I am looking to move from my full size to my queen size so that both my cat and my boyfriend can sleep on the bed without me getting trapped between them. Stats: I am 5’2", 135lb, side sleeper and my sig. other is 5’7", 140lb and a side/stomach sleeper. We both like the “feel” of plush and don’t care for the buoyancy of latex, so we’ve been zoning in on innerspring beds with pillowtops. We’re in Los Angeles and I’m comfortable spending around $1000.
We visited five stores yesterday and came up with two beds that we felt were quite comparable: Beautyrest Recharge Palisade Court Plush Pillowtop at Macy’s and Organic iSleep Beechwood at Beds Etc (visited based on the list posted here). However, as I kept reading the forum/posts on this site, I kept doubting myself, so I decided it was finally time for a individual post.
Here are some of my questions/confusions:
I keep reading about people who have bad experiences with pillowtops flattening/lumping, but we clearly prefer the plushness of them. I’m not clear on what sort of material I should be looking for in a pillowtop to guard against that. Is it wiser to simply buy a non-pillowtop mattress and get a separate topper? Wouldn’t any warranty help guard against the problems of flattening/lumping? What kind of question can I ask the salesperson to illuminate this issue?
The bed I have now is two-sided and I have flipped it semi-regularly over the years. However, as pointed out elsewhere on this site, many mattresses are no longer double-sided, especially for pillowtop mattresses. Whether a mattress is single- or double-sided is really an issue of longevity (because each side gets to rest) and the layering of materials, yes?
This site made me skeptical of the brand names, but clearly the Beautyrest at Macy’s is still in the running. For the record: the salesman at Macy’s was super low-pressure, which was nice, but we didn’t ask much about the layering and materials. I’m having a difficult time deciphering what the layers of the Beautyrest and Organic iSleep are to understand what it is we like about them (beyond the plushness). Obviously, this means I’m not well-equipped to call other stores to ask about comparable mattresses and find a better value. Any insights that might be able to help?
Of course, let me echo the praise of this site’s usefulness! Even if my head is spinning with all the information, at least I feel more informed and will hopefully make a better purchase! (Last night, I was so overwhelmed that I almost went with the “whatever, I don’t care anymore” approach, but a good night’s sleep gave me fresh energy to tackle the problem.)
It’s a good thing you were 'doubting yourself" because the Beautyrest (or any other major brand) is certainly not a mattress i would consider. If you haven’t already … the best “advice” I would provide would be to make sure you have read post #1 here which has the information, steps, and guidelines you will need to make the best possible choices … and avoid the worst ones. If you follow the steps it lists then you will significantly improve your odds of making the best possible choices. It will also help you understand the importance of knowing the quality details of all the layers and components of a mattress before you consider buying it because it is the only way to know the quality or value of any mattress or make meaningful comparisons between them. A mattress is only as good as it’s construction and the materials inside it … no matter whose label is on it.
You can also read more about warranties (which are mostly about marketing and have little practical value in most cases) in post #174 here. They only protect against manufacturing defects and the foam softening that goes along with lower quality materials and the loss of comfort and support that goes with it is the biggest reason people need to replace a mattress but is not a “defect” that is covered by a warranty.
Yes … it is one of the factors that can play a significant role in the longevity and durability of a mattress compared to a one sided mattress that uses the same materials and design (on one side). Of course the quality of the materials themselves can play just as big a role as whether a mattress is one or two sided. The “down side” of a two sided mattress is that the design possibilities are a little more restrictive because of the need to minimize thicker and softer layers in the bottom of the mattress which can reduce the support qualities of a mattress.
As you can see in post #2 here … there is a big difference between the feel and performance of a mattress and it’s quality and durability. Even the lowest quality materials can feel great in a showroom because you can’t feel quality. The reason you need to know the quality specs of a mattress is so that you can identify any potential “weak links” in the mattress and make more meaningful quality and value comparisons with other mattresses. Better salespeople will have the knowledge and experience to help you do this. The “comfort specs” (vs the quality specs) of a mattress are not necessary to know when you are testing mattresses locally because with careful and objective mattress testing your body will tell you what you need to know in terms of PPP (Pressure relief, Posture and alignment, and Personal preferences) and very few people that don’t make mattresses or have significant experience with different types of foam and materials would be able to use them in any meaningful way to decide on which mattress was most suitable for them.
I would never consider a mattress where you are forced to make a completely “blind” purchase and are not able to find out the quality of the materials that are inside it and the “real” quality and value of a mattress (which would exclude all of the major brands).
