The great mattress search - Dallas, TX. - HELP!!!

[phoenix]

Hi garyk1000,

After spending the last few days reading this forum, we started the great mattress search today. Fortunately, our first stop, Cantoni, we found a very, very knowledgeable and passionate sales person (John Shaw) that espoused everything this website talks about. Great, but also information overload. We stopped at Urban Mattress in Dallas. Much more low key, good information and different manufacturers.

Since I’m a believer in the KISS principle … I’ll start with the simple version.

In its simplest form choosing the “best possible” mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then …

1. Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP … and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or “fine tune” the mattress and any costs involved if you can’t test a mattress in person or aren’t confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.

2. Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress.

3. Comparing your finalists for “value” based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

The rest of this reply will be much longer because some of your comments and questions may be more complex than you realize and I’m not sure what you’ve already read because some of your questions are answered in the tutorial.

We looked at Visprings, Aireloom, Prana Vinyasa Plush and the Cantoni Mattress. So after a confusing day of too much information, we rated the mattresses we’ve tested. BUT we’re still in need of some help with comparable mattresses at a better value .

Hopefully you’ve already read the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice … and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you’ve read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort” and PPP that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

While I can’t speak to how any specific mattress will “feel” for someone else because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances and you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress … outside of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) which is the most important part of “value”, the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can’t see or “feel” and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label (or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new) so I would always make sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the quality/durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

Finding a “comparable” mattress will really depend on what you mean by comparable.

There is more information in post #9 here about the different ways that one mattress can “match” or “approximate” another one. Every layer and component in a mattress (including the cover and any quilting materials) will affect the feel and performance of every other layer and component and the mattress “as a whole” so unless you are able to find another mattress that uses exactly the same type of materials, components, cover, layer thicknesses, layer firmnesses, and overall design (which would be very unlikely) then there really isn’t a reliable way to match one mattress to another one in terms of “comfort”, firmness, and PPP based on the specifications of the mattresses (even assuming that you can find out all the specifications you would need for both mattresses you are comparing in the first place).

Mattress manufacturers generally try to differentiate their mattress from the mattresses made by other manufacturers and don’t normally try to “match” another mattress that is made by a different manufacturer so unless a manufacturer specifically says in their description of a mattress that one of their mattresses in the same general category is specifically designed to “match” or “approximate” another one in terms of firmness or “feel” and PPP and/or they are very familiar with both mattresses and can provide reliable guidance about how they compare based on the “averages” of a larger group of people that have compared them (different people may have very different opinions about how two mattresses compare) … the only reliable way to know for certain how two mattresses would compare for you in terms of how they “feel” or in terms of firmness or PPP (regardless of anyone else’s opinions of how they compare which may be different from your own) would be based on your own careful testing or actual sleeping experience on both of them.

There are also no “standard” definitions or consensus of opinions for firmness ratings and different manufacturers can rate their mattresses very differently than others so a mattress that one manufacturer rates as being a specific firmness could be rated very differently by another manufacturer. Different people can also have very different perceptions of firmness and softness compared to others as well and a mattress that feels firm for one person can feel like “medium” for someone else or even “soft” for someone else (or vice versa) depending on their body type, sleeping style, physiology, their frame of reference based on what they are used to, and their individual sensitivity and perceptions. There are also different types of firmness and softness that different people may be sensitive to that can affect how they “rate” a mattress as well (see post #15 here) so different people can also have very different opinions on how two mattresses compare in terms of firmness and some people may rate one mattress as being firmer than another and someone else may rate them the other way around. This is all relative and very subjective and is as much an art as a science.

In other words … if two mattresses have different designs and materials then your own careful testing or personal experience is the only reliable way to compare two mattresses in terms of “comfort” firmness, and PPP.

Comparing two mattresses in terms of durability is much more simple and more objective once you know the specifications of all the materials and layers in two mattresses you are comparing (see this article) because making durability comparisons is just a matter of comparing the quality and durability of the materials and components inside it and making sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in the mattress that would be a reason for concern. If for any reason a retailer or manufacturer you are dealing with either isn’t willing or able to provide you with the specifics of the materials and components in their mattresses then I would avoid it completely. Again though I would always keep in mind that the quality and durability of the materials has little to nothing to do with how a mattress will feel or compare to any other mattress in terms of comfort, firmness, or PPP.

Assuming that the materials in a mattress you are considering are durable enough for your body type and meet the quality/durability guidelines here relative to your weight range … the choice between different types and combinations of materials and components or different types of mattresses are more of a preference and a budget choice than a “better/worse” choice (see this article).

We loved the Vispring (med), but didn’t like the price. The price doesn’t fit my personal value equation unless it’s the entry level mattress - which isn’t the most comfortable. The $11k mattress - fit like a glove - but wounds my bank account… I don’t think we need a double spring mattress, wasn’t much difference between double layer and single layer except weight and price. The Vispring Cornet was a good single layer @ $8k…(w/foundation -$$$ whew!!) .

