So I just received a very nice phone call from Stan at Ideal Mattress Ltd. Itâs 8:30pm so a little unexpectedâŚbut was pleasantly surprised that he called. About an hour before I had re-sent my message from yesterday looking for some additional information. He called me back right away, apologized for not responding sooner, and was extremely helpful on the phone.
We talked about the various mattress options and got into some of the details of the one I tested in the showroom (7" firm, 3" firm, 1" soft"). He indicated that the firm is in the 27-28 ILD range, and the soft is in the 17-18 ILD range. Iâm not really overly concerned about the specs (which is why I didnât ask in the showroom), but it is helpful to have an idea when comparing the layers for other mattresses.
I did ask about a medium layer and he gave an interesting answer. He said that they have found that there isnât much of a difference between the firm and medium cores that they get from their suppliers. Instead if they feel the need when working with a customer they will try and create an âin-betweenâ layer from a firm core. To get their layer combos they cut a 7" core into 2 x 3" and 1 x 1". He said that because the cores arenât consistent all the way through because of the baking process, there can be some subtle differences in firmness that give them a little flexibility if someone is looking for something a little less firm.
In terms of pricing, he is right in line with the other options - about $3,000 for a King.
Lisa_mocha and dn, maybe you want to check him out for a mattress cover. He said they do a very luxurious silk cover. About $600 for a King. Might even rival dnâs Vasilo cover!
Lol, youâd be shocked (I was) at some of the super high end bedding, some of which is all for show⌠Some of which is more comfortable than I could imagine.
For fun, I looked at a set of sheets⌠$3,000 for a single queen flat sheet. More than $10k for duvet cover, flat sheet, fitted sheet, and 2 pillow cases. Cashmere and silk. Itâs horrible, and Iâm sure uncomfortable! Apparently Celine Dion has them. Also, apparently most of the âsalesâ have been of the fabric swatches for people to see in showrooms. http://www.tmasc.ca/st-geneve-custom-bedding/CashmereSet.html
Or, look into a genuine eiderdown duvet or pillow. $5,000 for a pillow, $10k for a duvet. Apparently, there are more Ferraris sold than eiderdown duvets each year.
(Just examples of tmasc stuff. Iâm sure there are high-high end retailers that go way beyond that)
I went with pure linen for sheets, which is sufficiently costly, and wool for duvet and maybe topper. Please, Donât get me interested in trying out silk!
there are people out there that have 1 flat sheet more expensive than any of us have spent on the entire bed. You could easily spend $50k outfitting one king bed if money were no object.
(Yes, I had a blast shopping for bedding. Who couldnât be entertained when looking at a bedding set the price of a small car. But every fabric we looked at had a story⌠Which mill in Europe each fabric comes from, how the mill has been around for generations, what they specialize in, how their fine European fabric feels vs. a different fine European fabric. Me and my wife felt like a million bucks! And no, we donât have a million )
Iâm running for the hills :lol:
VRAMâŚmaybe I should be checking out Ideal as well as only 20min or so away, but I honestly donât know if I can deal with another choice:) sounds interesting though.
I guess I get caught up in the up-front spend, however, if a mattress we were more than happy with was $1k more than another, then perhaps thatâ s no so bad over the life of the mattress.
The $600 padâŚgoing to have to pass on that one:)
DnâŚyikes! Iâm definitely not in the same âsnack bracketâ as those purchasing the high end bedding.
I donât think I could ever justify that!
I have some linen duvet covers, but have not tried linen sheets. Wonder what the ones from Restoration Hardware are like?
Ah wellâŚthatâs all for another day! (Stay focused LisaâŚneed mattress first :cheer: )
Ok⌠Just before logging off and going to bed, I happened to pop onto the Dormio site.
VRAM, not sure if you made it into their Mississauga showroom?
AnywaysâŚThereâs the posting for a sale on one of the beds we tried ( and quite liked) Emrosia Plush.
Just thought Iâd give you the heads-up on that. Just what you want⌠Another choice:)
I need to look at it when Iâm more awake tomorrow. Gânight!
Really? I bought my mattress this past spring and they only offered Talalay.
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Perhaps I misunderstood thenâŚI know the ones I tried were talalay, but I did have a quote on Dunlop and a quote on Talalay.
