How is this site supported? ... and a personal attack


Who do you work for? Perhaps you should disclose that as part of your crusade…

Hi Hoosier205,

I’m not sure what you’re “trolling” for but I think if you take the time to read even a few posts in the forum or a few pages on the site then your answer will be self evident. You could start with the first article on the home page of the site or this page about the industry about why and how this site was developed.

Just to answer your questions and “implications” more directly though and save you from having to read more than you need to … I run this site by myself which is currently a 12 - 16 hour a day project and has been for almost 2 years. The goals and values of the site are here. The sole source of income for the site (and how I eat) is listed in the services section here. The current business members of the site who share the goals and values of the site and have so far been invited and have chosen to become part of it are listed here. And the reasons why they were invited and why I consider them to be among the “best of the best” are outlined here.

There is more about why I started the site here and some of the history behind it is here.

So hopefully that answers all your questions … asked and implied … and it’s good to see that I seem to be stepping on some toes. I just hope they are the toes that the site was designed to step on :slight_smile:

And who do you work for?


PS: I’ve split off your post into a new topic that will keep it from hijacking the original thread

You have done nothing to dispel the notion that you financially benefit from trashing the major companies. This forum comes at a considerable expense with a small membership and very little in advertisement support. In short…I believe you are a crook.

Hi Hoosier205,

Well you’re right about one thing which is that this site comes at considerable expense. The expense though hasn’t been as much financial (the actual cost of running the site is not substantial) as it has been in time and effort and perhaps most importantly the cost to my DH and my family. Without their support, financial and otherwise, and their shared vision that the time would come when this site would be self supporting and produce an income that would support us and justify the effort … none of this would have been possible.

Just to clarify as well … there is not only “little” advertising support … there is none at all … and this was by choice and will continue to be this way.

As difficult as it may be for some people like yourself to understand or grasp this … there really are people who are motivated by what they believe in more than immediate financial rewards.

As I’ve mentioned on the forum on several occasions … the time is hopefully not far away that the income from the site and its business plan will provide the support for me and my family that will lead to a more “normal” life and allow it to continue and grow through its own resources. For now though that is an “almost” but not quite a reality.

Just to clarify one other point you tried to make … this is not about “trashing” any particular company but about being a force for transparency in an industry that has degenerated to the point of a “used car” mentality and where the major companies refuse to provide meaningful information about the products they sell. If they decide to go in this direction and release meaningful information about their products and begin to provide real value and become accountable to consumers … I will be the first to applaud them. For now though their commitment is to corporate shareholders, profit margins, and investment groups at the expense of consumers rather than because of them.

As long as consumers are left without any way to validate the stories that are being used to sell mattresses and as long as there are local and regional manufacturers who sell factory direct or through the better sleep shops all across the country, who are accountable to their customers, transparent about the real quality of their product, and who really do make and sell better quality and value mattresses … I will continue to do what I am doing. These are the types of businesses that I hope and believe are the future of the industry … regardless of their size.

I’m under no illusion that this site alone will change the industry but it really is encouraging that it has already made the difference that it has for so many people. This difference is not only for consumers but some of the better manufacturers and smaller retailers all across the country that can hopefully increase their market share in the face of the massive advertising and other “tactics” that have resulted in the dominance of the industry by a very few financial interests that have little real accountability or transparency.

Quite frankly … one of the signs of it’s success is when it is “noticed” by those who are the most threatened by transparency and the values of the site and have no other means to deal with this than to resort to personal attacks.

While your posts and personal attacks actually violate the rules of the forum and could easily be deleted … in this case the agenda behind them is so obvious and transparent that they can serve as an example of the type of pressures that are faced by small businesses every day as they try to provide a living for their families, educate their customers about what really does make a good mattress, and sell products that are great quality and value … in the face of efforts by much larger companies to put them out of business through “brand name” advertising that no longer has any substance and other business tactics that without consumer education and information will remain more common and effective than most people realize.

So I appreciate your posts and how they reflect the current state of the industry … and I’ve transferred it to a new thread so our conversation can remain without hijacking the thread where it began.


