New Tempur-Flex mattress making me miserable

Hello. I am a tall, thin female with various pain issues. I have lower back pain, sciatica, and an auto-immune disease that causes joint pain all over (hips, knees, ankles, wrists, fingers). The pain has gotten so bad that I can’t sleep for more than a few hours at a time, and need to switch positions every few hours. I had ~15 yr old, very firm, spring mattress (Simmons Beautyrest) with a fiberbed topper. I sleep equally on my back and my side. I prefer side sleeping, but whenever my back acts up, I need to sleep flat. I was hoping a new mattress might help alleviate pain and severe lack of sleep.

I made many, many trips to mattress stores. When I lie on the new mattresses on my side, firm ones hurt my shoulders in short order (pressure and numbness). But if they are soft enough for side sleeping, they don’t support my lower back, and my lower back will start hurting very fast. I tried a ton, and nothing worked for both back and side sleeping. Most of the salespeople would try to sell me on Tempurpedic for the pain, but I hated the sinking in cement feeling of memory foam. Then I discovered the new Tempur-pedic hybrid, the Tempur-Flex Supreme. In the store it seemed like the perfect solution. No pressure points, but didn’t sink quite as bad a traditional memory foam. (I tried the Serta and Simmons hybrids - did not like as much.) I was very hesitant to buy it though, since it just came out the week I tried it, and there isn’t a single review of it online. Given the 90 warranty, I decided to take the risk.

I received the new mattress 2-1/2 weeks ago. The first few nights were so painful it brought me to tears. The lower back is fine, but I got a sharp shooting pain right between my shoulder blades and horrible neck pain. I have tried at least 6 different pillows (fiber, memory foam, cervical) to try and alleviate the head/neck/shoulder pain. I figure the memory foam will take a little while to break in, and I am trying to be patient, but I am miserable and exhausted. It has softened a little bit, so not quite as hard on the shoulders, but now my ribs & mid-back are sore. Oh, and I notice when I sleep on my side, my ankle does not touch the bed?!

To add insult to injury, despite the cool gel, it does sleep a little warm. I am always cold, so it isn’t a big problem for me, but my boyfriend hates it, and we can’t really cuddle or it gets sweltering hot. I do have a mattress protector (that claims it does not get hot) per the warranty.

Will this ever get to the point that it doesn’t hurt, or is this mattress a lost cause? I have to stick it out 30 days before I can return.

Please help, I am exhausted and can barely move my neck and left shoulder. Thanks.

Hi Lackofzzz,

You can see some comments about the Tempur-Flex mattresses in post #2 here. They use good quality materials so durability wouldn’t be an issue but it sounds like your mattress isn’t a good match for you in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) and the most important part of the “value” of a mattress purchase is how well you sleep on it regardless of the quality of the materials or the price of the mattress.

There is more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress purchase in post #13 here that can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses but for most people Tempurpedic wouldn’t be the best value choice compared to many other mattresses that use the same or higher quality materials that would be just as suitable (and in your case hopefully more suitable for you), just as durable, and are in lower budget ranges.

As you know there will be a break in and adjustment period with any new mattress (see post #2 here and post #3 here) but if after 30 days you still aren’t sleeping well on the mattress and things aren’t showing clear signs of improvement then I would probably return it for a refund so you can start over again and choose a mattress that is more suitable for you and will hopefully be a better “value” choice as well.

If you do end up returning the mattress then I would start with the mattress shopping tutorial here which has all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that you will need to make the best possible choices … and know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

When you are dealing with more challenging situations that make it more difficult to find the most suitable mattress then I would do as much research on the retailer or manufacturer you are dealing with as you do for the mattress because the knowledge, experience, and service of the retailer or manufacturer you deal with and their ability to provide you with reliable guidance about the mattresses they have available can be one of the most important parts of a successful mattress purchase.

While memory foam (gel or otherwise) tends to sleep warmer than other types of foam materials (polyfoam, memory foam, and latex foam) … there are also many other variables that can affect the sleeping temperature of a mattress besides just the type of foam that is used inside it including the type of cover and quilting in a mattress, the firmness of the mattress, the mattress protector or any mattress pad you use, your sheets and bedding and bedclothes, and where you are in the “oven to iceberg” range that can all have a significant effect on sleeping temperature. There is more about the many variables that can affect sleeping temperature in post #2 here that can help you choose the combination of materials and components that will have the best chance of keeping you in a temperature range that you are comfortable with.

The mattress protector you choose can also affect the sleeping temperature of a mattress and protectors that are waterproof also have less airflow which can also result in a mattress sleeping warmer as well. There is more about the pros and cons of different types of mattress protectors in post #89 here.

If you let me know your city or zip code I’'d be happy to let you know about the better options or possibilities I’m aware of in your area.