(unless some blend of Dunlop) I really donât knowâŚ
Thanks for the heads up on the Dormio sale Lisa_mocha! I hadnât really looked at them, but even looking at the sale prices I think they are still more premium priced than I would like to go. I am also not a big fan of the limited time sale. If the margins are that great that they can offer 25% off, why not just give me a lower everyday price? But I digressâŚ
I am still focused on the Flobeds and Ideal options. The Ideal mattress Ltd has the advantage of being local and having the ability to work with them in the event of any issues. The Flobeds has the advantage of offering some additional bells and whistles (vZone and convoluted layer), but also the downside not being able to test it (and of making the bed have too many variables to get right).
I am still hoping that Phoenix might pop into this thread and give some feedback on my thought process and the logic that is leading me to a narrowing set of options. With such a big decision, it would be nice to hear his opinion (given his considerable experience), and try to get comfortable with the decision. I know that I have moved up the scale in terms of going for the absolute best âvalueâ, but I am ok with that (if fits my PVE).
Even with that, I am going to have a some âanalysis paralysisâ and it will be difficult to pull the trigger.
I normally scan all the threads looking for specific questions but this thread has been moving very quickly so Iâll answer the questions Iâve seen and if I miss any let me know.
I have no experience with either cover because I havenât slept on either of them and âfeelâ is completely subjective so I really canât answer this for someone else. In general I keep my comments to guidance about quality and value because PPP and "feelâ is much too individual and subjective to give any meaningful guidance for someone else except in the most generic way. I do know that both are good quality covers and quilted with wool but they would be a better source of information to try and describe the âfeelâ or the finer details of each of their components.
You can see some comments about the lanoodles topper in post #38 here. A thin shredded latex topper is more of a feel and surface softness layer than a significant pressure relieving layer. Contoured or âpillowâ surfaces would be similar to convoluting in the sense that they would have a different âfeelâ and a little extra softness. There is more about the different types of softness in post #15 here. The lanoodles is more of a âfeelâ softness that adds some extra âcushâ with a bit of benefit for pressure relief as well. It can add some extra softness with less risk of alignment issues than solid layers because the shredded latex can âflowâ around the more protruding body parts (like the shoulders) that need to sink in more but will be âcompressedâ and be more supportive under the larger surface areas (like the pelvis).
If you can feel the difference it makes and itâs a significant improvement in terms of PPP it would be âworth itâ but they would probably be a more valuable option for thinner mattresses (in the range of @6" - 8"or so) than with thicker mattresses. The benefits would be less with thicker mattresses because the mattress would absorb more of the compression forces before they reached the adjustable foundation. My âbaselineâ would be a firm slatted base with the mattress doing the work and I would only add an adjustable slat option if it provided a noticeable improvement (or I was convinced it would) that was significant to me.
The overall process I would normally follow would be to âforce yourselfâ to choose a single âfinalistâ at each store you are dealing with based on a combination of PPP (most important), quality (all the mattresses you are looking at are all good quality with no âweak linksâ), and value (are some of the more premium mattresses you are considering worth the premium cost based on any extra features they may have compared to others with similar materials). With your online âfinalistsâ that you havenât tested then your confidence about how suitable they will be in terms of PPP based on a combination of your conversations and testing experiences and your ability to re-arrange or exchange layers (or zones) would be a more significant part of my choice. Your own knowledge about where you are in the range of the âprincess and the peaâ to âI can sleep on anythingâ scale would also play a role in the options that were important to me. With local testing I wouldnât do too much analysis of the layering and would let my body decide which was the most suitable in terms of PPP. With online choices there is more âthoughtâ and intuiive judgement involved because you canât test them in person. Final choices can be difficult (it took me weeks to decide between my finalists !)
If Iâve missed any of the questions you had let me know
@ Lisa_mocha:
The last time I talked with Foamite was some time ago but at the time they only offered Talalay in a single ILD. Of course they may have changed the options they have available since then. Their site says they use Dunlopillo which used to make Talalay Latex in England but went bankrupt in 2008 and now itâs just a name. In North America Latex International owns the trademark which means that any latex that is sold as Dunlopillo would be Talalay latex made by Latex International.
Iâ ve decided to rule out a couple of options and have come down to my Top 2 or 3 picks:
FLOBEDS: Pros:I like the idea of convuloted topper and the fact I can purchase additional layers for a low price should our needs change over the next few years. I think the more conforming nature of talalay might appeal to me.
Like the idea of vzone⌠If we can get it right.
More affordable than the options Iâve looked at in Canada
Cons: Risk of buying on-line without trying. A little more of a hassle to return if requiredâŚbut hopeful it wouldnât come to that.
SmellâŚIâm sensitive to smellsâŚdoes talalay have a stronger or longer lasting scent than dunlop?
