I recently also got my bed from sleepez i made my sire a little too firm but before i go ahead and swap out a layer i wanted to ask something and enyone please feel free to answer with your opinion.
My current config. is from top to bottom is medium,firm,firm,extra firm i weight 245 am 5’10" and have a stockier build also have degenertive disk disease (it’s not horribly bad but kinda bothersome at times)
Now what i want to do is maybe swap one of the firm layers out place the medium layer as my 2nd layer and have a layer of memory foam on top for the comfort layer. Now i am not sure if sleepez does this or if its a good idea to put memory foam on latex
It would help to know what the specific symptoms are that you are looking to correct (in terms of pressure relief and alignment). “a little too firm” is somewhat subjective and a little too vague to make good suggestions. Are you looking for more pressure relief and do you have actual symptoms of pressure (such as numbness) or is it more a matter of “feel”. If it is about pressure relief … is there a place that it is affecting more than others (such as shoulders)?
It also helps to know how far away from your “ideal” you think you are because a “little” may indicate that a single small change (such as adding a memory foam layer) may be enough rather than exchanging a layer as well. If you make two changes where only one is needed it can introduce now problems.
Making layer changes (or other changes) needs to be a slow deliberate process with only one change at a time and where each change is tested for a few days (at least) to make sure that you have isolated the real cause of what you are feeling and increasing the odds of finding the best solution.
It is also a good idea to make sure you have given what you have enough time for you to adjust to a new seeping surface. Making changes while you are still going through an adjustment period can make things quite confusing. How long have you been sleeping on the mattress?
This would slightly increase the softness of the upper layers but would also slightly decrease your support so whether this was a good idea would depend on which needed fine tuning and the degree of fine tuning needed. A thinner memory foam topper would likely increase pressure relief but have less effect on support because both your hips and shoulders would “go through it” fairly equally. There is no good or bad in adding any material to any other material ,… only preferences and steps in getting to your ideal. I know that sleepEz has 3" memory foam layers which can be chosen as a layer but this would be a very radical change and not what I would call fine tuning.
PS: I forgot to ask if the other side has a medium layer. If it does … then you could actually test the layering you are thinking about for a few days to see from your own personal experience how it works or what changes you notice.
The other side is as follows medium, medium, firm, extra firm. I have tried this config out and it is a little too soft for my lower back and doesn’t provide the support i need for my lower back.
I was initally thinking going with a medium, medium-firm, firm, extra firm to try and strick the balance with the softer confort layer with the support my back needs
Currently the bed is too firm and makes it hard for me to get to sleep no fault of sleepez i chose the layer i just don’t wanna have to keep returning layers :lol: i do like the feel of memory foam and i don’t mind the feel of latex
I have been sleeping on the bed the way it is for about a week and a half now i feel comfortable with the material just not with how firm it is if that makes sense
I am looking for some pressure relief without sacrificing proper support i may not be getting the support i need because the mattress being too firm also would adding a soft lyer to the top help like a soft-firm i know with my weight i would “go through it” but would that help at all making the mattress softer?
P.S. i came from sleeping on a icomfort renewal refined which was really comfortable but just not quite enough support for my back and waaaaaaaay over priced;)
That helps to clarify the picture a lot so let me share a few ideas to see which one seems to fit your experience the best and help you better decide on the next step.
First … it seems that there are no specific “symptoms” that are attached to your current layering which could indicate that this is more a matter of overall “feel” and discomfort rather than specific pressure relief symptoms (such as numbness or pain). This would also seem to be confirmed by your experience on the iComfort Renewal Refined which has much softer and slower response comfort layers than your current mattress.
The first comment is that I would give it a little extra time (say a week" just to see how much you may adjust to the different sleeping surface and how much the mattress itself may need to be adjusted. In other words … in a week or so you may decide that it still isn’t “right” but the “degree” of change you want may change.
