Toronto Mattress Search

Mattress Talk General Mattresses Questions
21

Hi All,

Van, your logic makes perfect sense to me! It’s the convuloted topper and the vzone that has appealed to me from Flobeds, as I know I’ll want some softness, esp. in the hips and shoulders. Dewey has certainly been kind on the phone.
(hey…if it’s good enough for Barbara Barry and Mark Ruffalo, good enough for me,lol…Celeb reviews)
I’m more comfortable with shipping to Buffalo too…pay the Receiving fees etc. That way, no extra ‘surprises’ with a delivery to the door in Canada.

FYI, we did go to Foamite in Vaughan on the weekend. They did have a few beds with posted ILD’s so that might be of interest for you to check out. (now, whether or not their ILD/ratings would be comparable…)
I tried a 19,23,26 and 29. I even found the 29 on the firmish side. Liked the 19, but I know too soft, so I guess my preference was 23-26max, but I was advised 29 might provide better support. My husband prefers a firm bed and was happy enough testing a mattress with ILD of 34. I might end up a little softer than what the Flobeds website shows as a recommendation based on weight, sleeping preference etc.
Foamite offers both dunlop and talalay (about a $1000 price diff), but I have to admit I was a liitle confused as to how these mattresses were built. We both preferred the feel of the Sleeptek at Soma.

Re: the St Dormier cover, I’m pretty sure Soma had them and I think you mentioned you lived nearby. Elte, just a few minutes away, had them upstairs in the Bedding Dept which is where I saw it. Maybe under a sheet, the texture of the terry wouldn’t be as noticable, but it did throw me off a bit. (although wool component good for temperature regulation)
I’ll be looking at Sleeptek, Cozypure or Greensleep option,the vasilo dn has recommended. If it’s anything like the quality of the Greensleep mattress cover, am sure it’s great.

dn-wow, you have lots of options to test! I’m glad I’m not the only one in search of the perfectly comfortable bed.
My husband thinks I’m insane for spending this much time…then again, I think he could sleep on his head in a corner:)
Would be great if you could post a picture…thank you!

Will keep you posted on the continuing saga of ‘the mattrress mission’
(is it just me, or can purchasing a home be easier,lol)

22

Hi Lisa_mocha,

I know you know this but for the benefit of others who read this … I would be very cautious about using an “automated” method for choosing your layers of giving them much weight in your decisions because these are only very generic and often not the most suitable choice. Personal conversations and the suggestions they make are usually a much more effective way of making layering choices.

Phoenix

23

Picture attached of vasilo on king.

598×800 25.8 KB

24

Also, Clawdia in this thread:
https://forum.mattressunderground.com/t/mattress-protector-inquiry

Says she’s found the vasilo at 20% off.

I’ve pointed her at this thread, due to the question about the finish of the fabric.
And I’m posting a link that thread in this thread (that thread being about mattress protectors).

25

Thank you dn! Does not look like the one posted on some of the US websites, but this one sure looks ‘authentic’ with greensleep name all over it:)
I did see the sale at the Clean Bedroom.

Do you think it sleeps ‘warm’?? We had 1 protector I ended up removing as it just seems to have built up too much heat.
In that regard, the St Dormier would be a good option with the terry/wool.
Decisions, decisions on mattresses, pads and pillows…I’m going gray:)

I’m going to try to finalize this weekend!

26

[quote=“Lisa_mocha” post=25143]Thank you dn! Does not look like the one posted on some of the US websites, but this one sure looks ‘authentic’ with greensleep name all over it:)
I did see the sale at the Clean Bedroom.

Do you think it sleeps ‘warm’?? We had 1 protector I ended up removing as it just seems to have built up too much heat.
In that regard, the St Dormier would be a good option with the terry/wool.
Decisions, decisions on mattresses, pads and pillows…I’m going gray:)

I’m going to try to finalize this weekend!
[/quote]

Hi Lisa,

I’m not sure if the one at the Clean Bedroom is just a different pattern embroidered into it, totally different stock, or a bad picture. I do know the one I got is identical to the one I saw in tmasc, which is the same as on their website. I have no idea :frowning:

As to warm? I don’t think it does no. I sleep exceptionally hot, so… Now that said, I’ve worked many means to sleep cool because usually I’m so hot. We have air conditioning, and it’s programmed to drop the house to about 19 degrees Celsius at night. The blankets we have are wool from Bed Bath and Beyond, and tend to be a touch more temperature regulating. The sheets in my bed are pure linen, which is quite cool too (more so than cotton I find), and my pillows are encased in st dormier (the down pillow), or have a cooling treatment of some form and light cotton protector (zedbed breeze pillow). Needless to say, I needed a hot water bottle the other day (which is unheard of for me). The biggest impactor on that being the air conditioning… Once you get 9" of dense latex cooled, it takes a while to heat up :wink: in other words, no I don’t think the mattress protector sleeps hot, but I do have several things I’ve used to cool down.

