Resuscitating Helix hybrid mattress with latex topper?

Talk To The Experts
1

I’ve just bought a Helix Midnight mattress; as a curvy side sleeper with a BMI of 31, who holds her weight very densely for that BMI, I failed to realize that the 2.5 lb/ft memory foam comfort layer would be a problem for me.

During the trial period, I’ve been punching through the comfort layer and feel the coils when lying on the mattress. I also find the coils themselves to be a bit flimsy (they can compress very, very far when sat upon from a height).

In my understanding, the Helix Midnight has 2.5" of 2.5 lb/ft memory foam, a 1" transition layer of polyfoam, and 8" of pocket coils on top of 1" of 1.8 lb/ft base polyfoam.

I’ve been researching latex toppers – is it a reasonable possibility to fix my problem with this mattress by placing a 3" soft/medium talalay latex topper above it? Or is it going to be necessary for me to eat the $300 shipping cost to Canada and return the mattress? If I do that I’ll go all-latex or DIY.

2

Hi FreakingCapacitors, Welcome to the MattressUnderGround!

Despite not being a Trusted Member here, I think helix makes a nice mattress. Some folks are successful having purchased their product and others not as much. It happens. I am a Brooklyn Bedding Owner myself, before I came to TMU. Would things be different now. Who knows.

In your case, you have a BMI about what mine was when I bought my BB Plank Luxe. I was 250, now I am 200 and BMI down to 28. Of course, your distribution of weight is a bit different than mine, but be that as it may, you may have been better served with the Helix Twilight, a slightly firmer version to the Midnight, still able and designed to accommodate side sleepers.

The Helix Midnight based on my last chat with Helix is

Helix Midnight Core Mattress

External Cover: GlacioTex Cooling Cover: 50/50 blend of polyester and polyethylene (does not add any height)

First Layer: Flame Retardant Layer - FR Fiber Quilted to Cover Material Foam Layer - 1.5 inches

(Comfort Layer), Memory Plus Foam, 11 ILD Foam Layer - 1 inch

(Comfort Layer), High-Grade Helix Responsive Foam, 24 ILD Foam Layer - 1 inch

(Transition Layer), High-Grade Helix Responsive Foam, 36 ILD

Coil Unit - 8 inches Standard, Side Edge Support (reinforced edges)

Base Foam Layer- .13 inchesDuraDense Foam, 36 ILD
Approximately 11.5 inches total

The mattress gets progressively firmer as you approach the support layer, but is very soft in the upper comfort layers. This is an issue.

Considering your circumstances, I would try a couple of things. $300 to return a $1000 mattress in my estimation is not a good trade. Everyone’s financial situation is different, so keep in mind, this is coming from a place of, how you can rectify your problem, not finances. I will leave that part up to you.

First thing is I would call helix and ask them to send you a Free Topper, the firmest one they have to offer. I know BB will do this at the sister division. I am not sure how close you are to the end of your trial, hopefully, you have not exceeded that yet since you mentioned there is the option to return it at a costly amount.

I would consider looking into the BB Microcoil Topper or their Firmest Talalay Topper, it is a 3" 36ILD. The 36 ILD in the talalay sounds firm, but at 3 inches will offer a bit more plushness and support at the same time. The MC is close to 4" and will have a different type of feel. It will become a matter of floating on top of the mattress feel vs a little bit of sinking feel with the MC.

Remember, toppers do not normally make a mattress firmer. It may add a bit more support, contouring for the curves, and pressure relief if needed.

One more observation. A pocketed spring mattress is designed to be slept on, and support the full length of your body, contouring and allowing your entire body weight to be distributed accordingly. When sitting on a pocketed spring mattress, your body’s entire weight is concentrated through the “bottom” area, which a smaller area of pocketed springs is attempting to support the same entire body weight equal to that when you are lying prone on the mattress.

When “sitting” on the mattress like a chair, this will cause considerably more compression to the limited number of springs attempting to support your entire body. This is not an indication of weak springs, or poor edge support. Good or bad, it is just a fact of physics.

If the topper does not work (a free one that they may send you, or one you need to purchase as I described), and you are still within the trial period, you are already one layer into a DIY mattress, if you have to go that route.

What are your thoughts?

Maverick

3

Hi Maverick,

Thanks so much for your detailed reply! I’m well within the trial period (not even at the 30 day time clock at which one can initiate return) so have some flexibility. And the $300 was for shipping to Canada, so already paid it, but will not recoup it in a refund!

Your commentary about the pocket coils is very helpful; my last mattress was a Ghostbed Classic, which I liked but which became too unsupportive after 5.5 years of use. So I’m used to foam/latex compression when sitting, not coils. The edge support on the Helix does seem extra great so far compared to that past bed!

Will there be difficulty/complication from having a very soft layer sandwiched between more substantial foams and a firm topper? Or not really?

4

It’s probably worth taking the chance of getting the 3" topper 36ild rather than paying the 300 to ship it back. Unless i have the shipping part wrong. Will they make you ship the unit back if you say its not a good fit for you and it will cost another $300 to send it back?

Many times you see combinations of firm medium firm layers in a mattress. This one is a little trickier as one of the top comfort layer is an 11ild.

