Searching hard for a mattress for perhaps way too long. Found 2 mattresses with 12-gauge coils to last longer and give deep support. We’re choosing the “main ingredient” in our comfort layers (they all have some memory foam, some gel, some cooling surface, great)… but we have 2 beds nearly identical in all ways (same manufacturer, nearly same price point)… BUT one has 1 comfort layer of Talalay Latex in it, the other has 1 comfort layer of microcoils instead.
What are the pro’s and cons of each of these two as comfort layers?
Laying on each bed at the store for 5-10 minutes each, it’s hard to know which “feels better”, the talalay bed or the microcoil bed, so we’re at a 50/50 state right now.
Any expert advice, manufacturing know-how, or personal experience comparing these two “comfort layer” options?
Hi MrMattress and welcome to the Matteess Underground
Any mattress you choose will be unique to those sleeping on it, based on their Stats (height, BMI, sleeping position(s) and any underlying health conditions) and their PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences). Any ‘pros and cons’ list will be subjective to you, with your individual comfort and support needs.
As you can see by looking at the Mattress Durability Guidelines, latex is one of the most durable materials you can have in a mattress, though not everyone enjoys the feel of latex. Talalay latex has a very different feel from Dunlop latex as it’s considered ‘bouncier’ (the difference is like angel food cake compared to pound cake). As you don’t give any details on the mattress, your comfort on this mattress would depend on your Stats, and the thickness and firmness level of the Talalay comfort layer, as well as the other component layers in the mattress, and how they fit your body and sleep style.
The dual coil system, with innersprings and a microcoil layer, typically would have an additional comfort layer on top of the microcoils , of latex, memory foam, gel foam or polyfoam. For non latex foams, a good rule of thumb is to make sure any foam in a potential mattress has no more than an inch or so of lower grade foams (for memory foam no lower than 4 lbs/cuft for normal range weights) and if polyfoam is used, with at least 1.8 lbs/cuft density, just to ensure you have support.
A dual coil mattress has a very specific feel as compared to one with with just an innerspring support layer. I would take a look at the Mattress Specifications You Need To Know as well as this post from @Phoenix on comfort and support layers, to see how the components all work together. Also remember it can take anywhere from 4-6 weeks to adequately ‘break in’ a new mattress as well as your body acclimating itself to the mattress…it’s difficult to tell exactly how a mattress will feel over the long run after only spending a few minutes on it. This is why it’s important to consider all the aspects of your sleep and comfort needs before ‘taking the plunge’ on a new sleep system.
So in general, between the two mattresses you describe, what type of foam is on top of the microcoils or innersprings, and at what density and thickness, as well as the density and thickness of the other component layers, and how that matches your own body profile, and comfort and support needs, all need to be factored in for a good comparison. If you can provide your stats, and a couple specific mattresses you are considering, we can possibly assess how they may or may not work for your body type, needs, and preferences.
I appreciate your thoroughness in response and the links provided.
Stats:
Man
Height: 5’11"
Weight: 177
Average build (top to bottom).
Some lower back issues, exacerbated by excessively soft mattresses.
Definitely loosing feeling in my arms, legs, and sometimes RIBS on our current mattress (soon to be returned) as it’s crazy hard …feels like a carpeted floor… hurts all the places; even broken in for 45 days of “test run”. Better now, but uf!
Note: My wife thinks my body mass increases when I sleep. I’m known, for a roughly average guy, to be crazy dense, and to put “body indentations” or “nests” in mattresses in a matter of weeks. …Weeks.
Wife sleeps with me of course, and while she’s 5’7" and 125, she doesn’t care at all what she’s laying on. Poofy clouds or sharp rocks… simply doesn’t matter to her. (Jealous)
Specific Mattresses in question:
Lumina by Sherwood - “Nobility” - (the one with the layer of copper Talalay latex). Price point circa: $1999.
and
Lumina by Sherwood - “Royalty / Regis” - (the one with the “Nanocoil” layer). Price point circa: $2199.
