Latex Mattresses

Just a note to consider, I recently got the Snowmass mattress since it felt a slight bit firmer. I had been told that they tend to soften up a little as you sleep on them and I would agree, it does seem to feel just a little softer after I have been laying on it for over 10 to 15 minutes. Still has plenty of support and is very comfortable.

Hi Sepia,

The better choices I’m aware of in the NYC area are listed in post #2 here and a more categorized list with more detailed descriptions or many of them are in post #4 here.

Neither Original mattress or Denver mattress are close to NYC and shipping costs would likely be prohibitive so I would focus either on local choices (particularly the last group of 5 on the NJ list, 3 of which are close to you) or on better manufacturers that specialize in working with customers online or on the phone (and some of the best in the country of this type and that are recommended members here are listed in post #21 here).

Phoenix

Hello Phoenix
Thank you so much for your detailed response. It is a new experience for me to put my questions out on a forum and get personal attention!
To be more specific about my daughter’s sleep profile: 5’10", 155 lbs, side sleeper mostly, lordosis with some back issues, likes “plush” feel = not too soft but definitely not very firm. She is also a health conscious, very “natural products” customer. Sounds like good support layer and then not sure what for comfort. She likes the idea of the wool in cover but you mention that wool can “isolate from the response of latex” and over time will compact and feel firmer. She also has never slept on latex.
Given her location the on line sources are the best. She really doesn’t have time to test mattresses that aren’t even ones she would get. So she is trusting that we find the right combination. She is also a student so doesn’t feel this has to be the mattress that will last forever (10 -20 yrs) but find her a comfortable healthy bed now that lasts 5-6 yrs. My sister just got a mattress from Gardiner in MA but that more of an investment.
This makes the Dreamfoam natural with 100% natural dunlap and the wool sound good, although the talalay comfort layer might be softer as one of your members asked if they put the wool with it. As the dunlap is firmer over all, does it come in different ILD to affect the feel or is it in the 1-10 scale?
Also the AZ mattress with the zones sounds interesting but maybe too difficult to design.
Actually, I was raised on a dunlap “rubber” mattress in the northeast and tried for years to find them but they seemed to have disappeared from the market. I didn’t find them again until the internet. A friend just got a Sonoroll “latex” but I couldn’t any specifics - have you heard of it?
Amazon also lists “Eco-lux” and “Tranquility” mattresses, have you reviewed them?
Thank you for your help.

Hi katscan,

Wool is a great material to have in the quilting of your mattress but like every other choice it has pros and cons. It is very breathable and temperature regulating and in thinner layers and as part of a stretch knit cover can have less effect on the feel of the latex below it but in thicker layers you will feel more of the wool and less of the latex. A wool topper or mattress protector or mattress pad can also be added to a latex mattress. In other words … it is not a matter of better or worse but more about personal preferences and differences. The “feel” of wool is not better or worse than the feel of latex … just different and one will affect the other.

If I was adding a thicker wool layer though (vs a thinner one in the quilting) … I would tend to add it as a topper or mattress pad rather than in the quilting of the mattress. A thicker wool layer will develop some impressions in it which is part of how wool responds but impressions in wool are not the same as impressions in polyfoam (which means the polyfoam is softening and breaking down). A separate wool topper or mattress pad also allows you to replace it without replacing the whole mattress should that be necessary. It’s really a matter of degree and how well any combination of materials fits your needs and preferences. Both wool and latex are premium materials in a mattress or sleeping system and the trick is to make sure that any combination you use fits your needs and preferences.

While “good” latex is a great quality material … I would never recommend sleeping on a mattress that used materials that someone wasn’t at least generally familiar with. Not everyone likes the feel of latex or any other material and with an online purchase I strongly recommend some local testing as a guideline. Any good quality mattress should last 5-6 years if it is well matched to the person and uses good quality materials … especially in the upper layers which tends to be the weak link of a mattress.