OMG Hoosier205! What is wrong with you?!?!
I am very new here but this is the best, and only, site I have found with so much unbiased information about mattresses. Pheonix just gives the facts and it is blatantly obvious doesn’t work for any specific mattress manufacturer. I have even asked for specific models and was told that is not the way to go about the process. I was told to learn the facts about the content of the mattresses and how they feel first. In fact, that has been frustrating…it would be easier for someone to just tell me to go look at such and such model but the fact is, Pheonix does not operate that way.

You should be ashamed of yourself for such a direct attack like that. It is very petty!

Pheonix, don’t let this person upset you…you are a class act!

OK here is a comment from the one who give Phoenix a rough time and who he threatens to kick off every few days :slight_smile:
He is not a crook. He really doesnt have a hidden agenda, I have spoken with him and the way I would describe him is he is a mattress nerd. My guess is he has some sort of engineering background and has gone a bit crazy in his evaluations and although I adamantly disagree with some of the stuff he says and on other areas I think he just doesnt get the entangables, I will defend him in the fact that he is passionate about what he is doing and he has good intentions and has helped many people out (although I certainly do not agree with everything he says).

I do think the question of who phoenix is is valid. All i know is you are someone from Seattle based upon the hour long call which we had.

Hi JoeyTOB,

The goal of this site is not about personality but about providing a source of accurate and meaningful information to the degree possible, helping to change the direction of this industry, and giving people the tools that any information can be validated for themselves. The last thing I would want is to be an information “bottleneck”. The people who “need to know” such as the business members of this site and many others I talked with know who I am and how to reach me at any time. As you may imagine … every day I receive many requests for personal replies which of course are not possible and I redirect them to the forum so that the information in the forum can continue to grow, the forum can become a more valuable resource … and I don’t have to answer similar questions many times (I can just link to where they are already answered). To make me an issue rather than the information on this site and the means to validate it would only lead to a focus on the “person” instead of the “information” and the loss of control of my own home phone number and family environment (I work from home). I prefer to have control over who I speak with in person.

This same question has been asked and answered on several occasions including on the front page of the site (which I referred to in the post you mentioned) and at the end of post #4 here and in post #4 here.

The main difference is that I don’t sell mattresses and outside of this website am not involved in the industry so I have nothing to promote or defend. While I certainly have my own preferences (and latex for example is one of these) … my first loyalty is to information about anything connected to mattresses that can be validated or at least agrees with the “preponderance of the evidence” when black and white answers aren’t available so that people can make up their own minds about what they may need and prefer … regardless of who else it may agree with.

Even the logo of the site (Borromean rings and a mobius strip around them) is meant to represent the three “ideals” of the site (listed in the about us page here) which is to connect educated consumers, with high quality and value manufacturers and retailers that provide exceptional service. Like Borromean rings … if one of these links breaks … they will all fall apart and like the mobius strip that surrounds them … these types of manufacturers, retailers, and consumers are all on the same side no matter where they start.

[quote]We have 3 ideals, one for each part of the “resistance” against the mattress industry as it has “evolved” over the past decade or longer.

Knowledgeable consumers should have access to a quality mattresses, sold by a service driven retail outlet, and made by a manufacturer that understands and produces true value, at every budget range and in every area of North America.

Retail outlets who are service driven, knowledgeable about their products, care about their customers, are open, honest, and ethical in their sales practices, and provide true value are the most deserving of our business.

Manufacturers who produce the highest value, using the best quality materials and methods available in a price range, are transparent in the information they publish about them, who inform consumers and retailers rather than mislead or deceive them, and who offer their mattresses through a short supply chain at a fair profit are the most desirable brands.[/quote]

For those who are in the mood of a little more light hearted version of how this site began … then this article also answers the question in a little different way :slight_smile:

I have also answered the question of any other job I may have (and it would be difficult to add one to the 12 - 16 hours a day I spend with this project) but to make it clear again … I have no other job or source of income and the financial, emotional, and physical support that has allowed me to focus on this project in the way I have to the exclusion of many other things I could have done in these last almost 2 years was thanks to some very loving and supportive family members.


Post deleted and poster banned for personal attacks.