I have a 9 month old Serta iSeries Honoree that is not supportive enough for me - it solved my hip pressure point issue, but created a lumbar and thoracic back pain issue. It “hammocks” and I need something else.
I tried the Pure Talalay Latex Bliss “Beautiful” and “Worlds Best” models at a chain store called Bed Pros. I liked the feel and they didn’t seem to hammock, at least in the 10 minutes I was in the store. They are terribly expensive, near $4,000.
Do you have advice regarding latex mattresses in general?
Do you have experience with this specific Pure Bliss brand - and are these same models available for less?
Are there comparable latex mattress models I should consider?
I have seen latex mattresses online, but am reluctant to purchase without being able to try them out - unless there is a true, easy, money back comfort guarantee. If you know if such a thing, please let me know.
[quote]I tried the Pure Talalay Latex Bliss “Beautiful” and “Worlds Best” models at a chain store called Bed Pros. I liked the feel and they didn’t seem to hammock, at least in the 10 minutes I was in the store. They are terribly expensive, near $4,000.
Do you have advice regarding latex mattresses in general?[/quote]
While I can certainly help with “how” to choose … It’s not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).
I’m not sure what you’ve read since you found the site but just in case you haven’t read it yet … the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.
Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort” and PPP that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.
Again nobody can speak to how any specific mattress will “feel” for someone else or whether it will be a good “match” in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances and you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress but outside of PPP (which is the most important part of “value”), the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new so I would always make sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the quality/durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.
Assuming that the materials in a mattress you are considering are durable enough for your body type and meet the quality/durability guidelines I linked earlier relative to your weight range … the choice between different types and combinations of materials and components or different types of mattresses are more of a preference and a budget choice than a “better/worse” choice (see this article).
Yes I am familiar with them. The Pure Talalay Bliss mattresses use blended Talalay latex which is a very high quality and durable material so there are no lower quality materials or weak links in any of the Pure Talalay Bliss mattresses that would compromise the durability or useful life of any of their mattresses (unlike Serta or other major brand mattresses such as Sealy/Stearns & Foster, and Simmons which all tend to use lower quality and less durable materials in their mattresses). There is more about the different types and blends of latex in post #6 here.
There is also more information about the specs of the Pure Talalay Bliss mattresses in post #2 here. The two mattresses you mentioned are the two softest mattresses in their lineup which can be more risky in terms of alignment (particularly in higher weight ranges) so I would especially make sure that you do some good testing to confirm that you are in good alignment in all your sleeping positions when you are testing these two mattresses.
Pure Talalay Bliss mattresses have MAP pricing (minimum advertised pricing) but there are some dealers that sell them for for less than this but they can’t advertise the lower prices. If you do decide on one of their mattresses there are some PTB dealers that may be able to ship across the country listed in post #32 here that you can call to use as a pricing reference point.
There are many latex mattresses in the industry that also use blended Talalay latex but off the top of my head I don’t know of any that have the exact same design with the same layer thicknesses and layer firmnesses and the same cover so they could have a different “feel” and a different firmness level.
If you let me know your city or zip code I’d be happy to let you know about the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in your area so you could check to see if any of them sell similar mattresses.
If you are considering online options then the mattress shopping tutorial includes a link to a list of the members here that sell mattresses online (in the optional online step) and many of them sell latex and latex hybrid mattresses that use different types and blends of latex that have a wide range of different designs, options, features, return and exchange policies, and prices that would be well worth considering.
Many of these are component mattresses with loose layers and zip covers that allow you to fine tune the comfort and/or support of a mattress after a purchase by rearranging or exchanging individual layers and some of them are finished" mattresses with glued layers (like the Pure Talalay Bliss mattresses). There is more about the pros and cons of a component latex mattress with a zip cover and loose layers vs a finished mattress with glued layers in post #15 here and post #2 here.
Post #3 here includes a list of many of the online manufacturers that sell component latex mattresses as well (with some overlap with the members list).
When you can’t test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help “talk you through” the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and “feel” of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc) and the options they have available that may be the best “match” for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the “averages” of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about “matching” their specific mattress designs and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.
“If you let me know your city or zip code I’d be happy to let you know about the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in your area so you could check to see if any of them sell similar mattresses.”
Thank you! We are in the 34697 area and willing to travel a couple of hours for a mattress. Sarasota and Orlando might be the geographic boundaries to consider.
As for the PPP, I’m 5’9" and 150, and my boyfriend is 5’11" and 160. We are in our 50s and support and pressure relief seem to be increasingly important for sleep. We have read the tutorials and unfortunately, not done a great job with translating showroom feel to true support or pressure relief. We have been through several new mattresses within 2 years and we are not happy yet. Thanks for your heads up about the PTB Beautiful and Worlds Best models perhaps being too soft for support. They feel great for pressure (specifically my hips). But then again, I’m afraid of my own judgement of feel in the showroom as I’ve been wrong.
We found one other mattress by Natural Expressions, model “Angelica,” that felt pretty good, and I read the other forum post about this company, who manufactures their mattresses in China. I’m just not thrilled about that.
I’ll look into the online retailers with latex mattresses, and any local recommendations you have. It’s the only type of mattress we haven’t tried and I’m hoping it solves this Goldie Locks problem.
Subject to first confirming that any retailer or manufacturer on the list that you wish to visit is completely transparent (see this article) and to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines here … the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in and around the Tampa/ Clearwater/St Petersburg areas are listed in post #143 here.
As I mentioned in my previous reply … the only way to know whether a mattress is a good “match” for you in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP is based on careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) or your own personal experience.
I’m guessing the topic you read is this one but if the Angelica you are looking at only includes Talalay latex (I would confirm this with the store that carries it and check the law tag to confirm there is no polyurethane foam in the mattress) then there would be no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability or useful life of the mattress.