Each manufacturer is very familiar with the combination of components in their mattresses and is the best place to get more specific recommendations about the mattresses they make. They have “standard” recommendation for all the mattresses they make based on their knowledge of every component and layer (every layer and component affects every other layer and component in the mattress), “averages”, and feedback from their customer base along with any local testing that may indicate personal preferences. The 1 - 10 scale with the Dreamfoam is based on different ILD’s in the latex comfort layer (both Dunlop and Talalay have different firmness levels) but they use the scale because it is easier for consumers to understand and relate to than ILD numbers which for most consumers have little meaning.

Both Dunlop and Talalay come in a range of firmness choices so either one could be softer or firmer but in the same ILD … Dunlop will tend to feel a little firmer than Talalay. Each person also has a different “value equation” (the things that are more or less important) but the Dunlop would be a good choice for those who like the feel of Dunlop and the temperature regulation and other benefits of wool in the quilting. Just as an example … I personally prefer Talalay but my daughter bought a mattress in the last couple of days and after testing both she preferred the feel of Dunlop which is what she purchased after testing both.

Most manufacturers would be doing the “designing” based on your statistics and any feedback you provide so the designing is fairly simple and is based on their knowledge and experience. The best suggestion is to talk with the manufacturer about any online mattress you are considering because this is the only way to get a sense of how well their particular design will “fit” your needs and preferences and the various options you may have. Arizona Premium for example would have 3 basic firmness choices (in their “standard” 6" + 2" mattress) which is soft, medium, and firm so there isn’t a lot of “designing” involved although they of course have other options in terms of type of latex and thicker comfort layers as well.

If the Sonorall is this one … then it doesn’t provide any information about what is in it except to say that it includes 1" of Celsion. The rest of the materials are unknown so there is no way to make any meaningful comments about it.
ADMIN NOTE:Removed 404 page link | Archived Footprint: mauibedstore.com/products/mattresses/sonoroll-fairmont-plush-2/

The Eco-Lux is probably a Boyd mattress and some of these have latex and some have what they call “engineered latex” which is polyfoam and isn’t latex at all. If you provide a link to the mattresses you are curious about (to save me guessing which ones you mean or searching for them by model name which may lead to different mattresses) I’d certainly be happy to give you some brief comments if it includes (or I know) the layering of the mattress.

Phoenix

Hi again Phoenix,
Great work you are doing on here. I’ve been reading and trying to educate myself more since last I posted. I’m finally in a new apartment and can have a mattress delivered but I have some more questions.
I tried searching but I couldn’t find an answer to “What is the difference between a mattress that has innersprings/coils on the bottom with latex on top vs an all latex mattress?” I’m guessing the all latex mattress is softer? Being a side sleeper I want soft but having UPPER chronic back pain I don’t know if innersprings/coils with latex on top would be better? I have yet to get to the mattress stores around NYC yet b/c of moving and Hurricane Sandy but the answer to the above question will determine if I got to DixieFoam or RoomandBoard.
Secondly, if I go the all latex mattress route it seems there are some good online ones you pointed to in another post. The ones I liked best are:
Natural Talalay Latex Mattress w/ Organic Cotton Cover - $1395
9" All Natural Talalay Latex - $1390
ADMIN NOTE:Removed 404 page link | Archived Footprint: Latex Mattresses On Sale - Latex Mattress Toppers - Phoenix, AZ

What do you think of these choices compare to the DixieFoam all Latex Mattress ($1140 Queen)?

PS I saw a post where you admonished a troll trying to imply you get referral money. I think you handled it well and I do hope that very soon you can turn this into a profit where you can hire people to do some of the work (like webmaster) so you can concentrate on giving the mattress advise you are so good at and take a little time with your family.

Hi Sepia,

Both innersprings and a firmer latex core can be used as a support layer and each has very “different” characteristics but besides the more obvious ones the most important differences are the ones you can feel and that you personally prefer. Both of them come in softer or firmer versions and in many different designs so an innerspring could be firmer than a latex core or the other way around depending on the specifics of the components you are comparing. There is more about the 4 main types of innersprings in this article and in post #10 here and more detailed information about innersprings vs latex support cores in post #2 here and more about the different types and blends of latex in this article and in post #6 here.

