I am so happy to have found your website. We are two very different sleepers. I am a back sleeper that doesn’t move much through the night and enjoys sleeping under the covers. Occasionally I will switch to my side. She is a side sleeper that moves a ton through the night, puts off a lot of heat so doesn’t keep the covers on and sometimes wakes on her back. We both have lower back pain and I sometimes suffer from shoulder and leg pain. We are in desperate need of a new mattress. We did not like the large retailers, did not find the Sleep Number all that great and narrowed our search to Layers, OMF and Winn. We like Layers the best so far but have not checked out the Winn yet. Any suggestions for type of mattress and what we should be looking for considering our different sleep styles? We are open to order online as well, whether from Costco, Sleep Design, etc. Any insight would be appreciated. Thanks!
Hi festerhoo,
I see that you’ve already found the local manufacturers in the Richmond area so I’ll share a few ideas based on your comments and the differences between you.
One of the benefits of the Layers mattresses is that they offer a side to side split meaning that the same overall thickness of mattress can be layered differently to accommodate the different needs of two people in terms of pressure relief and support. Other manufacturers … including online manufacturers … also offer this but unfortunately original mattress factory doesn’t to my knowledge. There is a chance that the same layering may work for both of you though (as it did for my DH and I who have different body shapes and weights) so I would still include OMF in your testing.
Winn is a wholesale manufacturer which makes a wide rage of different mattresses but different retailers carry different models. They are very helpful on the phone (even though they can’t sell you a mattress directly) and if you have a good idea of the materials and layering that you prefer, they will let you know which retailer carries a model that would be worth including in your research. They make a mattress which is all Dunlop latex called the dynasty which may be well worth testing. They also have several models which are “partly latex” although the best of these that I know of still has 1.5" of polyfoam over the latex which would make me a little hesitant but may still be worth considering in value terms.
Besides the differences in your sleeping positions and possible weight as well it seems that motion isolation may be important. This means that materials like memory foam, and latex in the comfort layers and pocket coil innersprings, latex, and higher quality polyfoam in the support layers would be better possibilities for you.
Some of the guidelines you can use for different weights are here and different sleeping positions are here. The overviews (or at least the first one about the basic functions of a mattress) that you will find here may also be helpful.
Your lower back pains tell me that the support qualities of the mattress would be very important which means that both the thinnest possible comfort layers that relieve pressure for both of you and the firmest possible support layers under them would keep you in better alignment. Don’t forget that a mattress needs to be both soft and thick enough on top to relieve pressure and firm enough underneath to keep you in alignment (especially under the hips and pelvis) so you’re not tempted to give up one for another. Both are important.
Because she is a hot sleeper … more temperature regulating materials would also seem to be a good idea. While there are ranges in each category … memory foam is the hottest foam followed by polyfoam followed by latex which is the most breathable and coolest of all. Natural fibers in the quilting and ticking that surrounds the mattress are also more temperature regulating than synthetic materials as a rule. Sometimes someone who tosses and turns a lot is seeking out better pressure relief (among other possibilities) so again this should be an important part of your considerations.
I would probably narrow down your choices to one at each outlet or even less if there are one or two standouts. I would then compare the value of these choices to an online purchase to see if any difference in price would justify the online purchase of a mattress that may be similar but not exactly the same or if buying what you have tested and know is worth any extra cost (if there is any).
Hope this helps
Phoenix
I can’t begin to tell you how helpful your response is to our search. At Layers, we narrowed it down to the A-Series and the L Plus. We thought the A Series was much more comfortable than the Ortho line at OMF and the L Plus seemed to be a better fit than the memory foam line at OMF. However, both Layers mattresses are more expensive than their OMF counterparts, but we don’t mind paying more for a better mattress and better value. We went looking for one of the retailers listed on Winn’s website but they are no longer in business. The other one near our house is closed on Sundays so we will try and get by there tomorrow. Prices aren’t listed on the Winn website though. So far the A Series at Layers seems like the best fit for us.
