The Great Mattress Hunt....

Mattress Talk General Mattresses Questions
1

Good morning,

Thank you for a fantastic site! We upgraded to a king sized bed and are replacing a Sterns and Foster Cardinham Plush queen purchased in 2000 with a 512 coil count and medium soft feel. Over the years it has developed minimal body impressions and is now slightly uncomfortable because of a slight back sway in the stomach sleeping position. Other than this, it remains adequate at cushioning and providing support. Husband is military and during deployments the children pile in bed so motion transfer is a point to consider. We would certainly appreciate any feedback/advice!

Can you recommend any local latex mattress fabricators? At this point I am leaning towards a DIY option from Foam Sweet Foam, Flobeds, or Sleep EZ or possibly the local Latex Bliss Elegance. The many details of the Great Mattress Hunt followā€¦ : )

FSM-4 x 3" 100% Natural Talalay-$2,700
Value: Good customer service, good reputation, A+ BBB rating, 30 year full warranty at Ā½" loss, layer exchange option if necessary.
Risks: 18% restocking fee, lack of standard side/side customization, lack of paired foundation option.

Flobeds-3 x 3" + 2" convoluted 100% Natural Talalay-$3,100
Value: Great customer service, recommended by a friend, good reputation, A+ BBB rating, sides are customizable, company coordinates return shipping at lower than UPS going rates for returns and layer exchanges.
Risks: Warranty is less generous at 10/10 and 1", convoluted layer is not a our preferred choice, paired pine foundation is overpriced at $579 plus $50 sh.

Sleep EZ-4 x 3" 100% Natural Talalay-$2,900 (before 5% discount)
Value: Good pricing, good reputation, A+ BBB rating, paired foundation is well priced, sides are customizable.
Risks: Warranty is less generous at 10/10, depression limits not stated.

Healthy Backs Latex Bliss Elegance-12" latex blend-$3,500 (after military discount)
Value: Local, 90 day return option, 180 day comfort exchange option, 20 year full warranty at Ā¾" loss.
Risks: Blended latex/value proposition

Personal Stats:
Myself-34 year old female, 5ā€™4" and 120 lbs, stomach and side sleeper. Working with lupus and migraines so sensitive to odors and hoping to keep my bedding as free as possible from potential negative health triggers. A light sleeper and have difficulty returning to sleep once woken.

My husband-38 year old male, 5ā€™8" and 150 lbs, side and back sleeper. Sleeps well regardless of surface : ). Tends to sleep hot so mattress temperature retention is a consideration.

Field Tests:
Weā€™ve visited a few local chains and drove a distance to visit a Savvy Rest store. Because of the health concerns, I am not considering a memory foam purchase at this time but included these options in the field test as comparisons. Hereā€™s what we found:

Sterns and Foster Cora-$1,800
Lower marks on cushioning, pressure point in hip becomes noticeable after 10 minutes of side sleeping. Did not ache in that time, but may over hours of sleeping or contribute to restlessness. Provided great support, comfortable in stomach sleeping position, spine remained in healthy positioning. Cover is cheaply made, mattress overall appears of less quality construction than our ā€˜00 S&F queen. No return option, limited comfort exchange.

Tempur-Pedic- No return option, limited comfort exchange.
Cloud Select-$2,750
Mid-range marks on cushioning. Initial feel is not welcoming however does a good job of cushioning hip pressure point in the 10 minute test. Support is adequate, back did not sway in the stomach position.

Rhapsody Breeze-$4,000+
My husbandā€™s favorite. Nice initial feel, cushioning remains comfortable on hip pressure point in 10 minute test. Support adequate in stomach position, though felt there may be a slightly sway in back alignment.

Lacking in support allowing a back sway in stomach position: Cloud Supreme and even more so, Cloud Luxe.

Simmons ComforPedic Phenom Plush-$2,900
Great initial feel, excellent at cushioning hip pressure point in 10 minute side-laying test. Support adequate, did not detect a back sway in stomach position. No return option, limited comfort exchange.

