the toppers from. At the time of the purchase I talked to people and explained I needed the firmest possible because of the Rod and all the Metal in my back, and the extent of the fused back, but I still ended up with softer toppers than I received in the previous 4-5 years. I buy them every year and this year they have been so soft. I guess they are just going downhill like everything else. Nothing seems to be made with quality any longer. One of the companies I did return the topper to as it was stated on the packing list that it was a Talalay but they kept telling me it was a Dunlop and they told me to open it anyway. So I did but it was too soft to sleep on so I returned it and they graciously refunded my money (with a bit of a fight since they had charged over $400 for a twin topper). But these last two I bought are from SleepEz and the other is from Sleeping Organic. I have not asked for refunds since they are listed as Dunlop Extra Firm toppers. I was just curious if the D-95’s and the Extra Firm’s had different ILD’s. I was also curious why for 5 years they were really firm and now, starting this year, they are much softer. I will have to find some other means of finding something to sleep on. I thought 5 yrs ago I found a good solution to my problems, but it seems to have been short lived. Thank you for your help. I hate to try to return these last two, as it is difficult to re-wrap and re-package not to mention the cost of the shipping to and from, as the mattresses are labeled properly. So no one pulled the wrong topper to ship. Thanks for your help.

4

I only wish your employee from SleepEz would have pulled the firmest Dunlop for me. As on the invoice I stated I wished to purchase the firmest D95 possible, as well as stated it to the young lady I spoke to on the phone. But like I said before, it is much too difficult to re-roll and re-package the topper for a return. I can always save it as my husband will be able to use it on his side of the King Size bed. His last topper is still in good shape so we will just wait until he needs it. He has no fusions in his back and will have no problem sleeping on it. I believe that Latex manufactures have softened their product from previous years. I will just need to find another means for sleeping on my side. Latex no longer sounds like the way to go from what I have seen this year. Thank you.

5

If you’re having specific issues with a Sleep EZ order, please contact us directly and we’ll do whatever we can to get it taken care of for you. Without seeing the order details and notes, I can’t say what actually happened, but please note that latex is not getting softer or going down in quality, despite what your experience with the new toppers might indicate.

6

Hi tskubala.

As I was reading through your post and the description of your current sleeping setup I realized that there may be some other factors you may need to consider.

As SleepEZ mentions, it is true that different latex manufacturers have different firmness ranges for the same stated density, but how firm the latex “feels” to each individual depends on their own perception, and to complicate things even more it is also related to the type of latex (Blended, NR, or SBR). Additionally, in the case of Dunlop (as SleepEZ mentioned), there are variances in density and ILD between the 3" top or bottom cuts sliced from a 6" core. This is why manufacturers will customize and pick the top or bottom by hand according to customer needs. Latex particles in Dunlop production settle more when they are poured into a mold and a 3" Dunlop layer that is cut from the bottom half of a 6" Dunlop core can be firmer than a 3" layer cut from the top half and the top would be softer than the bottom. With Talalay, however, density and ILDs are more consistent from top to bottom so it doesn’t matter as much which part of the core a thinner layer was cut from. All the layers cut from a single core will be rated the same even though they may not have exactly the same ILD.

To add to the above considerations, there may be (and most likely are) even more variables at play that you’d need to consider. To start off, it looks like your condition requires a very firm and even surface so I’d suggest a few experiments before attempting to exchange, replace layers, or take further action.

I’d first do a “ground up” assessment to make sure that there is nothing under the mattress that may be contributing to a “bend” of the latex into an existing “virtual” dip or sag within the mattress which generally wouldn’t be visible to the naked eye as most foams, rubber, and flexible materials have a strong tendency to rebound to a level that is not detectible when the weight is removed. These sags or dips can be sensed by the body only under the weight of the mattress and people sleeping on it. In your case these virtual impressions may be caused by several factors … for example, the sleep number air chamber fabric stretched or softened over time in certain areas or the “hard plastic slats” on which your sleep number sits started to lose their properties especially if there is no center support to the floor (for bed sizes larger than twins) or both. In this case, it’s less likely that any Xfirm layer added on top will be an effective solution because you can’t compensate for soft spots or dips because they will just “bend” into the softer areas underneath them and any effect they have will tend to be partial or temporary at best. If this is the case then there are some suggestions in post #4 here that may be helpful.