In its simplest form choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers (either locally or online) that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in that are in a budget range you are comfortable with and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …
Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.
Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.
Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.
I have been making the rounds. In addition to Bed Pros, which carries the Pure Talalay Bliss and Somnis, which carries Natural Expressions, Reverie, OMI OrganicPedic and others, I visited Innomax (only had one all latex bed and was a gross showroom), Pittsburgh Mattress (one uncomfortable 6" latex mattress and an experience like the opening of a B horror movie), Sleep Organics (carries Savvy Rest and OMI Organicpedic and is a lovely place), and the Mattress Store of Sarasota (carries Biscayne Bedding, Pure Bliss, Dunlopillo, and some other latex hybrid beds). I guess you could say I’ve been laying around. Ha. Here are some thoughts:
The OMI OrganicPedic beds are comfortable and feel luxurious, but are insanely expensive. Their Pinnacle model is nearly $9,000. That’s not gonna happen. I don’t know if its the convoluted Talalay layer on top and/or the wool and cotton cover, but they really feel great. My hope is to replicate the feel for less.
I didn’t like the Savvy Rest dunlop layers, but they had talalay layers that felt better to me. Still, the bed feels rubbery (go figure) and the initial comfort is lacking.
The Innomax mattress was a joke, a plain slab of rubber that felt like a little trampoline. Same with the Pittsburgh Mattress latex, and that place was creepy. The person working gave us a long and unsolicited story (like a ghost story over a campfire) about how “all the mattress makers got together and decided to get rid of box springs” and other latex factoids that didn’t match at all with any of our other research. Really weird.
The Mattress Store in Sarasota has a giant showroom full of “latex” mattresses, but I think most of these are hybrids, and there wasn’t a lot of info about the specs of the models. Still, some of the hybrids (latex on soy foam or poly foam) were actually downright comfy and felt good. The Dunlopillo felt good, but I can’t find any good information on them - the website does not even have a US option under “select country” so not much to see.
Online I have found that Flobeds looks like it has the same components as the OMI OrganicPedic beds at a much lower price, and they seem to have a pretty good Goldilocks guarantee. Also, the Zenhaven looks like it might be similar, they also have a nice return policy. After all that laying around I might just end up online…
Thanks again for steering me to some resources, I will update when there is more to say,
Peace,
Kathleen
Ends up Dunlopillo’s site is within Sherwood Bedding. I found this page, most of the models have PDFs that describe the specs of the mattress club sandwich layers. http://www.sherwoodbedding.com/dunlopillo/
It ends up the Dunlopillos are mostly soy based foams on top. Not sure what that means for durability and all that…
Thanks for taking the time to share an update with your experiences … I appreciate it.
There is more information in post #9 here about the different ways that one mattress can “match” or “approximate” another one. Every layer and component in a mattress (including the cover and any quilting materials) will affect the feel and performance of every other layer and component and the mattress “as a whole” so unless you are able to find another mattress that uses exactly the same type of materials, components, cover and quilting, layer thicknesses, layer firmnesses, and overall design (which would be very unlikely) then there really isn’t a reliable way to match one mattress to another one in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) based on the specifications of the mattresses (even assuming that you can find out all the specifications you would need for both mattresses you are comparing in the first place).
If you wanted to build your own DIY mattress that was an approximation of the Pinnacle then you would need to find out the specifics of every layer and component in the Pinnacle (which would include the type and blend of latex, the thickness of each layer, and the firmness of each layer along with the specifics of the cover and quilting) and purchase them separately and it’s unlikely that OMI will provide you with all the information you would need to “duplicate” their mattress.
If you can’t “duplicate” a mattress based on the specs of the materials and components inside it then the only way to “match” another mattress in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP would be based on your own side by side comparisons and personal experience.
I’m not sure which combinations of latex layers that you tried but there would be a very wide range of different layering possibilities that use either Dunlop or Talalay in each layer with different firmness levels for each layer that would each have a different “feel” and firmness level. I would also guess that there was also less wool in the cover but I don’t know this for certain because I don’t know how much wool each of them use in their covers.
This is a somewhat distorted version of a true story. Box springs that have actual springs inside it were more common 15 and more years ago when there were still many 2 sided mattresses in the industry but they have been replaced with foundations that are firm and have no flex under the mattress since one sided mattresses have become more common.
A box spring can certainly have an effect on the feel and performance of a thinner 2 sided latex mattress that for some people may be too firm or uncomfortable without it. Most thicker latex mattresses tend to do best with a foundation rather than a box spring.
You can read a little more about the pros and cons of a latex/polyfoam hybrid vs an all latex mattress in post #2 here.
There is also more information about so called “soy foam” and other “plant based” foam in post #2 here but they are just a version of polyfoam.
I don’t know what the specifics of the layers in the Pinnacle you tested were but Flobeds gives you the choice between 100% natural Talalay and blended Talalay. They would certainly make a great quality/value choice and their vZone is also somewhat unique in the industry because it allows you to customize both the layering and the zoning in the mattress but their layers and components and the overall design of their mattresses would be different from the Pinnacle.
You can see some comments about the Zenhaven mattress in post #2 here but it also has a completely different design than the Pinnacle. Of course they are also only one of many online latex options that are available to you.
Sherwood is the Dunlopillo licensee in the US but unfortunately the information they provide about them on their site is missing the most important information that you would need to know about their mattresses (see this article) and particularly the thickness and density of each layer. Without knowing the density of any polyfoam layers in the mattress it’s not possible to make any meaningful comments about the durability or useful life of the mattress or make meaningful comparisons with other mattresses and I would avoid any mattress by where this information wasn’t readily available from a retailer that sells it.