Healthy Back/Pure Latex Bliss
Elegance-12" mattress, $3,500
1" Talalay 15 ILD, 4" Talalay 24 ILD, 6" Talalay 36 ILD, 1" High Density Latex 40 ILD
This bed was marvelous, tied for my favorite with the Savvy Rest 100% Natural Talalay. It provided fantastic cushioning, lumbar support, and maintained spinal alignment in stomach positioning.

Essence-10" mattress, $3,315
1" Talalay 15 ILD, 2" Talalay 24 ILD, 6" Talalay 36 ILD, 1" High Density Latex 40 ILD
A very nice experience, not as cushioning as the Elegance.

Savvy Rest- No return option, limited comfort exchange.
100% Natural Talalay 3 x 3" layers-$4,000
Initially did not enjoy the active feel of the foam. However after the 2 hour visit and laying on the dunlop, talalay, and combo beds, this one became my favorite.
ā€¢ Top layer 22-24 ILD, middle layer 30-34 ILD, bottom layer 35-40+ ILD
Initial feel is welcoming, if a bit bouncy. Provides outstanding hip pressure point cushioning. Support is great, back is well aligned in stomach position, lumbar is well supported. Tied for my favorite with the Latex Bliss Elegance.
ā€¢ Top and middle layers 30-34 ILD, bottom layer 35-40+ ILD
My husbands preferred choice among the 100% Talalay options. He was not thrilled about the active bouncy feel and overall prefers the Tempur-Pedic Rhapsody Breeze feel. I felt it to be a bit lacking in initial comfort feel but doing a great job at cushioning my hip pressure point in side testing and great at spinal alignment in stomach position.

100% Dunlop 3 x 3" layers-$2,900
Love the initial sink feel to these beds, reminds me of laying on a well loved quilt. However, the Dunlop beds allow me to notice my hip pressure point connecting with the bed within the 10 minute side test, though it does not ache in this period.
ā€¢ Top layer 22-30 IDL, middle layer 31-39 ILD, bottom layer 40+ ILD
Great initial feel, some hip pressure point cushioning and spine remained in alignment during stomach position. Lost marks in the hip pressure point cushioning compared to the 100% Talalay. Very similar in cushioning and support results to the S&F Cora tested above. Preferred the feel of the latex to the springs.
ā€¢ Top and middle layer 22-30 ILD , bottom layer 31-39 ILD
Great initial feel, moderate hip pressure point cushioning, back sways slightly when in stomach position.
ā€¢ Firm-Top layer
Initial feel is not as welcoming, hip pressure point is more obvious, lumbar support is decreased. Back does not sway in stomach position.

Combo 3 x 3" layers, 100% Talalay over two layers of 100% Dunlop-$3,250
This offered a middle of the road option. Better at cushioning than the 100% Dunlop but less so than the 100% Talalay.
ā€¢ Top layer 30-34 ILD Talalay, middle layer 31-39 ILD Dunlop, bottom layer 40+ ILD Dunlop
Welcoming initial feel, great initial cushioning of hip pressure point but towards the end of the 10-minute side position test, could notice slight pressure on hip point. Great support, back remains in alignment in stomach position also providing lumbar support.
ā€¢ Top layer 22-24 ILD Talalay, middle layer 31-39 ILD Dunlop, bottom layer 40+ ILD Dunlop
Welcoming initial feel, overly active, good cushioning overall but support is less comfortable with slight sway in back in stomach position.

2

Hi sunlover1978,

I have to say Iā€™m impressed with the testing and evaluations you have done. Thatā€™s particularly true when I read some of the comments you have made such as ā€œgreat initial cushioning of hip pressure point but towards the end of the 10-minute side position test, could notice slight pressure on hip point.ā€ which suggests you are paying close attention to the more subtle cues of your body and using them to ā€œpredictā€ your longer term experience.

If you do decide to go in an online direction your testing will be a very useful model.

Iā€™d be happy to let you know of any Iā€™m aware of ā€¦ but I couldnā€™t see any mention of your city or zip.

A couple of general comments as well ā€¦

The flobeds convoluted layer is 2" not 1" but they can provide custom choices as well.