You can verify if this is the case by placing your Xfirm Dunlop layers on the floor on top of each other and sleeping on them for several nights to assess your alignment and need for more firmness and compare it with your previous setup. If you sleep better than either the foundation and/or sleep number may be"dipping" under the weight of the mattress, additional layers, and sleepers on top. and you’d need to determine which one, or if both are the culprits.

If the 3" layers placed on the floor still feel too soft you may want to further eliminate the top layer. This will also allow you to determine if your level of comfort or needs changed over time. I’d keep in mind that as we age, gain weight, lose weight, but especially with chronic health issues, skeletal and structural replacements, the muscles will typically tense or stretch to compensate for any minor or major changes. They will adjust and readjust in an attempt to allow the body to get restorative nightly rest. When the adjustment threshold is too high you’ll gradually feel the discomfort and end up waking up in pain.

Another factor to consider would be the thickness of the layers you used in the past vs the thickness of your new setup. Thickness and softness work together and the more thickness you add to the mattress the softer it will feel.

Hope this brings more precision to your perspective while looking for the best solution.
Phoenix

7

Thank you for you response Phoenix. If what you say is true that different latex “manufacturers” have different firmness ranges for the same stated density, I will be out of luck to find the actual manufacturer who made the actual Dunlop D-95’s I purchase in the prior 5 years (from Plush Beds), as those were the same firmness and density from year to year. You can line them up side by side on a wood floor and you will not see or feel any difference in the density when you lay on them. You can roll from one to the other without there being any lump or difference as your roll, which was fabulous. But this year, the two new ones, if you lay them next to the previous years purchased D-95’s, they squash down to a soft 2" topper and leave you with a huge uncomfortable lump moving from the prior D-95 to the newer x-tra firms as you roll from one to the other. The newer ones also don’t do a decent job of keeping all the rods, pins, plates, and metal holding my back together in a unified manner. Because of the difference between the older densities and these two new softer ones, I will not be able to lay them next to my husbands side of the bed. We have a king size sleep number bed that I removed the padded topping from as well as their foam since it was causing me too many problems. The padded topping had a dip in it which was causing me extreme pain. I then would put D-95 toppers on top of the air cylinders and then a mattress cover over all holding everything together and then the sheets. My husband could air up his side to his comfort and I would do the same (with mine always being 100%), but he and I could not feel any real difference or “un-godly LUMP” if we were to roll a bit onto the other person’s side. Then after a year’s time, my side would need to be replaced as there would be a small dip in the center (even tho I rotated the toppers constantly to help not wear the dip too deep ). This worked for many years, but this year it all came to a halt as no one seems to be able to send us the same firm, dense, D-95’s that we received in prior years.

Plush Beds sent a topper that they said was a D-95 but the packing list said it was a Talalay x-tra firm. It was unbearable to lay on. They finally let me return it. Then I spoke to a person at Sleeping Organic and told him what I needed and he said they would pick the firmest they had. But what arrived was a topper that was comparable to the soft topper I had just returned to Plush Beds. I did not contact Sleeping Organic as I saw that there were no returns on toppers without the restocking fee, and you picking up the cost of the shipping, etc. But with the Sleeping Organic topper it was labeled as being a Dunlop X-TRA Firm, so I knew it wasn’t an error in the order and the company had not pulled the wrong topper such as I believed Plush Beds to do. I just considered it a loss, and put it on the floor in a back bedroom that was being used as and exercise room. I had plenty of room for it to lay in there until I could figure out what to do with it. I then went on and found Sleep-EZ and ordered a Dunlop X-TRA frim as no one called them D-95’s any longer. On the order ( Order #24833) I specified in the Order comments: “I am needing the firmest Dunlop Latex possible for my back that is fused from the shoulder blades to the tailbone.” After placing the order a young lady called me and I discussed with her about the extent of the fused back and I was needing the firmest latex possible as I always ordered D-95’s in the past and asked if the D-95’s were the same as X-TRA firm. She said they were and we confirmed my order.