I seriously gave up on the decision making. Buy it all and sort it out through actual use is what I decided :wink: hopefully my experiences and comparisons can be helpful for others. For whatever it’s worth, as mattress protectors go, I wouldn’t wish anything different about the one we have.

27

And the plot thickens…

So I just received a very nice phone call from Stan at Ideal Mattress Ltd. It’s 8:30pm so a little unexpected…but was pleasantly surprised that he called. About an hour before I had re-sent my message from yesterday looking for some additional information. He called me back right away, apologized for not responding sooner, and was extremely helpful on the phone.

We talked about the various mattress options and got into some of the details of the one I tested in the showroom (7" firm, 3" firm, 1" soft"). He indicated that the firm is in the 27-28 ILD range, and the soft is in the 17-18 ILD range. I’m not really overly concerned about the specs (which is why I didn’t ask in the showroom), but it is helpful to have an idea when comparing the layers for other mattresses.

I did ask about a medium layer and he gave an interesting answer. He said that they have found that there isn’t much of a difference between the firm and medium cores that they get from their suppliers. Instead if they feel the need when working with a customer they will try and create an “in-between” layer from a firm core. To get their layer combos they cut a 7" core into 2 x 3" and 1 x 1". He said that because the cores aren’t consistent all the way through because of the baking process, there can be some subtle differences in firmness that give them a little flexibility if someone is looking for something a little less firm.

In terms of pricing, he is right in line with the other options - about $3,000 for a King.

Lisa_mocha and dn, maybe you want to check him out for a mattress cover. He said they do a very luxurious silk cover. About $600 for a King. Might even rival dn’s Vasilo cover!

28

Lol, you’d be shocked (I was) at some of the super high end bedding, some of which is all for show… Some of which is more comfortable than I could imagine.

For fun, I looked at a set of sheets… $3,000 for a single queen flat sheet. More than $10k for duvet cover, flat sheet, fitted sheet, and 2 pillow cases. Cashmere and silk. It’s horrible, and I’m sure uncomfortable! Apparently Celine Dion has them. Also, apparently most of the ‘sales’ have been of the fabric swatches for people to see in showrooms.
http://www.tmasc.ca/st-geneve-custom-bedding/CashmereSet.html

Or, look into a genuine eiderdown duvet or pillow. $5,000 for a pillow, $10k for a duvet. Apparently, there are more Ferraris sold than eiderdown duvets each year.

(Just examples of tmasc stuff. I’m sure there are high-high end retailers that go way beyond that)

I went with pure linen for sheets, which is sufficiently costly, and wool for duvet and maybe topper. Please, Don’t get me interested in trying out silk! :wink: :wink: :wink:

there are people out there that have 1 flat sheet more expensive than any of us have spent on the entire bed. You could easily spend $50k outfitting one king bed if money were no object.

(Yes, I had a blast shopping for bedding. Who couldn’t be entertained when looking at a bedding set the price of a small car. But every fabric we looked at had a story… Which mill in Europe each fabric comes from, how the mill has been around for generations, what they specialize in, how their fine European fabric feels vs. a different fine European fabric. Me and my wife felt like a million bucks! And no, we don’t have a million :wink: )

29

I’m running for the hills :lol:
VRAM…maybe I should be checking out Ideal as well as only 20min or so away, but I honestly don’t know if I can deal with another choice:) sounds interesting though.
I guess I get caught up in the up-front spend, however, if a mattress we were more than happy with was $1k more than another, then perhaps that’ s no so bad over the life of the mattress.
The $600 pad…going to have to pass on that one:)

Dn…yikes! I’m definitely not in the same ‘snack bracket’ as those purchasing the high end bedding.
I don’t think I could ever justify that!
I have some linen duvet covers, but have not tried linen sheets. Wonder what the ones from Restoration Hardware are like?
Ah well…that’s all for another day! (Stay focused Lisa…need mattress first :cheer: )

30

Ok… Just before logging off and going to bed, I happened to pop onto the Dormio site.
VRAM, not sure if you made it into their Mississauga showroom?