Thanks for the quick reply. I don’t have the time to read all of your links now, but I will!

I actually did a ton of reading before I went mattress shopping (~2 weeks), and spent a month looking at mattresses every weekend. It’s hard though, once you step through the store doors and the salesperson gets their claws in you. I found most had very strong opinions on the right mattress for me and sucked up so much time talking that it was hard to visit more than 2-3 stores in an afternoon. (I did not enjoy the shopping experience at all.) That being said, I never really found any other mattress that felt good when sleeping on my side, on my back, and spooning with a partner. The firmer ones hurt my shoulder, the softer ones hurt my lower back. And the one that felt the best one day, would feel too hard/ soft the next. So, I was willing to pay the higher price for the Tempur-Flex, since it was the best in store.

BTW, does all the pain in my shoulders and neck mean the new bed is too hard or too soft?

I read a lot of reviews on Amazon, because I wanted to purchase a mattress protector that would not effect the heat transfer properties of memory foam. I’ve tried both the waterproof ultra-thin terry surface and the Perlux tencel mattress protectors. (They seemed about the same to me.) I need waterproof because I sleep with water on my nightstand, and to be completely honest, I am a klutz and have knocked it over or spilled more than I’d like to admit in the dark. I sleep with 100% cotton sheets, and lately no comforter. My comforter is a regular fiberfill. It is okay for me alone (I am not a warm person), but it’s pretty miserable with two people.

I have not tried the Tempur-pedic mattress protector because it seems to get terrible reviews and is very pricey.

I appreciate all of the information. I live in DC and have a car, so can travel to the surrounding MD & VA metro area.

Hi Lackofzzz,

This type of salesperson is usually an indication that you are in a store that is more interested in “selling” you whatever they can convince you to buy than “educating” you and helping to “guide” you about which of the mattresses they carry would be the best match for you.

There are some testing guidelines in the tutorial post that can help you test a mattress for PPP which can improve your chances of making the most suitable choice but if you are facing more challenging circumstances and you are uncertain about whether a mattress that seems to work well in a showroom would work as well when you sleep on it then the options you have after a purchase would become a more important part of the “value” of your purchase.

There is more about the different ways to choose a mattress (either locally or online) that is the most suitable “match” for each person’s specific needs and preferences and how to identify and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for that are involved in each of them in post #2 here.

I’m not as sure as you are that the Tempur-Flex would have been the “best” mattress in the store but it would depend on how you are defining “best”. I would normally avoid Tempurpedic along with all the other major brands (see the guidelines here).

There is more about the more common symptoms that people may experience on a mattress and some of the most likely reasons for them in post #2 here and the posts it links to and there is also more about shoulder pain and discomfort specifically in posts #2 and #3 here but the most likely reasons for shoulder or neck pain are a pillow issue or a mattress that is too firm.

These (and many others that are similar) are both the “thin membrane” type of protectors and they would all be fairly similar. They are among the most popular protectors for memory foam mattresses and for most people they work well because they have less effect on the feel and response of the memory foam but for some people they can also have a bigger effect on sleeping temperature than they are comfortable with.

The better options and possibilities I’m aware of in the general Washington, DC area (subject to the quality/value guidelines I linked in my previous reply) are listed in post #2 here.


Sorry for the delay. I wanted to read all of your links before I responded, but it’s been a crazy week of work. I still haven’t gotten through all the reading, but wanted to give you an update.

I did find new fiber pillows that seem to alleviate the neck pain. I do still have pressure points/ pain in my shoulders when I sleep on my side, and my arm has even fallen asleep. I assume this means it is too firm. My question is, how long does memory foam/ tempurpedic normally take to break in?

With the spring weather, the heat has turned into a much bigger problem. We removed the mattress protector all-together. (Turns out that wasn’t the problem.) Sleeping with just 100% cotton sheets. No blankets. No heat or A/C is on at home. It still warms up quite a bit. I was okay with it in the colder weather, but it makes it very hard to sleep in the warm weather. My partner is miserably hot. Which of course, makes cuddling impossible, which makes him even more miserable. :frowning: So much for the “SmartClimate System”.

Is there something I can put on the mattress to alleviate the heat issues without affecting the performance of the mattress?

It will be one month on the 12th. I dread the thought of going back to mattress shopping, but I haven’t gotten a good night’s sleep in months.

Oh, and thanks for the great links to mattress stores in my area! I have only heard of two of these stores, but didn’t go to any of them before.

Hi Lackofzzz,

I’m glad to hear that a new pillow helped with the neck issues.

If your arm is falling asleep then the most likely cause (although not the only cause) would be a mattress that is too firm and needs some additional softness and pressure relief.