There is little point to having a mattress that feels great at first only to discover that lower quality materials have softened or degraded much more quickly than you expected and your mattress no longer provides the comfort and support that you need in just a few years (and sometimes much sooner) and the unweighted impressions are not yet deep enough to be a warranty issue … assuming there are not other reasons for the manufacturer to deny warranty coverage.
Thanks for the quick reply! What I’ve learned: I need to do some more reading on the website, ignore warranties, quality materials in a one-sided mattress may provide better support but otherwise two-sided mattresses should last longer, and visit more recommended stores in the area.
Would you comment briefly on the issue of pillowtops and toppers? Should I try to forgo the pillowtop mattress in favor of a topper, if that will allow me to afford higher quality materials and a double-sided bed? If we didn’t like the “feel” of latex, would a topper resolve that and give us the best of all worlds?
Also, if we wanted to consider memory foam, do I need to increase my budget beyond $1,000?
In the meantime, we’ll keep visiting mattress stores on your LA list. Expect more questions from me as I continue my journey!
The information on the site can be somewhat overwhelming but the suggested reading in the post I linked contains most of the basic information you will need. I would “scan” it more than “study” it and it will give you the tools you need to know when you are getting more accurate information that is meant to educate you and when someone is just giving you “marketing” information which is only meant to sell you.
For the most part … knowing the quality of the materials is much more important than warranties yes. Smaller local manufacturers who are much more concerned about their reputation and work of mouth referrals will tend to be much more responsive to warranty issues and customer service issues as a whole as and “err” more on the side of the customer in the grey areas of warranty and customer service issues than larger manufacturers who are often more concerned with how many hurdles and restrictions they can put in the way of a warranty claim.
The quality of a material has more to do with how long a material will keep its original properties than it does will how supportive it is. Most materials have firmer (more supportive) and softer (more pressure relieving) versions and firmness/softness has nothing to do with quality. If a two sided mattress uses the same materials as a one sided mattress it will be more durable yes but a one sided mattress that used high quality materials can also be more durable than a two sided mattress that uses lower quality materials. I would have no concerns with a one sided mattress with a suitable design that used high quality and durable materials.
You are fortunate to have some very good options in the area yes
Pillowtops are just a construction method and it’s the quality of the materials in the pillowtop that will determine its durability. In most cases (or at least with most larger manufacturers) … pillowtops use thicker layers of lower quality foam and this should be avoided and is the reason that so many pillowtop and eurotop mattress develop hills and valleys and soft spots more quickly. Thicker layers of softer materials are always more “risky” in terms of durability as well because softer materials are also less durable (subject to deeper ongoing mechanical compression) than firmer versions of the same material … but of course if you only consider the firmest materials for the sake of durability then the mattress wouldn’t be very comfortable for most people.
For those who don’t like the feel of latex a latex topper wouldn’t likely be the most suitable choice although latex can have a very wide range of “feels” just like any other material because of the many different designs and the range of softness/firmness that is available so just like any mattress material … you may like one version but not another. A topper can be a good idea on a firm mattress (if you test the specific combination) because it can be replaced without having to replace the entire mattress. A topper will also be a little softer than the same thickness, type, and firmness of material inside the mattress cover because it can act and conform more independently and won’t be pre-compressed as much.
That would depend on the type and amount of memory foam and the design of the mattress. Larger amounts of higher quality memory foam is more costly and larger size mattresses are also more expensive but you would probably find some more basic memory foam mattresses that use good quality materials in this price range (again depending on the size you are looking at).
I’m looking forward to your feedback and any questions you have along the way that I can help with.
After a long hiatus from mattress shopping, my boyfriend and I ventured out to four stores today in pursuit of a mattress. This time, I had taken careful notes from Post #1 so that I could ask better questions.
I’d appreciate any thoughts you might have to offer on the three mattresses we took a liking to:
At Snoozzz Mattress: Diamond Mattress, Rejuvenate, Euro Top. It is made with natural talalay latex and eco-memory foam (1.5 lbs density) for the comfort layer and pocket coils for the support layer. (http://www.snoozzzmattress.com/diamond-products/)
At Custom Comfort Mattress: Their Revive 200 mattress. All cotton comfort layer and innerspring coils for the support layer. This particular model isn’t listed on their website. It’s the only two-sided mattress on our list. (http://www.customcomfortmattress.com/)
All three are about $1,200, give or take delivery, taxes, etc. It might sound silly, but I am concerned that we are at the lower end of the mattresses at #2 and #3 above. I’m wondering if there will be a major difference in splurging on the higher quality memory foam at Selectabed or the added latex comfort layer at Custom Comfort.