Hi festerhoo,
The A series is a memory foam/innerspring hybrid which is a little unusual. Instead of putting memory foam over a polyfoam support core (like tempurpedic and most other memory foam mattresses) … it uses memory foam over a pocket coil (zoned) with thin layers of polyfoam in between as insulation/transition layers and to prevent the memory foam from compressing into the coils and to give a more gradual feel as you sink into the pocket coils. This allows for the use of thinner layers of memory foam because the innerspring is more conforming. I can certainly understand why this would be comfortable. I would want to know though what the density (quality) of the memory foam and polyfoam was though to get a sense of how long this feel would last. I called them to ask and the lady there is finding out for me.
The L Plus series there is a latex mattress that uses a combinatioin of Dunlop and Talalay latex with a 1" layer of temperature regulating talalay (called Celsion) on top. These are very high quality materials but latex isn’t comparable to memory foam in terms of how it feels. It is a very elastic or “instant reacting” foam while memory foam is a “slow reacting” foam which is partly viscous (like honey) and partly elastic (like latex or polyfoam). The best comparison to this at OMF would be the two latex mattresses they carry although the layers uses more materials and has a more sophisticated layering arrangement so they are not directly comparable except in terms of using similar materials.
At OMF, the Ortho line uses a different type of innerspring called an offset coil which is very strong (12.75 gauge) but doesn’t have the independent movement of a pocket coil (the coils in an offset are connected together with wires called helicals). It also uses polyfoam on top of the innerspring rather than memory foam which is a very different material (memory foam is more expensive). Memory foam is not really comparable to polyfoam or latex in how it feels or reacts to weight so the Ortho line is not really comparable to the A series. The differences between the various models in the Ortho line are the types and amount of foam that is used over the innerspring. Here too it is important to know the density of the polyfoams used.
The Serenity at OMF is their memory foam mattress and it does use high quality memory foam but it has a polyurethane support base (more like a traditional memory foam mattress) rather than a pocket coil also it also isn’t directly comparable. Pocket coils are a more expensive component than most polyurethane cores (depending on the construction of the pocket coil and density of the poly used). They have 2 latex models which are the Latex and the Latex Supreme … both of which use an inch of polyfoam over the latex (which is about the maximum that I recommend) and are 2 sided.
When I last talked with Winn I told them about their broken link and where it led to (and it certainly isn’t mattresses :)). Hopefully they will tell their webmaster to remove the link. They don’t list their prices because they don’t sell direct so the retailer usually sets the prices individually. Hopefully the retailer near you will have a memory foam/pocket coil hybrid (like the layers but less likely), a more traditional memory foam / polyurethane mattress or the Dynasty (their latex mattress which would be somewhat comparable to the L series plus) or even their Berkeley 2 model which is a partly latex model (somewhat comparable to the L series) although the Berkeley 2 has some polyfoam over the latex.
Hope this helps in terms of making a few rough comparisons at least in terms of similar materials.
Phoenix
Thank you again. Please let me know what you find out from Layers about the A-Series. What are your thoughts about Design Sleep and the individual mattresses? Is it worth ordering something online and paying for shipping? What about the slats? Same questions about Custom Sleep Design.
Also, if you were able to get any mattress in the sub $4000 range, what would your top 5 choices be and why? Thanks again!
Hi festerhoo,
Design sleep is one of a small group of retail direct outlets for the Berkeley Ergonomics mattresses which I like. They are well designed and have many options from all latex to latex/innerspring hybrids to microcoil comfort layers all with good value compared to mainstream mattresses. Each mattress can also be customized in both the comfort layers and the support layers and can be made in a side to side split construction (each side is layered differently).
I have talked with Design Sleep several times and have been impressed with their knowledge and helpfulness. I wouldn’t hesitate to include them in my search if I was in reasonable driving distance from them. They’re 500 miles away from Richmond though so unless I was going there anyway I’m not sure I would drive that far vs ordering from an online manufacturer.
