Thanks for the well wishes and also for all of your advice and help. Without you and the others here I would have been like a fish out of water with this stuff. One never knows for sure of course but I feel that with the information I have gained here in just a week’s time that I made good, intelligent choices for my needs. Anyone serious about a good night’s sleep needs to visit the Mattress Underground.
Hi JDMWDC,
This is not actually a “pillowtop” layer (which is very different) but a quilting layer which is compressed with the quilting design. They also have different mattresses which use different amounts of quilting foam and other materials as well (such as wool) depending on the mattress and on the “feel” that the design goal is meant to achieve.
Once you get into the range of about 2" or more then I would be cautious (and the Sealy Pillowtops nave much more than this) but in this range it’s there to fine tune the feel and performance of the mattress. You can read a bit more about quilting layers in post #2 here and the post it links to.
As you are pointing out … ordering a mattress online can have some extra risk involved. You can read about some of the pros and cons of local vs online (which of course is an ongoing discussion) in this thread as well as post #2 here. Good local testing on similar materials or designs can certainly be helpful to reduce the risk. Some online mattresses are also made to be similar in “feel” and performance to some mattresses (such as Tempurpedic) that are widely available locally which can then be used for local testing as an approximation. In other cases … exchange or return policies (either for a mattress or for individual layers) can also reduce the risk substantially because then your own sleeping experience can be used for “testing”.
What you were told is also correct that higher quality and density foams are also more durable (and logically they are also more costly as well of course). You can read more about the many factors that are involved in durability in post #4 here (and the post it links to as well).
As in all things connected with mattresses … the parts of each person’s “personal value equation” that are most important and each person’s risk tolerance and the tradeoffs they are happy to make can be quite different.
Phoenix
Well I pulled the trigger today and bought the Aloe Alexis. I’ll probably start another thread with my experience.
Hi Kmfl98,
You certainly made a great choice and I think that the Aloe Alexis with its two latex layers is one of their most popular mattresses.
Congratulations on your new mattress 
I’m looking forward to your feedback when you receive it and have had a chance to sleep on it.
Phoenix
Phoenix,
What’s the rule with regard to “sink in” of the memory foam? I’m having difficulty determining if the Aloe Alexis double latex, or memory foam + latex would be better. I know when I have tried memory foam at department stores, I’ve liked the “Firm” variety, but BB, for example, only has 1 type of 4 lb memory foam to offer. Would you expect it to be more firm or more plush? How would altering the firmness of the latex layer underneath impact the memory foam layer? I actually saw 1 mattress manufacturer who says putting latex ABOVE a memory foam layer is the way to go, as it slows the speed by which memory foam breaks down (under the premise that memory foam, over time, will gradually cause you to sink deeper and deeper into it.)
Also from a budget standpoint, how important is that second layer of latex in the Aloe Alexis? That is, how would you expect a double-latex Aloe Alexis to behave vs. their single-layer Cotton Camilla or Bamboo Bliss? It’s a $400 price savings (king size) to go down to the Bamboo (Cotton Camilla being nearly half the cost), so worth asking.
Thank you!!
Hi JDMWDC,
What’s the rule with regard to “sink in” of the memory foam?
As with most things concerning mattresses … the “rules” are always about how a mattress performs not about which materials or design is “better or worse” because this depends on the person. Better and worse is always measured by how a specific mattress interacts with a specific person. Everything comes down to which mattress provides you with the best possible spinal alignment in all your sleeping positions, the best possible pressure relief in your most pressure prone positions, and has the combination of other qualities that you most prefer (ventilation and temperature regulation, motion isolation, responsiveness and resiliency, freedom or restriction of movement, feeling more “in” the mattress or “on” the mattress and many others) along with the durability of materials that will ensure that the properties of the mattress stay closer to their original specifications for a longer time than lower quality materials and the tradeoff between cost and higher performance and more durable materials and designs.
Every type of material including memory foam has many different versions or varieties that each have their own unique and different properties (you can read about some of the differences between different types of memory foam in post #9 here and post #8 here). I can only speak to the quality and value of a mattress (which has nothing to do with how it may feel and perform for a specific person) and because I have never slept on their mattresses I have no personal experience with how they feel for me (and my specific body type and sleeping style) or how they may feel for someone else. The manufacturers themselves are always the best source and are in the best position to describe how their memory foam feels and performs or how one of their mattresses as a whole may compare to others that either you or they they are familiar with.