You are both very light and itā€™s not likely that you would need 12" of latex. This also seems to be re-inforced by the fact that the 9" Savvy Rest was your favorite and your husbandā€™s favorite latex option. Because of this Iā€™m wondering why you are looking at 11" - 12" versions from the online vendors you are considering.

I would also consider the mattress separately from the foundation. There is certainly no harm in buying a mattress at one place and a foundation at another.

Since you are also considering the PLB Elegance ā€¦ this indicates to me that you may be OK with blended Talalay as well in which case the layering choices you are considering would be available to you in blended Talalay as well from some of the merchants which would save you some cost.

Other than this, you seem to have identified all the pros and cons very well and it would seem its just a matter of more conversations with each manufacturer and eliminating some of your choices once by one ā€¦ even though they may all be good ones.

ā€¦ and of course letting me know your city or zip in case there are any other local options :slight_smile:

Phoenix

3

Thank you very much for the feedback! Yes, I may look at reducing the mattress size and decreasing cost. I did come across the post on foundations, is there one in particular you like above the rest based on quality? This bed thing is something I hope to do only rarely : ). Some of the manufacturers indicated a plywood base is fine, but the vast majority seem to feel a latex mattress should breath and therefore recommend/sell slatted platforms, what is your opinion?

We are currently living in Maryland, 21140.

Sarah

4

Hi sunlover1978,

My thoughts are in the foundation thread you mentioned here along with post #10 here which suggests a firm slatted foundation with gaps between the slats of less than 3" would be fine. There are several there that would qualify and I will leave the choice between them to your preferences. I would choose one of these unless there was a compelling reason for a solid foundation (such as wanting an adjustable bed which I myself have so I couldnā€™t choose a slatted base).

The better options and possibilities Iā€™m aware of near you are in post #2 here.

Phoenix

5

Thanks to Phoenixā€™s advice, we went to one on the list here in Maryland today. Itā€™s in or near Columbia. The Mattress Organic. Phone 1-410-730-2575. I think itā€™s also called Rhinetec. Heā€™s done lots and lots of research and will set up an appointment with you to show you the pure latex and let you try them. He sells them in 3 layers of 3 inch pure latex and you can choose the layering. Heā€™s very knowledgeable and patient. But there are only three versions to try, so Iā€™m a bit confused as to what I want to order. He offers both dunlop and talalay-prefers the latter, but sells mostly dunlop.
Also tried Healthy Back in Annapolis and the Mattress Store in Annapolis and had to eliminate them because of my sensitivities to chemicals. (fire retardant, polyfoam,)etc. Iā€™m extremely impressed with your reviews and find them helpful.

6

Hi!

I returned to test the PLB Elegance today and found to my sadness, it allows a slight sway to my back. I didnā€™t notice this during my first test because my back was already sore that dayā€”thank you rotten current mattress! Today I tested the PLB Essence, and while it looses marks on the initial welcoming feel, it does a great job of spinal alignment. Short pressure point observation seemed good, but need more time with that aspect.

As I continue my analysis, could you elaborate further on the average ILD? Is it the average ILD of the entire mattress or the average ILD of the first 6 inches, cushioning + perceived support? As I narrow my choices, if I calculate the average ILD for the mattresses I prefer, can I use this to better select DIY mattress layers from Sleep EZ or others by matching up the average ILDā€™s? My attempt at averages is below : )

How does the sag factor calculate in? How do I determine/calculate it?

Durability is an important factor in my decision process. Ideally I would like 10 years of consistent performance, without any or only minimal loss in support, given my stomach sleeping position. Natural/Organic is another important factor because of my autoimmune health concerns. As I weight these possibly conflicting goals, what am I sacrificing in durability to choose the 100% NR talalay vs. the blended talalay? Is this still an issue given our relatively low/well distributed body weight? Is there ways to mitigate decreased durability by selecting a higher ILD 100% NR talalayā€”of course without compromising cushioning and support functions?

Is there a comfort/durability benefit to selecting the 12" vs. the 9" NR talalay? There is a $300 price difference from Sleep EZ between the options. This could be a less expensive than a future purchase of a replacement layer if the top layer becomes compressed or less supportive. It also allows for more combination options without needing to exchange a layer.

