hi ~ the more i read about latex mattress configurations the more confused i become :unsure: i have a painful muscle disorder that causes my muscles to be chronically tight. i’m 5’3", 110 and sleep on my back. am also considering getting a mattress genie so that i can sleep in a type of zero gravity position.
any suggestions for what configuration might work best be thoroughly appreciated.
The most effective way to buy a mattress is to learn just enough that you can ask better questions (just scanning the overviews in the mattress section is usually easily enough) and then to find the 'experts" in your area that can help you make better choices. There are a large number of better sleep shops and/or local factory direct manufacturers that are very knowledgeable and carry higher quality and value mattresses than the typical mainstream outlets or major brands. They have the knowledge, skill, and experience to help you make much better choices than trying to learn everything yourself. What they already know you don’t have to learn and then instead of going by theory … you can actually lie on mattresses that use the materials you are interested in and listen to what your body tells you.
If you let me know the city or zip where you like I’d be happy to let you know of any better outlets or factory direct manufacturers I’m aware of in your area.
I also think Post #2 here may be very helpful.
Once you’ve found the best places … then you can focus on finding the best mattress or layering using someone else’s knowledge, willingness and ability to help you in real time and in person. It’s much less confusing and frustrating than the other way around.
zip is 61550 but i’ve already been to the local dealers on brandywine and checked out denvers website. none of those have what i’m looking for.
i want all natural latex in a zippered cover so that i can experiment.
the closest i came to liking a mattress was verlo who said it was a flippable talalay, 2-4 1/4" layers of i believe 28.
want to stay away from any kind of padding for allergy purposes.
i’m thinking i have to order online to get what i want.
the mattress above was actually at lebeda. the one i tried at verlo was 19/24/36 i believe. sorry!
You are very light which generally means that lower ILD latex would tend to work better than firmer latex. A total of 4" of softer latex (both 19 and 24 ILD latex would be quite soft for most people) could be a little on the thick/soft side and “risky” for some back sleepers but with your lower weight it may work quite well (the 24 ILD would act as a transition layer more than a comfort layer) but your own personal testing would say more than “theory”. How did you find the mattress at Verlo for pressure relief and alignment? Your experience with this could be a reasonable guideline for a “choose your own layer” mattress.
I’m guessing you mean polyurethane or memory foam here? Latex (both blended and all natural) is also foam and padding of course but they are both OekoTex standard 100 class 1 (safe for babies) certified. The 100% natural Talalay has all natural latex but is also more expensive and likely to be a little less durable and pressure relieving in the softer ILD’s. 100% natural Dunlop is perhaps the “purest” form of latex but is also firmer and doesn’t come in layers that are as soft as Talalay which may be important to you.
I’m not sure if I understand the layering of the Lebeda you mentioned. Was it just 2 x 4.25" layers of latex with an ILD of 28 with no polyfoam in the quilting? This seems to be an unusual layering and doesn’t seem accurate but if it is it may be a little on the firm side for you for pressure relief but again your own experience would be more accurate than “averages”.
Some of the best online manufacturers that are members of the site and make and sell high quality and value mattresses are listed in post #21 here. Several of these sell layered zip cover mattresses.
Post #2 here includes the better options within reasonable driving distance of Peoria (and I see you’ve already fond the ones that are closest)
Hope this helps but if you have more questions feel free to post them
oh wow ~ you certainly are thorough and thoughtful in your reply. thanks so much!
How did you find the mattress at Verlo for pressure relief and alignment?
well, it’s so hard for me to tell since my muscles are so tight and contracted. i would have to lay on something for quite awhile before i could really tell.
my sleep set up right now is a large memory foam wedge to raise my torso and a leg bolster to lift my knees. this puts me in a zero gravity position so as to keep pressure off my spine which in my case is crucial. whichever mattress i choose, i plan to use a mattress genie to lift the top and then a leg bolster so as to replicate the zero gravity position.
so i guess what i’m saying is that i think that will take care of the pressure relief and alignment that you’re talking about. is that correct? if so, then what i think i would really like is something really cushy to sink into.
want to stay away from any kind of padding for allergy purposes.]