Some of the more technical differences include …

Innersprings have a more “flat line” response curve than latex (see the graph here) but because there are many types of innersprings with different response curves this doesn’t always hold true and there are also different types of latex which would also have different response curves.

Innersprings absorb less energy than latex which means they are more resilient. They “push back” more strongly than latex in other words but this is not the same as softness … only about how much of the energy that is used to compress them is lost (or how high a ball will bounce when it’s dropped on them).

Latex has a similar or higher compression modulus than most innerspring spring rates and either gets firmer with deeper compression at a similar rate as an innerspring (Talalay) or at a faster rate than an innerspring (Dunlop) which means it can be more “supportive”.

Different innersprings have widely different abilities to take on the shape of the body (depending on the number of coils and how independently they function) while latex is much more “point elastic” than any of them because it can flex in each part of the core with less effect on the area around it than an innerspring.

In general latex will be more motion isolating than an innerspring.

Firmer latex will be more durable than an innerspring but neither of them would tend to be the weak link of a mattress.

Innersprings have more “air” in them so they would be more breathable than latex even though latex is the most breathable of the foam materials but the deeper layers of a mattress also have less effect on the ventilation and temperature of a mattress than the comfort layers.

Most latex is more expensive than most innersprings.

They “feel” very different with innersprings being more “bouncy” or “springy” than latex (although latex has more “spring” than other foam types).

There are many other more technical differences but the most important differences are the ones you can feel. Either of them can make a good choice for a support layer and in the end it really boils down to which one you tend to prefer. Both of them can provide good/support alignment. There are so many varieties of both that it’s not really possible to make more specific comparisons outside of some of the more obvious and more “generic” differences that I’ve mentioned.

Making more generalized assessments of a mattress only based on one component doesn’t take into account that all the layers in a mattress work together and will affect its feel and performance so either one could be part of a mattress that provides you with your pressure relief and alignment/support needs. Assuming that all the materials in a mattress are high quality … everything boils down to which mattress design works best for the two basic functions of a mattress.

I think that all of these could make very good choices. Once you have narrowed your list down to choices between “good and good” … my job is done and it’s time for me to “step out of the way” so you can decide on which is best based on your conversations with each manufacturer, your own personal risk tolerance (online is “riskier” than local), and the other parts of your “value equation” (see post #46 here) that are most important to you. I would never make a “final decision” for anyone else because that’s when it needs to be up to your own unique preferences and what is more or less important to you.

The good news is that there are no “bad” choices in your list and your own thoughts and confidence about which will best “match” what you need and prefer is the only real way to choose between them. I know from personal experience how difficult it can be to “eliminate” a great choice but it has to be done (unless you buy more than one mattress ;))

Thanks for the thoughts … and it’s nice to see that the site is reaching a place where I can “begin to breathe” and there are a lot of things that I have planned in the next year or two that will increase the scope and helpfulness of the site. :slight_smile:

Phoenix

OK so I finally out a mattress and have had it for a few weeks. So I figured I would report in as well as ask some questions.

I decided on the Rocky Mountain Talalay Latex Mattress with 16 IDL top layer over firm (35 IDL I think) bottom layer.

Customer Service of Rocky Mountain Mattress before I got the mattress was not good. They didn’t/couldn’t tell me where the mattress was or when it would be delivered. When it did finally get delivered the delivery guys left it just laying outside my apt (inside the gate but still on the outside street part of apt building). Yes they left a $1300-1400 purchase just laying around. I don’t work and am home all the time so luckily I saw it very soon after it was delivered when I took my dog out (no they didn’t ring the door bell).