If my top softest layer compresses or develops a body impression, can I swap it down in the mattress configuration? My concern would be that the now upper layer will reflect the body impression due to the lack of support from the compressed layer below.

My attempt at averages:
Sean at Sleep EZ recommended the following configurations for a 9" and 12" 100% NR talalay:
Top layer-19-20 ILD, middle layer-30-32 ILD, bottom layer 38-40 ILD
Average total ILD: 29.81, Average top 6" ILD: 25.25

Top layer-19-20 ILD, 2 middle layers-30-32 ILD, bottom layer 38-40 ILD
Average total ILD: 30.12, Average top 6" ILD: 25.25

The Savvy Rest averages for the 100% NR talalay in first post are:
Average total ILD: 31, Average top 6" ILD: 27.5

The PLB Essence blended talalay:
1" of 15 ILD, 2" of 24 ILD, 6" of 36 ILD, 1" of 40 ILD
Average total ILD: 32, Average top 6" ILD: 28.5

7

May I ask Sunlover where she is trying these mattresses? I think sheā€™s in Maryland where I am. I am having trouble findingthe link that Phoenix sent originally.
Thanks, Wheezer

8

Of course : ). Youā€™re welcome to email me directly as well: [email protected], we could commiserate about how challenging it is to find a fantastic mattress and then how much it costs!!

Iā€™ve driven out to Vienna, VA to the Savvy Rest store twice. They have more combos to try than the location in Colombia according to Savvy Rest customer service. The blended latex by Pure Latex Bliss is over at the Healthy Back store in Annapolis. The other places Iā€™ve gone are Sleepys and Mattress Discountersā€¦not much to see there in the way of quality/valueā€¦\

Pheonix linked the post above with the DC locations. Iā€™m still working on calling through the list. For knowledge, so far Mattress Traditions really stands out and has a few latex models on the floor, NR Talalay at $5,000 but itā€™s two sided and 7" Dunlop at $3,000. Not sure if Iā€™m up for the drive and the price is high enough to significantly decrease the value proposition.

9

I just spoke with Robert from AmericanFoamCenter with a showroom in Fairfaxā€¦think that will be my next visit! He has 6" 80/20 blended Talalay latex mattress cores for $1865 (king), 2" toppers for $519, and 3" toppers for $780. He also has dunlop options and both available at the showroom for demos.

10

Hi sunlover1978,

I think you may be crossing the line into becoming overly analytical and starting a learning curve that will take you months (or longer) before you end up buying a mattress.

Average ILD is not particularly meaningful. I use it sometimes to illustrate various points but itā€™s certainly not something I would use as a way of choosing a mattress.

Sag factor is the ratio between IFD/ILD @ 25% compression and IFD/ILD @ 65% compression and is an indicator of how quickly a material gets firmer with deeper compression. More than that I wouldnā€™t pay any attention to it. It would be a spec that a foam manufacturer may provide to you but wouldnā€™t generally be available to a consumer. As an example of how technical this could be you could read post #26 here which is still not likely to have any practical benefit to you. I would work with people who already know what you would otherwise take months to learn and avoid the temptation to get as technical as you are. I would let the designers design and limit your own role to ā€œreportingā€ what layering works best for you.

[quote]
As I weight these possibly conflicting goals, what am I sacrificing in durability to choose the 100% NR talalay vs. the blended talalay? Is this still an issue given our relatively low/well distributed body weight? Is there ways to mitigate decreased durability by selecting a higher ILD 100% NR talalayā€”of course without compromising cushioning and support functions?[/quote

I donā€™t think there is any way to give specific answers to these kinds of questions except to say ā€œsomeā€. You are looking for a degree of specificity that probably doesnā€™t exist and is relative to each person anyway. You can read more about the different factors that affect durability in post #4 here and the differences between 100% natural and blended Talalay in post #2 here. Many if not most things involving mattresses donā€™t have specific quantifiable or certain answers and involve intuitive judgement or relative answers more than people are often comfortable with ā€¦ even though they are the only truly ā€œaccurateā€ answers.

You can read about the potential benefits of a thicker mattress in post #14 here. As you mentioned ā€¦ it also allows for more layering possibilities.