That’s of course an individual decision based on how much better the value would be than a local choice. If you mean buying the exact same brand and model of a specific mattress that you like from an online outlet … I wouldn’t hesitate at all if the outlet was good, if the mattress was exactly what I wanted, the savings justified it, and the local outlet didn’t come at least very close to matching the price. If you mean buying a “similar” mattress where you can choose your own layers or even purchase a mattress that has several comfort options that you believe would suit you well … it would depend on how someone felt about the risk of buying a mattress that they haven’t tried vs. the benefits. I would personally pay a small premium (say about 10-20%) to purchase a mattress locally that I knew was “perfect” but if the savings of an online purchase justified it … I would certainly include it as a serious option.
Local testing and knowing the materials and the general layering of mattresses that “work” for you can lessen the risk a lot and the online manufacturers that are members of this site (and others) are good at working with their customers to come as close as possible to their ideal layering. If the savings justified it (and how much that would be is of course a personal choice) I wouldn’t hesitate to order from a good online manufacturer who offered a mattress that I believed would work for me and that also offered options for exchanging layers at a reasonable cost if I didn’t get it quite right. There are many people who are very happy with both the quality and value of their online purchase … especially when there wasn’t reasonable comparable value available locally. It’s sure nice to have the option and in many cases it’s well worth considering.
Most online manufacturers will also sell you an appropriate base for your mattress if you wish to add it to your purchase. Most of them carry a base that can be shipped with the mattress at a very reasonable cost to their customers.
Custom Sleep Design as you know is one of the members of this site which means that I believe they have great quality, value, and service. They are what I would call a premium mattress meaning that the price higher than most other options available to members here but they also build a design which is rather unique and is both layered and zoned on an individual basis for each person or couple (which is the reason for their name). This means that they can be very “accurate”. Part of the process of buying a mattress from them is taking a series of measurements as well as your height and weight that they use to layer and zone the mattress to your individual specs and sleeping positions. They are a great choice for those who are in a higher budget range and who place value on the design and the ability to highly customize the mattresses they build. In the end though … as in all things connected with buying a mattress … each person needs to decide for themselves the components of their personal “value equation”.
Even if I could answer this … any answer I gave would do far more harm than good. There are several reasons for this. First is that there is no such thing as a mattress that is “better” than another without taking into account what I call PPP meaning the Pressure relief needs, the Posture and alignment needs, and the Preferences of each individual. A mattress that is very high quality, uses the best materials, and is perfect for one individual may be completely unsuitable for another. The goal of this site is to give people the information and the tools they need to decide on their own top 5 (and eventually their top 1) rather than duplicate mine or anyone else’s only to discover that their PPP is very different from me or someone else. My loyalty is to materials and layering patterns that work for each individual. This is part of the reason why online reviews can be so misleading … especially when they only mention a brand without mentioning their own height, weight, sleeping positions, and the layer by layer description of the mattress they bought. Since they are usually written when people have just purchased a mattress … they also say little to nothing about how durable the materials in a mattress are. Of course very few if any mention any specifics or ongoing feedback which is why online reviews based on brand are mostly meaningless.
I personally believe in quality materials and appropriate layering designs (for an individual) rather than brands. I also believe in manufacturers who are transparent about their materials and consistently offer better quality materials along with better service and value than the majority of manufacturers or outlets that most people buy from. As a general rule … my favorite brand is what others would call “off brands” meaning mostly unknown brands made by local or smaller manufacturers. Of course not all of these are as good as others (in terms of the quality, service, and value they offer) so there is also a group of these that are what I consider to be the “best of the best”. These are the ones that I invite to become members here and hopefully as they come to know me and what I stand for as well they will see the value of doing so.
There are currently 17 of these manufacturers and I would estimate that there will eventually be about 50 (including many of the manufacturers that I talk about in various threads in the forum) as we get to know each other better. The reason I value these though isn’t because of their name but because they use higher quality materials in each budget range and they also offer the kind of knowledge and service that is dedicated to the long term satisfaction of their customers. I believe in good construction using quality materials that are appropriate for both a person and a certain budget range more than I do the name on a mattress. The fact that the manufacturing members here also offer an additional 5% discount to anyone who has posted in the forum is an additional bonus but even without this their value would be exceptional.
So offering a top 17 (for the moment) and knowing that there are many more who I would consider to “fit the profile” of being among the best of the best is about as close as I can come to a top 5 list.