Each different mattress design and the thickness and types of layering and other components will also make a significant difference in terms of how a mattress interacts with different types of people with different body types and sleeping styles. Heavier people, people who have a narrower waist and either wider shoulders or hips, or people who are side sleepers will sink into the top layers more deeply than lighter people or those who sleep in flatter positions (back and stomach). The middle layer is more of a transition layer and has a more “dual” role in a mattress because it “helps” with pressure relief, primary support, and secondary support and is a big part of how a mattress adapts to different people and different sleeping positions. Because latex is so adaptable and has a wider range of response between soft with initial compression where it needs to be and firmer where it needs to be with deeper compression … it is particularly useful in transition layers. In addition to this it is also a very durable material and will keep its properties for a long time and for those people who sink into the mattress past the top layer it’s durability can also play an important role in the durability of the mattress as a whole.
The middle transition layer will also lend its properties to the layers above it. If the transition layer is more resilient (and latex has much higher resilience than memory foam which has very little at all) then depending on how thick the layer above it is and on how much someone sinks into the mattress … it will “modify” the properties of the layer above it to different degrees. If the transition layer is latex and the top layer is thin enough for a particular person to “feel” the deeper layers … then the “feel” of the mattress will be more resilient and responsive to movement. If the transition layer is memory foam … then the “feel” of the mattress will be mush less resilient and responsive to movement. Memory foam tends to “restrict” movement because it absorbs energy and latex tends to “allow” movement because it is highly resilient and returns energy to the body when you move. The closer to the top of a mattress a particular layer is the more it will contribute to the overall feel and response of the mattress. “Comfort” which is what most people feel when they first lie on a mattress and is most dependent on the upper layers. Support and sleeping with your spine in a neutral alignment in all your sleeping positions over the course of the night is what most people will “feel” when they wake up in the morning (with or without stiffness and back discomfort or pain).
As you can see in post #4 here (and the posts it links to) which talks about all the factors involved in durability … this is correct and the layers above another layer will improve the durability of the layers below it.
I am also one of those who likes the combination of memory foam and latex in the comfort layers (although I prefer all latex even more) and I also prefer latex over memory foam (with a thin layer of latex over a thin layer of memory foam so that they “modify” each other more effectively than a thicker top layer would) because I prefer a more resilient sleeping surface that “allows” for more free movement on a mattress. As you mentioned this is the other way around than is most commonly found. One advantage of the Aloe Adele for example is that you can reverse the top two layers and put latex over the memory foam.
I tend to approach things from the other direction. As you can see in post #2 here which compares a latex hybrid mattress to an all latex mattress … there are clear differences between their performance levels and then the question becomes whether the higher cost of a higher performance mattress that has more costly and higher performance materials is comfortably in your budget range. Not everyone can afford the highest quality mattress available even though they would be “worth it” in terms of quality, performance, and durability. The other advantage of a mattress like the Aloe Alexis (or Aloe Adele) is that it allows you to “fine tune” both the comfort layer and the middle transition layer so it is a much more flexible design in terms of customizing a mattress to your specific needs and preferences either before or after a purchase. A forum search on aloe alexis bamboo bliss (you can just click this) will also bring up more posts with more information about how they may compare.
These are all decisions that need to be answered on an individual basis based on your own unique personal value equation and what is most important to you because nobody else can really tell you which would be better or worse or match your personal criteria in a mattress better than you.
Phoenix
Phoenix,
Comparing the Cotton Camilla to the Bamboo Bliss for a moment. What value is there between the two? From what I can tell, the difference is 2" more of the HD foam core. To me it seems like that wouldn’t be noticeable. My wife and I are about 150 lbs each, so the bottom 2" would probably be doing a very minimal job, if any job, in support. Is this reasonable or am I missing something?
Thank you!
Hi JDMWDC,
It’s usually best to ask specific questions about specs directly to the manufacturer because they have the most accurate and current information.
But since I know how these two compare for now I can answer here as well.
The Cotton Camilla is the entry level and uses a 1.5 lb polyfoam base layer vs a higher quality 2.17 lb polyfoam base layer in the Bamboo Bliss and Aloe Alexis. It also doesn’t have the higher quality cover with quilted wool in it that are in the models above the Cotton Camilla and there are only 2 comfort choices in the Cotton Camilla vs 6 with the Bamboo Bliss.
Hope this helps
Phoenix.