]I’m guessing you mean polyurethane or memory foam here?
what i am worried about is padding, or i guess it’s called batting, in the covers like cotton that dust mites would like in. this is why i was thinking about a zippable cover with no batting.
Was it just 2 x 4.25" layers of latex with an ILD of 28 with no polyfoam in the quilting?
that’s what i believe he said. it had a bamboo/cotton cover.
i will check out the 2 posts that you mentioned also.
any other insight on the above would be totally appreciated!
thanks so much!
Yes … the zero gravity position can take pressure off the spine for those who are back sleepers and also changes pressure distribution for pressure relief so this would allow you some room for a cushier top layer.
Most of the “DIY” mattresses use latex (usually Talalay) in the range of low 20’s rather than the slightly softer 19 ILD that is in the Verlo but most will also custom order a slightly softer ILD in the high teens for those who need it. Latex comes in ILD’s as low as 14 but many manufacturers are hesitant to use it because of the greater risk of softening and alignment issues but you may be a good candidate for this. If you want to see what low teens latex feels like … then the Pure Latex Bliss mattresses have a 2" and 3" topper that you can test (I would suggest on one of their firmer models like the Pamper to get a sense of how soft the topper is). This may give you a good sense of the feel of the softest latex in this range or in the range slightly above it (@ 19 ILD). Pure latex bliss has a retail outlet finder here which will give you the retailers near you that carry them. It may also be worth testing various models without the topper because they all use top latex layers in the 19 ILD range with various thicknesses and with different layers and firmness levels below. These could provide a good guideline for your “softness” preferences.
There are very few mainstream mattresses that use cotton in the padding (these are usually more expensive) and most use either foam or various types of fibers in the quilting layers (for those that are quilted) and in the comfort layers as well. Cotton batting is usually used in more premium or hand built mattresses that are more along the lines of the “old style” mattresses. Some of these will use wool because of it’s ability to regulate temperature and moisture and kelp keep dust mites at bay.
A stretch knit cover made from natural fibers (like in the Pure Latex Bliss) without any quilting layers will conform to the latex layers more readily and be softer than a woven material. Supersoft foam in the quilting can add to softness while fibers may initially feel softer but as they compress they tend to pack down and get get firmer. Just a stretch knit though without quilting will allow you to be closer to the latex and take full advantage of its benefits … especially if it’s soft latex. Bamboo/cotton is a good choice in a stretch knit because the bamboo is good at wicking moisture and is also strong and breathable.
Local testing to the degree that your circumstances make possible … along with spending more than “normal” time on each mattress that is a serious candidate (not necessarily for purchase but for how it feels as a guideline) would be helpful. the “norm” for testing a mattress is 15 minutes as completely relaxed as possible and in your case a little longer may be better.
Hope this helps a bit.
phoenix, you are amazing! can’t believe the amount of knowledge about mattresses that you have acquired!
will definitely be going to check out pure latex bliss!
so, dust mites do not like wool?
thank you so very very much!
Dust mites need humidity in the air and wool has the ability to absorb moisture and store it in the core of the fiber and release it gradually while the outer part of the fiber remains dry. It can hold up to 30% of its weight in moisture without feeling wet. This is why it’s such a great temperature regulator and is worn in both desert cultures and cold environments. If it’s been processed naturally or without harsh chemicals … it also retains it’s natural lanolin content which also repels dust mites and makes the wool self cleansing when it’s put in the sun to be “refreshed”. These two properties make it dust mite resistant although it’s not dust mite “proof” of course.
thanks again, phoenix!
am off to test pure latex bliss today so will be back to pick your brain later
with much gratitude,
I’m looking forward to your “report”
hi phoenix ~ change of plans. i had planned to go to the mattress doctor to test the pure bliss mattresses but the do not have them on the floor yet. hopefully i can get out to the back store tomorrow to try them out.
in the meantime, i was researching the mattresses but cannot find what ild’s the layers are in the pure latex bliss.
is this a guarded secret???
also, the guy at the mattress doctor said that latex international owns pure latex bliss and will be selling their own mattresses instead of supplying retailers. true or false?? i know that you have all the info!!!
thanks again for all your help!