Anyways…There’s the posting for a sale on one of the beds we tried ( and quite liked) Emrosia Plush.
Just thought I’d give you the heads-up on that. Just what you want… Another choice:)
I need to look at it when I’m more awake tomorrow. G’night!

31

Really? I bought my mattress this past spring and they only offered Talalay.

32

Really? I bought my mattress this past spring and they only offered Talalay.
[/quote]

Perhaps I misunderstood then…I know the ones I tried were talalay, but I did have a quote on Dunlop and a quote on Talalay.
(unless some blend of Dunlop) I really don’t know…

How do you like your mattress yoshi?

33

Thanks for the heads up on the Dormio sale Lisa_mocha! I hadn’t really looked at them, but even looking at the sale prices I think they are still more premium priced than I would like to go. I am also not a big fan of the limited time sale. If the margins are that great that they can offer 25% off, why not just give me a lower everyday price? But I digress…

I am still focused on the Flobeds and Ideal options. The Ideal mattress Ltd has the advantage of being local and having the ability to work with them in the event of any issues. The Flobeds has the advantage of offering some additional bells and whistles (vZone and convoluted layer), but also the downside not being able to test it (and of making the bed have too many variables to get right).

I am still hoping that Phoenix might pop into this thread and give some feedback on my thought process and the logic that is leading me to a narrowing set of options. With such a big decision, it would be nice to hear his opinion (given his considerable experience), and try to get comfortable with the decision. I know that I have moved up the scale in terms of going for the absolute best “value”, but I am ok with that (if fits my PVE).

Even with that, I am going to have a some “analysis paralysis” and it will be difficult to pull the trigger.

34

Hi vram,

I normally scan all the threads looking for specific questions but this thread has been moving very quickly so I’ll answer the questions I’ve seen and if I miss any let me know.

I have no experience with either cover because I haven’t slept on either of them and “feel” is completely subjective so I really can’t answer this for someone else. In general I keep my comments to guidance about quality and value because PPP and "feel’ is much too individual and subjective to give any meaningful guidance for someone else except in the most generic way. I do know that both are good quality covers and quilted with wool but they would be a better source of information to try and describe the “feel” or the finer details of each of their components.

You can see some comments about the lanoodles topper in post #38 here. A thin shredded latex topper is more of a feel and surface softness layer than a significant pressure relieving layer. Contoured or “pillow” surfaces would be similar to convoluting in the sense that they would have a different “feel” and a little extra softness. There is more about the different types of softness in post #15 here. The lanoodles is more of a “feel” softness that adds some extra “cush” with a bit of benefit for pressure relief as well. It can add some extra softness with less risk of alignment issues than solid layers because the shredded latex can “flow” around the more protruding body parts (like the shoulders) that need to sink in more but will be “compressed” and be more supportive under the larger surface areas (like the pelvis).

If you can feel the difference it makes and it’s a significant improvement in terms of PPP it would be “worth it” but they would probably be a more valuable option for thinner mattresses (in the range of @6" - 8"or so) than with thicker mattresses. The benefits would be less with thicker mattresses because the mattress would absorb more of the compression forces before they reached the adjustable foundation. My “baseline” would be a firm slatted base with the mattress doing the work and I would only add an adjustable slat option if it provided a noticeable improvement (or I was convinced it would) that was significant to me.

The overall process I would normally follow would be to “force yourself” to choose a single “finalist” at each store you are dealing with based on a combination of PPP (most important), quality (all the mattresses you are looking at are all good quality with no “weak links”), and value (are some of the more premium mattresses you are considering worth the premium cost based on any extra features they may have compared to others with similar materials). With your online “finalists” that you haven’t tested then your confidence about how suitable they will be in terms of PPP based on a combination of your conversations and testing experiences and your ability to re-arrange or exchange layers (or zones) would be a more significant part of my choice. Your own knowledge about where you are in the range of the “princess and the pea” to “I can sleep on anything” scale would also play a role in the options that were important to me. With local testing I wouldn’t do too much analysis of the layering and would let my body decide which was the most suitable in terms of PPP. With online choices there is more “thought” and intuiive judgement involved because you can’t test them in person. Final choices can be difficult (it took me weeks to decide between my finalists !)