The “normal” break in and adjustment period would vary from person to person but would generally be in the range of 30 days or less but for some people it can take a little longer and some people don’t seem to notice it at all. If you have slept on your mattress for a few weeks and your “symptoms” seem to have stabilized and are consistent then it’s probably safe to assume that it won’t really break in much more or get much softer.

A more breathable material that allows for more airflow will generally be more temperature regulating (memory foam is usually the warmest of all the foam materials) but any topper you add on top of the mattress will have some effect on the mattress as well because it will reduce the amount of heat that reaches the memory foam which can make it feel firmer or at least take longer to soften with heat so if you add a softer foam topper (such as latex) that is more breathable for example then the surface feel would be softer but the deeper feel may be firmer although it would still probably feel softer overall. The only way to really know how any mattress/topper combination will feel for you “as a whole” would be based on your own sleeping experience.

A topper will also change how your mattress feels in other ways as well because you will “feel” more of the upper layers of a mattress and less of the deeper layers so if you add a more resilient topper such as latex then you would have a more resilient and “on the mattress” sleeping surface instead of the more slow response and less resilient and “in the mattress” feel of the memory foam.

Wool is also a great temperature regulator so you could add a thinner wool cotton/wool mattress protector (such as the St Dormier mentioned in the mattress protector post here) but it may also firm up the sleeping surface somewhat so it may help with temperature regulation but not as much with the additional softness that you may need.

It sounds like your sheets aren’t an issue (unless they are a very high thread count which may be less breathable) so adding a foam topper that was more breathable than memory foam (such as latex) would be the most likely solution that could help with both temperature and the additional softness you need outside of returning the mattress and starting over again to look for another mattress that would be a better “match” for you (which is probably what I would do rather than spending more on experiments that may not turn out as well as you hope for).


Thanks for the input. I am begrudgingly facing the reality that I am probably going to have to go out and look for a new mattress. This one felt so amazing in store, that I am questioning whether I’ll make the same mistake twice.

The mattress does still seem to be softening. I don’t know that it has plateaued yet. But the heat issue is really miserable right now. (Waiting for building management to turn on the AC!)

Oh, and I still notice that if I sleep on my side, and my leg on the bottom is straight, my ankle is in the air!! (We are talking inches.) What’s that about? Is that a normal memory foam thing?

So wish I found this forum before I purchased.

Hi LAckofzzz,

It’s easy to get “faked out” by the “showroom feel” of a mattress that is very subjective but there are some testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial post that can help greatly improve your odds of making the most suitable choice.

Post #2 here that I linked in an earlier reply has more about the different ways to choose a mattress (either locally or online) that is the most suitable “match” for each person’s specific needs and preferences and how to identify and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn’t turn out as well as you hoped for that are involved in each of them.

That could mean that the middle of your body including the upper part of your legs is sinking down too far into the mattress so that your legs are at an angle and aren’t as level as they could be. It would be hard to know for sure though without seeing you on the mattress.


I’ve been reading through all of your links, and going through the list of DC stores (so incredibly helpful!). Trying to come up with an attack plan. I do know that I don’t like the feel of traditional memory foam. I do like coil. I thought the tempur-pedic hybrid was the answer, but that didn’t really work out for me. So, I am back to looking at coil or latex. I only tried out one brand of latex the first time around, and found it much too soft, but by everything I have been reading here, it looks like I need to reconsider.

It seems a lot of the suggested stores are foam-centric. There seems to be a lot written about the “American Foam Center” in VA, but their website isn’t that helpful. Do you think that would be worth including?

It also seems that several places in my area sell the Savvy. I hadn’t really heard of it until I read about it in your mattress forum. Do you think that might be a good fit for my health issues?

I did purchase an adjustable bed (which I like) that I will not be returning. So whatever I buy needs to work with that.

Starting to feel better about mattress hunting again, although I don’t know how I am going to find the time to do it., since I am normally at work the hours the stores are open.

Hi Lackofzzz,

Like all foam materials latex comes in a very wide range of firmness levels so it’s certainly possible that some latex mattresses will be too soft and others may be too firm. There may also be some latex/innerspring hybrids available in the area that could make a good choice that use an innerspring (often a pocket coil but in many cases other types of innersprings as well) as the support core and then use latex in the comfort layers. There is more about innerspring/latex hybrids in post #13 here and the posts it links to. I would be cautious about “judging” an entire category of mattresses based on your experience on only one or two of them because all mattress categories will include a very side range of different mattresses with different firmness levels some of which may be a good “match” for you in terms of PPP and others which may be completely unsuitable for you to sleep on.

In the end the type of materials or the types of mattresses that you tend to prefer is more of a preference choice than a “better/worse” choice as long as the materials are good quality and durable versions of the materials that you tend to prefer and there are no “weak links” in the mattress.