The Mattress itself is comfortable and uncomfortable and this is where I need your help. When first lying on the mattress it is really comfortable & soft and has a firm but somewhat bouncy feel that you described. All those things I love about it. The problem occurs after a night of sleeping. I wake up with pain :(. What kind of pain? Pain in my lower back (which hasn’t been a problem for me) and added pain in my upper back (which is always a problem for me). Pain in my shoulder and in my hip. I like a soft mattress but is a soft mattress making it painful? Or is the mattress too firm so that it is causing me pain because my spine isn’t aligned right or my hip doesn’t sink in enough?

Before I return the mattress I want to know what I might do to remedy this problem. Right now the mattress is on a wood platform with no foundation. Should I get one of the foundations you talked about here: Post #1
Or should I get an overlay such as latex or memory foam?
Or should I do both?
I realize that those are different takes but I’m not sure exactly what to do?

PS Customer Service since I have the mattress has been good as they are willing to work with me whether I return it or give me a price break on an overlay if that is what I decide.

Hi Sepia,

It would be helpful to know your height/weight information and your sleeping positions but based on the construction of the mattress, your symptoms, and on the fact that you have a 2" layer of very soft latex in the comfort layer over a fairly firm support layer … I would suspect that you need a little more thickness in the comfort layers and that would likely solve the shoulder and hip discomfort (from going through the soft latex into the firmer latex below it) and it may well solve the lower back issues which could be coming from twisting away from pressure or from not having enough thickness in your comfort layer to fully fill in the lumbar gap in the small of your back.

Even though the top layer is soft … this would be more of a firm mattress because you are so close to the firmer layers and the upper layers are fairly thin and soft which lets you “go through” them and feel more of the firmness underneath them.

The first step is always to give yourself some time to adjust to a new mattress so that you aren’t making changes too quickly (and your body doesn’t have enough time to catch up to the changes in your sleeping surface).

Outside of that … I don’t think a different foundation would help much (you are already on a firm base on a wood platform and a tension adjustable base would likely only have a smaller effect because you would have 8" of latex over it) but this would likely be a situation where a topper would have very good odds of solving the issues you are facing.

Phoenix

THANKS SO MUCH PHOENIX! You have been such a help and I’ve recommended your website to several people including my doctor.
My height is 5’ 4 1/2"
My Weight is 168 lbs (yes I’m a vein woman and couldn’t put 170lbs cause those 2 lbs mean something :stuck_out_tongue: )
My sleeping position is side sleeper
I have a T5 Fracture as well as herniation at T7 & T8 (just added this info in case that is helpful?) so I have upper back pain mostly.
I’ve been sleeping on the Mattress for 2 1/2 weeks (not sure if that is enough time)

Re Comfort Layer
Do you think 2" comfort layer is enough? Or should I go for 3"? or 4"?
And I should continue with the latex re the comfort layer?
Should I keep with Talalay latex for the layer or Dunlop latex or a blend latex?

OR

Should I just return it and get a mattress that has a larger comfort layer (as in larger than 2" of soft latex)?

Thanks for any other info you can impart.

Hi Sepia,

Sorry to take so long to reply to this … I was up till about 5:00 AM last nigh/this morning and for some reason I skipped over your post (and a couple of others).

This would depend on many factors including your body shape, overall health condition (in terms of muscle tone etc), and sensitivity to pressure as well as the combination of the firmness of the topper and the firmness of the base layers below it.

In general terms a 3" - 4" comfort layer (what is in the mattress along with ny topper combined) would be in the average range and since your comfort layer is quite soft you may need something on the thicker end of this range to help isolate you from the firmness of the base layer.

I would use the topper guidelines in post #8 here along with post #4 here to help you decide how much extra thickness/softness you may need.

This is really a matter of personal preference. If you prefer the feel and performance of latex vs memory foam (the two most common topper materials) then I would go in this direction. With a mix of the two materials … you would have a combination of the feel and performance of both which some may like and others not so much.

Another option if you want to experiment a bit with a “cheap” topper (to see if it moves you in the right direction) before deciding on a higher quality more permanent replacement is in post #16 here (this is polyfoam which is a “fast response” material).

