Recommendation for Softening a New DIY Mattress

I have just begun my DIY mattress project and have purchased a 6inch HR Foam Firm Core (36ild) and was recommended a 2inch Soft Dunlop Topper. My first night on this build was not pleasant to say the least and I did not sleep at all. It was way too firm for me and I cannot decipher whether it has to do with the pushback of the latex topper or if the latex topper was just bottoming out resulting in me feeling the firm core. For context, my previous (10yr old mattress) was a Galaxy Bedding CoolMax 12 inch mattress which consisted of a 7inch HD Foam base (unknown ILD), 1.5 inch 1.85lbs transition foam layer (unknown ILD) and 3inches of Gel Infused Viscoelastic Memory foam on top. I have had to return to sleeping on my old mattress just to be able to sleep for now until I can figure out how to fix this DIY build.

What do you suggest I try to resolve this? Should I add another layer of 2in Dunlop Latex or 2in or 3 inches of memory foam or Serene foam? I have seen many people recommend Talalay as a top layer but for me it is just too expensive from where I am in Canada and I do not have the budget to drop another 500-600 dollars on Talalay and find out it is not for me.

I’m a male 5ft 10inches and around 220lbs. Fairly broad shoulders. Combination sleeper but usually resort to my side as lying on my back on my old mattress did not provide enough support and typically results in lower back pain.

Any suggestions or recommendations are greatly appreciated.

@EngineeredSleep

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Two things: (a) add 2" PU foam transition layer (not HR/HD foams, but around 24 ILD) under the dunlop (b) add an 1" plush PU or memory foam layer on the top.

At that weight and 2” latex, you are for sure bottoming out and hitting the 36 ILD brick wall underneath. The other poster has solid advice with adding a transition and a softer topper.

Are you suggesting to add both a transition and an extra memory foam layer? Or can I use the soft dunlop layer as a transition layer and add 2 or 3 inches of memory foam on top of it? So I would have a 6inch HR foam firm base, 2 inch Dunlop Latex Soft, 2-3 inches of memory foam on top.

Simple set up: 5" HD36-HQ foam + 2" 24ILD poly foam + 2" 18 ILD polyfoam + 1" for ticking. That’s how all foam mattresses are built.

You can add 2" memory foam on top of latex too. What if you end up sinking 4" deep? That’s why it is good to have some low end of medium PU foam as a transition layer.

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Thanks,

Maverick

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@DupNorth Hi! Sorry for my late reply. I don’t blame everyone for jumping in to help ha.

We see this scenario often - someone who has been on an all foam, memory + poly foam mattress and switches to an all latex or hybrid latex and has a really hard time with the new feel. Your body has been use to one thing and when you switch it is an adjustment.

Your jump was even a bit bigger because you only has 2 inches of soft latex before you are hitting the firmer latex core…and latex already has a lot of pushback.

What a few people mentioned above is good advice. You can start with either trying to add a transition layer or some memory foam on top of the latex, or both. That will be what you need to do to get the right feel!

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Thank you all for your response on this post. I appreciate any and all input. I think I may have messed up the original post as I had originally wanted to get feedback from any of the Experts but was also open to those from the rest of the forum community as well. Bear with me as this is my first post and i’m still learning the nuances of this forum.

The Transition layer as well as an additional softer topper are great suggestions and I will have to look into my options.

Do you think a transition layer of medium dunlop latex will help or will that still be too firm? Unfortunately I don’t have many options to source regular PU foam for a transition layer and can only find HD or HR in a medium (ILD 28/30). Will HD or HR still be too firm at the medium ILD? I’m located in Canada so my options are limited (MFC, Foamite, Foambymail).Perhaps I’m going to have to start with a memory foam layer on top and see how it goes. What are your thoughts?

Foambymail has egg crate toppers. For example a solid layer of hd36 would be 35 ild but in convoluted form, it’s softer.

My concern about using the polyfoam in the 1.5lbs density is that it is lower quality and lower durability and is not going to last as long as a higher density foam. Although I suppose it is cheap enough that It could be replaced every few years. I would prefer to not have to replace layers that often.

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Makes sense. The hd36hq egg crate foam is 1.8+ density i think but I’m interested to see what engineered sleep says.

Hi Maverick.

Would the moderators be able to post this discussion in the Talk to the Experts category so that several trusted experts could possibly provide their input? Not sure if this is possible after the post has been made.

thanks

Better try cheaper fixes. I would avoid any HD/HR foams with 25+ ILD. Head to local Walmart, and look for any cheap foam mattress toppers without any case. Even egg crate foam would do. Put that foam under/over the dunlop and see whether you like it. Also check local Costco for any foam toppers.

Just out of curiosity I tried folding the soft Dunlop Latex topper over so that it is 4inches on top of the 6In HR foam and it did feel softer for the 10-15 minutes I tested it. Definitely better than the 2 inches. So I think I was definitely bottoming out the 2 inches and really feeling the Firm HR base layer, which is why it was so uncomfortable. I’m waiting to hear back from a few vendors for a polyfoam transition layer, or I may just try another Dunlop latex layer in medium as a transition, however i’m not sure if the medium latex will still be too firm of a transition as I have heard some people describe it as too firm. I think I will definitely order a 2 or 3 inch 4lbs Memory foam as a top layer regardless of whether I order a transition layer or not.