Phoenix
Phoenix,
Did you ever hear back from Layers about the A Series? Thanks!
Hi festerhoo,
Yes … I actually had a long conversation with John Fazio yesterday and he was very open and helpful on our conversation. He is very passionate about the mattresses they build and quite proud of what he is doing and the “European” design focus of his mattresses. The fact that they are connected to EBI which is a larger company that also builds mattresses for Ikea also leads to economies of scale.
He told me that the A series uses either 3.0 or 2.7 lb memory foam depending on the softness choice of the customer. I told him that I was surprised that the density was that low as that is usually the sign of lower quality memory foam. We talked quite a bit more about materials and foam and other things as well connected with his company and the industry in general. He said he would talk with his foam manufacturer to ask about my concerns and would keep in touch and keep me up to date about the outcome of the conversation. He also liked what I was doing with the website even though my focus on materials was the basis of my concerns.
So for the moment and pending further updates … I am left with mixed feelings. I very much like his passion for mattresses and mattress design and I also like his responsiveness to my questions and comments. The ticking and innersprings are also good quality but I am somewhat hesitant though about his choice of foam materials and pending more information that may add some clarity to the reasons why or information that indicates that the foam is somehow different from more typical 3 lb memory foam, I would be reluctant to spend that much on this particular model.
As I gain more information … I will add it to this thread.
Phoenix
Thanks for talking to him! I guess it’s back to the drawing board for us. We still need to check out the Winn mattresses but went to another retailer listed on the website that is no longer in business. I just emailed customer service for an updated list. What do you think of their Winndom collection and the Winnsations collection? Those were the only two on their website.
I like the idea of the Custom Sleep Design mattresses but am worried about delivery time and also need to find out what the satisfaction guarantee covers. Any thoughts?
Hi festerhoo,
My thoughts on a mattress are more specific to a specific mattress rather than a lineup and would depend on knowing the layering and materials that are in the mattress. I think that Winndom as a whole has better value than other larger manufacturers and are much more responsive to the needs of their retailers and their customers … but my thoughts on any of their lineup would depend on knowing exactly what was in it.
As you know I think highly of Custom Sleep Design and I think they would be well worth a phone call to ask them about their current delivery time. Their satisfaction guarantee means that you can adjust the layers in their mattress through a layer exchange (or by exchanging part of a layer) if you are not completely happy with how your mattress feels. They would be well worth a call to ask any specifics about their mattresses or what they might recommend for you whether you end up purchasing from them or not. They are “good people”.
Phoenix
Thank you! I think we are going to pass on the Layers A Series because of what you mentioned. I also think we are focusing on latex after reading the forum posts and some other websites…
How do you think OMF Latex Supreme compares to the Bliss line at Healthy Back? I also like the SleepEz, Mattresses.net and Custom Sleep Design mattresses. As I mentioned, I am primarily a back sleeper who doesn’t move much while my wife is side sleeper who moves a bunch and puts off a lot of heat. I am 5’9’’ about 175 with most of my weight in the upper body and she is a very fit 5’5’’ 140 with most of her weight in the lower body. Any thoughts as to which of the 5 manufacturers would be best for us? Also, any mattresses from them (or other manufacturers) we should be looking at?
I hate to keep bothering you but hopefully this will narrow our search. Thanks!
Hi festerhoo,
The OMF Latex supreme has a 6" talalay core and 1.5" of softer convoluted talalay and there is 1" of polyfoam in the quilting. It’s also 2 sided. So it would have a 2.5" soft comfort layer over a medium/firm core (Latex International calls this firm but most manufacturers would call it medium or medium/firm). It either works or it doesn’t for any particular individual and if it doesn’t then the only other option would be their regular latex mattress which is 6" of “medium/firm” talalay with an inch of polyfoam quilted to both sides.
The Bliss line on the other hand besides using Celsion in the top layer, uses much more sophisticated layering patterns and has a much wider range of choices in terms of fitting certain layering patterns to an individual using either the different models or the mattresses in combination with the two toppers. Most of them also use more latex than the OMF and they also don’t have any polyfoam on top of the latex and use a thick knitted ticking without any quilting materials at all (meaning you are sleeping directly on the latex). The range of comfort layer materials and different support levels is broader … but they are also more expensive.