I would tend towards fine tuning what I had because its a clear reference point (and to save the expense and hassle of a return) if that was possible but this is also a personal decision of course and would depend on how you feel about one option vs the other. Keep in mind that if you order a mattress with a different combination of materials that it may also need some fine tuning because unless you have actually tested it … you won’t know for certain that the specific combination of layers is what you need and prefer.

Hope this helps.

Phoenix

Hi Phoenix,

I just found this thread. I’ve been looking for a full latex mattress and came across Denver Mattress Snowmass. I’m a side sleeper and I weigh 190. I’ve tried it for 30 minutes and its felt comfortable. But because it’s being discontinued, it’s being sold as a final sale which of course means if I don’t like it, I can’t return it. It’s selling for 30% off the $1349 price for the queen set. I offered 50% off since I’m taking a big risk in not being able to return it. The sales guy said he’s only authorized to go down to 40% off which would make it $875 including tax! That sounds like a great deal. Then he suggested I return tomorrow and talk to the manager about the 50% discount, which would be $675 plus tax. I think $875 is great, but I don’t feel so good about not being able to return it in case it doesn’t fit my needs. As Bobfrog stated earlier, it’s a 2" 24 ILD Talalay comfort layer with a 6" 32 ILD Talalay core and 1" foam padding. Being a side sleeper and weighing 190 lbs, what’s your opinion on these specs for someone like me? I did find it comfortable and while I’ve tried others and this has been the best feel. I think I"m crazy to pass up on this mattress. I suffer from allergies and latex is the way to go for me. But I’m wondering if I should save up my money for another mattress out there that would have better specs for my weight and side sleeping preference. I’m new to the latex mattress and would like your opinon on this. Thank you so very much.

Although the discount sounds very tempting I would recommend against it. When we bought the Snowmass it was wonderful for about the first 3 to 4 weeks. My only complaint was that it was so comfortable I didn’t want to get out of bed and slept till about 9:00 most mornings. However it did start to soften up quite a bit to the point of feeling a lot of aches and pains in the morning. It also felt somewhat hot at night in the bed. My wife and I finally couldn’t sleep on it and went back to our old very hard bed with a mattress topper. I called Denver Mattress and they were very nice, and are offering us an exchange for another mattress.
I can’t say what your experience will be like with the mattress, but I think I would like to have the insurance of being able to return it if I wasn’t happy. Better to spend the extra money on a chance to change it than being stuck with something that wasn’t right. When I was researching this I did contact an online company that sent the latex mattress pieces separately that you could then put together into a zip up mattress cover when you received them. This gave you the opportunity of seeing the ingredients (knowing what is going into the mattress) and changing the density to suit your needs. I was never quite sure about the layers of latex and 1.8lb density standard foam in the Snowmass since it did get so much softer over the breakin period. From what I had read latex was not supposed to do this, so I am still concerned about this hybrid combination, which may be why they are discontinuing the mattress or as they say reconfiguring it.
Good luck.

I purchased the Denver Mattress Snowmass model about 4 months ago and at first loved it but after about 1 month it got much much softer and ensuing aches and pains now prevent me from sleeping on it. The Denver Mattress store where I bought it has offered an exchange, but not wanting to re-experience this problem with the same model, I am now looking at one of their models with a Talalay latex,1.25" 1.8lb. density convoluted foam, Flex net insulator(? not sure what this is), and a coil support systemof 1080 individually wrapped foam encased coils of 16 gauge tempered steel. There is another mattress, The Madison, which is about the same but the layer of latex is replaced with high density foam and the coils count is 567 of 15 gauge steel.
My concerns are that, given the way the Snowmass softened up so much (and it was mostly latex foam), will the Telluride or Madison have the same problem since they have 2 thin layers of what they call high density, but convoluted, foam, or will their coil support base keep the support that I need.
Also if you have any information on their adjustable bed base systems I would be interested in any feedback on them. The salesman gave us a demo and my wife really liked it. I checked their website and they have 4 models available. We saw the base model and there is no information on materials and motor specs on any of them, so I’m again, concerned.