I have a 10" total latex that I bought about a month ago, and I’m not sure how happy I am with it. I like it much more than my TempurPedic Cloud Supreme that I had before it, but I think the BB bed is getting to be too soft. I even customized it to make it fairly firm, and I’m a lightweight guy (5’9", 150lbs) but it’s kind of making my back sore. The bed is three layers, with the bottom two layers fused together. All Talalay, 36ILD, 32ILD and 28ILD on the top. Mario told me this was the equivalent of a “5”. I find that the top layer is sagging a bit, there’s an impression, and if I sleep on the edge of the bed, I now feel as though I’m at the top of a valley that I could roll into at any point. However, it was very comfortable before the top layer softened up so much.
Another issue I have with it is the construction of the core. They told me that the two layers would be fused together, which was fine. When I was chatting with Mario, he told me that the core would be removable, just that the two layers would be fused together. I liked this idea because it gave me the ability to flip the core, and if I wanted to, put the soft layer below the core and sleep on the 32ILD layer, if I desired.
When I got the mattress, I unzipped the cover out of curiosity to find that the two layers of the core are sewn into the cover, so only the top layer (28ILD layer) of the mattress is removable. This means that I have to exchange it for a firmer layer instead of just changing the order of the latex in the mattress that I already have, avoiding having to ship big expensive pieces of latex around the country, which is not a good solution, and I’d like to avoid.
The weight for the mattress was quoted to be 130LBs. I can tell you that it weighs MUCH more than that, it took 2 burly guys to carry it up my stairs, friends who I tricked into doing it. I could have carried it myself if it was 130 pounds. I told them I couldn’t and how much it weighed and they told me I was a wimp, so they came over and did it, then told me it was much heavier than 130. This would have been nice to know, because if I didn’t have friends who could have helped me, I would have been stuck not being able to get it up the stairs in my house.
I will also say that I had read the shredded latex pillows were a little underfilled. This was mentioned in a few of their reviews. I think they took that to heart because the pillows I got are very overfilled, extremely fluffy. I wish there was a way to empty a bit out, because I could easily make a 3rd pillow out of the excess in the two I have. Not a huge deal, but again a simple zipper would have made this a non issue.
I will mention that the mattress was delivered without signature required. This is something that the shipper decides when they ship the package. This is just something to keep in mind, your ~$2000 bed will be sitting on the ground outside your house if you’re not home when it gets there. That made me a bit nervous when it was delivered.
On their website, they advertise that if you purchase the 10" Total Latex mattress, you have 120 days of comfort exchanges, absolutely free. This is not amended anywhere, it just says that it’s absolutely free. In speaking with one of their reps, the exchange process is kind of complicated, and you have to pay a $200 deposit, which makes it not free. He kept explaining to me why they need to obtain the deposit, and that’s not the point, and not what I am not understanding. I just don’t understand why they would advertise the fact that it is “absolutely free” when they are taking money from you, even temporarily, that is not free. It’s kind of misleading actually.
I am sorry to hear all that. On Thursday I will have the exact same mattress delivered by FedEx. I also asked BB about the weight and was told the mattress weighs 120-125 lbs for King Size (that seemed quite light when I read that in the email response). “Jacob” also told me he and his wife were able to carry the King Size Aloe Alexis mattress up two flights of stairs with no problem. The Aloe mattress has to weigh considerably more than the one I bought since it is 4" thicker than the all natural latex mattres. However, I have to believe what I was told is correct because the FedEx tracking sheet shows 135lbs shipping weight and that also includes the mattress cover (and my order was for a queen size). But if you are correct and BB gave me the wrong weight, I too will have to “trick” a couple friends into helping me!!
I explained I was 6 foot, 230 lbs, which is quite a bit larger than you, yet a “5” firmness was also recommended for me. I indicated that I like a firmer mattress as a matter of course but was told the “5” should be right for me. All I can say is that I hope my impressions are different than yours - we will have to wait and see.
Well my Aloe Alexis is suppose to be delivered friday. Mine is a king and fedex tracking says it’s 83.7 lbs. That’s worrysome. It also says the box measures 42x16x15. I would have thought the box shouid be as tall as a king is wide?!? I sure hope I don’t have any premature impressions forming!
A lot of times these mattress shops will compress the latex for shipping. I don’t think it reduces shipping costs. every time ai’ve shipped something, they charge by weight. But it probably protects the mattress from damage, e.g. knocking around something when it’s compressed is less dangerous than when it’s all loose and hanging out.
My Cloud Luxe is supposed to be delivered on Friday too. Fed Ex is making me crazy because there have been no location updates since it left Phoenix. 
The weight is listed as a total of 110 lbs. I hope they bring it to the porch. There are no box dimensions in my tracking report, again getting anxious.
Hi Kmfl98,
The mattresses are compressed before shipping because courier companies have both size and weight restrictions for shipping and if it doesn’t fit their size restrictions (and a mattress doesn’t) then it would have to be shipped truck freight which is much more costly.