Any advice you might have, or additional questions we should call and ask about, would be greatly appreciated!
I’d be happy to provide some comments about the quality of the materials but I would need to know the details of all the layers in each mattress. Each manufacturer should have a spec sheet that has this information (layer thickness, density of any polyfoam or memory foam, and the type and blend of any latex in each mattress) along with information about the the innerspring, cover and any quilting layers in each mattress.
The more general specs you provided aren’t specific enough to make any meaningful quality assessments.
1.5 lbs is also a more typical density for polyfoam than memory foam (if it was actually a memory foam density it would be very very poor quality).
The mattresses at Selectabed and Custom Comfort Mattress appear to use good quality materials which would be typical of both manufacturers but some of the details are missing.
If you ask them for the specifics and post them here I’d be happy to make more comments.
I decided to not keep Custom Comfort in the running, but I think I got most of the specs for the other two mattresses.
The Diamond Mattress at Snoozzz is 14" total, with an organic cotton cover. The comfort layers are made up of natural talalay latex (top), 5 lb visco memory foam (middle) and 1.5 lb “soy based” polyfoam. I couldn’t get the exact height of each layer, but from looking at the cut away, it looked like 1" of the latex, 2" of the foam, and 4" of polyfoam. The support layer is 744 pocket-coils.
The Selectabed Memory Zone mattress is 9" total, with a bamboo-cotton blend cover. The three layers are 2" of 4lb memory foam (10 ILD), 2" of a polyfoam (28 ILD), and 5" HR polyfoam base (36 ILD). When I asked about the density of the transitional layer, they only told me the ILD.
Thanks for any insight you might have on which I should go with!
NerdyVibe
This appears to be close anyway. The latex and the 5 lb memory foam are both good quality materials but the 1.5 lb polyfoam is a little on the low side. The good news is that it’s under 3" of higher quality foam which would take up most of the compression when you sleep on the mattress and being lower in the mattress would add to its durability even though it would likely be the 'weak link" in the mattress (depending on your weight and how deeply you sink into the upper layers). A hybrid comfort layer combination with a thin layer of latex over a fairly thin layer of memory foam has a feel that is a combination of the two (it has a more resilient surface feel that is more “movement friendly” than sleeping directly on memory foam and is a feel that many people like (including me).
The ILD is just a “comfort spec” and has little to do with the quality of the foam (although softness is also a durability factor and softer foams are less durable than the same density polyfoam in a firmer version). 28 ILD is in a medium firmness range and the memory foam on top would be fairly soft for most people. I would need to know the density of the polyfoam though to make any meaningful comments about this mattress because it is also likely to be the “weak link” of the mattress… With only 2" of 4 lb memory foam (mid range of quality/durability) on top of it … it would be important to know that the next layer down was also a durable polyfoam … especially in a one sided mattress … because depending on your body weight you will be sinking into this layer more than you would if there were thicker layers above it. With only 2" of memory foam over a more resilient layer (the polyfoam) this would also be less motion restricting than sleeping directly on thicker layers of memory foam.
It appears you like a combination of more resilient materials in combination with some degree of the slow response of memory foam in your comfort layers.
The middle layer on the Selectabed is a 2lb polyfoam. So, all together, 2" top layer of 4lb memory foam, 2" middle layer of 2lb polyfoam, and 5" bottom layer of HR polyfoam. Based on other pages of this site, I know 2lb indicates good quality. So what, if any, is the weak link in the mattress?
With a 2 lb polyfoam layer under the memory foam it wouldn’t really have a weak link. If anything … the 4 lb memory foam would be the first to soften but it’s a perfectly suitable material and I wouldn’t really consider it a weak link unless you were quite heavy and 4 lb memory foam often has a better “feel” than higher density memory foam in the top layers for many people. With only 2" of mid density memory foam … foam softening would have less effect than if the layer was thicker. Overall it seems to be a good design with no “obvious” weak links (which isn’t surprising because they put good thought into their mattress designs).
Stats: I am 5’2", 135lb, side sleeper and my sig. other is 5’7", 140lb and a side/stomach sleeper. We both like the “feel” of plush and don’t care for the buoyancy of latex, so we’ve been zoning in on innerspring beds with pillowtops. We’re in Los Angeles and I’m comfortable spending around $1000.