It also seems to me that you may like to be a little more “in” the mattress than your current layering. The Renewal Refined for example has 4.75" of memory foam on the top of the mattress (2" KoolComfort 5 lb memory foam over 2.75" of the KoolAction gel memory foam which is firmer but still memory foam which is soft).
When you are making changes to a mattress … the upper layers will have more of an effect on the pressure relief and surface feel while the lower layers will have more of an effect on support and deeper feel of the mattress.
This tells me that you may be better changing the top 3" layer to “soft” which would still be firmer than the comfort layers of the Refined but would be softer than what you now have. This will give you a more pressure relieving surface (deeper cradle) and a softer surface feel that will let you sink into the mattress more without sacrificing the support from the lower layers (where you come to rest) and alignment. In every mattress ,… you will “go through” the upper comfort layers (which is what you want or they would be a support layer) and the idea is to control how much you go through them not to prevent it. The layer that you don’t “go through” is the beginning of your support. While this is not “exactly” correct because all layers will compress simultaneously … they will do so to different degrees. If you are sinking in to the mattress 5" for example … then the layer that is 5" deep is primarily the “transition” between pressure relief and support and plays a dual role.
So here are the options … and this may be need to be tested in two steps with each evaluated separately. The first step would be to order a soft for exchange. This would then be switched for either the medium or a firm layer. My first tendency would be to switch it with the medium first. This would have little effect on support (your lower layers would be the same) but it would change the pressure relief and surface feel a lot and you would be a little more “in” the mattress (although it would still be more instant response and not like the slower response of memory foam). The risk with S/F/F/XF would be that with your weight, you may “go through” the softer top layer a little too quickly/ too much and feel a more of the firmness of the next layer down than you want to. As the top layer compresses more … it will get firmer (for example a 24 ILD layer at 25% compression would be closer to 60 - 70 ILD at 65% compression) but it may not do this quite fast enough to isolate you from the transition between the two.
The second option would be to switch a firm with a soft which would give you S/M/F/XF. This would give you a little deeper cradle and slightly more pressure relief yet but could also begin to affect support and alignment a little more (depending on your weight distribution and body shape). The transition between the top and next layer down though would “smoother” and less noticeable so this would be the advantage here. The transition between layers would be more noticeable with side sleeping than with back sleeping (and I scanned your posts and didn’t notice which sleeping position(s) were the norm for you) but the assumption is that you spend at least some time on your side.
So subject to sleeping position information (and I hope I didn’t miss it if you’ve already posted it) … my tendency would be to have at least one soft layer … try the two configurations … and then decide which layer to send back. If you needed any more minor fine tuning after than or wanted more of a memory foam surface feel … then you could always add a thin memory foam topper as “fine tuning” (which would allow both your shoulders and pelvis to sink in a little deeper and maintain your overall alignment but change the “feel” more).
Hopefully this will help and you can connect your experience to my thoughts.
Here is where we are at. Husband tried the soft,medium, medium and it was not an improvelment. So we went back to soft, medium, firm as I did not like sleeping on the soft, firm, firm. I tried to get more feedback from my husband but can’t make heads or tails out of it. Here is what he said. he wakes up with back pain everywhutrere (so no back pain when he goes to sleep) and he often wakes up with his arm and hand having gone numb during the night (the arm on the side that he sleeps on). He says the mattress doesn’t necessarily feel too firm, he just doesn’t like the overall feel of the mattress. I think our old innerspring mattress was firmer (or at least, there was less sinking in because the top foam layer has compressed but also less support over time). But the innerspring mattress has a totally different feel than the latex. I definitely prefer the latex feel and I love the movement isolation. I don’t feel him moving, which says a lot since I am a very light sleeper.
We currently have a lightly padded mattress topper and a regular sheet on top. The mattress is also on the wood floor right now because we are co-sleeping with our 1 year old who has a second mattress next to us. Don’t want her falling out of the bed.