There are some guidelines in the mattresses section regarding different weights here and regarding different sleeping positions here but these are guidelines only and your own personal testing for pressure relief and alignment is always more accurate that “theory at a distance”.
For most couples … the biggest challenge for women is to “stop” the wider and heavier hips and the challenge for most men is to “allow” the wider shoulders to sink in far enough (if they are side sleepers). If the heavier part of the couple doesn’t sleep on the side (like yourself) … then it makes it a little easier because they may find the upper range of typical back sleeping layers “matches” the lower range of typical side sleepers. Even though men typically have wider shoulders and a heavier upper body … the lower body still carries a larger percentage of their weight so the hips will sink in more easily than the shoulders and on the back they also need to “stop” the heavier pelvis with firmer support layers. Back sleepers would typically be in the range of 2-3" and side sleepers would be in the range of 3-4" in the comfort layers so somewhere in the range of 3" may work well but again this is a guideline only and your own testing will always be more accurate as long as you are testing specifically for pressure relief and alignment/support in all your sleeping positions and preferably on the mattress together.
Softer support layers will increase the effective thickness of the comfort layers while firmer support layers are better if the comfort layers are already thick and soft enough by themselves (don’t really need any “help” from the lower layers).
All of your choices are good ones but each has different options and “benefits” and “risks” which may be more or less important for any individual. I never compare manufacturers because the label on a mattress is not nearly as important as the ingredients in a mattress. I consider a manufacturer to be worth considering when they disclose the materials in their mattress so that a consumer can make more meaningful “value” comparisons and all of your choices are transparent in terms of materials. I would be looking at any mattress that came close to either “matching” or “improving on” the layering that you felt was most appropriate in your personal testing.
My goal on the site is to help with guidelines and information that can give people the tools to make meaningful comparisons and better choices but I never make final choices for anyone because the “value equation” and final decisions are always a personal decision that have no right or wrong. Quality of materials, layering that “works”, ability to customize or exchange before or after purchase, price, service and advice, importance of actually laying on a mattress vs ordering online, and many other intangibles are all part of each person’s personal “value equation”. I do understand that the final decisions can be the most difficult of all … but if they are being made between good options and the worse or “unknown” options are eliminated … then I’m happy and I’ve done my “job”:).
Your “informed” gut feeling about the PPP (Pressure relief, Posture and alignment, and Preferences) and value (to you) of different mattresses based on the information here, talking in person with all the manufacturers and outlets you are considering, and your thoughts and feelings about all the different “pieces of the puzzle” is the only way to make a final decision without getting into “paralysis by overanalysis”. When the details become too much of a “chore” and the process seems to become so complex that a decision seems to be impossible … that’s a good sign that the “analysis” part has gone far enough and it’s time to make a decision based on all the factors that you (and the people helping you) know. Different people will reach this point at different times and at different levels of “analysis” (some enjoy the research, analysis, and testing process more than others). Don’t forget that every option you are considering already has many happy and satisfied consumers that have bought them before you and in the overall scheme of things … all of the choices you are considering are good ones.
Phoenix
We liked the Latex Supreme but couldn’t make it to Healthy Back. We also tried a bunch of different Winn mattresses and narrowed it down to 3:
The Jefferson has a 6’’ firm latex core, then 2’’ soft latex foam, then 2’’ quilting foam and finally a cashmere wool cover all on top of a wooden box foundation. It’s one sided and says it is natural latex.
The Capital II Plush is two sided with 3’’ firm foam, 2’’ quick recovery lifetime foam, 2.5 quilting foam with a silk cover. It comes with a wooden box foundation with 1320 mini pocket coils.
The most expensive and perhaps our favorite was the Grandview. It’s a one sided pillowtop. It has a 808 coil unit, then 2.5’’ insulator pad, 1320 mini pocket coil unit, 2’’ latex foam, 2’’ 5lb visco foam, 2.5’’ super soft quilting foam, with a cashmere wool cover. It comes with a wooden box foundation with 1320 mini pocket coils.