I would suggest that along wth your personal testing ā€¦ some extended conversations with SleepEZ or some of the other online manufacturers here will give you more meaningful ā€œreal lifeā€ information than months of analysis based on specs.

Phoenix

11

Thanks for the technical info overview, itā€™s fun to try to understand a bit of the logic behind the art : )

To fine-tune my comfort/support needs, I took a trip back to VA and checked out some of the MU recommended locations. In the Savvy Rest configuration below, is the secondary 3" of 30-34 ILD providing support, comfort, or both? Based on the tests below, what best guess could we make on the ideal thickness and ILD of comfort/support layers? My goal is to determine if I can improve at all on the Savvy Rest configuration through adding an additional 3" of latex and enhance the luxurious feel of the bedā€”without compromising pressure relief or support. This will help to determine which manufactures I look at seriously as I narrow the field : )

I would like to keep the option of an adjustable base open for the future. Would we want to stay in the 9-10" mattress range or could we go to the 12"? I like the overall comforting feel better of the deeper beds, but 9" would probably provide enough pressure relief and support for a great night sleep.

As always, thank you for the fantastic feedback! What an amazing site!

Sarah

SavvyRest 100% NR Talalay:
Top Layer: 3" of 22-24 ILD
Middle Layer: 3" of 30-34 ILD
Bottom Layer: 3" of 35-40+ ILD
The best combo of comfort and support. It doesnā€™t have the same luxurious feel as 11-13" beds however.

American Foam, Talalay blend:
Top Layer: 2" at 19 ILD
Bottom Layer: 6" at 36 ILD
This bed felt hard, it did not provide pressure point cushioning or lumbar support. It was good to experience how the raw materials in a very thin cotton cover felt, to differentiate the feel of the quilted covers from the latex. Provided decent spinal support in stomach position.

Goldbond brand latex option (Talalay blend, but not sure):
Top Layer: 2" of 14 ILD
Middle Layer: 2" of 19 ILD
Bottom Layer: 6" of 36 ILD
Great lumbar support but insufficient spinal support, I sank too deeply into the comfort layers.

WJ Sutherland NR Dunlop:
Top Layer: 4" topper, wool and cotton cover over 3" of 20-25 ILD
Bottom Layer: 6" of 30-35 ILD in a 1" thick cotton and wool cover.
This bed was close! However, the additional 1" of cover width on the 3" latex topper was enough for my hips to sway slightly in the stomach positionā€¦.too much comfort layer. The bed was displayed on a box spring, so possible slight impact on softness feel, however based on similar issue with the 4" of comfort layers above, think that 4" extends beyond my comfort needs.

PLB Essence, Talalay Blend:
Top Layer: 1" at 15 ILD
Middle Layer 1: 2" at 24 ILD
Middle Layer 2: 6" at 36 ILD
Bottom Layer: 1" at 40 ILD
This bed is pretty close. It provides decent comfort, pressure relief, and lumbar support. Hip pressure point is slightly more noticeable than in the Savvy Rest bed. The knit rayon cover is not all that welcoming and doesnā€™t provide the additional 1/2 " comfort of the Savvy Rest cover. Overall the bed feels similar to the Savvy Rest bed but I just donā€™t ā€œlikeā€ the feel as well, canā€™t put my finger on it. Spinal alignment is good. Again, not particular luxurious in feel.

The deeper PLB Elegance is a more luxurious feel but does not offer the necessary spinal support. (Top layer: 1" at 15 ILD, Middle layers 2-3: 4" of 19 than 24 ILD, Middle layer 4: 6" of 36 ILD, Bottom layer: 1" of 40 ILD.)

12

Hi sunlover,

I wouldnā€™t think in terms of things like ā€œideal thicknessā€ or ā€œwhich layer is doing whatā€ but would use your testing to determine if a mattress provides you with the PPP (Pressure relief, Posture and alignment, and Personal preferences) you need. You can read about the two main functions of a mattress here and everything else is relative to these and your own personal preferences. Post #2 here also has more about how to ā€œdefineā€ your perfect mattress. I wouldnā€™t try to ā€œtheorizeā€ your way to a choice. If you plan to consider other manufacturers than the ones you are personally testing ā€¦ then more detailed conversations with them is the ā€œbestā€ approach.