Other than making the mattress firmer, I don’t think we will be able to change the feel of the mattress as changing a layer to make it softer doesn’t work. I think he’s losing support when going that route. He laid down on my side when it was soft, firm, firm and he didn’t like that either. I’m thinking that the only possible solution would be to add a topper on his side that would somehow make it feel less like latex and more like a standard innerspring. Because getting rid of the mattress is not an option. I LOVE IT
I “split” Immortal’s thread off into a different one so I could keep better track of the “flow” of your posts
Do you happen to know what brand and model this was? Knowing this (and I’m assuming that it didn’t have the same symptoms) could help as a “pointer”.
It would also help to know what type of topper this is. Different types may have different effects on the latex below it and sometimes it can be quite surprising how much of an effect it can have for some people. different people with different sensitivities and body weight/shapes can be affected differently by the same topper or protector.
Layer thickness and layer firmness work hand in hand together and sometimes it can be the thickness that needs changing rather than the firmness. For example … a 3" soft upper layer over F/F may not be thick enough to isolate him from the firmness of the middle and lower layers but an extra inch (of something to be decided) may be just enough and work out perfectly. In cases like these … layer exchanges are sometimes too big a change and all that is needed is some fine tuning. Again … your old mattress could provide a “pointer” here.
This is the direction I would be leaning as well because a fairly thin topper of softer material may bring him closer to the performance and feel his body is used to without sacrificing support (if it’s soft enough he will sink into it evenly in both shoulders and hips and it will change the pressure distribution along the surface of his body). Typical “soft” latex in the range of lower 20’s ILD will often be firmer than the layers of super soft polyfoam or memory foam that many people are used to.
[quote]Do you happen to know what brand and model this was? Knowing this (and I’m assuming that it didn’t have the same symptoms) could help as a “pointer”.
It was a Stern’s and Foster but I don’t know what model. I will try to see if I can find out.
[quote] It would also help to know what type of topper this is. Different types may have different effects on the latex below it and sometimes it can be quite surprising how much of an effect it can have for some people. different people with different sensitivities and body weight/shapes can be affected differently by the same topper or protector.
Let me correct that. It is not a topper, just a waterproof mattress cover that has a little bit of padding on top. Nothing fancy and I have no idea what kind it is.
[quote] This is the direction I would be leaning as well because a fairly thin topper of softer material may bring him closer to the performance and feel his body is used to without sacrificing support (if it’s soft enough he will sink into it evenly in both shoulders and hips and it will change the pressure distribution along the surface of his body). Typical “soft” latex in the range of lower 20’s ILD will often be firmer than the layers of super soft polyfoam or memory foam that many people are used to.
While I doubt this is the case here, sometimes a mattress protector (even a thin one) can have a significant effect on how a mattress feels. If it is too tight, it can create a drum like effect and decrease the amount that someone sinks into the latex which can reduce the cradling effect of the softer latex and the pressure relief of the mattress. Of course this would be fairly easy to test by replacing the protector with a stretchy blanket and testing for any difference.
More likely though … the latex itself is too firm for his preferences. Some people that are used to soft polyfoam can also be sensitive to the different way that latex distributes pressure and the difference in how it feels compared to polyfoam which is not as resilient (doesn’t “bounce back” as much. This can lead to different areas of the body bearing more weight than they are used to. While this is actually better in terms of pressure distribution … it can also be uncomfortable for some who are not used to it.
A topper made with either soft polyfoam or even memory foam can change this more towards the feeling and pressure distribution they are used to. I would keep it as thin as possible and probably no more than 2" at most (depending on the degree of fine tuning that someone believes is needed). While it is also possible to add softer latex as a topper … it will not be the same as soft polyfoam because even soft latex has a higher resilience and a higher compression modulus (gets firmer faster than polyfoam).