–I’ve had one heck of a time finding any of these online, or at more than my local store, let alone solid stats for the materials outside the “12 gauge in these 2” as requested from the very helpful sales rep.
Size: King.
It was not made clear to me if these were “soft, medium, or firm” versions of themselves, but if I had to guess I’d put them in Medium-Firm. The floor version were not rocks, but they’re also not so poofy I expect to destroy them in a week or 2.
Preferences:
I, like any Joe love a giant poofy cloud, but it’s terrible for my back. So we’re going for a higher guage coil to maintain hip support despite any weakness in comfort layers, and trying to get a medium firm set of comfort layers.
Shrug. Whatever works at this point.
Any help on durability of microcoils would be appreciated. Everyone says “it has a unique feel” and that’s great, so does jello, but will those bazillion little coils hold up?
Conversely, everyone says “talalay holds up really well cause it’s latex”. Great. But will a single layer of talalay make a difference in holding up, when it’s sandwiched in unknown foams? It’s not like it’s a true-latex mattress. Ya know?
Hoping for any data really addressing these issues as “layers” in addition to any additional factoids you can provide. : )
Hoping for specs on the other foams in these mattresses as well.
Heck, you get me all that data, I’ll paypal you an advisor’s fee!
Glad you found the info I provided helpful. Sherwood was recently purchased by Sealy; and while there’s no way to tell how that will affect the quality of the mattresses they provide going forward, their lack of transparency in material thickness, firmness and composition on their site makes it impossible to assess how the various comfort and support layers may work for consumers, and how they compare to the Mattress Specifications You Need To Know and the Mattress Durability Guidelines. I would avoid any mattress that does not provide this info as this can hide suboptimal types and densities of foam and construction ‘shortcuts’ - though either of the Sherwood Lumina mattresses you mention could work for you. Also, we have heard from other consumers that these are backordered and availability is difficult at the moment as you can read in post #22 here and the first post here.
As you and your wife are lower BMI sleepers, you should not concern yourself too much with additional support…any mattress, of quality, should provide adequate support for you from the Stats you provided - thanks for giving those!
As far as microcoils ‘holding up’…again, as you are both lighter, there should be no issue in prematurely wearing out a microcoil layer. You can see @Phoenix on microcoils here it comes down to your preferences - you should not ‘need’ a dual coil support layer, if you can dial in the correct firmness for your comfort layers that is not too soft nor too firm, as you do not like the feel of either extreme - that’s the missing piece of the puzzle.
In your case it might help, if possible, to try some various mattress types in a local retail store or showroom - all latex, latex hybrid, memory foam, memory or gel hybrid, etc - so you can make a short list of materials that feel comfortable for you and your wife; then you can focus on finding a good quality mattress with known densities and materials used in their construction. At the price point you mentioned, there are many great mattresses in that range…you may also want to consider looking at the offerings of our Trusted Members as they offer mattresses of all types, styles and firmnesses, and they have been vetted for quality, transparency, and excellent customer service. If any specific mattresses catch your eye we may be able to comment on how they might work with your specific needs and preferences. I wish you success on your search!
Thank you so much. We’ll use this to best of our ability to inform our -continued- search.
Your words to not go with a company that doesn’t share the foam details are disheartening. I haven’t found a single company that does. They don’t even publish their coil gauges anymore. Every entity hides it all because too much of it overwhelms the average customer. “How it feels” is all anyone goes on these days.
Frustrating for folks like me that want “all the data”.
Should all be easily found on any site, but it’s not.
I might need to ignore this advice since it’s so hard to find even from Sealy or Posturpedic and other giant name brands. If the leaders aren’t, neither will most others.
Unfortunately, most big retailers are not very transparent in the specifications for their mattresses; much of the time this can be due to their ‘proprietary’ formulas of foam, which can also be full of jargon and is used as a marketing tool. Since it’s proprietary, they don’t even disclose specifications to the retailers who carry their products…however, smaller manufacturers - like our Trusted Members, do in fact disclose this information, so you may want to look into non-big brands if you want to know the particulars of the components. Without this info, you can end up with substandard materials which may not last very long.