There are a very wide range of stores that carry different types of mattresses available from the list including different types of foam (latex, memory foam, polyfoam), different types of innersprings with different types of comfort layers, and many others so you certainly have more options than just foam mattresses (although most mattresses include some type of foam in their comfort layers). I would suggest talking to any retailer or manufacturer you are considering on the phone first (see step 3 of the tutorial) to tell them the criteria that are important to you, your budget range, confirm that they are transparent about the type and quality of the materials in their mattresses, and to get a general sense of their knowledge and experience and to make sure that they carry some mattresses on their floor that you are interested in testing. I would then decide which ones to visit based on the results of your conversations.

Savvy Rest makes component latex mattresses that certainly use high quality materials (100% natural Talalay latex or organic Dunlop latex and cotton covers quilted with wool) that are very “safe” and also very durable so there are no lower quality materials or weak links in their mattresses in terms of durability. They are also in a more premium budget range than many other similar mattresses so I would make some careful value comparisons.

Only you can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved for anyone to be able to predict whether any mattress will be a good match for you based on specs (either yours or a mattress), health conditions, individual circumstances, or “theory at a distance” (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here). The only reliable way to know for certain whether any mattress is a good match for you in terms of PPP ( Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) is based on your own careful testing or actual sleeping experience but they would certainly be worth testing to see if one of their layering combinations is a good “match” for you either as a purchase or as an indication of whether another similar mattress would work well for you.

Most foam mattresses (such as memory foam, latex foam, or polyfoam) will work well on an adjustable bed and most pocket coils and some other types of innersprings that are specially made to bend will work well on an adjustable as well. I would check with the retailer or manufacturer though to make sure that any mattress you are considering is flexible enough to be used on an adjustable.


Well, I picked 3 stores from your recommended list that sounded promising, as well as a Savvy Rest store (wanted to try the customizable latex), and headed out mattress shopping again yesterday. Much better experience with these stores.

The first store was very small, but the owner was incredibly helpful. Given my issues of needing good lumbar support on my back, but mattresses hurting my shoulders on my side, she placed me on a Royal-pedic Latex Quilt-Top (7-zone). Natural latex core with cotton/wool quilting. My alignment has never been so good. I felt totally straight. It was a little firm, so she recommended the 3" pillowtop pad. It felt like heaven. Was seriously considering calling it a day when she dropped the pricetag. Queen - $4300, topper $1100. Yikes! To make it worse, can return for store credit only, and the selection is so small, there really is nothing else in the store for me. (I googled the mattress when I got home - and this is actually a good price for this bed.)

What do you think about the 7 zone mattresses? It seems good on principle. What if you are curled up on your side? Does it still work?

Store 2: Healthy Back to try the Bliss Latex. Only had the plush model. Too soft. Salesperson said the firm would be too hard. Didn’t really like anything here. Moving on.

Store 3: Savvy Rest. The salesperson was pointless. She explained the layout of the store. Said to lay on stuff, see what I liked. Then went to play on the computer. Tried all the configurations in the store. The Serenity Firm Dunlop/ Med Talalay/ Med Talalay or Firm Dunlop/ Med Talalay/ Soft Talalay felt the best, but not amazing. They did feel like they were sleeping a little warm (and I am super sensitive to that given the current tempurpedic). She never mentioned anything about toppers. I asked about other possible configurations. She said you could do that, but didn’t offer to let me try. Gave up and left.

Store 4: Carried Sherwood, Tempur-pedic, Vi Spring, Prana. The Prana Vinyasa Plush was the next mattress to have amazing alignment. I felt so straight, and no shoulder pain. Mixed Talalay core. 3" of poly-foam topper. This gave me pause (as I did read through your website and others that mention to be wary of foam toppers). I tried asking about the foam. One kind of polyfoam wrapped in another. Still didn’t seem to be getting the info I needed to feel comfortable (although the salesperson was amazing and so helpful). Also had concerns about the tufting. It was pretty deep, which is a very different feel for me. While it feels luxurious in the store, I wonder how that feels overnight. Does it effect the alignment or support?

And lastly, I laid on a Vi-Spring Elite Medium. Touching it, I expected it to be much too firm. But my alignment was perfect and it was surprisingly comfortable. It was even better with a Suite Sleep wool Topper. Since it was a bed where half was medium and half was firm, I was unable to gauge how it would be sleeping with a partner. Spring coil with wool topper. The salesperson said it would form body impressions, but it had to be flipped every 4 months, and it would go away with the flip. That was a little concerning. Also wonder how it would be on my shoulder after a whole night.

Both of these mattresses were $3000. The topper is $600. The Prana would be exchangeable for store credit. The Vi Spring is not exchangeable/ returnable. It is guaranteed for life though.