It’s difficult for me to make a specific suggestion without a reference point of something that he likes which is why information about the S & F could be useful. My guess though is that the foam on top of the S & F was mostly polyfoam and there were probably some super soft layers in the mix (which allows someone to sink in more and doesn’t distribute pressure as evenly). With an extra inch or two … then the firmer middle and lower layers may work very well for support much like a firmer innerspring (although an innerspring is also different from latex and this also will vary depending on the type of innerspring) and the thicker comfort layer would allow his shoulders to sink in deeper and get better pressure relief while still being isolated from the lower firmer layers.
The “up side” to polyfoam or even memory foam is that they both have less resilience than latex and would “alter” the feel of the latex to be more like what he is used to. They are also less expensive than latex. Polyfoam would probably be closer to what he was used to if that is what was in the previous mattress. It is also a faster response than memory foam.
The “down side” is that polyfoam and memory foam are not as natural as latex and with memory foam in particular which is a slow response material and can have more issues with offgassing … I would not expose a young child to this material. Even if it is “safe” for an adult … I don’t believe it is a good choice for an infant or even a toddler or younger child.
If you exchange the soft latex layer for even softer latex (19 ILD is the next softness level down), then this could make it even more likely that he may feel the firmness of the layers below it because it sounds like the problem is more one of thickness than softness which leads to the pressure symptoms he is feeling (including the numbness and arm falling asleep). This would depend on how much his shoulders need to sink into the mattress to relieve pressure (there are many variations in each persons body shape and also in side sleeping positions).
So I would tend to wait until you see if you can find the model of the S&F as a guideline which would be a better reference point. My next step, depending on how you feel about natural vs synthetic materials and on what the S & F “pointed to” , would likely be to add a layer of soft polyfoam because it is a much less expensive way to experiment. If that gets it right … then it can always be exchanged for a softer latex topper with much less “experimental” expense.
I wasn’t able to figure out what model the S & F is. I’ve been thinking that a memory foam topper on his side only might be a good solution. He really just doesn’t like the feel of latex. He prefers more of a sinking in feeling which is why I think the memory foam might work for him. Can you recommend a type/brand. Should we try with a 1 or 1.5" first or go straight to the 2"? 3lb, 4lb, 5lb density? Does the memory foam need to be in a case or will it suffice to put it under the mattress protector and sheet?
Without a reference point of something that your husband likes and that “works” for him it’s really not possible to make a specific suggestion. Part of this too is that he is outside the “averages” of most people’s needs and preferences so his own experience would really be the only way to know what will “work” for certain. Part of this may also be that his body has become used to sleeping on a much softer surface and that anything firmer will be uncomfortable. It could also be that his body shape or “normal” spinal alignment is not “average” (his spine may have more or less curvature).
I can give you some of the tradeoffs though that may help him decide what may be best for him.
One option that is available … although I wouldn’t recommend it unless you were comfortable with the “tradeoff” involved would be to replace the top layer of latex with 3" of memory foam on his side. SleepEz carries 5.5 lb Sensus memory foam which is a very high quality memory foam. This would leave the mattress closer to the same overall height on each side but the “down side” would be that the two materials are very different and there would be a definite “transition” in the middle area of the mattress which would be quite noticeable.
The option of a topper on his side alone would also make sense but the two sides of the mattress would have different heights and the middle of the mattress would have a ridge between the sides. The choice of materials (between soft polyfoam and memory foam) would be a preference on his part depending on which he preferred and/or was used to. The thickness would also be a more subjective decision that would depend on how far away from his “ideal” he believed he was. A 1" layer of memory foam would provide more of a surface feel and modify the feel of the latex in the direction of the slower recover of memory foam. It would help to modify the resilience of the latex and would lower the feeling of “pushback” in some areas of the body. It would be more of a “modification” of the latex. A 2" memory foam layer would add more of the slow recovery properties of memory foam to the feel of the mattress and be more pressure relieving. It would also create more of the resistance to movement or “hold” him in position more.
Using polyfoam instead of memory foam would depend again on which “feel” he was used to (fast recovery foam or slow recovery foam). The advantage of using a soft or supersoft polyfoam would be that it was less expensive, would be closer to the feel of latex (faster recovery) but softer and less resilient (in a very soft ILD) and the cost of a “mistake” would be much lower.