If I’ve missed any of the questions you had let me know :slight_smile:

@ Lisa_mocha:

The last time I talked with Foamite was some time ago but at the time they only offered Talalay in a single ILD. Of course they may have changed the options they have available since then. Their site says they use Dunlopillo which used to make Talalay Latex in England but went bankrupt in 2008 and now it’s just a name. In North America Latex International owns the trademark which means that any latex that is sold as Dunlopillo would be Talalay latex made by Latex International.

Phoenix

35

Thanks again Phoenix!

I’ ve decided to rule out a couple of options and have come down to my Top 2 or 3 picks:

  1. FLOBEDS: Pros:I like the idea of convuloted topper and the fact I can purchase additional layers for a low price should our needs change over the next few years. I think the more conforming nature of talalay might appeal to me.
    Like the idea of vzone… If we can get it right.
    More affordable than the options I’ve looked at in Canada
    Cons: Risk of buying on-line without trying. A little more of a hassle to return if required…but hopeful it wouldn’t come to that.
    Smell…I’m sensitive to smells…does talalay have a stronger or longer lasting scent than dunlop?

  2. SLEEPTEK EURO 4/OBASAN ACADIA 3 ( I think these are pretty much the same except Obasan has 3 zone layer)
    Pros: Comfortable(dunlop) 10"" with very nice quality cover. Can buy locally. Entire mattress appears to be v. Good quality
    Cons:: Price. Approx $800 more than Flobeds. (Pillows thrown in on both) No convolutedbor plush topper lie Flobeds. The question if I’d prefer talalay or dunlop…???

Greensleep still lingering as an option. Beautiful cover, but was a little firmer than the Sleeptek. Also, most expensive pick.
This one will likely fall off the list unless we can negotiate a better deal…if that’s possible.

Phoenix , any idea as to how the Flobeds mattress cover compares in quality/ texture to the Sleeptek ( or Oyasumi version from the Clean Bedroom) and Greensleep?

Thanks again:)

36

Hi LisaMocha,

Talalay generally has a milder smell than Dunlop that some people describe as a “sweetish” smell like vanilla or sugar cookies rather than the more rubbery smell of Dunlop and it tends to dissipate more quickly (see post #2 here).

I don’t know other than knowing that they are all good quality covers that are quilted with wool. I would suspect that both the Sleeptek and the GreenSleep would have more wool in them but you would need to find out the more detailed specs of each cover directly from each manufacturer to make more detailed comparisons or have them provide more detailed descriptions (the specifics of the cotton and the amount of wool etc) but this still wouldn’t tell you how each will actually feel to you until you actually lie on them.

All of these mattresses use good quality and durable materials (you can read more about the different types of latex which may help you make better comparisons in post #6 here). You can also read a little more about the difference in “feel” between Dunlop and Talalay in post #7 here but the only really reliable way to know which you prefer is to try both types. None of these mattresses have any weak links in their design.

The Flobeds would have the edge in terms of being more customizable (more like a custom made suit rather than a suit off the shelf that you can make some adjustments to).

No matter which you choose you will end up with a very high quality and durable mattress but final choices can be very difficult when there are no clear “winners” and will depend on all the objective, subjective, and intangible factors that are most important to you.

Phoenix

37

Thanks again Phoenix for this valuable info.

I’ m still leaning towards a talalay mattress from Flobeds, but have 1 more concern…

Given that talalay has a 'springer/ bouncier and lively feel, would this mean that motion isolation would not be as good as a more dense dunlop mattress? Sorry, I’ve likely asked this, and am tried to get my head around ‘bouncier’ and if my husband is flopping around all night, which latex would offer the best possible motion isolation.Or, really no difference and all depends on mattress itself?

38

Hi Lisa_Mocha,

I would treat Dunlop and Talalay as being roughly equivalent in terms of motion isolation. Latex is very “point elastic” which means that it compresses in a local area under compression without affecting the area around it. Both are “good” although of course memory foam is the leader in this category because it not only compresses locally but also absorbs energy while latex is much more resilient and “returns” the energy which is why it’s more “springy”.

There is more about motion isolation and vibration “damping” in post #4 here.

Phoenix

39

Just placed my order with Flobeds…start the delivery clock…

40

Hi VRAM, happy to hear that!
My husband just asked again last night when I was going to decide!
I was still leaning toward flobeds, but still a tad nervous about taking the plunge!(on-line)

I think I’ m going to go for it too! Worse case scenario, we can still return and just be out the shipping $.

Did you end up going with v zone? With a foundation?

I was pretty happy with sleeptek too, but I keep thinking about talalay and a convuloted topper…so, think Flobeds is the winner:)