Not sure where to go from here. Was thinking about giving Savvy Rest (a different location) another try. The first mattress, while wonderful, seems crazy expensive. I might be able to swallow $3000 for an amazing night’s sleep (I am that desperate). I just can’t be sure either of these mattresses are my holy grail. Any thoughts? Similar beds I should consider? Experienced advice? Thanks so much. At the very least, because of you, I had a much more pleasant shopping experience and am more aware of alternative options.

Hi Lackofzzz,

There is more about the most important parts of the “value” of a mattress in post #13 here but I would keep in mind that the value of any mattress is relative to the other finalists you are considering and how they compare in terms of suitability and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences), the type and durability of the materials inside it, and how it compares to other similar mattresses based on these and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you … not how they may compare to the regular selling price of the same mattress (which may not even be the “final” price that most retailers will sell the mattress) or to the same mattress sold somewhere else.

Just as an example … if you have a mattress that normally retails for say $5000 and it’s “on sale” for $4000 (or is available at another store for $4000) but it’s very comparable to another mattress that you are considering that uses the same materials and is just as suitable, just as durable, and matches all the other criteria that are important to you but sells for $3000 then even the sale price of the first mattress (or the lower price at another store) wouldn’t be particularly good value.

Whether a zoned mattress “works” for any particular person depends entirely on the specifics of the zoning and how well they “match” the body type, weight distribution, and sleeping style of a particular person. Some zoning systems that work perfectly for one person may not be suitable at all for someone else. The only way to know whether a particular zoning system is a good “match” for you is based on your own personal testing and experience. Having said that … zoning can certainly have some benefits for those people that have more difficulty in finding a mattress that is a good “match” for them. There is more about zoning in post #11 here and the other posts and the article it links to.

It sounds like they may not have been one of Savvy Rest’s better dealers or at least the salesperson in the store wasn’t one of their better salespeople. Savvy Rest is more costly than many other very similar mattresses that are often sold online (and sometimes locally as well) and one of the reasons that they use to justify their higher prices is the personalized service that they can provide with a local purchase … and unfortunately this didn’t seem to be the case with your experience.

You can read more about the previous versions (up to version 4) of Pranasleep mattresses in post #3 here and in post #2 here and in post #3 here and in posts #1 and #2 here and a forum search on Prana (you can just click this) will also bring up more information and feedback about them as well.

The good news is they changed the design in version 5 and the top layers of polyfoam are now higher quality/density and are no longer what I would consider to be a weak link in the mattress in terms of durability but they are still in a significantly higher budget range than other similar mattresses and the top layers are still polyfoam so you would still be feeling and sleeping on polyfoam as much as latex. There is more about the new version 5 in post #19 here and I would certainly make some very careful “value” comparisons with other latex mattresses that are in a lower budget range before considering one of their mattresses to be the best value for you.

Tufted layers will be a little firmer because of the tufting and will be a little more durable as well because they are precompressed and aren’t as subject to impressions but the only way to know whether any mattress is a good “match” for you in terms of PPP (whether it has tufting or not) will be based on your own careful testing or personal experience. This is another one of those cases that a particular mattress that has tufted layers may be a good match for one person but that same mattress may not be a good match for someone else. The tufting is just one part of the overall design and layering of different mattresses that is the reason that some mattresses can be a good match for some people and not others. In other words tufted layers doesn’t mean that it would be a better match for any particular person.

I also would be very cautious about testing a mattress based on how “luxurious” it feels in a showroom which is only about the more subjective “feel” of a mattress which is much less important than posture and alignment and pressure relief which are the basic “needs” of any mattress. Your body doesn’t “feel” whether a mattress is “luxurious” when you are sleeping and I would focus much more on testing whether a mattress keeps you in good alignment and relieves pressure in all your sleeping positions.

If you sleep with a partner I would always make sure that you test a mattress together with both of you on the mattress.

There is more about Vi Spring and other “ultra premium” mattresses in post #2 here and post #2 here.

In some cases a mattress in this budget range may be “worth it” for a particular person that isn’t price sensitive and that has specific criteria that aren’t available in lower budget ranges but this would be unusual and in general I would need a very compelling reason that clearly indicated there was “enough” of a difference in “real life” compared to many other mattresses that may be just as suitable in terms of PPP (including temperature regulation), just as durable, and that are in much lower budget ranges to justify the higher cost based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Mattresses that have natural fibers in the comfort layers will form some initial impressions that will tend to even out as you sleep on different parts of the mattress and flip it on a regular basis. These impressions in natural fibers don’t have a significant effect on the comfort, support, or feel of the mattress because there really isn’t much difference between natural fibers that are compressed when you sleep on them and don’t spring all the way back when you are off the mattress and natural fibers that are compressed when you sleep on them and do spring back because both ways they are compressed to about the same degree and would have a similar firmness when you sleep on them (although they will become a little firmer than they were initially). Foam on the other hand is different because foam softens and breaks down over time and foam that softens or develops impressions can have a much more significant effect on both comfort and support.