Finally of course you could add a topper over the entire surface which would even out the feel between the two sides but then you would have less of the “feel” and resilience of latex which you like.
My “sense” is that he seems to be leaning towards a memory foam “feeling” but I don’t know this for sure and this would depend on whether he is familiar with the feeling of memory foam. Here again it would help to know what he is used to. If he is used to polyfoam and then chooses memory foam it will again be much different from what he is used to but in a different way.
Because my sense is that he is looking for more than just “fine tuning” he may be better off with about 2" or so of memory foam which will provide more of a memory foam feeling overall rather than just a modification of the latex feel. I would tend towards higher density foam between 4 and 5 lbs. In general (and this depends on the foam formulation so it is not a “rule”) lower density memory foam is more breathable and has a little faster recovery time. Higher density memory foam is more conforming and durable but can also be more temperature sensitive (varies between firmer and softer more based on temperature). All of this depends on the specific formulation of foam that is used. I would not tend to go below 4 lbs density unless durability is not an issue and price is more important. Low density 3 lb foams are closer to polyfoam and in general will have less “memory foam” qualities.
I personally would add a cover to any high quality foam topper including memory foam. Most foam toppers will last longer with a good cover and in the case of polyurethane or memory foam … heat and humidity as well as oxidation and ultraviolet exposure will degrade the foam over time (although many foam formulations contain different types of antioxidants to protect against this). Polyurethane and memory foam are more susceptible to humidity than latex so without a cover I would make sure that there is at least a good moisture barrier of some type (wool or a thin breathable membrane type of barrier) between the person and the foam.
Because of his uncertainty of what he may prefer … this is one of those cases where a refund policy may be the most important factor so he can "experiment with little risk. Costco (mostly memory foam), and Sams Club (they carry high density 5 lb Aerus memory foam which is very breathable), and Walmart (they carry both memory foam and polyfoam) all have great refund policies so it’s easier to experiment with little risk.
I would love to be a little more specific but I can’t “feel” what your husband feels and I’m not sure if he is familiar with memory foam or if what he is used to was polyurethane so hopefully this will help with better choices with lower risk that will get him closer to his ideal.
I’ve been tracking your post for a while now because I too am interested in purchasing a SleepEZ 10,000 or 13,000.
My biggest concern is trying to figure out the best layering that will fit the needs of me and my wife.
After reading the many tips from Phoenix(THANKS!) we went to a local mattress outlet and spent an hour trying out different models and different materials. In the end, I felt confident that a Talalay Latex mattress would be perfect for me… she was set on the sinking-in feel of memory foam.
Similar to your husband, my wife is 5’11, weighs about 180lb, and is a side sleeper. She says the memory foam we tested in the store felt better on her shoulder by letting it sink in more. Our current bed causes her arm to fall asleep or go numb and she is concerned a latex mattress will do the same.
As Phoenix has mentioned in other posts Talalay GL has the slow recovery feel of memory foam, sleeps cooler, and has the natural properties of latex. There’s more here.
The only issue that I’m struggling with is that the Talalay GL topper’s I have found online are in 3". I believe the current recommendation if you go with a topper is to go thinner.
A potential solution would be to replace a 3" latex layer in your current mattress with the 3" Talalay GL. (This is a $397 solution in King size).
Phoenix, please correct me if I’m wrong, if you wanted to keep the current latex configuration on your side of the King size bed and include the GL as the top layer on your husband’s side you could order a Queen size topper at 3"x60"x80" and then cut it down to fit the half King dimensions of 3"x38"x80"?
This would allow you to have a configuration of Talalay latex on one side, with a slower recovery latex on the other side. If the dimensions are correct it would all fit under the mattress cover you currently own… plus it would save $100 over purchasing the king size version.