[quote]in the meantime, i was researching the mattresses but cannot find what ild’s the layers are in the pure latex bliss.
is this a guarded secret???[/quote]
Perhaps a “semi guarded” secret but there are some online sources that give this information but they are also listed in a few places in the forum including post #1 here (for the blended talalay versions).
While it’s true that Latex International owns PLB, I don’t know where he is getting his information from about removing them from the stores or any plans to stop selling PLB through retailers. They are still expanding their distribution network and have even just released a new line and if they did this they would probably be cutting their own throat.
alrighty! we went and did the testing ~ my husband likes the nature and i like the nutrition.
sooooo, how do you go about constructing a diy???
thanks so much phoenix!
OK … now you have a couple of “guidelines” that you can use. Bear in mind that no two mattresses that use different layering will be exactly the same so you will need to “approximate” the feel and performance of one mattress into the closest model that a particular manufacturer offers.
This involves several things.
- Specific knowledge about every component of a particular mattress you are considering and knowing how it affects the mattress as a whole.
- The technical knowledge about how a particular material and layering may compare to what you have tested.
- The intuition to “translate” one type of layering into an approximation of the other.
- Customer feedback about particular mattress designs so that your body type and sleeping positions can be “matched” to other customers that are similar.
All of these are available from the manufacturer of a specific mattress … so your next step would be …
Go to the list of online manufacturers that are members here and do some preliminary research on their website to find the ones that offer Talalay latex mattresses with options that can customize them (there are different degrees of customization available).
Call the ones that meet your criteria and talk with them. They will want to know about your specifics and the details of any mattresses that you liked in your testing (have the layering ready in case they’re not familiar with them).
They will then give you some suggestions (and some of them can customize each side of a mattress to suit each of you separately) about which of their mattresses or layering options may come the closest to what you have tested and that would suit your body types and sleeping styles. they may also make other suggestions that they think you may want to take into account.
Now you will have a few “options” and some choices between “good and good”. Now it’s time to choose the one which you believe best fits your “value equation”. This would include all the things like price, service, how well they seemed to “get” what you wanted and needed, options available to you for any exchanges if your selection isn’t quite right and needs to be changed after you have slept on it etc.
This way … you do the “reporting” about your needs and preferences and any details of mattresses you like and ask the questions you need answered and that are important to you. They help you with the design and help you make choices between the options they offer that they believe will best suit your criteria. In other words … you do the reporting and ask the questions and they give you the benefit of their skills and knowledge about how particular choices may “fit” and help you make the best choices among the options that they have available.
hi again phoenix ~ one of the online stores (not one of the ones you list) shows the following for the pure latex bliss:
The Nature Mattress Layers, Features & Benefits:
10-inch Profile Natural Talalay Latex Mattress
2-inch ActiveFusion LayerActiveFusion Logo
Advanced Gel & Latex Temperature Regulating Technology
2-inch Pressure Relief Layer
Experience unsurpassed support with the Sleep on Air feeling that proper pressure relief offers.
6-inch Latex Support Core
Long-Lasting Bonded Foam & Latex Core
20-year Manufacturer Warranty (10-year full, 10-year prorated)
what in the world is “active fusion”???
This is part of the new line of mattresses that were just released by Pure Latex Bliss called the Hybrid line. The mattresses use a form of Talalay latex than has phase change materials in it which helps to regulate temperature. They also use phase change materials in the cover. The latex material itself is called Talalay GL and it has a “fast response” version and a “slow response” version. In other words “active fusion” is just their trade name for the phase change temperature regulating materials. They were introduced earlier this year.
so, that online company was incorrect in saying that the nature had the active fusion layer???
Yes … those are not the specs of the Nature and if you are referring to “this link” then the mattress name and the description (which talks about slow response latex which is in the Hybrid line) don’t match.