Any thoughts on these three? She liked the Capital II more than the Jefferson, I was the opposite but we both liked the Grandview. It’s a good deal more expensive and a lot more than OMF.
Hi Festerhoo,
I would be a little hesitant with all of these because of the unknown polyfoam they contain. All of them are more than the 1" I usually try to stay under in the comfort layers (including the quilting) but the Jefferson is the closest to being OK. I would also want to know if the latex was Dunlop or Talalay and whether it was blended or natural.
I woudn’t consider the other two without knowing the specs of the polyfoam they used (even though they’re likely better quality than many other larger brands).
The specs of the Capital II seems a little odd. Mini pocket coils are usually used in the comfort layers of a mattress (not in a box spring) and the Capital II seems to be missing an innerspring?
The Jefferson is the closest to the OMF Supreme although it may feel different because of the extra polyfoam and the type and ILD’s of the latex are probably different.
I should make a comment as well about mattress testing. When you are testing mattresses … it’s important to look at and test for PPP which is Pressure relief, Posture and alignment, and Preferences. The overall feel of a mattress is more about the last one or preferences than it is the first two.
When you look for and can give specific feedback about the pressure relief qualities and alignment of a mattress … it’s much easier to relate a certain thickness and firmness of comfort layer and support core to what works for you and it gives a much better indication about similar mattresses that may be worth trying to “adjust” the pressure relief and support either up or down.
So typical feedback would be something like … I like the XYZ mattress and the pressure relief on my side seemed good except perhaps for a little bit of pressure on my shoulders. The support was only OK and I couldn’t completely let go and relax on my back because it felt like my pelvis was sinking a little bit too much. I loved the overall feel though.
If this hypothetical mattress had a 2" comfort layer and a soft support core it would tell you that you needed a slightly thicker comfort layer (for the shoulders) and a firmer support core (for the pelvis) but that the overall “feel” (types of materials used) was good and this would help a lot in knowing the next mattress that was worth trying.
This type of testing that is specific to pressure relief, support/alignment, and preferences can really “zone in” on the layering that may work best for you.
Phoenix
Thank you again Phoenix. After visiting a few places over the last week, considering all the information on the internet, and your valuable input, we have narrowed it down to SleepEz and Custom Sleep Design. I just don’t think we can get a mattress that isn’t split and I am not convinced Layers is the answer. SleepEz seems to have one of the best guarantees I have seen and CSD seems to work with you if you aren’t happy so we don’t mind the risk of ordering online. What do you think of this configuration for CSD?
King 11" Talalay Latex Mattress with Organic Cotton Cover and Foundation
For my wife the side sleeper: we need to address the difference in width of your shoulders as compared to your hips. There is approximately a 1.5" difference between the plane of the shoulder and the hip. So to align the spine we recommend dropping the shoulders slightly into the mattress with a combination of a medium 3" middle layer and with a 2" soft layer on top (28 ILD and 19 ILD). This construction will minimize the strain on your lower back and reduce the pressure on your shoulder. The base 6", 36 ILD core is the support system and based on your overall weight.
For me the back sleeper: we recommend a base core of 36 ILD which will support your body profile, a one piece middle layer and a split top layer. We do this because as a back sleeper your weight distribution is spread over a much larger area. The split top layer will allow the shoulders to sink slightly into the mattress allowing the spine to take a more natural position.
I have no idea how to come up with a configuration of layers for SleepEz. We are looking at the Select Sleep 10,000 (3 layers custom layers) and the 13,000 (4 custom layers). It’s 100% natural latex with a Talalay blend. The organic is 100% Talalay but more expensive. Any thoughts on the 3 vs 4 layers or blend vs. full Talalay?
Hi festerhoo,
There are basically 2 approaches to buying a mattress online. The first way is to use your own testing as a guideline so that you know the types of materials and layering that works best for you. This involves knowing the difference between materials, ILD’s and layer thicknesses of the mattresses you test so that you can identify “patterns” in the types of mattresses that are best for you in terms of PPP (pressure relief, posture and alignment, and preferences). Because nobody else can “feel what you feel” … if this testing is done with the goal of identifying a “blueprint” for an online purchase … it can be very accurate as long as you can identify the patterns in terms of materials, layering, and firmness levels. This method involves more time, research, and knowledge and also involves knowing the layering in the mattresses you test.