This would depend on the ILD of the latex that was being used. As a reference (and this can be somewhat misleading because latex and memory foam are two different animals and have very different properties in any version) …Most memory foam is in the 10 to 18 lb range and the most common are under 15 ILD. They can feel firmer though because their ILD will change with heat, humidity, and how long you have been lying on the mattress and they are not instant reacting like latex so when you change positions it will feel firmer while it forms itself to the new profile.
While 19 - 24 talalay latex will normally be very pressure relieving for the majority of people (and some prefer and do well on ILD’s that are even higher) … talalay latex ILD’s go down to 14 ILD which are the rough equivalent of memory foam (again though this is only a “somewhat” comparison). For practical purposes … both latex and memory foam have equivalent pressure relieving properties (it’s pressure points that normally causes arms to go numb and fall asleep and lower ILD’s will create a deeper cradle and spread weight more evenly).
Of course no matter what the ILD … latex is a more “on the mattress” foam that is more instant and less motion restricting and memory foam is a more “in the mattress” foam which is more motion restricting and slower reacting. Bear in mind that there is a wide range of memory foams and a wide range of latex materials and without knowing the specifics of the mattress she was lying on (type of latex and hopefully ILD) it’s difficult to know the ILD of latex that she may do best with. My arm would fall asleep too on some of the latex mattresses that some people prefer
Talalay GL may also be a very good idea. Apparently the ILD is 24 but again this would be somewhat modified by the feel of a slow response foam. There is not a lot of feedback about it yet but there have been several people who I know have tried it that have said that if they had their eyes closed and didn’t know what they were lying the feeling would be closest to a version of memory foam that was “dense and firm”.
The “best” thickness of a topper would normally depend on the type and thickness of the comfort layers in the mattress that it was being used on. In general … because most mattresses already have a significant amount of softer foam … it’s safer to use a thinner topper for the most part. With a mattress that had much firmer or thinner upper layers or for someone that was either heavier or curvier and a side sleeper … 3" may work very well. I tend towards “less risky” suggestions though and “just enough” is generally better than “too much” (which can lead to alignment issues with any softer foams in layers that are too soft or thick for a particular person).
[quote]A potential solution would be to replace a 3" latex layer in your current mattress with the 3" Talalay GL. (This is a $397 solution in King size).
Phoenix, please correct me if I’m wrong, if you wanted to keep the current latex configuration on your side of the King size bed and include the GL as the top layer on your husband’s side you could order a Queen size topper at 3"x60"x80" and then cut it down to fit the half King dimensions of 3"x38"x80"? [/quote]
Both of these suggestions could certainly work well. Cutting a King size in half (and an electric knife works well for this if done carefully) would give you two equal pieces and one could be used in a twin XL (that could be sold to someone else who wanted it) while one was kept. A queen would be a little less costly but would have some waste because the piece left over would fit any standard mattress size. If someone wanted more of a memory foam feel with many of the benefits of latex … this would certainly be a real possibility well worth considering.
I should also mention that SleepEz is also about to bring in slow recovery latex and it’s on the horizon (a few weeks) so this would be available as a full or half layer exchange when it arrives.
@paashjc, It may still be worth considering a “big box store” memory foam topper just to get a sense of how you feel about memory foam (and by implication slow recovery latex) because it is a no risk way to experiment when you are uncertain about what type of foam or topper may work best for you.
Thanks for the suggestions. I’ve been checking out the Talalay GL. SOunds promising. However, sleepez had decided there is not enough demand for the slow recovery latex and will not be carrying it. For now, I ordered the 2.5" aerus memory foam topper from Sam’s club. I want to let my husband try that. We’re going to try it on top of the current firm, medium soft layers and then also try it by removing the soft layers and putting the memory foam right on the firm and medium. My thinking is that we could just put a layer of GL over our current mattress and thus making it a 4 layer or we could remove the top layer and exchange it with the GL leaving us with 3 layer mattress and exchange the 2 soft layers for a firm and medium layer and together with a cover, we would have a twin xl for when the baby needs a mattress. Last option would be to exchange the two soft layers for either 2 mediums or 2 firm and then put the GL on top of the mattress. so we would have firm, medium, medium, GL or firm, firm, medium, GL?