Hello! Thank you so very much for sharing your experience. I’ve been doing quite a lot of research and didn’t go to bed until 5:30 am determined to try to find the most info I could before heading out there today to see the manager. I did come across a company that will take your physical specs and custom make the layers just for your body…I bookmarked it, can’t recall right now, I think it has the word “comfort” in its name, but it seems to be the way to go–although I’m sure it will be quite pricey! So I just might go that route and save up for it. Thanks again!

Check out https://www.mattresses.net/
I recall speaking to Ken (1 888 77dream)
I’m not sure but I believe they had a 2 layer set up that you could make adjustments to.

Well actually I was only interested in the mattress but then I drove over to a local mattress manufacturer to ask if they made full latex mattresses. They do and they cost $3800 with an adjustable frame ($2400 for mattresses). One thing their saleslady mentioned that I hadn’t thought about was that some adjustable frames pull you away from your nightstand when it’s adjusted. She said theirs is a wall hugger in that you won’t leave the nightstand behind when you adjust the bed. Since I didn’t talk about the Ergo adjustable frame that Denver Mattress sells, I researched it online and found that theirs is a wallhugger too, so that’s good to know. I also found it for almost half price (Denver Mattress is $1600) from an Amazon seller. Google the bed frame name and you should find other prices. I tried the frame yesterday when I was trying out the Snowmass and I really like that it’s so quiet. It’s definitely something that I would like to get also. I have a sleigh bed and assumed that I wouldn’t be able to use it, but the saleslady from the local manufacturer told me that they work fine with sleigh beds as well. I checked that out and sure enough Denver Mattress Ergo system works with them as well too.

Thank you so much. I will check it out. I checked my bookmarks. The site that makes a custom laxtex mattress is CustomSleepDesign.com. And the Ergomotion 100 series adjustable frame from Denver Mattress is $899 for queen size at Amazon. But if you want king, its $1538. Both have free shipping. I also discovered that there are other series like the Ergomotion 200 & Ergomotion 400, but I haven’t researched what they have that the 100 series that Denver Mattress sells doesn’t have.

Hi bertiebus,

Unfortunately there is no way for anyone else to know how a mattress will feel and perform for someone else based on specs and you will need to trust your own personal testing which is really the only accurate way to know. Post #1 here has some suggestions about how to test a mattress as objectively as possible (rather than testing for the much more subjective “feel” of a mattress) which can improve your odds of making a suitable choice. The only thing I can speak to is the quality and value of a mattress. It may also be worth reading post #2 here and post #5 here.

From a quality perspective the materials are good and there are no obvious weak links in the mattress. From a “commodity value” point of view the value is also great. There are also many other parts to value though which may be part of your personal value equation and only you can know your own confidence level in the suitability of the mattress as well as all the other objective, subjective, and intangible parts of a mattress purchase that are most important to you. If the mattress is suitable for your needs and preferences it would seem to me to be great value. If it’s not … then no matter what it’s “commodity value” … it would have little value for you regardless of the price you paid. This is the question you would need to decide based on your own personal testing.

The adjustable bed thread here may also help you with making choices between adjustable beds and has some good value references as well.

Phoenix

Hello Phoenix,

I’m new to this site and it’s been great learning something new every day. What a wealth of information you are. Thank you so much for sharing your expertise!

Well, you confirmed what I was already thinking about the Snowmass, that it really wasn’t quite the mattress for me. It was comfortable and while my back was mostly aligned, it felt that my shoulders should have dipped a bit more. So no, the significantly reduced price of the Snowmass wouldn’t have been a good value for me after all. Thanks for the info on the adjustable beds. I will certainly be studying up on those too.

I have a question about another thread, so when I have a bit more time, I’ll get to it. Thanks again and congratulations on a fantastic website.

Hi bertibus,

You’re very welcome … and thanks for the kind words :slight_smile:

Phoenix