The second method is to use the knowledge and experience of the outlet that you are buying the mattress from to choose layers that work for people that are similar to you in terms of height, weight, sleeping positions, and general preferences that work well for the majority of people that are similar to you. This method assumes that you will fall into the “averages” that most people find works well for them. This is much easier and involves much less research and testing and for most works very well but can’t take into account the many ways that you may not be “average”.
Of course these are the two extremes. With the first you are the designer of your mattress and the outlet will have little influence in your final choices while with the other they are the designer and you will have little influence in your final choices. In practical terms … most people will be somewhere in the range between the two.
The more accurate your testing and the more you can accurately identify the patterns in your testing … the more your input can help the “designer” of your mattress.
Both Custom Sleep Design and SleepEz are very good at making layering and ILD suggestions for their customers based on various factors such as your height, weight, and sleeping positions and within the design limits of the materials and layering they have available. They are both quite comfortable with any level of input you may choose into the design of your mattress since in the end you have the final say.
CSD “specializes” in more customized designs that take more factors into account and can customize a mattress in more ways than most. This would be good for people who have difficult circumstances or who want something that is closer to “perfection” and are willing to pay for this level of customization.
SleepEz has a more “basic” design (although basic here is very relative because their different models and the layer and ILD choices they have available are still very wide ranging and allow for higher levels of customization than most) that for the vast majority works very well but isn’t as “customized” in as many different ways through zoning. This also means of course that their prices are lower.
Both offer layer exchanges and will work with their customers both before and after purchase so they are satisfied with their final configuration.
So the choice is to decide on the level of research and specific testing you are comfortable with so you can decide on how much each of you will be the “designer” of your mattress. There is no right or wrong in this … only choices and of course deciding on how much different levels of research and different options for customization fits into your “value equation”.
The best way IMO is to talk with them on the phone so your conversations can be more “fluid” than the limitations of email or written communication that tend to be more “linear”, tend towards one topic or question at a time, and don’t deal as easily with the implications and nuances of the questions you may be asking. When you are dealing with something as “complex” as the construction of a mattress combined with the infinite variations of how someone feels about different choices … there is nothing that can replace actual conversations on the phone or in person. You will have a much clearer sense of the advantages and disadvantages of different choices and your decisions will be much easier.
Just as a “point” of information … Talalay is one of two main methods that is used to make latex foam out of latex “milk” (the other being Dunlop). Both of these methods can use either natural rubber, synthetic rubber, or a blend of both. Talalay latex is always 100% Talalay and Dunlop is always 100% Dunlop but both can use different combinations of natural or synthetic raw materials.
The most common reason for the choice between the 10000 and the 13000 would be weight (the 13000 can accommodate higher weights) although the different feels between a thicker or thinner mattress may also be a factor for some.
Hopefully the first part of the post helped with how to choose a configuration 
Phoenix
You have been a huge help! I may end up letting my wife decide between the two because I can’t make up my mind or just flip a coin. I have been emailing with Bob and CSD and just emailed Jeremy at SleepEz. I’m not sure it will make a difference but maybe one of them says something that tips the scales. I can’t begin to thank you for all the information and I will let you know which we go. Thanks again!
festerhoo,
If it helps, I had basically the same dilemma as you regarding the choice. I made several phone calls, probably to the point of being a pest, but hey, it’s my money!
In the end, I went with CSD because of two reasons. 1) CSD made me feel they had the industry knowledge and my welfare at the forefront of any of the conversations. The way their selection process for ILD for both my wife and myself was explained was very easy to understand and above all, believable. 2) Even though the others guaranteed my sleeping success, I did not want to have a long and drawn out shipping exercise across country until I felt comfortable. I wanted minimize that risk and CSD seems to fill that need.
My order should be shipping Monday or Tuesday this week. I’m excited that by this coming weekend, my “quest” will be over.
Monte