SLEEPTEK EURO 4/OBASAN ACADIA 3 ( I think these are pretty much the same except Obasan has 3 zone layer)
Pros: Comfortable(dunlop) 10"" with very nice quality cover. Can buy locally. Entire mattress appears to be v. Good quality
Cons:: Price. Approx $800 more than Flobeds. (Pillows thrown in on both) No convolutedbor plush topper lie Flobeds. The question if Iâd prefer talalay or dunlopâŚ???
Greensleep still lingering as an option. Beautiful cover, but was a little firmer than the Sleeptek. Also, most expensive pick.
This one will likely fall off the list unless we can negotiate a better dealâŚif thatâs possible.
Phoenix , any idea as to how the Flobeds mattress cover compares in quality/ texture to the Sleeptek ( or Oyasumi version from the Clean Bedroom) and Greensleep?
Talalay generally has a milder smell than Dunlop that some people describe as a âsweetishâ smell like vanilla or sugar cookies rather than the more rubbery smell of Dunlop and it tends to dissipate more quickly (see post #2 here).
I donât know other than knowing that they are all good quality covers that are quilted with wool. I would suspect that both the Sleeptek and the GreenSleep would have more wool in them but you would need to find out the more detailed specs of each cover directly from each manufacturer to make more detailed comparisons or have them provide more detailed descriptions (the specifics of the cotton and the amount of wool etc) but this still wouldnât tell you how each will actually feel to you until you actually lie on them.
All of these mattresses use good quality and durable materials (you can read more about the different types of latex which may help you make better comparisons in post #6 here). You can also read a little more about the difference in âfeelâ between Dunlop and Talalay in post #7 here but the only really reliable way to know which you prefer is to try both types. None of these mattresses have any weak links in their design.
The Flobeds would have the edge in terms of being more customizable (more like a custom made suit rather than a suit off the shelf that you can make some adjustments to).
No matter which you choose you will end up with a very high quality and durable mattress but final choices can be very difficult when there are no clear âwinnersâ and will depend on all the objective, subjective, and intangible factors that are most important to you.
Iâ m still leaning towards a talalay mattress from Flobeds, but have 1 more concernâŚ
Given that talalay has a 'springer/ bouncier and lively feel, would this mean that motion isolation would not be as good as a more dense dunlop mattress? Sorry, Iâve likely asked this, and am tried to get my head around âbouncierâ and if my husband is flopping around all night, which latex would offer the best possible motion isolation.Or, really no difference and all depends on mattress itself?
I would treat Dunlop and Talalay as being roughly equivalent in terms of motion isolation. Latex is very âpoint elasticâ which means that it compresses in a local area under compression without affecting the area around it. Both are âgoodâ although of course memory foam is the leader in this category because it not only compresses locally but also absorbs energy while latex is much more resilient and âreturnsâ the energy which is why itâs more âspringyâ.
There is more about motion isolation and vibration âdampingâ in post #4 here.
Hi VRAM, happy to hear that!
My husband just asked again last night when I was going to decide!
I was still leaning toward flobeds, but still a tad nervous about taking the plunge!(on-line)
I think Iâ m going to go for it too! Worse case scenario, we can still return and just be out the shipping $.
Did you end up going with v zone? With a foundation?
I was pretty happy with sleeptek too, but I keep thinking about talalay and a convuloted topperâŚso, think Flobeds is the winner:)
I went with the organic vZone and fir foundation. Shipping to the UPS store in Niagara Falls, NY.
They are also including the extra components to be able to change up the dual side vZone layers and provide some extra flexibility without having to worry about cross-border layer exchanges.
It was a bit more than i anticipated paying going into this process. it came to $4k with the mattress, foundation and shipping - and I will still need to pay taxes at the border. It is still cheaper than the retail options (Green Sleep, Sleeptek, etc.), a bit more expensive than ideal (but with more âfeaturesâ for better or worse), and not as value priced as some of the other Toronto factory direct options.
Having said that, I am pretty excited to pick the bed up next week!
Next up is mattress protector. I am leaning towards the St. Dormeir but want to check it out in person to make sure I will like the cotton terry cover. If I do I will probably get the mattress and pillow protectors from tmasc.ca.
Hope you love it Vram!
Looking forward to your feedbackâŚIâve been travelling past week so didnât have chance to order yet. Ready to go with Flobeds.
Comfort, any smell, motion isolation⌠What do you think? Is it close in comfort to the Euro 4 sleeptek?