But, alas, what I received was yet another soft topper that did not have the firmness as any of my previous D-95’s but was instead a soft mess of latex. I let the latex topper from now, both companies, lay on the floor, unrolled to air out in the hopes they would firm up. But they never firmed up enough. I tried putting one each (a D-95 and a softer new X-TRA firm) on each side of the bed, but I could still feel the little dip that was in the previous year’s D-95 through the new X-TRA Firm (which was the reason I had tried to find a new D-95 as I always did every Jan. That little dip causes a great deal of pain). Then we put the D-95’s on my husbands side (since the dips don’t bother him as he has a regular back) and put the two new X-TRA Firms on my side. That left a huge difference in the mattresses as even though I air up mine to 100%. It was like having two 3" toppers next to two 2" toppers since the two new ones flattened out so much as I laid on them. So then we put all the toppers on the floor so I could see what was going on. All the previous D-95’s were much denser and firmer than the two newest X-TRA firm Dunlop’s I recently received. No doubt about it. The new ones squash down to nothing.

I see no reason to ask for a refund as Sleep-EZ evidentially sent me their firmest since it is the same as Sleeping Organics. They both are no where near as comparable as the older D-95’s. My guess is that the manufacturers are no longer making them as firm. Also, it would be extremely difficult for us to try and re-roll and re-pack them to send back. There is only so much I can do with this back. Now my only hope is to lay some of the D-95’s on the floor in the back room for a year or so and hope the dip will plump up or firm up with time. In the mean time I guess I will have to either resort to sleeping on a different bed from my husband with maybe some 1" plywood (cut by home depot) and put the new soft toppers on the wood. I am hoping that will give me enough stability to get some sleep. I wish there was a way to sleep in the same bed as we had been doing for past years but that doesn’t seem to be an option any longer. I don’t believe for a minute that I will ever find the GOOD Firm/Dense Dunlop D-95’s ever again, and I am not about to keep wasting money trying to find them with only soft latex being delivered to my home.

You can say they haven’t changed, but I and this back of mine know that is not true. Maybe the manufacturers are not being honest with you. But if you had this back of mine fused together as mine is you would know what is being sold as Dunlop X-TRA Firm in no way begins to compare to the previous years Dunlop D-95’s. Nor do I believe that 5 yrs of good dense firm toppers was simply my good luck to get firm toppers and all of a sudden my luck has changed to get soft toppers. Whoever is making/pouring the Dunlop toppers has made changes…maybe because the public didn’t like them that firm, or just cutbacks as everyone is scratching to become richer. 20 or so years ago Sleep Number made a really firm pillow and I loved it. It supported my head and neck and kept all in alignment with the back. A few years later I ordered another one and what they sent was soft as crap. I called them and told them about it, and they at least were honest with me. They changed the way they made them, as people said the extra-firm was too firm and gave them headaches. So they changed the firmness so their firmest was too soft for me but the public liked it better so they sold more. It wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest that this is much of what is happening now. Maybe most people can not tolerate the level of Firmness that was once a D-95 and the manufacturers have made changes and thus the new name X-TRA Firm instead of D-95 (too bad they don’t publicize the ILD’s any longer).

I appreciate all you have said. But I know my back and I have lived a lifetime with this back. The levels of thickness, or the changes as we age, etc. are not what is in play here. As my husband reminds me, that with the first surgery back in 1977, I was screaming out with pain, and what was causing the pain turned out to be a wrinkle in the bedsheet. I have had many surgeries on this back with the last one in 1993 that finished all the fusions down to the tailbone and a plate going across the tailbone area and the plate screwing into the pelvic bones. At least for the last 5 years I was able to sleep comfortably with the annul changing of the D-95’s. After reading everything and laying out all the toppers on the floor next to each other, I know that it is a change in the product. If the manufacturers changed the product then there is no reason to complain to Sleep-EZ or Sleeping Organic or anyone else. They can only sell what is being manufactured and shipped to them. It is time for me to try and find another means to get some sleep. It was great while it lasted.

8

I might also mention in case you didn’t know, all of these toppers I am speaking about are twin 3 inch toppers. I would put the best/newest toppers on my side of the king bed and my husband would inherit my year to two year old toppers that had the slight dip in the center where my hip would cause the dip. I am a side sleeper and can’t lay on my back very long due to the way they attached all the rods, pins, plates, etc. to the spine and pelvic bones. I also only weight 130 lbs.