You can never be 100% certain something will work to any individuals satisfaction, if what you have now is not fully working, so it is probably a worthwhile chance. As i said if it doesnt solve the problem your are 1/3 the way to a DIY with the 3" 36ILD talalay topper.

5

They won’t make me ship the unit back! I’ll just get it taken to some donation center in Canada. And it won’t cost me more money! I’ll just not retrieve the $300 I spent initially on mattress shipping.

I’ll take a chance on the Talalay topper, thanks for your help and advice!

1 Like
6

I actually contacted Helix, this afternoon. I described your situation, forgot to ask them about if they offer a free topper, like BB, as I got caught up in the day job.

They recommended a 3" 36ILD Talalay Topper. So, we were on the strategic path.

Good luck with it and keep us posted!

Maverick

7

I heard back from Helix regarding my situation – they do offer free toppers, but only the fabric/foam kind, not latex. They also, I think, request return of the topper in the event you return the mattress.

I have ordered their firm topper, since it’s free; if it proves unhelpful I’ll just get a firm Talalay topper on my own and see if that solves the problem.

1 Like
8

Sounds like a good plan. I cant imagine they would ask for the topper back, but just in case, hold on to it if it doesnt work.

Cool that they will send you something. It may work or guide you in the right direction for what will work!

Post how you do with it.

Maverick

9

I got the Helix topper, which was a very thin quilted mattress pad, basically. There was an unforeseen $60 customs fee at the border, so it was much less free than anticipated, but it did provide some improvement – I think it helped distribute weight across the memory foam underneath, and helped provide a barrier to keep my hips from punching all the way through the comfort layer in the mattress. But it was almost too firm, and the combo of very firm quilt and squishy memory foam right underneath felt a bit strange.

I’m going ahead and getting a 3" Talalay topper – it’s likely going to be “firm”, which the company claims is 31-35 ILD. They have a customizable option to get 36-40 ILD, but that seems to be a very firm range, and they suggest that it’s inappropriate for toppers.

As I’ve seen the downsides of getting US mattress items shipped to Canada twice now, I’m getting one from inside Canada, from the company Fawcett, which seems to have the cheapest verifiably Talalay toppers I can find in Canada.

10

Sorry the nailed you with that $60 customs fee. They get you coming and going.

It’s worth considering that quilting can indeed contribute to firmness in a topper. The sensation you’re experiencing might be attributed to the lack of thickness in the Helix topper. I must acknowledge, I am not clear on the squishy sensation you describe.

Transitioning to a 3" Talalay topper could prove beneficial, although it’s important to note that Talalay latex offers a distinct feel compared to the memory foam blend in the Helix.

Selecting an appropriate ILD for a 3" Talalay topper can be a bit nuanced. Even opting for a mid-firmness or higher ILD might not yield the firmness you might expect. Their is a plushness created by the 3 inches of thickness in a topper, even on higher ILD’s

Considering your current situation, an ILD in the higher 20s, say within the range of 28-31, might provide a better fit. If you find it too plush initially, reintroducing the Helix topper into the stack could help balance it out.

It’s essential to recognize the inherent differences between latex and memory foam. While latex tends to offer a floating sensation, memory foam provides more of a hugging and sinking feel.

I can offer a meaningful comparison with my pillow collection at it underscores this point vividly. Talalay latex pillows may feel super squishy and soft to the touch, yet they offer substantial pushback, a quality that might not be to everyone’s preference. I thought I would like it as I was looking for a pillow, at the time, that supported my head and neck.

As it turns out, I have a preference for wool, Tempur-Pedic, and horsehair pillows, or a combination of horsehair and latex noodles, as there is very little to no push back but a comfortable weightlessness feeling that is created with these materials in a pillow that keeps my head and neck in a motionless position throughout the night as if the pillows were not there at all and without contending with the bouncy pushback of the all talalay pillow. My wife, on the other hand, loves the all Talalay pillow and complains about the other pillows referenced as being too hard for her
I think Helix’s initial suggestion of a 3" 36ILD Talalay may be valid as it will have some plushness associated with a this thickness in a topper. My only concern, if it turns out to be too firm, you have to exchange it for something in the 28 range as I suggested, whereas if the 28 is too soft, you can introduce the Helix topper back into the mix.

Finding the perfect comfort level can indeed be a journey, but making adjustments step by step will undoubtedly lead you to the ideal feel. Keep experimenting, and I’m confident you’ll discover the combination that’s just right for you.

All the best,

Maverick

11

Thanks a bunch for your reply, Maverick!

Re the squishy sensation, it’s basically that instead of punching straight down through lots of the memory foam, I felt like having a firm quilted topper helped ‘recruit’ the nearby memory foam that I wasn’t directly on top of to redirect pressure. The result was that I felt like I was rolling a bit horizontally if I was squishing the comfort layer in my general vicinity in some slightly asymmetric way.

My previous mattress was a classic GhostBed, which proved not quite supportive enough after years of use; but I loved the latex feel at the top! Having now tried memory foam as well, I think I prefer a sense of pushback and the ‘floating’ sensation you describe.

The Canadian mattress company got back to me quite swiftly and say that they can supply basically anything in the range of 31-36 ILD, as each latex layer is tested for its ILD individually upon production. Based on your advice perhaps I’ll target the lower end of that range. I’ll let you know how it goes!

1 Like