Mattress warranties only cover defects in the materials or construction of a mattress and they don’t cover the gradual (or more rapid in the case of lower quality comfort layers) loss of comfort and support that is the main reason that most people will need to replace their mattress. In other words warranties have little to do with the durability or useful life of a mattress or when you may need to replace it and longer warranties are more about marketing than anything else. If there is an actual defect in the material it will usually show up early in the life of the mattress but knowing the quality and durability of the materials in your mattress are a much more reliable way to assess the durability and useful life of a mattress than the length of a warranty. There is more about mattress warranties in post #174 here. A “lifetime” warranty is only for the comfort life of the mattress not for your lifetime.

There is no way to know for certain how long any mattress will last or maintain it’s comfort and/or support for any particular person or how long it will take before someone crosses the thresholds between sleeping well on a mattress to sleeping “OK” to tolerating a mattress to finally deciding to replace it because there are too many variables involved that are unique to each person.

If a mattress uses high quality and durable materials (which of course is the case with the Vi Spring mattresses) then it’s more realistic to think of about 10 years as a reasonable expectation for any mattress no matter what the quality or durability of the materials and then treat any additional time after that as “bonus time” because after about 10 years the limiting factor in the useful life of a mattress will often be the changing needs and preferences of the person sleeping on the mattress and even if a mattress is still in relatively good condition after a decade … a mattress that was suitable for someone 10 years earlier may not be the best “match” any longer.

Having said that … with higher quality materials throughout a mattress and/or for people whose needs and preferences or physical condition or body type hasn’t changed much over 10 years then “bonus time” or even “extended bonus time” with higher quality/density materials like latex or higher density memory foam or polyfoam or natural fibers like the Vi Spring is much more likely than with less durable materials.

If a Savvy Rest is a good “match” for you in one of their specific layering combinations then it may also be worth considering some of the very similar online latex component mattresses that have a very similar design and layering options and are in a much lower budget range. They will also have a similar or better exchange policy and most of them also have a good return/refund policy as well which Savvy Rest doesn’t have so it would make sense to make some very careful comparisons based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you to make sure that the higher price for a local purchase of a very similar mattress would be “worth it” to you.

It seems like you are making progress but you still have a ways to go and it would be worthwhile to consider some other mattresses that are in lower budget ranges that may be just as suitable, just as durable, and may be better “value” since you are looking at mattresses in more premium budget ranges than you may need to.

If you aren’t confident that a mattress is a good match for you or that your testing will accurately predict your sleeping experience then I would make sure you factor in the "value of any exchange or return policies and there is more about the different ways to choose the most suitable mattress (locally and online) that can help you assess and minimize the risks involved in making a choice that isn’t as suitable for you as you hoped for with each of them in post #2 here.


I stopped by another Savvy Rest store. I understand they may be pricier, but they are a local business, and so have several company stores in my area. I thought it would be a good way to test out the three layer systems and see if that would work for me. (If they did, I wouldn’t have any problem buying a similar system online). Had a similar experience at this store. The salesperson explained the layout of the store and left me to try them out while he worked on his computer. I think the Dunlop Firm/ Talalay Med/ Talalay Med was the best of the set-up configurations, but I really felt like I wanted a comfort layer on top. Tried the wool topper. Didn’t really notice any difference. I wasn’t wowed by the beds. Don’t think this is for me. BTW, at their stores, they have a 90 day period where you can swap out the layers for free until you find the correct configuration. And for anyone in the area, the stores are having a 15% off everything sale through Memorial Day, but prices go up June 1.

I did search your mattress forum after trying out the Prana, because I was concerned about the foam top layer. I called the store back, and was told Prana has upgraded from 1.8 to 2.-something foam. It is good to hear you consider that acceptable.

So, the reason I narrowed my choices down to the 3 mattresses above are all 3 had near perfect alignment for me. I think the Pressure relief was good on all of them, but I’d probably go back and lay on my side for 15 minutes again. Unfortunately, it usually takes a few hours for my arms to fall asleep, and my shoulders feel terrible in the morning on most mattresses. As for personal preference - I definitely don’t like memory foam. Dislike that sinking feeling. Prefer to sleep on top of the mattress. I thought I liked coils because of the bounce back, but am discovering that latex may indeed be a good match for me. It has the uniform softness and bounceback. I think my ideal mattress would be the Talalay latex core with ~3" of natural fiber comfort layer. I really did love the Royal Pedic 7-zone Latex Quilt-Top. If the price were more reasonable, it would be a winner. The high price tag and lack of ability to return is a scary combination.