You can read more about the potential benefits of thicker layers and thicker mattresses in post #14 here.

12" of latex would generally be fine for an adjustable bed (I say generally because if all 12" were very firm then it may not work as well).

A few general comments which may be helpful ā€¦

This is an example of a comfort layer that is quite soft and thin to the point where you are ā€œgoing throughā€ it and feeling the firmness of the layers below it. An example of a very similar layering would be the Pure Latex bliss Pamper which has 2" of 21 ILD over 6" of 40 ILD.

This may have more to do with the box spring than the comfort layer. If this is Dunlop ā€¦ you will sink in less than you would into 3" of Talalay (much less 4") and the wool would have the effect of reducing the cradling a little more. In terms of the comfort layer ā€¦ this would be similar to the Savvy Rest with 3" of soft Dunlop except with a little more wool. I would also keep in mind of course that the next 3ā€™ down are firmer so the S/M/F Savvy Rest would be softer and this would be closer to S/F/F in the Savvy Rest.

I would also make sure that the PLB specs you are quoting are correct. they are the old versions which are still being made in some areas of the country but make sure that the cover isnā€™t blue or the name of the mattresses includes ā€œActive Fusionā€ which would indicate the new versions and a little different layering (see post #2 here)

Overall it seems to me that your comments and perceptions are very ā€œaccurateā€ and follow ā€œtheoryā€ well and would provide a good guideline for a choice.

Phoenix

13

Hi Sunlover. I am just starting my mattress hunt, and I wanted to let you know how useful your notes have been. I am going to try to organize my notes in a similar way so that I have the mattress specs right next to my initial impressions. I think timing yourself on the mattresses is also a brilliant idea to keep the testing more even. Thanks for your help (and this fantastic site) - good luck finding the perfect mattress!

14

I am also partaking in the great mattress hunt. First time buying a mattress and Iā€™ve been using this site to try and find out as much information as I can. So far during our tests my fiancĆ© and I find that we are really enjoying the latex mattresses from the Healthy Back store in Columbia MD. We live in Glen Burnie (21060), and Iā€™ve gone through Phoenixā€™s list of retailers in the area from Post number 2 here. So far I havenā€™t been able to find a retailer that has any latex or latex hybrid that has the same comfort and support as the Healthy Back store. The two beds my fiancĆ© and I are looking at are the Essence and the Peace. I appreciate the post from Sunlover because I believe the salesperson misunderstood me when I asked for ILD ratings for the mattress because he called the manufacturer and was told it was 36 for all layers which didnā€™t make much sense so Iā€™m thinking I only got the support layer. He gave me the number for the manufacturer and I left a message for them to call me back so I can confirm Sunloverā€™s post and I also sent an email to the healthy back website asking the same.

What Iā€™m hoping to gain from this post is how good a value these latex mattresses are since this is my first go round. My understanding of the specs of the two mattresses right now are as followed:

Essence:
$3120 (Flat King)
1" Celsion Talalay latex at 15 ILD
2" Talalay latex at 24 ILD
6" support Talalay at 36 ILD
1" stabilization base at 40 ILD

Peace:
$2240 (Flat King)
1" Talalay S latex at 28 ILD
6" support latex light (Dunlop?)
1" stabilization base

The information for the Peace I got here. The salesman said that all the latex mattresses were only Talalay but the post for the Peace says the support layer is Dunlop, can anyone confirm? The post for the Peace is almost two years old and I would like to be accurate as possible.

I believe the prices include mattress and foundation and the salesman said heā€™d ā€œthrow inā€ 2 of their high end pillows which run about $120 each. I was also told that both mattresses are a 70/30 blend of mostly synthetic Talalay.

Some general information on my fiancĆ© and myself. Iā€™m about 6ā€™2" and 175 lbs and sheā€™s 5ā€™2" 125 lbs. sheā€™s mostly a side sleeper. I generally can sleep in any position though when Iā€™m having trouble I find my stomach to be the most comfortable.