I suppose we could also cut up the memory foam and swap it out with the soft on my husband’s side only and then exchanging the soft for a medium or firm and buying another layer plus cover for the baby. It would mean my husband’s side would be 0.5" lower than my side but I’m thinking it won’t be that noticable. However, I am not crazy about memory foam and would prefer we both sleep on the more natural (non-off gassing of the latex).
I will give more update once my hubby tried the memory foam.
That was fast … I just talked with them yesterday about the same thing and it was on the horizon at some point
This makes perfect sense to me and the different combinations would provide the kind of information about his preferences that would make any other options much more clear. I think the 2.5" 5 lb Aerus is a good and “low risk” choice.
This also makes perfect sense to me if your experience with the Aerus indicates that a slow recovery foam in the top layer is the direction that works best for either or both of you.
This would also be a possibility as long as you bear in mind that changing the thickness of the layers or the overall mattress will also change the performance characteristics of the mattress. I would use your testing experiences to help determine whether this would make things better for you because you may need to “re-think” how the increase in the number of layers will affect the performance of the mattress and the ILD’s of the thicker layering which may work best for you. I would probably lean towards the additional firm layer if you went in this direction because of the “softening” effect of a thicker mattress.
This is probably too many steps or possibilities ahead of where you are and I would probably wait until you had some feedback and experience on the Aerus before I went into too many possibilities that involved cutting foam. For example if he absolutely loved a the memory foam over 2 layers and you wanted to stay with where you are … then it may be worth the side to side differences. If he only “liked” it … then it may not. I tend to take things one step at a time and base each new possibility on feedback and what is learned from the last
got the aerus memory foam and placed it on top of the 3 layers of latex (firm, memdium, soft). Slept on it for 2 nights now and my husband loves it. No pressure points or arms falling alseep and he said he slept the whole night through. He loves the sinking in feeling of the MF. For me, it was the same as sleeping on just the three layers of latex. I do prefer the more natural material of latex and would like to keep it that way. My next step is the remove the soft layer of latex and replace it with the MF to see if it is soft enough fo my husband. That should give us insight as to whether we can stay with 3 layers or need to move up to 4 layers.
Phoenix, have you made any experience yet with the GL latex and how it compares to MF in feel?
At least now you can relax (or sleep) a bit on something that’s working well while you decide on your final configuration.
I’ve had a few more conversations about the slow response GL but none of them have slept on it so they were more about general impressions which seemed to be in line with my previous conversations (except one which called it “boardy”) that it was similar to memory foam in feel. I haven’t had the chance to try it myself unfortunately so I don’t have any direct experience with it yet. I’m hopeful that the next few months will provide more first hand and long term reviews.
Thanks for the feedback and I hope you let us know how the memory foam works as a 3 layer combo. Your “one step at a time” experimentation and adjustments are well thought out and certainly the best way to go
just switched out the soft with the MF. First impression I had when laying down on it was that it was too firm. I think 2.5" of MF is firmer than the 3" soft talalay. I am pretty sure that my husband will find it too firm. We will try it out but I am planning the next step. I am hesitant to permanently have 2 soft layers on top and I don’t really want to stick with the MF anyway. In order to somewhat replicate the cushy feeling of F,M,S plus MF, but still having enough support for long term use, I think we will need to go with 4 layers. Given that F, M, S plus MF is what my husband likes, what about doing F, M, M, GL? Will that give enough support or should we really be looking at doing F, F, M, GL and hoping it will be soft enough for hubby. I suppose we could also order the GL first and put it over the F and M and see if that is enough for hubby before adding a 4th layer.