I would love to compare it to other mattresses that use the same materials and are just as durable, but sell for less, but I don’t know what brands/ mattresses that would be. Any suggestions?

Hi Lackofzzz,

The top 3" medium layer would be the “comfort layer” in this configuration. If you wanted something softer then you could exchange the medium for a soft or you could also add a topper that was outside the cover as well which would also have a softer but different “feel” than having the same layer inside the mattress cover (see posts #3 and #4 here and this topic).

Their previous versions used 2" of 1.5 lb polyfoam which was a lower density and less durable material than I would be comfortable with… especially in a mattress in this budget range. Their current version uses 2.5 lb polyfoam which is a much more durable material although you would still be sleeping on 2 3/4" of soft polyfoam which is a lower quality and cost material rather than sleeping directly on the latex.

If you are confident that all three of these mattresses are a good match for you in terms of PPP then none of them would have any weak links in their design in terms of the quality or durability of the materials so it would be a matter of making good “value” comparisons between them based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you. While they are all in a more premium price range than most people would generally consider or would even “need” to consider … the “value” of a mattress purchase really depends on how it compares to the other finalists you are considering based on suitability, durability, and preferences and for some people that are less price sensitive a mattress in these budget ranges may be “worth it” not so much because the quality or durability of the materials is better but because they have a very specific and compelling reason to choose a mattress in a higher budget range that has “real life” benefits that they can clearly identify (that aren’t just based on a marketing story or a belief that higher priced mattresses are somehow “better” based on price alone) and none of the other mattresses they’ve tried and tested would be a “good enough” choice or have the same benefits.

I would always keep in mind that the two basic “needs” in any sleeping system are that it keeps your spine and joints in good alignment and relieves pressure in all your sleeping positions and that everything after this are your preferences. There is more about the properties of an “ideal” sleeping system in post #4 here.

I don’t keep a record of the specific details of the mattresses that each retailer/manufacturer carries on their floor (keeping up with the specifics of all the mattresses on the showroom floors of all the retailers or manufacturers that are listed throughout the hundreds of forum lists would be a bigger job than anyone could keep up with in a constantly changing market) but checking the websites or making some preliminary phone calls to the retailers/manufacturers that are on the local list will tell you which of them carry mattresses that would meet your specific criteria. The brand name isn’t important as the type and quality of the materials in the mattress because all manufacturer have access to the same type of materials and outside of PPP a mattress is only as good as its construction and the quality and durability of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label.

If you are open to an online purchase then the tutorial post includes a link to a list of the members here that sell mattresses online (in the optional online step) and many of them sell latex mattresses that use different types or blends of latex with a wide range of designs, features, options, return or exchange policies, and prices. I would keep in mind though that while they may use the same type of materials as the Royal-Pedic or the Pranasleep mattresses and may have much lower prices … the designs will be different which means that even though they may be much better “value” in terms of the material costs of the mattress (the same materials at much lower prices) they won’t be the same in terms of their design so they may be either a better or a worse “match” for you in terms of PPP and how well you sleep on a mattress is always the most important part of the “value” of a mattress purchase even if the materials themselves in a much lower priced mattress are either very similar or the same.


Phoenix, Thank you as always for your thoughts.

I am confident that all three mattresses are a win in the posture department. My big fear is the pressure relief. I have huge problems there. And not to bore you with my sob story, but I have severe joint pain that I have spent the past 8+ months, a million tests, and a thousand doctor appointments trying to deal with (with no definitive diagnosis yet). It’s been a year since I’ve had a good night’s sleep. So, yes, I am desperate enough for the elusive solid night’s sleep sans Ambien that I would consider paying a premium range for a mattress if I knew it was the one. But… all three of these mattresses are so very different. And I feel like if I choose one, given the store policies, that I am stuck with it. Given that I have already chosen wrong with the Tempurpedic, I am very nervous in my ability to judge a mattress based on 15 minutes in a showroom. I really can’t afford to get this wrong again.

I don’t think I’d be comfortable purchasing a mattress online that I haven’t tried in real life. I’ve been trying to find other brands of latex mattresses that can be tested in a local store, but am coming up blank. For a major metropolitan area, we seem to be seriously lacking in non-chain mattress stores. I do feel like I have run out of options, and need to chose from what I have tried. It doesn’t seem like a good latex mattress with a natural fiber comfort layer at a reasonable price would be impossible to find, but I can’t seem to find it in store. Feeling frustrated again.