Are these good value mattresses? I will get a 5% military discount that is not considered in the prices I quoted.

15

Hi Jwaldorf2,

The specs you are mentioning are different from any of the three versions of the Pure Latex Bliss that they have had since they staqrted. Version had a 1" polyfoam stabilization layer, version 2 here replaced the polyfoam stabilization layer with 1" of very firm Talalay, and version 3 here removed the 1" firm Talalay stabilization layer and added it to the comfort layers and also replace the top layer of retular blended Talalay with Talalay GL fast response. None of these match the specs you listed and I have never bee able to confirm the specific layering of the Healthy Back mattresses or whether they are the same or different from the current PLB mattresses. Your specs appear to be closest to the original version of the Pure Latex Bliss mattresses (when they still had a polyfoam base layer) but I donā€™t know if what you have been given is accurate.

Having said that ā€¦ the comfort specs of a mattress that you are testing locally arenā€™t really relevant anyway because your body will tell you much more about whether a mattress is suitable for you in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) than any ILD specifications.

In terms of value ā€¦ the PLB mattresses could be compared in terms of quality and value to any other mattress that use a similar amount of blended Talalay latex regardless of ILD (or in the case of the Peace similar amounts of synthetic Dunlop and blended Talalay latex) and a similar cover (good quality unquilted stretch cover). They would typically be better value than many mainstream brands but not in the same value range as many smaller manufacturers or online choices (such as the members listed in post #21 here which sell many types and styles of latex mattresses).

Because of the extra risk of an online mattress that you canā€™t test before a purchase ā€¦ I generally suggest that a local mattress that is in the range of 20% or so compared to a similar online mattress that uses the same amount and type of latex and has a similar cover would be roughly comparable value and that if a local purchase has more than about a 20% - 25% premium then it may be worthwhile to consider an online choice. Some of the online choices reduce the risk of making an unsuitable choice because of options that can either re-arrange or exchange individual layers in a mattress or with good return policies.

Since the PLB mattresses are not the same design and donā€™t use the same layering as most of the online choices ā€¦ the best way to make a comfort choice with an online purchase would be a more detailed conversation with the online retailer or manufacturer so they could help you make a choice between the options they have that was either based on ā€œaveragesā€ for different body types and sleeping styles or can use any information you have about local mattresses you have tested to choose one of the design options they have available that are as close as possible to the mattress you tested. This is normally a matter of ā€œeducated guessworkā€ because translating one type of layering into another for a specific person is not by any means an exact science.

Blended Talalay is usually a 70% synthetic / 30% natural blend yes although latex international also uses a fairly high percentage of filler so the latex content is only a percentage of the latex in the mattress ā€¦ not a percentage of the total layer.

From a ā€œcommodityā€ point of view ā€¦ I would call them fair value but not ā€œgoodā€ value but there are many aspects to the value of a mattress purchase besides just the materials in a mattress. Value always depends on all the objective, subjective, and intangible parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you and this can vary widely from from person to person.

Phoenix

16

Phoenix, just so I can correct some errors from my first post, I just got off the phone with the rep that supplies the beds to the Healthy Back store and Iā€™ve confirmed the current specs for both the Essence and the Peace.

Essence:
$3120 (Flat King)
1" Celsion Talalay latex at 21 ILD
2" Talalay latex at 28 ILD
6" support Talalay at 36 ILD
1" stabilization base at >=40 ILD

Peace:
$2240 (Flat King)
1" Talalay S latex at 21 ILD
6" Talalay 40 ILD
1" Talalay >= 40 ILD

Hopefully this will help some people

17

Hi Jwaldorf2,

Thanks for the specs.

These specs are closest to the second version of the PLB except they use the Celsion latex (now called Talalay GL fast response) in the top layers.

The Peace is closest to the PLB Pamper and the Essence would be closest to the PLB Nature.

They would likely have a somewhat similar ā€œfeelā€ to the second generation (see here) or the third generation (see here) PLB equivalent (with some differences because of differences in layering) and you could also use the PLB line as a ā€œvalue comparisonā€ along with other blended Talalay latex mattresses that used the same amount of latex.

Phoenix