If anyone has any other suggestions please let me know. TIA

I was also interested to see what some of the experts would say about this HD36HQ foam in convoluted form. I did contact foambymail and they had made this suggestion given my current setup to put between the HR foam and Soft Dunlop Latex. They did say that because it is convoluted it would feel softer than the full slab of HD36HQ, however they could not provide an estimate at how much softer that would be(I have read that convoluting can reduce the feel by between 20-30% of the stated ILD/IFD rating but this is not confirmed). I’m still on the fence about whether to order a full slab of the HD36HQ or another vendors 2lbs Foam in 28-30 ild/ifd or to go with a convoluted form of either.

Any further input from any of the experts on the forum would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

It looks like the 2.5" would be softer than the 1.5" too because it has longer peaks.

I guess we are not going to get a response from any experts on this. Do any forum members have any experience with the Foambymail HD36HQ in convoluted form who can attest to their perceived firmness of this foam? I’m going to need to order something soon. TIA

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Hey DupNorth,

First, my apologies for not jumping in sooner!! I have to be honest, this thread generated a lot of really solid responses from subscribers and visitors, and I found myself hanging back since the community was doing such a good job covering the ground. But I didn’t want you to have to make a purchasing decision without at least some additional input, so here goes.

On the foam itself, it’s worth knowing exactly what you’re working with… the HD36-HQ is a conventional open-cell polyfoam with a density of 2.8 lb/cubic ft and a 35 ILD rating, putting it firmly in medium-firm (leaning firm) territory. The upside of that density is durability. FBM’s own data sheet puts the typical lifespan at 12–18 years, so it’s not going to break down on you. It also has a support factor of 1.90 and 45% resiliency, which is decent bounce-back for a poly foam (though still well below latex). It’s not latex and does not incorporate the additives to classify it as memory foam, just a well-built, durable conventional poly foam. Now here is the caveat.

On the convolution question, it is important to understand what actually happens in that process. A full slab of foam is run through a convolution machine which creates two identical pieces with peaks and valleys, each piece the same height but with only half the foam material in each piece. This is a really important point that often gets overlooked. Because those peaks and valleys have removed half the foam from each piece, you now have significantly less foam bearing the load of your body weight. The peaks especially, being thin points of foam, will break down considerably faster under repeated compression than a solid slab of the same height would.

So while the convoluted HD36-HQ may feel softer initially at the surface, it will not have the same durability and longevity as the original solid slab, and it will not perform with the same support characteristics over time either. The “20-30% ILD reduction” you may see cited around the forums is really an oversimplification of what is actually a more complex change to the foam’s performance. If you are comparing the convoluted HD36-HQ to a genuine 28-30 ILD 2lb foam from another vendor, neither option will match the durability and long term performance of the original solid HD36-HQ slab.

A few other things worth thinking through as you decide:

Position in your build matters. Sandwiched between HR foam and soft Dunlop latex, this layer is really acting as a transition/support layer. The latex above it will heavily influence how it actually feels in use, so the convolution likely makes good sense there for both softness and airflow. But reduces longevity and durability.

FBM’s recommendation carries weight they know their own product, and if they specifically suggested the convoluted version for your layering, that’s meaningful even if they couldn’t quantify the ILD reduction exactly.

Convoluted seems like the lower-risk choice given it came as a direct recommendation for your specific setup. Worst case, a layer swap is always an option later. You just need to understand if you are using a convoluted layer, it does not change the density 2.8lb or the ILD 35, but the foam is not measured the same way, so the feel will be different. When the ILD is measured, a solid block of foam is used, not the convoluted piece. So the two pieces are still 2.8lb and considered an ILD of 35 (or original) but does not feel the same under load.

Hope that helps, and again sorry for the delayed response, you asked a great question and deserved a quicker answer!

Maverick

Thanks Maverick for jumping in and providing a very informative response. I will say that I believe FBM’s recommendation to use the convoluted HD36HQ was made because they do not have any polyfoam in a 26-30ILD and I had originally asked them for something in this ILD range. I did not want to get something that was too close to the firmness of the 6in HR Foam base layer that I have which is 34ILD. Although I’m confused as to why 34ILD would be rated as firm in HR foam whereas in other HD foams it would be considered a Medium-Firm. The HR foam that I have is 2.75lbs density and has a support factor of 2.4 so perhaps this is why. Do you think I would be safer choosing a full slab of a 2lbs density HD foam with a 28-30ILD from another vendor or would the FBM HD36HQ be close enough? Given what you said about the reduced durability with the convoluted foam I’m not to keen on that sacrifice given durability was the reason why I purchased the HR foam in the first place over a much cheaper HD foam as a base. I’m trying to have my build last at least 10years or more as I do not want to keep replacing mattresses every 5 years or less.

I’am also tempted to try a medium Dunlop Latex layer in 28-30ILD but i’m not sure if I like the feel of Latex thus far and I feel this could compound my issues and make things feel more firm than they are.

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