Looking online for other possible latex mattresses in store in my area. Sears carries a line of “Classic Brands” Latex mattresses (Blissful 11", Serenity 10" Firm, Serenity 10"plush, Purity 9"). The label in the photos say “Natural Sleep”. List prices $2000-$2700. It appears to be a few inches of latex on a foam base. In trying to find more information on it, I found what appears to be the same mattress at Amazon for $523!

According to Amazon, it is 3 Inch of talalay latex over 8 Inch of high density base foam. I tried chatting with a Sears rep, but got frustrated and gave up. Do you think this mattress would be worth looking at? It seems to be mostly foam. Don’t know what effect that has on durability.

Hi Lackofzzz,

The blended Talalay latex in the top 3" is certainly a good quality and durable material but I would want to know the density of the polyfoam base layer as well (see the guidelines here) although if it’s 1.5 lb density or better with your lower weight it wouldn’t be a weak link in the mattress.

I would also keep in mind that there is only one firmness level so it may or may not be a good “match” for you in terms of PPP (it would only be the “best” match for a relatively smaller percentage of people) and if it isn’t then there could be some cost involved in returning it (see the details about Amazon’s large item return policy in post #11 here).

If you are attracted to a Talalay latex/polyfoam hybrid then Dreamfoam has a very similar mattress here which sells for $539.10 (after the 10% discount) and also has a wide range of firmness levels and they are also knowledgeable enough to provide you with some guidance about which of their firmness levels may be most suitable for you and it also has a relatively low cost return policy ($99).


Hello Phoenix, hope you have been doing well. Looks like your keeping up the good work since the last time we have exchanged comments. Would be be wrong to mention Tempflow as a possible solution Lackofzzz. At least it could possibly give her an option. Every since our I-Comfort disaster it took Mattress Firm over a month to take our mattress back and refund our money. A lot of things have been going on over the past year or so I’m still stuck with our 10+ year old mattress that kills my back. I’m at the point now where I can get a Temflow with adjustable frame. Dr. Rick is giving me the same great deal he offered me a year ago. Thought that was honorable.

It’s been awhile since I have been active on the forum.

Hi jdeck,

Welcome back :slight_smile:

As you know from your previous time here I think highly of Rick and the quality of the mattresses he manufactures (which is why they are included on the online memory foam list in the mattress shopping tutorial and also on the local list in Los Angeles) and the Tempflow mattress would certainly be one of several good options or “possibilities” for those who prefer the feel and performance of memory foam over other types of mattresses and are comfortable with an online order (see post #9 here)

While it’s not possible for anyone to know whether any mattress will be a good “match” for someone else in terms of PPP or whether it will solve any issues they may have until they have actually tried it … and each person may have different criteria based on all the parts of their personal value equation that are most important to them … you are always welcome to share your personal experience with any mattress you have tried or a retailer/manufacturer you have dealt with on the forum.


Sorry for the delay. I have been out of town. Wanted to give you a field report.

  1. Sears does not carry the latex mattresses in store. However, I’d like to mention, at least in the DC area, Sears has by far the largest selection of traditional mattress manufacturers on the floor, so it was definitely good for comparing different types of mattresses and different manufacturers as a starting point.

  2. Mattress Fame does still exist. It was on your DC store list, but then marked as closed. The Gaithersburg location is closed due to building renovation. However, there is a location on Rockville Pike in Rockville, MD. Their website is terrible, and their hours seem somewhat flaky (they were closed mid-day for an hour and a half the first time I attempted to visit), but they are an outlet, so their prices are better than online or other stores in many cases. They claim to carry the full line of pureBLISS mattresses. The day I visited, they had the Pamper, Nature, and World’s Best on the floor, as well as two hybrids. They seem to operate like a regular mattress store, so you’ll have to deal with the typical salesperson negotiations.

  3. If you have a little more money to spend, I had a great experience with Mattress Traditions in Falls Church. It is appointment only (weekday), as the owner is an interior decorator so she is running two businesses. She listens to all your needs and does an excellent job at matching you with the right mattress, and gives you as much time as you’d like to just lie on the mattresses. Unfortunately, they are high end, expensive mattresses. I tried the Royal Pedic here and fell in love with it. By far the best mattress I tried, but I have a hard time paying such a high price for a mattress, especially given if you decide it’s not the right one for you, you have to pay a restocking fee (15 or 20% ?) and only get store credit, plus shipping in both directions. Given the small selection and that it was the most expensive mattress there, I couldn’t quite pull the trigger.

  4. Urban Outfitter in Vienna, VA. This is a wonderful store. All of their salespeople were extremely helpful and patient. I never felt any pressure to speed things up or buy. They knew the answers to all of my questions. Very educational. Free delivery & return. They allow a trade-out (store credit only) if the first selection does not work out. I think there is a fee for additional trades. Given the positive experience I had here, they have won my business. Now let’s hope I chose well, as I desperately need a good night’s sleep.