Sleepez offered to alter our current cover (for the cost of shipping) so we can add a 4th layer. It was under the assumption that we would purchase a 4th layer from them but since they won’t carry the GL, that won’t work. I hope they will still honor that. It would also mean sending back the two soft layers and exchanging them. We are coming up on the 90 day deadline so need to make a decision soon.
This doesn’t surprise me. The Aerus is actually less than 15 ILD (allthough ILD in memory foam can be misleading) and quite a bit softer than the latex on top but memory foam can be misleading because it takes time to soften with heat and can feel firmer initially or when you move. It’s only “soft” under the parts that are in direct contact and warming up the foam. You would “go through” a softer memory foam more than the latex and this leads to feeling the firmness of the layer below it. This is what happens with a lot of “ultra firm” mattresses that use very firm support layers (firmer than your middle layer) and then add some very soft foam on top which “brings through” the firmness of the layers below them.
This may very well be true. The issue may be one of thickness and adding some extra “soft” materials seems to work well for him to modify the properties of the latex below it. Memory foam can also be helpful here when it is over firmer foam because it is soft enough that all parts of the body can sink into it evenly and “reach” the firmer layers below it. Comfort layers that hold up one part of the body (usually the upper parts) and allows the lower heavier parts to sink in too much is what leads to sleeping out of alignment. When the “sinking in” is even and also creates enough of a cradle to provide pressure relief to the parts of the body that need it … then you have the best of both worlds … pressure relief and alignment.
In effect you have a 5.5" comfort layer but because 2.5" of this is softer memory foam that allows both the shoulders and hips to sink in evenly … this can lead to being more “in” the mattress but still being aligned.
If you go with the F/F/M/GL … he may still “go through” the GL enough that he feels the firmness of the layers below it in the same way that the memory foam over the medium is firmer although the GL is firmer than the memory foam so it may isolate him better from the layer below it and actually feel softer. It appears though that he may need or prefer a thicker comfort layer than just 3" as his ideal and there would be no problem for a comfort layer to be made up of two layers of different materials (it’s actually an option that I like as well). It may well be that the Soft latex is ideal but that it just needs to be part of a thicker comfort layer that includes some softer material.
The 5 lb Aerus is a high quality material and may be a great final solution for both of you but if not … then 1/2 a layer for him with an “alternative” for you to keep the sides at close to the same height may also provide a good solution.
I also talked with Shawn again today and he confirmed that they are bringing in the slow recovery Talalay as a test. While they haven’t been promoting it … the order should be coming fairly soon. I would also talk with him about the 90 days because while I can’t speak for him … I know from experience that the trial period can sometimes have “soft edges” and they are quite happy to bend the “rules” when it seems justified.
I would stay with what you have for the moment though to make sure that what you have also works in the slightly longer term and also talk with Shawn before deciding what may be next.
so you’re saying that the soft talalay plus 2.5" MF is ok as a top layer and would still be good for alignment? I guess that would be ok. I would prefer an all natural mattress without the off gassing issues but I can’t think of what we could use instead of the MF or polyfoam that my husband seems to prefer.
Yes. As long as the pressure relief and alignment is good in your actual experience (and the odds of this are increased with thinner layers of memory foam over latex vs 5.5" of just memory foam) … then this would be fine. This type of layering can help with those who like or need to sink in more but also help them sink in more evenly. This is why I would test it for a bit longer though just to make sure that the pressure relief issue hasn’t been “fixed” for him at the expense of alignment.
If this continues to work well for both of you … it would be an encouraging sign for the use of the slow recovery GL on your side (if you decide that would be more along the lines of the material you prefer) when Shawn gets it in. Then he could have his memory foam on his side and you could have the slow recovery GL on your side if you wanted to … or of course you may decide that the Aerus is working so well that you want to keep it or try both sides with the GL. The slow recovery GL would be a bit of a “risk” because it wouldn’t be the same as the Aerus but at least with the Aerus working well for now and with the GL having a similar feel … it points in that direction as a legitimate possibility.