As long as it isn’t compressed for extended periods of time and the foam is good quality (and both of these are the case with Dreamfoam) it will have no effect on the durability of the mattress.
Phoenix
Hi noneedlessnoise,
By my standards … this qualifies as free or as they call it “risk free” and it’s quite reasonable to expect a deposit to ensure that the exchanged layer is returned. More than that though … their return and exchange policy is explained in detail on their site here so there is no reason for anyone to be surprised or complain about something that is clearly outlined when they make a purchase. When you make an online purchase it’s important to make sure you understand the details and are comfortable with a manufacturer’s or retailer’s return and exchange policies before you make a purchase. This is (or should be) part of every online purchase so there are never any surprises or reasons to be unhappy when you need to make an exchange. A good exchange policy is part of the “value” of an online purchase and helps to offset the risk that you may make the wrong comfort choice which is part of the inherent risk every online mattress purchase.
It’s unlikely that your latex has softened as much as you believe it has (outside of the slight amount that is part of the initial break in period for a mattress and part of this is the cover and quilting as well) but for most people their subjective impressions of their mattress will change over the first few weeks and this is just a normal part of adjusting to a new mattress. If you put the layer on a flat floor for example you will almost certainly find that any slight impressions are not the latex but the ticking and quilting materials (depending on how slight you are talking about of course). Latex mattresses also don’t usually have edge support so if you sleep close to the edge it will be a little softer and this is also normal for this type of mattress.
If for some reason you have a defective layer (which can happen on occasion of course although it is a small percentage of people who will actually experience this) then if you talk with them and it is confirmed that you have an unusual softening issue they are the type of manufacturer who will go out of their way to fix any reasonable issue you may have.
If you were given incorrect information (or if you misunderstood correct information) then I would also bring this to their attention to help make sure that others also understand that only the top layer can be accessed and exchanged. The description on their site is fairly clear and says that only the top layer can be accessed and exchanged and I think most of the people who work there would know this and would have no reason to provide you with incorrect information but in any case regardless of whether it was misinformation or your misunderstanding I would bring it to their attention so that it is less likely to happen to someone else.
The first step though is to call them and talk with them about your issues and the options you have to change your comfort choice which is the main value of having an exchangeable layer in the first place.
Phoenix
Check your tracking again, my Aloe Alexis in King was just delivered and they used two separate packages. You probably have two numbers linked together in the FedEx report. Both of mine were ~90-lbs (one 90, one 95 for a total weight of 185-lbs) and one was 79x15x15 with the other being close to your 42x16x15 dimensions.
The larger box was the main support core and quilting of the mattress (which is why it is the full King width) and the smaller box was the four 3" talalay latex pieces.
Hope that helps!
Fed Ex is making me crazy. There have been no updates to the location of my mattress since Saturday. Am I worrying for nothing? It says they expect delivery tomorrow.
I’ve noticed that with FedEx they don’t update locations as often as UPS usually its because the package is on one long haul truck so its not unloaded/loaded and scanned each time. If they have a delivery date I wouldn’t worry. There will probably be an update the evening before delivery when it reaches a regional facility and is unloaded to be put on a local truck.
nik
My base was delivered wednesday and the latex today. We had to sleep on the base foam with the quilting layer (no latex) and it felt great to me. I had a great nights sleep. I prefer a firm surface so now that I have my latex (32/28) I’m excited to sleep on it tonight! I’ll report back.
You slept on it that quickly? I thought these things had to take a few days to get into shape after being compressed for shipping. I just checked the FedEx tracking and it says “delivered”. I went to the garage just now and there it is! The box looks a bit damaged but nothing too serious, at least not for something made of latex. I’m now going to open it up to decompress but I have to wait for my Ergo advanced mechanical bed which comes on June 4th. By that time the mattress should be stretched out to spec. Exciting time!!
I will edit this because it only took me 15 minutes to load the box on my dolly, bring to my bedroom and unpack. It looks great! The weight is total dead weight so it seems much heavier than the 130lbs listed but I believe that weight is correct. Nonetheless, I could not carry it alone up flights of stairs but I had no steps to my bedroom and with my dolly it was a piece of cake. I unwrapped it and it puffed up to what looked like spec right away. However, the instructions in the box said to give it 24-48 hours in a warm room before using so that is what I will do (as I said before, my base won’t get here until June 4 so it will have plenty of time to fully decompress). I believe by that time the fairly strong chemical smell will leave the mattress as well. I can’t wait until the 4th!