Vi-Spring certainly makes some exceptionally high quality hand built and tufted mattresses that uses high quality materials and components (pocket coils and natural fibers) but as you probably know they are in a much more premium budget range than many other mattresses that also use natural materials. There is more about Vi Spring and other “ultra premium” mattresses in post #2 here and post #2 here and post #2 here may also be of interest as well but I would be very careful to differentiate how you feel “about” a Vi Spring and how you feel “on” a Vi Spring. There are certainly cases where a mattress in this budget range may be “worth it” for a particular person that isn’t price sensitive and that has specific criteria that aren’t available in lower budget ranges but this would be unusual and in general I would need a compelling reason that clearly indicated there was “enough” of a difference in “real life” compared to many other mattresses that may be just as suitable in terms of comfort and PPP, just as durable, and that are in much lower budget ranges to justify the higher cost.

Aireloom (medium) is very plush, not a great value and doesn’t get value reviews. Also has reports of not being as long lasting. Our sales rep told us that Visprings now owns Aireloom, so maybe that’s old data.

I would be very cautious with Aireloom because in most cases they aren’t transparent and it’s unlikely you will be able to find out the information you need to assess the quality and durability of the materials or make meaningful comparisons with other mattresses (see this article). If you can find out the specifications of any Aireloom mattress you are considering and post them on the forum then I’d certainly be happy to let you know if there are any lower quality materials or weak links that would be a reason for concern but if you can’t then I would avoid them.

Prana (med-firm) - Like the comfort. Noticed it was much warmer than Vispring. Reviews indicate it’s not built with much quality and tends to fall apart after 5-6 years. Again, these are reviews.

You can read more about Pranasleep in general and the previous versions (up to version 4) of Pranasleep mattresses in post #3 here and in post #2 here and in post #3 here and in posts #1 and #2 here and a forum search on Prana (you can just click this) will also bring up more information and feedback about them as well.

The good news is that they changed the design in version 5 and the top layers of polyfoam are now higher quality/density and are no longer what I would consider to be a weak link in the mattress in terms of durability. Having said that they are still in a significantly higher budget range than other similar mattresses and the top layers are still polyfoam so you would still be feeling and sleeping on polyfoam as much as latex but this could also be a “feel” that you prefer compared to sleeping more directly on latex . There is more about the new version 5 in post #19 here but I would certainly make some very careful “value” comparisons with other latex mattresses that use similar materials and are in a lower budget range before considering one of their mattresses to be the “best value” choice available to you.

Cantoni Mattress (med) - Nice mattress, good materials. Support is good but “sink-in” and overall comfort isn’t as good as the Vispring or Aireloom. Hybrid mattress so we worry about if it will sleep hot. Not much information on this mattress.

Again if you can find out all the specifications of this mattress and post them on the forum then I’d be able to make some comments about the quality and durability of the materials and the mattress as a whole. If you are looking at one of their private label mattresses made by Berkeley Ergonomics then there are some comments about them in this topic that may be helpful.

Bottom line - we’d like some recommendations on mattress that are similar to the VIspring but a better value ($$). I realize nothing will be like the Vispring, but close would be awesome. We’re really uncomfortable that latex beds will be too hot. Don’t need to run up my A/C bill in Texas!! I do like FloBeds concepts, and they’ve been very helpful answering all my questions, just worried about the bed being hot. Thoughts about the Aireloom would be helpful.

If you’ve made it this far in my reply then you will know that while I can certainly help with “how” to choose … I don’t make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first “rule” of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best “match” for you in terms of “comfort” or PPP or how a mattress will “feel” to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or “theory at a distance” that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here).

While it’s not possible to quantify the sleeping temperature of a mattress for any particular person with any real accuracy because there are so many variables involved including the type of mattress protector and the sheets and bedding that you use (which in many cases can have just as significant an effect on temperature as the type of foam in a mattress) and on where you are in the “oven to iceberg” range and because there is no standardized testing for temperature regulation with different combinations of materials … there is more about the many variables that can affect the sleeping temperature of a mattress or sleeping system in post #2 here that can help you choose the types of materials and components that are most likely to keep you in a comfortable temperature range.

Latex is the most breathable and “temperature neutral” of all the foam materials (polyfoam, memory foam, and latex foam) so a mattress that has latex comfort layers wouldn’t tend to sleep hot for most people. Wool is also one of the best temperature regulating materials (in both directions) so it would also be very unusual that anyone would sleep hot on a mattress that has a cover that was quilted with wool.

As you probably know Flobeds is one of the members of this site which means that I think very highly of them and that I believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency.

The great mattress search - Dallas, TX

The better options or possibilities I’m aware of in and around the Dallas/Ft Worth area (subject to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines I linked earlier in this reply) are listed in post #4 here.

We’re considering investing in a new bed next month. We will buy a mattress and foundation from the same manufacturer. I think a reasonable budget is around 7-10k for mattress and foundation. This will be my first “educated” mattress buy. Thank you @Phoenix!! :woohoo:

There are some very general guidelines about what to expect in different budget ranges in this article. Depending to some degree on the size you are looking for … your budget is in the range of about twice as much (or perhaps more) as you would need to find a great quality/value mattress.

Phoenix